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Posted: 7/27/2009 8:13:43 AM EDT
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Straight from Steyr:
The barrel and flash hider are made in the US, as well as the following parts: 1. Gas piston 2. Cocking body (3 pieces) 3. Receiver 4. Magazine follower 5. Magazine body 6. Magazine Floorplate 7. Trigger –– Thank You Eric Wood Sales Manager Steyr Arms 205-467-6544 Update on Austrian Magazines from Steyr Arms My question On Mon, Jul 27, 2009 at 8:29 PM, Friendly Crusader <[email protected]> wrote:
So, it looks like A3 has the following 8 imported parts under 922r (please correct me if I am wrong): 1. Stock 2. Trigger housing 3. Hammer 4. Disconnector/Sear 5. Front pistol grip (forearm) 6. Trunion 7. Bolt carrier 8. Bolt If we add an imported mag, it brings part count to 11, and that violates 922r. Is this correct? Or am I getting something wrong? Thank you for your time, and again, your answers greatly help the firearms community -Friendly Crusader his reply from Eric Wood <[email protected]> to Friendly C <[email protected]> date Tue, Aug 11, 2009 at 6:31 AM subject Re: AUG A3 mailed-by steyrarms.com XXXX, The Austrain made AUG magazines are not 922r compliant for the AUG A3. However the magazines that come with the AUG A3 have both US and Austrian made parts that make them 922r compliant.If you have any other questions feel free to contact us @205-467-6544. Thanks Eric Wood |
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Here is the thread where someone fitted a NATO stock to his A3.
THIS IS A WORK IN PROGRESS This started out from people wanting to install a NATO stock on A3's. Parts restricted under 922r Parts followed by * apply to AUG (1) Frames, receivers, receiver castings, forgings or stampings* U.S. ON A3 (2) Barrels* U.S. ON A3 (3) Barrel extensions N/A (4) Mounting blocks (trunions)* IMPORTED (5) Muzzle attachments* U.S. ON A3 (6) Bolts* IMPORTED (7) Bolt carriers* IMPORTED (8) Operating rods* (CHARGING HANDLE) U.S. ON A3 (9) Gas pistons* U.S. ON A3 (10) Trigger housings* IMPORTED (11) Triggers* U.S. ON A3 (12) Hammers* IMPORTED (13) Sears* IMPORTED (14) Disconnectors* IMPORTED (15) Buttstocks* IMPORTED (16) Pistol grips N/A INTEGRAL WITH STOCK (17) Forearms, handguards* IMPORTED (18) Magazine bodies* NO CLEAR ANSWER (19) Followers* NO CLEAR ANSWER (20) Floorplates* NO CLEAR ANSWER It is unknown at this time which parts of the mags (that are shipped with A3s are U.S. made). The emails from Eric Wood at Steyr do not specify. He simply says they have both U.S. and Austrian parts. He does say that imported mags are not 922r compliant an the A3. So far we have 9 imported parts. A NATO stock should be legal to use as long as the mags are of U.S. origin. The NATO stock has a trigger and sear lever (considered a disconnector by BATFE) already installed. This will bring the imported parts count to 9. Still under the limit of 10 imported parts as long as the mags are U.S. TPD sells a U.S. made trigger and sear lever (disconnector) for the NATO stocks. (Also trigger and sear levers for AUG stocks) TPD also has U.S. made foregrips but unsure if they fit A3. MSAR has foregrips also but unkown if they fit the A3. 1st thread 2nd thread |
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Great info, thanks for sharing!
So, it looks like A3 has the following 8 imported parts under 922r (please correct me if I'm missing anything): 1. Stock 2. Trigger housing 3. Hammer 4. Disconnector/Sear 5. Front pistol grip (forearm) 6. Trunion 7. Bolt carrier 8. Bolt If we add imported mag, it brings part count to 11, and that violates 922r! I think there must be something wrong here.... Maybe front pistol grip (forearm) is also US-made? -albertr |
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Quoted:
Feel free to email steyr or call them. It took me 4 days to get the answer I got and hopefully it was the wrong answer, or maybe incomplete I was trying to get (unsuccessfully) an answer from them a few times before, obviously you did much better than me. -albertr |
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Quoted:
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Feel free to email steyr or call them. It took me 4 days to get the answer I got and hopefully it was the wrong answer, or maybe incomplete I was trying to get (unsuccessfully) an answer from them a few times before, obviously you did much better than me. -albertr I sent them another email asking about the number of imported parts. |
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Quoted:
What's the "Cocking body (3 pieces)"? Can someone clarify? And thanks to Friendly Crusader! What a fitting name! The A3 uses an A2 folding charging handle assembly. In all there are 10 parts I believe, but there are 3 main parts. The charging handle itself, the folding hinge and the bracket that connects the handle assembly to the reciever group. And don't mention it  , I need to know just as much as everyone else about this, and why not share.
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Man, we really need to consolidate these threads. We have three going at the same time on the subject. Maybe we could put all of the known factual info in one thread by editing the O.P.
Check the first and second post on this page. Friendly_Crusader and I are trying to put all of the info in one thread. |
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Quoted:
Great info, thanks for sharing! So, it looks like A3 has the following 8 imported parts under 922r (please correct me if I'm missing anything): 1. Stock 2. Trigger housing 3. Hammer 4. Disconnector/Sear 5. Front pistol grip (forearm) 6. Trunion 7. Bolt carrier 8. Bolt If we add imported mag, it brings part count to 11, and that violates 922r! I think there must be something wrong here.... Maybe front pistol grip (forearm) is also US-made? -albertr I sent Steyr Arms an Email on this. They again said they have to contact Steyr Austria for the answer and I will have it within a couple days |
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Just don't email anyone at Steyr Mannlicher over in Austria during August. The whole damn country goes on vacation for like a the whole month of August over there it's nuts. You'll probably not get a reply back until September especially if you send it in English.
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Is that the answer you got from Steyr? Jeez, I cannot believe they are opening themselves (and us too) to possible liability... That's just lame. How much more it would be to make one more US-made part? That's peanuts comparing to the cost of A3. -albertr yup, look at the bottom of my Original post they basically said the two that come with the rifle are legit, and austrians are not 1 part would make them legal in A3s, a floorplate, follower or new body considering US made mags have had problems, id rather replace the floorplate or follower maybe MSAR floorplates are the same spec, and USA made, and available. Unless we could replace 1 part in the weapon or 1 part in every magazine with a us made part, Austrian mags are a liability TPDUSA does sell a couple US made parts that are countable on 922r that are Austrian on the A3, like a disconnecter |
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I know for a fact that you can make an MSAR hammer work in the Steyr trigger pack, I have one in my AXR and it works great. Same story with the MSAR gas pistons and regulators. The AXR has a US-made gas block, but it's supposed to be Steyr spec. Also, I've seen enough pictures of guns that have MSAR VFG's installed, that I would say this part is very probably compatible as well. I know they work with AXRs, Dave R. or someone else at MSAR (or someone with an AUG A3 and MSAR VFG) might chime in and verify compatibility with the Steyr gas blocks.
It would be interesting to know if other MSAR trigger pack components (or the whole piece of kit) would work with their Steyr counterparts. I know that in the past, MSAR changed the design of the trigger pack housing a bit to prevent you from doing this. The new E4 stocks might use a different pack, I'm thinking. Using MSAR parts, you could very easily keep an AUG A3 (or USR) under the 922r limit. Then again, BAFTE only seems to enforce 922r on manufacturers, not the little guys. |
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I would agree with you on that. It is their opinion that counts, not whatever list we come up with using third-hand information from AUG and AUG-alike manufacturers. Unless you've got a letter in your hand addressed to you from the BAFTE, you might be wrong. And they could change their minds at any time. It's a vague, stupid law.
Let me start off by saying that none of my guns, to my well-informed knowledge, are in violation of 18 U.S.C. 922(r). Hell, I've added US-made parts to my AXR. I have yet to hear of a case where 922r was being enforced, and the guilty party wasn't a dealer or importer. Why? BAFTE probably has their reasons, but I (and many others) guess that it's because 922r is very difficult to enforce on a specific firearm, and it's very difficult to go around to people's houses and legally take a count of the parts in their guns. I would even question the legality of them asking to take your gun apart and inspect each part at a public range. Basically, if you think your gun might be in violation of 922r, or maybe you want to intentionally violate 922r, you've probably got a better chance of being killed on the highway tomorrow than you do of being hit with a 922r case. I'm not saying it's okay, and I'm not saying you should do it. You shouldn't. Whether or not the law was intended to be applied to importers, dealers, and manufacturers and not J. Random A-hole with a modified SKS is up to BAFTE and the judge at your case. |
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Quoted:
I would agree with you on that. It is their opinion that counts, not whatever list we come up with using third-hand information from AUG and AUG-alike manufacturers. Unless you've got a letter in your hand addressed to you from the BAFTE, you might be wrong. And they could change their minds at any time. It's a vague, stupid law. Let me start off by saying that none of my guns, to my well-informed knowledge, are in violation of 18 U.S.C. 922(r). Hell, I've added US-made parts to my AXR. I have yet to hear of a case where 922r was being enforced, and the guilty party wasn't a dealer or importer. Why? BAFTE probably has their reasons, but I (and many others) guess that it's because 922r is very difficult to enforce on a specific firearm, and it's very difficult to go around to people's houses and legally take a count of the parts in their guns. I would even question the legality of them asking to take your gun apart and inspect each part at a public range. Basically, if you think your gun might be in violation of 922r, or maybe you want to intentionally violate 922r, you've probably got a better chance of being killed on the highway tomorrow than you do of being hit with a 922r case. I'm not saying it's okay, and I'm not saying you should do it. You shouldn't. Whether or not the law was intended to be applied to importers, dealers, and manufacturers and not J. Random A-hole with a modified SKS is up to BAFTE and the judge at your case. the thread was started for people who wanted to know, the 922(r) is public information and the parts that qualify under it are listed with it. every week someone asks about 922r compliance, which parts are what, etc. instead of asking over and over they can look at this |
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Quoted:
the thread was started for people who wanted to know, the 922(r) is public information and the parts that qualify under it are listed with it. every week someone asks about 922r compliance, which parts are what, etc. instead of asking over and over they can look at this Understood, my comments were directed to those concerned about 922r in three ways. One being that you can easily acquire and add several US-made parts to an AUG, thanks to MSAR. Two being that BAFTE hasn't shown that they care about what you do with guns made of foreign parts in your basement, so long as you aren't selling them as a dealer. Three being that the law is vague and subject to BAFTE's changing opinions. Example: the VFG on an AUG. Title 27, Chapter 1, Section 178.39 includes in the parts list "(17) Forearms, handguards". I've never heard anyone refer to a vertical forward grip as a handguard or a forearm. I would say that an AUG-style rifle doesn't have a true handguard or forearm, and that if it does (that two inches forward of the pistol grip finger guard) then it's integrated into the receiver and buttstock, and therefore doesn't count. I'm reminded of this picture of an early in-development AXR, sans VFG: 
I wouldn't say that weapon has any handguards or forearms. And if it can't be said that a VFG constitutes a handguard or forearm, then it doesn't have one with it installed either. Basically, we rely on someone at BAFTE to provide us with a list of what parts constitute a certain gun, and depending on the day and the person, that can change. Keep in mind that if they really wanted to get you for something like this, they could change the definition in a heartbeat. Say they decided that the VFG on my AXR doesn't qualify as a forearm or handguard. The VFG on my AXR was one of the compliance parts. Now I'm in violation of 922r. Only I'm not, because I added a US-made hammer. |
Interesting! So if i understand what has been said correctly it would not violate 922r to install a pre ban semi Austrian trigger pack into an A3 Aug! From what i've read here the packs are all Austrian parts. Can someone tell me if this assumption is correct? 
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Quoted:
Interesting! So if i understand what has been said correctly it would not violate 922r to install a pre ban semi Austrian trigger pack into an A3 Aug! From what i've read here the packs are all Austrian parts. Can someone tell me if this assumption is correct? Should be good to go. From our contact with Steyr, the hammer pack parts are imported so swapping with another pack should make no difference. |
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not to resurrect something without good cause-
isn't the part of the AUG that houses the trigger the stock? why count the same part twice? also, isn't the trunion the part of the receiver that the barrel is held by? the foreign parts count might be lower than represented in this thread... my reason for taking interest is that I have a pre-ban AUG barrel that I swapped out the vfg (thanks to MSAR) and gas piston (thanks AXR) on but still have to make up one more part. So I installed a US made disconnector into the rifle (from AXR as well). has anyone gotten a final word from Steyr Inc? you'd think they'd know by heart what their total is (re: US vs Austrian parts count). |
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The hammer pack is what is being called a "trigger housing". The trunnion is a press fit part into the receiver. It's still a seperate part.
No word from Steyr or Sabre and I've stopped pursuing it. The ATF changes it's mind from one approval letter to the next. There are no clear definitions/descriptions for some of the parts on the list. On some guns the charging handle is called the op rod and others the op rod is a recoil spring guide rod, not the charging handle. It varies depending on what the manufacturer calls it and the agent that would be inspecting it. |
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ok... thanks for the clarification-
so if I were to replace the hammer / disconnector / handguard (vfg does protect your fwd hand, if you shoot with it up, you can get a gas burn) these three parts can negate whatever Austrian parts are in my pre-ban magazines. |
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Isn't this rifle made in the USA? Receiver and barrel made in USA, out the door 922 compliant. I think you guys are overthinking this.
Does it mean you could take a Colt and replace everything but the barrel and receiver with foreign parts and no longer be 922 compliant? Think about it, the gun is the receiver. The other prohibited part from importation is the barrel. Both made in the USA, what exactly are they importing. Parts that are not restricted from any parts kit. |
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Quoted: Isn't this rifle made in the USA? Receiver and barrel made in USA, out the door 922 compliant. I think you guys are overthinking this. Does it mean you could take a Colt and replace everything but the barrel and receiver with foreign parts and no longer be 922 compliant? Think about it, the gun is the receiver. The other prohibited part from importation is the barrel. Both made in the USA, what exactly are they importing. Parts that are not restricted from any parts kit. Read here... http://home.comcast.net/~navy87guy/home/922r.html |
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Isn't this rifle made in the USA? Receiver and barrel made in USA, out the door 922 compliant. I think you guys are overthinking this. Does it mean you could take a Colt and replace everything but the barrel and receiver with foreign parts and no longer be 922 compliant? Think about it, the gun is the receiver. The other prohibited part from importation is the barrel. Both made in the USA, what exactly are they importing. Parts that are not restricted from any parts kit. The rifle is assembled here using both US and imported parts. Since this is the case, 922r is a factor. |
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