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Posted: 4/28/2009 11:21:56 AM EDT
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Newbie here but I need a question answered. My youngest son, 21, just got his CCH in Texas. I bought him Kimber Super Match 2 for his birthday. He (and I) just love it. Very nice pistol. One problem. It is just to big for him to carry with out wearing a jacket and guess what ,,,he`s a college student and wears flip flops and shorts virtually everywhere. I am asking all you long timers what size,cal,brand that you might suggest for him so that he can literally carry it in his front pocket with out any issues as to it not being "fully concealed". He is an excellent shot, long time hunter/fisher and has just scored a big "A" in his stat. class. I want to buy him the best available.
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Get him and yourself a Glock 19 or the even smaller Glock 26. Both make for a superb CCW pistol and are the absolute most reliable pistols on the planet....far more durrable and reliable then any Kimber. There will soon be many people backing up what I just said.
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After 25 years of carrying just about everything. The Glock 19 is the best carry gun period! And the Glock 26 is a close second.
The only modification these guns need out of the box is maybe night sights. For carry ammo the G19 like Speer Gold dot 124gr. +P and the G26 like Corbon 115 gr. +P DPX load. For range use just about anything works. CCI Blaser 115gr. is cheap and the Glocks love it. 
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| +1 on a G19 for a great carry piece. I'd also recommend you consider an Ultra CDP in a good IWB holster such as a Galco Royal Guard. Since you commented on his attire being shorts and flip-flops, I feel compelled to add the following comments: IMHO, any CCW should be secured with a high quality belt (preferably one designed for the task), or, if front pocket carry is chosen a purpose built pocket holster should be used. |
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Glocks are great. I have a 19 and 26, and have carried the 26 for years.
Unfortunately, it's too heavy for shorts and pockets. Unless he wants to get an in-the-waistband holster, it won't work. I would recommend a nice air weight revolver. Lightweight, don't have to worry about sharp edges snagging, and dirt/lint won't jam it up 
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| Khar CW9 is in my opinion the best CCW around. It is light, thin and packed with 9mm goodness. It is comfortable to shoot, accurate and reliable to boot. The other plus is you can have it for about $350 which is only a little more than half what a g19 or S&W .357 would cost (I've had a G23 and S&W as well and much more prefer the Khar). check one out as it is an excellent gun. |
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I'm not a fan of extremely small pocket pistol like the Kel-Tec's and have not been impressed yet by their quality. I can say the same about the Kahr pistols as well.
In my honest opinion any caliber pistol below a 9mm is a "back-up" pistol at best. The ideal CCW pistol is what is called a "sub-compact" and is chambered for 9mm. The reasoning behind this is that a subcompact allows a good pistol grip and a long enough sight radius to draw and accurately fire the pistol under a stress situation where fine motor skills will be diminished. Most subcompact pistols come with adjustable backstraps as well to better accomodate the shooter's hand and the magazines are often used to allow extension serving as part of the lower grip for a better draw and grip. The 9mm round is not my "ideal" pistol round, but it is ideal in the case of a CCW pistol since it allows for more rounds to be carried and in the 147 grain JHP by the right manufacturer provides acceptable "stopping power" in my opinion. Once you start going up to the .40 S&W or .357 SIG you trade stopping power for the number of rounds and with a subcompact pistol you're already going to be carry very few rounds as it is with a 9mm. My CCW pistol is the Walther PPS in 9mm. 
The advantage to the Walther is as follows: 1. It has a very slim profile. This makes it less likely to "print" that similiar sub-compact pistols that have thicker profiles. 2. It has an adjustable backstrap. This allows a more ergonomic and custom fit to the individuals shooter. 3. It is short in overall length. Although now as short in overall length as some sub-compact pistols it is in my opinion the "ideal" length providing a long enough barrel and long enough relief between front and rear sight. |
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Now the things I don't like about the Walther PPS is the magazine release and the cost. It is also not the easiest to obtain holsters for.
I do recommend that you obtain an inside the waist band holster and train frequently in how to draw it wearing common clothing. I would also recommend NOT purchasing a level 2 holster, but sticking with a kydex level 1 holster for CCW that way only the tension is securing your pistol and there is nothing to do other than draw it out of the holster without trigger any special mechanism or unsnapping a botton. Wouldn't recommend pocket carry. Too likely he'll snag the pistol on the draw or the pant pocket will become bunched if he's wear loose fitting shorts or slacks. If he can't carry with a proper holster than it's best probably not to carry. Most in the wast band holsters now have sweat bands and guards and are very easy to put on and off once that becomes habits. Good Luck. |
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Quoted:
Newbie here but I need a question answered. My youngest son, 21, just got his CCH in Texas. I bought him Kimber Super Match 2 for his birthday. He (and I) just love it. Very nice pistol. One problem. It is just to big for him to carry with out wearing a jacket and guess what ,,,he`s a college student and wears flip flops and shorts virtually everywhere. I am asking all you long timers what size,cal,brand that you might suggest for him so that he can literally carry it in his front pocket with out any issues as to it not being "fully concealed". He is an excellent shot, long time hunter/fisher and has just scored a big "A" in his stat. class. I want to buy him the best available. Nothing changes on this issue over the years and you'll get people recommending every pistol under the sun that they like, but it still comes down to that you need to get out to the shops and see which one fits him best in grip, function and controls. People are different and different firearms are better for particular people while not someone else. I've found in shorts he's not going to have the support and cover up for a pocket pistol unless it's really small and there are always sucrifices. If he's wearing shorts with a good belt than as many people have found, myself included, one of your better carry rigs is a good sub compact in a IWB (in the waistband) holster. A spare mag doesn't hurt either in a good concealed quick draw pouch. All he needs to do is wear a tshirt and a buttoned cover shirt either unbuttoned or buttoned depending on the shirt thickness and how much it prints the pistols. I do it everyday and when it's colder and I can wear a jacket I carry my Beretta fullsizes. Thinner pistols print less, but they also carry less rounds and if you've only got a mag in and a spare that's not many if things get bad. .45 is a good round, but he'll get more in capacity out of 9mm and there are lots of quality defensive rounds these days to choose from. HydraShok's are a great place to start. So you got some recommendations to look at and you've got some carry options. It's just finding what's right for him. Since you both love the Kimber and he's used to the palm swell safety, I'd recommend you look at the Springfield Armory XD compacts and sub-compacts too. There a good pistol and Springfield is a very good company. The polymer frame are lighter and they use a melonite finish. XD sub-compact Holster option, Galco IWB Another IWB IWB mag pouch |
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I would recommend checking out one of the Smith J-frames, a Walther PPS, a Sig 239, a few different Kahrs, a Glock 26, a Ruger LCP, a Kel-Tec PF-9, and a Kel-Tec P3AT. You could also look into Smith's M&P Sub Compact, or a Springfield XD Sub Compact, or a Ruger SP101, or a Taurus or Charter Snubby.
The bottom line is there are many good choices. It is all about how it feels in the hands of the shooter once you get something that is 100 percent reliable. |
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Hammerless S&W J-Frame. I carry a 340PD, hardly know its there. Can be fired from concealment without worrying about the slide getting fouled.
Meaning, I can keep the gun in a jacket pocket, with my hand on it; I can also fire it from that location without having to worry about cloth or whatever getting caught in the slide, or about slide travel clearance for that matter. A LOT can go wrong shooting a magazine-fed semiauto from concealment/retention positions. IMO, when it comes to CCW, KISS wins. |
| All of you guys are GREAT. Thanks for all the input. I suppose my basic scenario is the ability of my son to protect himself in the event of a V-TECH shooter. He is a rather large framed young man ( 6-2 @185) with large hands. I think we`ll just go down to Ray`s in Dallas and let him try out ALL the options. I am a fan of semi`s as is he. That being said 9mm with an extra clip seems to be my solution as many of you mentioned. I have several but none would be suitable for "pocket carry" which due to his lifestyle is probably the only option at least for the next year or two. I know he`ll be happy to read all the input and we`ll make the best choice for him. I am new here but THRILLED to have access to all that the site has to offer. Thanks again. |
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My take is: if he's gonna pocket carry.....try the XD compact (but without a mag extension, it may be too small for his hands). The reason I say XD if it's gonna be pocket carried is that while I love Glocks, they are too easy to snag a trigger on while in your pocket and have it go off (unless you use a pocket style holster.....but that's sort of a holster IMO).
If it's gonna be holstered: XD9/XD40 or Glock 19/23. They always go bang, have good capacity in either 9mm or 40 S&W, are easily concealable on a guy your son's size, have decent sized grips, are considerably lighter than full steel frame pistols and are reasonably priced for the quality. Regardless, as other's have mentioned, everyone has a preference and you should get him down to a gun store/range to try out different ones and decide from there. Since it's a self defense pistol, my number one priority (and I believe your's should be too) is that it's 100% reliable. In my experience, Glock, HK, XD will all give that. I'm sure there are others....those are just the ones I've had experience with. As much as I like the feel and accuracy of various 1911 style pistols, in my experience, they have not been 100% reliable. Good luck and let us know what you end up with. Sean |
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For pocket carry I have used two S&W 360PDs with hammers bobbed (one in each pocket) for years. It never made sense to me to take the time to reload from a tiny speed strip when I can just draw a second weapon much faster. At just 12 oz. each my shorts stay up just fine.
MadDog 
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| Being a fellow college student I too have been considering going ahead and carrying on campus. Are you preparing for a law allowing it? or just saying screw it, I'm not going to be a victim or a bad guy, but when I need it, no one's going to bitch? Just curious... |
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Being a fellow college student I too have been considering going ahead and carrying on campus. Are you preparing for a law allowing it? or just saying screw it, I'm not going to be a victim or a bad guy, but when I need it, no one's going to bitch? Just curious... As the old saying goes, "Better to be tried by 12, than buried by 6". BTW if your in Texas and want CCW on campus then get your butt over to the hometown forum. There's a link to the phone #'s of the commitee members debating the bill. It stands a good chance of passing but is being held up by a nitwit RINO Sen. Duncan. |
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Thanks guys. My wife has a Glock 26 but it is TOO small for his hands. It hurts a bit to shoot it (me). I`ll keep thinking. I have large hands. I prefer large frame pistols. I routinely carry a G26 with the extended finger grip base on the magazines. It is uncomfortable to shoot without them for me. I would seriously consider trying them before giving up on the G26. It really is a good CCW piece. I.C. |
| Again, THANKS TO ALL, my son is taking finals now and won`t be home for another week or so. We`ll take our time on this. He has ZERO experience with any wheel gun but listening here and thinking about it the reliability isssue of semi`s "getting caught" in his pocket is a concern. I`m thinking hammerless may be the way to go and just let him train & train till he`s used to it. I have been active with the campus carry issue here in Texas and will ramp it up today. These kids need the same mindset about weapons that we all grew up with. Guns are a tool,,,period. |
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Again, THANKS TO ALL, my son is taking finals now and won`t be home for another week or so. We`ll take our time on this. He has ZERO experience with any wheel gun but listening here and thinking about it the reliability isssue of semi`s "getting caught" in his pocket is a concern. I`m thinking hammerless may be the way to go and just let him train & train till he`s used to it. I have been active with the campus carry issue here in Texas and will ramp it up today. These kids need the same mindset about weapons that we all grew up with. Guns are a tool,,,period. FWIW...my pocket carry is this 
S&W 37...or 36...can never keep the model numbers straight. It's a 5 shot J-frame 38 made back in the 70s or 80s. As you can tell it's got the meat hook on it, and to be honest it's not much of an issue to draw it either. You just adapt your draw so that your thumb stays on the spur (not pulling it back mind you) so it won't catch on anything. I picked it up in a gunshop for $250
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Quoted:
Again, THANKS TO ALL, my son is taking finals now and won`t be home for another week or so. We`ll take our time on this. He has ZERO experience with any wheel gun but listening here and thinking about it the reliability isssue of semi`s "getting caught" in his pocket is a concern. I`m thinking hammerless may be the way to go and just let him train & train till he`s used to it. I have been active with the campus carry issue here in Texas and will ramp it up today. These kids need the same mindset about weapons that we all grew up with. Guns are a tool,,,period. S&W 642 or 442. It is the tool you will never leave home w/ out. If you look around, you can get one w/ out the stupid S&W internal lock. Accountant |
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I have been contacting my people about the concealed law in TX.
Funny thing is in class next week I am being forced to debate on the issue of concealed carry on campus and because of my beliefs on the subject my professor is having me lead the opposing team. We may even have news coverage. So if you live in Tx and see a big white guy with dark hair and glasses at some college bitching bout why there shouldn't be guns on campus, remember this post before you hate me. |
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