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Posted: 4/19/2008 8:31:48 AM EDT
| I was wondering if the BATF allows stuff like mortars, Recoiless rifles etc. Probably registering a 37mm as a DD is the place to start on my NFA path but I want to know if I can aspire to one day own light artillery. |
Light artillery? You can legally own heavy artillery.  The only limit is explosive warheads, which each require registration as a DD in themselves. Jamee DeGroat at Armament Sales is selling his live US T8 90mm Anti-Tank Cannon with ammo & extras -- price on request, as they say. And Dangerous Bob has a trailer-mounted 3" Navy deck cannon for sale for $26k. There prolly are more live Lahti 20mm cannon in civilian hands than there are Colt Thompsons. The only problem is finding someplace to shoot them. 
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Here's a video of some of us locals shooting my NFA registered M2 60 mm mortar: youtube.com/watch?v=Qpj5_umBAPQ 
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That's because demand outstrips supply. Most of the live, uncut artillery and naval cannon are WWII veterans (or even older), and at the time they were decommissioned, they were worth more as scrap steel -- no one back then was buying live examples to shoot. Who was interested or rich enough to shoot a gun that required 15 pounds of gunpowder per shot? AFAIK, .gov stopped selling live DD to the public in the 1960s per policy. So you are left with the few that escaped the scrapyards before then, or the smaller Lahtis and pack cannon which were imported before GCA 1968 made all imported NFA into dealer samples. You can find a nice Lahti today for $10k, give or take. (I remember when you could buy them direct by mail-order for $200, pre-1968!) Pack cannon have increased the most in price because they are still relatively portable -- you can haul them with a pickup instead of needing a flatbed. But if I had the land, I would go for one of the big guys. A 90mm or a 3" Naval gun, for less than the price of a new car? C'mon, where are your priorities? 
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i can understand about the true "big boys" but even the smaller stuff, i had it all set to pick up a 203 but then a car wreck happened, even more common DD are over priced. look at the 203, i can buy a 37mm for what $300. but as soon as some one makes a copy in 40mm the price pops up to $1500 what i realy wanted was a m79 but its not even close to being worth 7-8k, 
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might just be me but i think if your going go thro the trouble of playing might as well go for the DD tax its only a extra $200 and paperwork ant a problem |
You've got it the wrong way around -- the $1,500 40mm is the milspec original; the 37mm is a cheap copy of the 40. After all, Noveske and Hesse both make AR15s, but there is the same difference in cost. You get what you pay for. Having seen a DD-registered 37mm M203 clone blow up and frag the operator at the Hernando shoot, I would not own one. I understand money is money, and we both work hard for it. When it comes to buying something that can remove my body parts, I would rather give the extra $$$ to the manufacturer up-front instead of the ER docs later. As always, Your Mileage May Vary. 
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I couldnt agree more. Problem is, I cant afford the ones that may ocassionally come up for sale and no one is reproducing any of them. Until I get out of college. It's stuck playing with 10lb 3" and 20lb 3.67" civil war parrott guns. |
I disagree. I love mine. Of course I went into it knowing how hot of loads it would take. 12ga would blow it apart at the barrel latch, yet I shoot lots of 20ga. As far as fun rounds, I shoot wood batons, marbles, bb's, rubber balls from gum machines or whatever else I can find laying around. You just have to know the limitations of loads. I'm not sure what incident you are speaking of but I have seen the pictures on Grog's board of the "binary product" being loaded in a 37mm which would be stupid to load in a 40mm round. It would have exploded in either. Granted, his hands and arms were screwed up worse due to the cheap launcher. Heck, reloading a .223 round too hot can cause catostrophic problems. reloading doesn't hurt people, stupid people doing stupid things hurts people. |
I will concede all your points. In fact, I can't remember if the Hernando ka-BOOM! involved a 40mm or a 37mm. All I know is that there was a lot of blood afterward, and the incident was rumored to involve handloading. Now I'm even more cautious about anything that starts its trajectory between my left hand and my right hand, up near my face. |
It can be done, but probably not wise to do. IF and ONLY IF you are just wanting to load some stuff in a 40mm casing isntead of 37mm, go right ahead. IF you are wanting to shoot real 40mm factory ammo...well, hope you won't miss a hand or an arm afterwards. I know of several who have either put 40mm barrels on 37mm underbarrels or simply bored the chamber out of a standalone (fed labs or similar gas gun) to accept a 40mm casing but the barrel was not bored, only the chamber. They did this because 40mm casings are much easier to come by than 37mm. Being that it can't actually shoot a 40mm round, they aren't even DD's. The entire key to DD's is to read, read and when you are done, read a little more. Not forums like this because there is much mis-information. REad a forum dedicated to the hobby such as Grog's. It's full of folks who have tried these things or are smart enough not to try some of them. You wouldn't reload a .223 round if you didn't know what you were doing right? Well don't screw with much larger rounds either. You wouldn't take a .223 brass and fill it to the rim with the hottest powder available so don't do it with 37mm or 40mm. Research and know what you are doing. Start MUCH smaller than what you even hear is ok. My first round only had around 15 grains of FF. I went from there and Now, depending on the payload and the casing, I load anywhere from 40 grains of FFF to 65 grains. It just depends on the weight of the projo, as well as the compression of the projo (how tight it's stuck in the casing). Of course if you get ahold of some booster casings (I can tell you how) you will only use around 25 grains of FFF. Smokeless boosters you ask? Yep, but if you put 25 grains of smokeless powder, you better be close to a hospital or morgue. My point is that you have to have some education on how to do this hobby. It's not something you just sit down and do one day. It's trial and error (hopefully not too much error) and you start very slowly and carefully. Now, all that being said, if you do it right (and carefully), it's a freakin blast to load up all sorts of strange household items and shoot it. |
Could you please specify this? I was having a conversation with a friend and was told that anything over like 6 grams or something was out of the question illegal etc etc.. I was under the impression that you could get 20mm Solothurn or 40mm Bofors HE rounds if you wanted but you had to pay the $200 tax for each HE projectile aswell. Is there a limit to the size of them, or is it just HE=$200 per head? |
lots of storage rules. Funny story, I looked at a property (500+- acres) just South of Jefferson yesterday and the lady said there was an explosives dump on part of the property. My first thought was maybe years ago Lone Star dumped some old demiled ammo there or something since they aren't far away but turns out, Austin Powder Co. had 4 shipping containers modified to be used as explosive containers out in the middle of the property. Austin Powder leased this little spot from the owners. I would have LOVED to been there when they open them up. |
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