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Posted: 1/7/2011 6:46:48 PM EDT
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I am interested on one of these but I have a few questions relating to the stock/receiver: 1) Does anyone make an aftermarket collaspible stock that is a clone of the Benelli factory one? From what I understand, the Benelli factory collapsible stock would violate 922 rules for civies. 2) Can a side folding stock similar to the Butler Creek models be fitted on this shotgun or will it be a problem because of the action design? 3) Are the actual receivers mechanically different between military & commercial models and/or collapsible & fixed stock models? (meaning are the stocks and internal parts interchangeable?) 4) Are the markings different between the military & civilian models? Thanks! |
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Quoted:
I am interested on one of these but I have a few questions relating to the stock/receiver: 1) Does anyone make an aftermarket collaspible stock that is a clone of the Benelli factory one? From what I understand, the Benelli factory collapsible stock would violate 922 rules for civies. Negative. Recently the price has dropped significantly on the collapsible stock market. I just got mine for 265$ shipped. There are solutions to the 922 law. US part replacement. You would need: 1. US made magazine tube (not an extension, carriercomp's titanium tube is the best) 2. US made magazine Follower (carriercomp gives one away with their magazine tubes now) 3. US made forearm (FFT has a stock reproduction coming) 4. US made hammer (carriercomp is finalizing theirs) 5. US made disconnector (carriercomp is finalizing theirs) 2) Can a side folding stock similar to the Butler Creek models be fitted on this shotgun or will it be a problem because of the action design? Negative. Inside the stock is a recoil tube extension. 3) Are the actual receivers mechanically different between military & commercial models and/or collapsible & fixed stock models? (meaning are the stocks and internal parts interchangeable?) Generally they are the same. M4's have a lot of inline upgrades and refinements. Newer models are superior. I believe military M4's have a fixed choke in the barrel. The older model m1014 and 11703 models have a recoil extension that will not allow a collapsible stock to collapse. The tube can be replaced, but it is a pain. I just did mine. To answer your question though, most parts are interchangeable. Some parts such as handguards have been revised in the past. You should have no trouble with the stocks. 4) Are the markings different between the military & civilian models? Generally they are the same. The m1014 model has an American flag engraved on the receiver. Subsequent models do not have this. I've noticed color filling being different over model runs on some of the weapons markings. The hue of the anodizing has changed as well. Newer production M4's have an OD greenish tint when viewed in direct sunlight. Thanks! |
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StrangeDanger, Thanks a bunch, your post was very helpful. Can I purchase a collapsible stock from Benelli or does it have to be 2nd hand? If I buy one second hand, how do I know that I'm getting a genuine Benelli collapsible stock? The parts you listed, I assume that these are for the 922 compliance, in a similar manner to imported AKs? |
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You can buy them here. Word of advice, buy one quick. The market on the stocks is very unstable. You cant buy them from Benelli direct due to their internal policy. There have been no other stocks on the market for the M4 except the factory ones and the Mesa Tactical. Its almost impossible that you will find a counterfeit collapsible stock. To my knowledge no one has tried to make one due to the costs and the limited market. If the part is U.S. made its compliant. |
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Gravity is correct.
Not all parts count towards compliance. Example, a US made bolt handle will not count towards the reduction of foreign made parts. So the parts I listed above will bring you into compliance. You end up with a better weapon too. The parts count is identical to the AK rules. Same BS essentially. I'd nab one of the stocks today if you're serious about buying the Benelli. I've never seen or heard of a fake collapsible stock. There isn't a large enough market. 250 bucks is a steal. A year ago, people were paying 500 - 750$ for used ones. People were thrilled to get one for 450$ a few weeks ago. As soon as this supply runs out, the prices will start marching north again. |
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Thanks! I looked at the Benelli website, and it appears that you can put a 'normal' field style stock on the M4. Is this actually true? Would I need to worry about 922 compliance if I bought a field stock to install on the M4? One more question - on their website it states that the mag capacity for the M4 is 4+1. WTF? I thought it was 7+1 or something like that? Does Benelli modify their commercial M4 to not hold as many shells? |
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Quoted: Thanks! I looked at the Benelli website, and it appears that you can put a 'normal' field style stock on the M4. Is this actually true? Would I need to worry about 922 compliance if I bought a field stock to install on the M4? If I recall correctly you can, but I'm not positive on this. Field stocks are a bit hard to find, I think Numerich Arms may sell them. One more question - on their website it states that the mag capacity for the M4 is 4+1. WTF? I thought it was 7+1 or something like that? Does Benelli modify their commercial M4 to not hold as many shells? Benelli uses the Benelli M4 SBS mag tube which is intended for 14 inch barrels on the neutered imported M4. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Thanks! I looked at the Benelli website, and it appears that you can put a 'normal' field style stock on the M4. Is this actually true? Would I need to worry about 922 compliance if I bought a field stock to install on the M4? If I recall correctly you can, but I'm not positive on this. Field stocks are a bit hard to find, I think Numerich Arms may sell them. One more question - on their website it states that the mag capacity for the M4 is 4+1. WTF? I thought it was 7+1 or something like that? Does Benelli modify their commercial M4 to not hold as many shells? Benelli uses the Benelli M4 SBS mag tube which is intended for 14 inch barrels on the neutered imported M4. Interesting. Is there any way to put the standard capacity mag tube on there or would that be a violation of 922? |
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Install a field stock, or comply with US made parts. For a full length magazine tube you need 3 US made parts. If you want a functional collapsible stock, you need 4 US made parts.
1. A full length mag tube. Extensions do not count. (Carriercomp's are the best) 2. Mag follower (carriercomp gives one away with their mag tubes now) 3. Forearm replacement. FFT has a stock reproduction unit coming. 4. Carriercomp hammer (coming soon) 5. Carriercomp disconnector (coming soon) |
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Quoted: Yes, they can all go fornicate themselves with an iron stick. However, these items are parts you want anyway. They're superior in quality to Benelli parts. It's worth jumping through the hoops. The Benelli beats the 590's ass all day long. Yeah, I don't doubt that they are. I guess I just wanted to buy a shotgun and not have to mod the heck out of the internal parts to get it the way I want. I will still consider it, but I am wondering why Benelli just doesn't build the M4s in the US to avoid the 922 regs? |
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Quoted: Quoted: Yes, they can all go fornicate themselves with an iron stick. However, these items are parts you want anyway. They're superior in quality to Benelli parts. It's worth jumping through the hoops. The Benelli beats the 590's ass all day long. Yeah, I don't doubt that they are. I guess I just wanted to buy a shotgun and not have to mod the heck out of the internal parts to get it the way I want. I will still consider it, but I am wondering why Benelli just doesn't build the M4s in the US to avoid the 922 regs? Beretta USA is running at full capacity fulfilling military contract M9s. Adding additional Benelli M4 production would require a lot of investment in business capital. By the way how did the M4 get an NSN even though it's not Berry Amendment compliant? |
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what the heck m4 do I have? it says M4 on the receiver but it has a changeable chokes, and it holds 5+1. what do I need to change the tube for more rounds and I guess with no flag it can not take a collapsible stock thanks for the help You probably have a 11707 model. Which is the best one to have. You most likely have a 3 position recoil tube. Remove the stock and count the grooves milled on the recoil tube. If you bought a collapsible stock, it should slip right on and be fully functional. To add a full capacity magazine, you need a heat gun to remove the existing tube. The best model to buy is the carriercomp Titanium model. It'll drop the weight by 5 ounces. |
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The magazine and recoil tube are both installed with green locktite. You will need a heatgun to break the hold before you can unscrew it. It is fairly easy to do really. You don't want to apply a lot of torque on the aluminum receiver.
The m4 is much heavier than the m1 or m2 due to the piston setup of the Argo. The receiver is also thicker. So cutting 5 ounces off where it counts the most is a big deal. Ordering the tube from carriercomp will also get you a replacement follower and a high quality mag spring from Wolff. So right there, you're 2 parts down out of 3 or 4 needed for compliance. The collapsible stock will need 4 parts due to the collapsible stock being considered two imported parts. |
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can you tell what I have by these pictures? http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs1369.snc4/164175_1739297116089_1048477983_1998501_7076949_n.jpg http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/hs262.snc6/179077_1739296276068_1048477983_1998498_35262_n.jpg Yello Lab....Dock Siders |
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what the heck m4 do I have? it says M4 on the receiver but it has a changeable chokes, and it holds 5+1. what do I need to change the tube for more rounds and I guess with no flag it can not take a collapsible stock thanks for the help I copied this info a couple of years ago. Hope it helps. Tools required; > Heat gun.(Refrain from using flame devices, torches, etc., they are overkill and have the potential of discoloring the finish on the receiver) > Snap ring pliers. >Stiff nylon or brass bristled tooth-brush, Q-tips and acetone. > Rubber grip pad. (Similar to a jar lid gripper, or even a piece of tire inner tube) >Padded vise. (not required but helpful if done alone without an assistant) Before proceeding please ensure the firearm is completely unloaded, clear mag tube and chamber, firearm on safe. Lock the bolt to the rear, then remove the factory barrel nut (by hand), set the barrel, bolt group, and handguards to the side. Using snap ring pliers set to compress when gripped, carefully remove the spring retainer from the end of the factory mag tube, (keep it aimed away from your face, with your other hand over the end so that the spring can be safely contained when it is "set free"). Then tilt the gun downwards, allowing the spring and follower to fall out. Place gun in a lightly clamped padded vise (ensuring the bolt release button is not clamped), between your knees, or in the hands of a competent assistant. Using the heat gun set to a maximum 400 F, apply direct heat to the full circumference of the mag tube where it meets the receiver, allowing heat to reach the receiver as well, continue rotating the heat around the junction until the two are beyond unbearable to touch (using an infra-red thermometer if available, you will typically see results when the receiver temp nears 250F), favor application of heat to the receiver, as it retains heat more efficiently. At that temp (around 250F) you should be able to begin twisting the factory tube off [ccw](here's where the rubber grip pad does double duty as a heat shield, and provides much better grip than bare hands). Do not use a pipe wrench for a few reasons, 1st it will damage your factory tube, but foremost it will provide excessive torque that may allow you to force removal before the loc-tite is ready to let go. Once it starts to turn, the battle is won, just keep it turning until it is free. Next clean the internal threads with acetone, Q-tips, and the nylon or brass tooth brush. It will look scary at 1st since the residue from the factory loc-tite is chalky white, but once you have it all cleaned off, you should be looking at the pristine black anodized receiver threads where the old tube use to be. You are now ready to install your replacement tube. Don't forget to transfer the handguard's stamped steel rear brace onto the new tube BEFORE threading it into the receiver, it is a "captured part" that has to be in place during assembly. Most people opt to fore-go the use of loc-tite, simply torqing in their new tube as tight as can be done by hand. If you use loc-tite, make sure you check the data sheet, and select a grade that can be heated for removal with LOW HEAT like the factory used. Typically just a drop of medium strength Loc-Tite brand "blue" will be sufficient if you use any at all. Replace all the remaining components, and enjoy!! *Edited to make paragraphs. |
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hi, can someone tell me how to remove the non-military stock off please?
one more question: in case my doesn't have the 3-position recoil tube, can i get it somewhere? if i can't get one of the 3-position tube can i file the notches onto my existing tube? ETA: sorry i'm still a noob when it comes to the M4 even though i have one for over a year now  .
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hi, can someone tell me how to remove the non-military stock off please? one more question: in case my doesn't have the 3-position recoil tube, can i get it somewhere? if i can't get one of the 3-position tube can i file the notches onto my existing tube? ETA: sorry i'm still a noob when it comes to the M4 even though i have one for over a year now .To remove the stock is easy. Pull the bolt handle, push the retention pin to the trigger group with the bolt handle. Press the bolt release while pulling the trigger group free. Then unscrew the stock from the receiver. It just twists off. Done. Compare your recoil tube to the ones I posted. Numrich arms sells a 3 position tube. Only the complete assembly is a 3 position unit. The cheaper stripped one is a 2 position POS. The install job is moderately difficult. I posted a guide about it a few weeks ago. All newer m4's come with 3 position tubes. So chances are, you're okay. I doubt anyone could file the non collapsible tube and make it functional without a mill. If you could, you're a god and have more time on your hands than you should. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
hi, can someone tell me how to remove the non-military stock off please? one more question: in case my doesn't have the 3-position recoil tube, can i get it somewhere? if i can't get one of the 3-position tube can i file the notches onto my existing tube? ETA: sorry i'm still a noob when it comes to the M4 even though i have one for over a year now .To remove the stock is easy. Pull the bolt handle, push the retention pin to the trigger group with the bolt handle. Press the bolt release while pulling the trigger group free. Then unscrew the stock from the receiver. It just twists off. Done. Compare your recoil tube to the ones I posted. Numrich arms sells a 3 position tube. Only the complete assembly is a 3 position unit. The cheaper stripped one is a 2 position POS. The install job is moderately difficult. I posted a guide about it a few weeks ago. All newer m4's come with 3 position tubes. So chances are, you're okay. I doubt anyone could file the non collapsible tube and make it functional without a mill. If you could, you're a god and have more time on your hands than you should. thank you Sir. you're the best  .
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