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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Expensive Loading (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 10/9/2016 12:27:19 PM EDT
| (I'm not a reloader so I'm sorry if I get the lingo wrong) So I understand if your a competitive shooter you would load your own rounds, but what about normal guys like me? I was going to buy a press to save money but after adding up the cost it looks like I can buy ammunition cheaper than I can buy the components. This all started because I bought a .458 Socom and thought I would save money by reloading. When I started looking up prices of projectiles/bullets I couldn't believe how expensive they are. In some cases 20 bullets costs just as much as 20 rounds using those same bullets. Is this an issue of I can't buy in enough bulk to make the components cheap or what? Granted I avoid paying shipping and if I reuse my brass, it still seems like more of a hobby thing and not a cost save thing. Especially when you factor how many rounds I have to shoot to recoup the cost of the lress and other supplies. I thought I would look to see what some cheaper more common round I own would cost (5.56 nato & 32acp). Using Midsouths website 5.56 would be around 51 cents which is more than I py on bulkammo.com. 32acp was lso cheaper. Am I missing something here? Am I going to the wrong place to get supplies? |
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I don't have the time to do the math, nor do I care to.
My dad loads his own stuff. Carefully measuring everything, making sure everything is to spec... For the time he spends doing that, I can click a button and order 1,000 rounds and then go cut the grass. I get it, if you want a round dialed in, fine, go nuts. I also get the tin foil hat idea that "what if you cannot buy it in the stores anymore and have to make bullets on your own." But, do you think there would be restrictions placed on ammunition and they wouldn't cover gun powder? It wasn't a month or so ago that the ATF raised a stink about gunpowder. |
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You can buy once fired surplus 5.56mm brass for around .07 cents each. You'll need to resized, remove the military primer crimp and trim before it's useable.
Match grade bullets, purchased in bulk go from 8 cents to 18 cents a piece. Primers are 3.5 cents a piece. Powder (for 5.56mm) is less than 10 cent per round. The brass can be reloaded another four times easily before it's trash. If you get five reloads the brass ends up costing 1.5 cents per loading. You will have to buy a lot of equipment and none (of the good stuff) is cheap. It is labor intensive. Self-sufficiency has it's own rewards as does making better ammo than you can buy at the store. When posting, use double spacing between thoughts so it's easier to read. More people will respond to your post if the don't have to fight to read it. |
| Before you ever hit the "savings" point on reloading you'll have to reload tens of thousand's of rounds. Not kidding. If you're looking at reloading only from a cost savings stand point it's not a good idea for the average shooter. Most folks don't shoot enough rounds in a year to justify the cost of equipment and components. For a while my wife, my son, and myself shot competition twice a month. That's what got me into reloading. The cost savings paid for the equipment in about 3 years. Now I have the ability to load 50 rounds of .40 S&W for about $6.50. More over, I can make custom ammunition for each of my guns to serve different purposed that I can't buy commercially. I don't think many will argue that custom reloaded bullet will shoot more accurately that off the shelf ammo. Assuming the reloader know their stuff. I spend more money on components then I used to spend of ammo, but I'm shooting twice or three times as many custom rounds. Hope this helps. |
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Reloading isn't for everyone. But never have I encountered a scenario where it was absolutely cheaper to buy loaded rounds, especially in match or specialty configurations. (Maybe an awesome 1 time sale somewhere would prove me wrong)
458 cal bullets are expensive. The socom brass is proprietary. But the primers and powder are not special. The 458 socom is a spendy little round regardless. I can't wrap my mind around sending $3-5 downrange every trigger pull. So I reload. 9mm $.10 cpr 45 $.16 cpr 38special $.10 cpr 357 mag $.13 cpr (got a sweet deal on projectiles recently) 300 rsaum $.37- $1.00 cpr (depending on bullet choice, Barnes all copper is spendy too) If it's not for you, buy factory ammo and sell your brass to us. That would help offset your costs, especially 458 socom brass. |
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I don't think many will argue that custom reloaded bullet will shoot more accurately that off the shelf ammo. I agree. If you can dial in a round for your gun, it will be more accurate (in general) than a box bought in a store. I know this stands true for my 700. It is a time and volume issue for me. Good luck. |
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Look into bullet casting and powder coating. I use old wheel weights and range scrap for lead. I'm shooting 9mm and 45acp cheaper than I can buy .22lr.
The trick to saving money in reloading is to order in bulk from the cheapest supplier. Cabelas has S&B primers for $25, but it sometimes goes down to $20 on sale. Powder Valley is still one of the best for bulk powder and primers but you have to order enough to offset the hazmat cost. See if a friend can go in on a order if it helps. If you don't want to get into bullet casting, buying cast bullets are still a great way to save money. Shooting rifle rounds are expensive either way but I still save money by reloading while getting more accurate results. As an example, entry grade .308 hunting rounds are at least a $1 a round. Reloading can easily get down to $.65 a round using midgrade bullets. |
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It's not for everyone for sure. You could get started with everything on a single stage for around 400.00.
Then you need components too. More $$. The 458 seems to be one that begs to be reloaded. Just depends on your level of commitment, reloading is a precision hobby, and it takes time. My presses have more than paid for themselves over the years, but I shoot a lot. |
| My son and I put less than 1,000 rounds down range a year, and most are 5.56, 9mm, or 40s&w. Maybe 40 rounds of 458, 200rds of 300blk, and 5rds of 300weatherby mag. It might take 20 years to offset the cost of buying a rock chucker select kit. I just wanted to save a little money over time by reloading the rifle rounds. I probably won't put 1,000 rounds through my 458 in my lifetime. |
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Savings come in to play but not always. My .223/5.56 rounds cost me $.35 each but I am using hornady 75 grain match bullets. I save on rounds loaded with the same or similar bullets but can buy blaster ammo cheaper if accuracy isn't an issue.
In handgun the big savings come from reusing your brass and/or if you touch off magnum/odd rounds. My 45 colt loads cost me $.17 reusing brass cheapest I have found otherwise is $.70 each. That round alone paid for my setup in less than a year the rest in money for more shooting. |
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You will save about $2 per round if you reload. Starting with nothing, you can pay for an awesome reloading set up in as little as 250 rounds.
Some arithmetic: BRASS: $0.074 ($0.74/piece with 10 loads) https://www.midwayusa.com/product/941591224/starline-reloading-brass-458-socom BULLET: $0.18 https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1016226330/rainier-leadsafe-bullets-45-caliber-458-diameter-350-grain-plated-flat-nose PRIMER: $0.03 each https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1301332027/cci-small-pistol-primers-500 POWDER: $0.11 https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1009326035/hodgdon-h110-smokeless-gun-powder TOTAL: $.394/round LOADED AMMUNITION: $2.50/round https://www.midwayusa.com/product/268259/sbr-ammunition-458-socom-300-grain-hornady-interlock-round-nose-box-of-20 COST DIFFERENCE: $2.11 per round. |
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My son and I put less than 1,000 rounds down range a year, and most are 5.56, 9mm, or 40s&w. Maybe 40 rounds of 458, 200rds of 300blk, and 5rds of 300weatherby mag. It might take 20 years to offset the cost of buying a rock chucker select kit. I just wanted to save a little money over time by reloading the rifle rounds. I probably won't put 1,000 rounds through my 458 in my lifetime. You probably shoot more pistol ammo than anything. 9 and 40 are cheap, sort of, loaded. But pistol ammunition is the easiest stuff to reload. And the most frustrating to reload on a single stage. A Dillon square deal is super easy and pretty fast, but it is only for pistol ammo. Getting into one would be more than your years ammo budget, but you have to think long term to see the savings in ammo. Or shoot a lot more. Like I said, it's not for everyone, but it works well for me. |
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Especially in rifle rounds, I think most get into home reloading for precision and accuracy at about the same price as a lot of off-the-shelf ammo.
OP you mention 5.56 bulk ammo. IMO any decently home loaded ammo is going to shoot better than most any 5.56 bulk ammo. While it's not odd that bulk ammo in 5.56/.223 usually shoots pretty crummy compared to say a 68g HPBT match bullet, I find it surprising how well home loaded ammo in that same 68g bullet shoots in a cheap barrel. You have the ability to tune ammo to your guns that you never get with off-the-shelf. I guess it all depends on what you're trying to accomplish...good-enough blasting or precision. You also get to make combinations of bullet, case, and powder that is never available commercially. |
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I saved brass for years. I have 9mm brass from the early 90's.
I would think about reloading, do the math, and hold out and go buy more ammo. One day I looked at my brass pile, did more math, and figured if I spent $1000 on equipment, and components, and loaded all the brass twice, Im even. Five yeays ago when everyone was lining up at walmart every morning hoping to get some ammo,... I was shooting. 
Once I started with the 300 Blackout, I could actually see a savings. The cheapest 300 ammo local is about $25 a box. Loading coated lead, I can knock them out for under $5 I picked up NEW brass, and was loading Barnes 110gr, for 1/2 the cost as new Barnes loads. You have to look at the big picture. |
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Do it because you are interested in doing it. I don't concern myself with calculating equipment cost into my savings. If you decide you longer want to do it, you can sell the equipment and recoup most of that expenditure. In some cases, you can sell it for more than what you paid, depending on when you bought and where you bought.
In most cases, you will save money per round. You just have to learn to research, sign up for newsletters, wait for sales, and look for people selling their stuff. |
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I started loading for Hi Power Rifle competition I needed Quality ammo that I could afford ( the only fliers are my fault ) Some load as a hobby ( it is time consuming ) If you are thinking about loading to save money, you will not, unless you shoot thousands of rounds a year, and then, if you add in your time you save nothing at all |
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I got into reloading because I enjoy shooting older firearms chambered for obsolete or difficult to find cartridges. I don't reload 9mm or 5.56. I like load .30 Luger, 30 Mauser, .44 special, .44 mag, .38 ACP, 9mm largo, .348 Win, 30-40 krag, .300 h&h, 45-70, .45 Auto Rim, etc. One cannot just order some of these in bulk from SGAmmo.
Guys that just load 5.56 and 9mm I don't get. But if you like .348 Win then you have no choice. |
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I don't have the time to do the math, nor do I care to. My dad loads his own stuff. Carefully measuring everything, making sure everything is to spec... That's one way to do it, but not the only way or even the best way. For the time he spends doing that, I can click a button and order 1,000 rounds and then go cut the grass. I get it, if you want a round dialed in, fine, go nuts. I also get the tin foil hat idea that "what if you cannot buy it in the stores anymore and have to make bullets on your own." But, do you think there would be restrictions placed on ammunition and they wouldn't cover gun powder? It wasn't a month or so ago that the ATF raised a stink about gunpowder. I've never really understood the concept of someone who's never done something, as in a hobby or past time, telling someone else they shouldn't do it either. Quoted:
I don't have the time to do the math, nor do I care to. My dad loads his own stuff. Carefully measuring everything, making sure everything is to spec... That's one way to do it, but not the only way or even the best way. For the time he spends doing that, I can click a button and order 1,000 rounds and then go cut the grass. I get it, if you want a round dialed in, fine, go nuts. I also get the tin foil hat idea that "what if you cannot buy it in the stores anymore and have to make bullets on your own." But, do you think there would be restrictions placed on ammunition and they wouldn't cover gun powder? It wasn't a month or so ago that the ATF raised a stink about gunpowder. I've never really understood the concept of someone who's never done something, as in a hobby or past time, telling someone else they shouldn't do it either. Quoted:
Before you ever hit the "savings" point on reloading you'll have to reload tens of thousand's of rounds. Not kidding. If you're looking at reloading only from a cost savings stand point it's not a good idea for the average shooter. Absolutely not true. If you're ONLY loading really popular cartridges such a .223, 7.62x39, 9mm, 40 S&W, et al, it will certainly take longer to pay for equipment because ammunition such as this is produced in larger quantity and is therefore less expensive, but not anywhere close to "tens of thousand's of rounds". A mistake most potential handloaders seem to make is thinking they have to go out and buy a brand-spanking new reloading kit. Buy good, used equipment. RCBS comes to mind because I'm using the same press my father bought in the early '70's and I've used it infinitely more than he did. ($65 - $75 used) Some of the dies I'm using were handed down from him and will still be in use generations from now. ($35 +/- used) My beam scales were produced when magnetic dampening was first put in to use 35+ years ago. ($15 - $25 used) The RCBS powder measure on my bench likewise was my fathers, purchased in the '70's.($45 - $55 used) A powder trickler, a lube pad and lube and you have the basic equipment for <$200. I've found that really, if one has to ask, they probably shouldn't reload. |
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Get back to us on Nov 9, when all your ammo sites say "out of stock, no backorder"
Do you not remember 2012, and empty ammo shelves??? I have tools and supplies to make ammo when the shelves are empty. And if Hillary wins, you can bet they will be empty. and possibly illegal. |
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Get back to us on Nov 9, when all your ammo sites say "out of stock, no backorder" Do you not remember 2012, and empty ammo shelves??? I have tools and supplies to make ammo when the shelves are empty. And if Hillary wins, you can bet they will be empty. and possibly illegal. That kind of makes no sense. Primers, powder and bullets will also be out of stock. Sure, you can stock up now. But you can also stock up on a few cases of ammo now. |
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That's another concern. Spend a grand buying a set-up then Hillary makes it illegal for normal folks to buy gunpowder, or tax the hell out of it and brass. I got nothing but time so maybe I'll give it a go. You certainly do not have to spend a grand to give it a go. Some people like to spend gobs of money, but really to try it out, learn the ropes, get a Lee or a used single stage, 1 die set for your caliber, and a scale, and get learning. $150. I have spent a lot on supplies, but I can make a lot of ammo, and not sure how they might figure on trying to confiscate powder and primers. The Brits tried that in 1776, did not go well for them. |
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You certainly do not have to spend a grand to give it a go. Some people like to spend gobs of money, but really to try it out, learn the ropes, get a Lee or a used single stage, 1 die set for your caliber, and a scale, and get learning. $150. I have spent a lot on supplies, but I can make a lot of ammo, and not sure how they might figure on trying to confiscate powder and primers. The Brits tried that in 1776, did not go well for them. Quoted:
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That's another concern. Spend a grand buying a set-up then Hillary makes it illegal for normal folks to buy gunpowder, or tax the hell out of it and brass. I got nothing but time so maybe I'll give it a go. You certainly do not have to spend a grand to give it a go. Some people like to spend gobs of money, but really to try it out, learn the ropes, get a Lee or a used single stage, 1 die set for your caliber, and a scale, and get learning. $150. I have spent a lot on supplies, but I can make a lot of ammo, and not sure how they might figure on trying to confiscate powder and primers. The Brits tried that in 1776, did not go well for them. I second this suggestion there are lots to be had, you just have to look be patient, don't rush anything. |
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It would be hard not to save money reloading 458 Socom.
If you go all out it only costs ~10-15 cents per round. Calculate the savings of that against buying factory ammo and you would have to be making a hell of a lot more money than me to not make it worthwhile. 
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There's a "satisfaction" and "hobby" aspect to it that helps negate the time put into reloading.
Cost depends on what and how often you shoot. A case of .223 goes for about $400 - $420 where I live. To reload 1,000 rounds 223 you need just shy of 4 lbs powder - about $90. I recently bought an 8 lb container of CFE223 for $152, so that comes out to $76 per 1,000 rounds 1,000 small rifle primers = $35 1,000 once fired Lake City brass on Gunbroker = $70 1,000 Hornady 55 gr FMJBT bullets = $72 That adds up to $253 for a savings of $150. If you recover the brass from the range you save $220. There's the initial investment and a learning curve (I'm still on the curve myself) so how long it takes to recover your investment depends on how much you shoot. I didn't go into it for the money, it's just something I want to learn as a hobby so didn't mind paying up front. You could get started for under $500 especially looking for deals. I bought the Rock Chucker Supreme kit on Amazon for $305 and RCBS is offering a $75 rebate through the end of the year so got it for $230. Kits don't have everything you need but they get you off to a good start. A Lee Die set is $35, media tumbler $75, Case Trimmer $30 - $80, and a bunch of small hand tools that come in handy that aren't too expensive (i.e primer pocket uniformer, primer pocket brushes, military crimp remover, etc). Then there's the time you put into it. You need time to learn and time to process brass and load. YouTube has a metric f#3kton of reloading videos that are a great resource. My favorite is a channel called "Hornady Loader". It's not an actual Hornady channel, just a guy who's been reloading forever that goes into great detail (who happens to like Hornady) so is great for a beginner. |
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My son and I put less than 1,000 rounds down range a year, and most are 5.56, 9mm, or 40s&w. Maybe 40 rounds of 458, 200rds of 300blk, and 5rds of 300weatherby mag. It might take 20 years to offset the cost of buying a rock chucker select kit. I just wanted to save a little money over time by reloading the rifle rounds. I probably won't put 1,000 rounds through my 458 in my lifetime. In your case you should be looking at a LEE press. But 1000 rounds per year is consumer territory, you might as well buy factory ammunition if it is available. The other side of that is access to ammunition, most of us here never stopped shooting completely during the starvation times of 2008 and 2012 through 2014. Plus I shoot at least two cartridges that aren't available at all as factory ammunition, and own a rifle for another one that doesn't get shot. |
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.... In some cases 20 bullets costs just as much as 20 rounds using those same bullets.... Do you buy a six pack of beer before the weekend, only to run out and have to make another beer run? Do you wait for a good sale and grab a few cases? Or do you have a keg and tap set up in your man cave? Same applies for bullets, you can pay full retail for a small amount, wait for a sale and lay in a small supply, or make a large purchase and save some money. Unlike beer, bullets won't go bad 
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A big way money is saved is by using a cheaper coated pistol bullet as opposed to buying top shelf jacketed pistol bullets and also using brass many times over. These two items and company profits are your key ways to save moola. Bought in large 2000 round cases coated bullets can be found a lot cheaper than factory jacketed bullets.
Rifle rounds are usually jacketed so you can do a more direct comparison using factory loaded ammo and your component costs. You'll have to shoot a lot to save much money or be interested in what you can make your rifle do accuracywise. Shoot a 100 rounds a year, buy factory ammo. Shoot 2000/yr and reload. |
| I've been looking at the Rock Chucker Select kit and the Ultrasonic bath. Together they're about $700. Then dies, build a small bench, and other little odds and ends and I'll be there at about $1000. Sounds reasonable for what I've been told is the best single stage you can buy. A couple of people told the RockChucker would quality and consistency every time. They also told me not to use progressive loader if I'm doing specialty rifle rounds. |
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(I'm not a reloader so I'm sorry if I get the lingo wrong) So I understand if your a competitive shooter you would load your own rounds, but what about normal guys like me? I was going to buy a press to save money but after adding up the cost it looks like I can buy ammunition cheaper than I can buy the components. This all started because I bought a .458 Socom and thought I would save money by reloading. When I started looking up prices of projectiles/bullets I couldn't believe how expensive they are. In some cases 20 bullets costs just as much as 20 rounds using those same bullets. I posted detailed pricing in a previous post, above. Reloads were $0.40 versus $2.50 for the cheapest factory ammo. That's a savings of over $2 per round. You can buy and shoot any bullet you want and still save money. If your 458 SOCOM estimates are not saving you beau coups bucks, you are doing your estimating wrong. It's that simple. Is this an issue of I can't buy in enough bulk to make the components cheap or what? Granted I avoid paying shipping and if I reuse my brass, it still seems like more of a hobby thing and not a cost save thing. Especially when you factor how many rounds I have to shoot to recoup the cost of the press and other supplies. If you were to spend $500 on a reloading set up (press, dies, gages and tools), you break even after just 250 rounds. Spend $1k and your even after 50 rounds. I thought I would look to see what some cheaper more common round I own would cost (5.56 nato & 32acp). Using Midsouth's website 5.56 would be around 51 cents which is more than I pay on bulkammo.com. 32acp was also cheaper. Am I missing something here? Am I going to the wrong place to get supplies? My 223 reloads cost less than $0.50 per round for super-premium, match quality ammunition. That saves me over $0.50 per round. It is also about the cost of the cheapest ammo available. The difference is, my reloads are match quality. I don't shoot 32 ACP, so I can't comment on that pricing. I know my 45 ACP is cheaper than the cheapest I can buy online (or locally). |
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I've been looking at the Rock Chucker Select kit and the Ultrasonic bath. Together they're about $700. Then dies, build a small bench, and other little odds and ends and I'll be there at about $1000. Sounds reasonable for what I've been told is the best single stage you can buy. A couple of people told the RockChucker would quality and consistency every time. They also told me not to use progressive loader if I'm doing specialty rifle rounds. That is a very well equipped kit. Much better than the Master kit. I would get it if you want to buy new but I would pass on the ultrasonic cleaner. It offers zero advantage over a simple tumbler kit. If you really want to save money, get the following stuff used. It is what I am using right now, when I am not running the Dillon stuff. Even at new prices, you are looking at between $450 and $500, less with one of the frequent coupons for various sites. RCBS Rock Chucker LEE Perfect Powder Measure ($20 instead of $100 + that most others cost) RCBS Universal Hand Primer. You can save a few bucks by getting the standard one, but you will need to use the shell holders with it. You can also save even more money and prime on the press, but that will take longer. If you decide not to get a hand primer, make sure you pick up a flip tray. Trim Pro trimmer. I have upgraded mine with the 3 way cutters, but they are pricey. There are also several other trimming options that may be a little cheaper. Case mouth tool. Beam Scale. I am using a Dillon, but you can often find the RCBS 505 or 510 used at good prices. Stay away from the Lee beam scale. Frankford Arsenal Tumbler kit. Harbor Freight 6" digital calipers. Use the plastic trays from used ammo as loading blocks. Make your own case lube. Google home made case lube, you will find a bunch of stuff using Lanolin and alcohol. You may also want to get a powder trickler. Some people like to powder dump their loads a little light, and trickle them up to their desired weight. I prefer to set my powder dump where I want it. The Lee Perfect Powder measure allows me to do that because it is so consistent, if you are consistent when you cycle the handle. |
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.32 acp brass is hard to find, even if purchased once fired. It is tedious to reload because it's so small and the powder charges so light. I have the dies an saved cases but purchased several thousand CCI aluminum cased Blazer ammo in this caliber because it was cheap and available.
.32 acp would be second to the last round to consider for reloading. Last place goes to .25 acp. Anyone who has not experienced the accuracy improvement achieved in .223 with match grade bullets from Hornady, Nosler or Sierra don't know what they're missing. I stopped buying 55 grain FMJ's almost 30 years ago. The only time I will shoot them is if somebody gifts them to me. Match grade bullets shoot wonderfully even through standard rack grade barrels. |
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I loaded up hundreds of thousands of .45 ACP target loads for Bullseye competition.
I also have a Kelbly built varmint rifle. It is set up with bench rest techniques and scary accurate. When you factor in the wear on the barrel for each shot it costs around $0.60 each. At least $0.45 is barrel wear alone. Tight neck (100% turning required to chamber). Every shell measured for wall thickness variation and grouped before neck turning to 0.0100 Release space is 2.0 mils (0.0020 in). Brass life is excellent. All are annealed at the start and then after about 6 loadings annealed again. Never lost one for loose primers so pressures are not 'out of there.' Tha ability to match ammunition to your chamber and achieve the ultimate in accuracy is there. Or you can bang out some shorter rang ammunition with the accuracy level YOU want for the use of your choice. I hunted power lines cuts in the National Forest. Had a couple very nice spots that worked year after year. Fall down log cabin and the remains of an apple orchard. Small creek at the bottom of the draw. Sharp drop on one side to creek but very gradual on the other. Longest shot was under 300 yards. Just sit on the ground and wait in the evening. Deer (like humans) do not look up all that much. |
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I've been looking at the Rock Chucker Select kit and the Ultrasonic bath. Together they're about $700. Then dies, build a small bench, and other little odds and ends and I'll be there at about $1000. Sounds reasonable for what I've been told is the best single stage you can buy. A couple of people told the RockChucker would quality and consistency every time. They also told me not to use progressive loader if I'm doing specialty rifle rounds. Do not buy an ultrasonic cleaner as a beginning reloader. It simply is not necessary. A wet tumbler with stainless pins is not necessary. Both fall squarely into the "nice to have" bucket. If your sessions are limited to 50 to 100 rounds, you will do just fine by wiping the cases off with a rag and light solvent such as Hoppe's. This is the method that all of our forebears used up until vibratory tumblers became common in the 60's. The cases do not need to look like new, the outsides need to be clean before lubing and sizing so the sizer die does not get ruined. The carbon deposits in the interior of the case have no effect on the performance of the reloaded ammunition. If you want a more hands off cleaning approach, the small Lyman tumbler is $60 and the RCBS tumbler is $75 from Midway. That and a 5 pound bag of walnut will clean thousands upon thousands of cases if it's not allowed to get nasty with cleaning additives. (I would by the RCBS machine due to their customer service.) The advice about using a progressive press for precision ammunition is flatly not correct. However, I recommend a single stage press for new reloaders unless they are experienced mechanics on other machinery such as a packaging line. There's a lot going on to start and the new reloader needs to master each step. When all stations are working in a progressive, if something get out of whack on one, it can, or does, affect all the other operations. However, it is possible to learn on a progressive by simply working on one operation at at time. Plus, if you decide to continue loading and add a progressive press, a single stage press will always be useful. A Rock Chucker is a very good press. So are the Hornady, Redding, an Forster presses. The LEE Classic Cast Single Stage and the Classic Cast Turret presses are good; my main complaint with them is the wood ball on the operating handle, right after taking one out of the box, bond the handle on with a dab of epoxy. The Classic Cast Turret is a sort of hybrid, a press with an advancing turret and a fixed shell holder, and the advance feature is easy to disable for use in a single stage mode. Sitting at a single stage press to load 50 rounds in one session can be therapeutic, a good way to concentrate on something besides the outside world. It's all that is needed for 1000 rounds per year, and it's easy to load far more than 1000 rounds per year with one. Back to case cleaning for a second - A soak of the brass in a container of Lemishine solution will brighten the brass, especially if it is followed by a tumble in walnut with just a dab of case polish added (I use Graf's). But the shine left by an hour tumble in clean walnut is sufficient, after all, the cases are going to get dirty as soon as they are fired. None of the kits contain every tool needed, and frankly they contain stuff that I won't use, lube pads in particular. I would have to look at the contents of the current Rock Chucker kit to see which critical tools are missing now. The lists up in the Resources lay out exactly what is needed according to whether a person wants to start bare bones, go in ultra deluxe, or somewhere between. Finally - You have to get your feet wet in order to understand reloading. Initial reading is necessary, and asking questions from this good source is a good idea, and there is no substitute for hands on experience. Especially if your previous advice comes from someone that bought some stuff and assembled cartridges from "recipes", there is no worse advice available. |
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.32 acp brass is hard to find, even if purchased once fired. It is tedious to reload because it's so small and the powder charges so light. I have the dies an saved cases but purchased several thousand CCI aluminum cased Blazer ammo in this caliber because it was cheap and available. .32 acp would be second to the last round to consider for reloading. Last place goes to .25 acp. Anyone who has not experienced the accuracy improvement achieved in .223 with match grade bullets from Hornady, Nosler or Sierra don't know what they're missing. I stopped buying 55 grain FMJ's almost 30 years ago. The only time I will shoot them is if somebody gifts them to me. Match grade bullets shoot wonderfully even through standard rack grade barrels. I agree with this, .32 ACP is not easy to load for someone with experience, I had to do lots of rework, mostly because the die set contained the wrong seater stem for Gold Dot bullets. Before I finally caved and got a new stem from RCBS (no cost), I modified the one I had, but it was a pain to get it working right. I licked the charge weight issue by using a Lyman #55 thrower. I sold the gun, dies, brass, bullets, and loaded ammunition. Probably won't load .32 ACP again. |
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I can see the debate of reloading vs buying factory. I reload, have for about 5-6 years now. I cant think of how much ive "saved" *HA! saved... ive just used that savings and bought more components* but either way, the savings is there. my 308 rounds im shooting an easy .5 moa @ 100 yards. but just say MOA. normal factory precision ammo is an EASY $1 a round. i make mine for around $0.40. Factory 223, usually 300/1k is a good price. I make 1k for around $0.15 each (so about 1/2 price). 9mm, same thing. $200/1k factory but i make mine for about $100/1k. *and i am sure ill hear about it from other reloaders, but im not gong for EXTREME savings. I use to reload my 9mm and 223 for plinking but after i saw the few 1/10s grains more (and better powder) to get much better accuracy , ill take the slightly higher price for powder. (prefer xbr for 223).
now yeah. the press can cost you. from a cheap single stage to fancy now dillon 1050. it all depends on what you want to do and how much u want to make. I have a 550B and make everything on that. I am going to get a 650 for 9mm and 223, mostly cause ill make a min 1k a sitting, and on a 550b, while ok, the 650 would speed it up alot. |
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Depends what rounds you load. This is why I try to not shoot a gun that has rare brass.
For my 30-06 rounds using premium bullets I'm loading at $35 per 100 rounds. While those same factory loads would easily be $30-35 for 20 rounds. I shoot lead or coated lead in pistol rounds and can load for about $5-6 per 50 rounds. |
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If I reloaded 1000 rounds of each of the three of the most popular cartridges: 9mm; .45; and .223; my cost savings is ~$400.
More if I get into my precision and hunting rigs. Granted, I have roughly $2000 in equipment, but it's a hobby that's saved me some money. |
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To keep from getting this thread locked, I'll say that Mills Fleet Farm has a deal right now on a basic reloading package..
Reloader Special 5 Press Model 5-0-5 mechanical scale Speer reloading manual Universal case loading block Case lube kit Debur tool - .17 to .60 Powder funnel Small & medium case neck brushes Will not post links. If this is too on the line Dryflash, I can delete my post to keep it from getting locked |
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Quoted: To keep from getting this thread locked, I'll say that Mills Fleet Farm has a deal right now on a basic reloading package.. Reloader Special 5 Press Model 5-0-5 mechanical scale Speer reloading manual Universal case loading block Case lube kit Debur tool - .17 to .60 Powder funnel Small & medium case neck brushes Will not post links. If this is too on the line Dryflash, I can delete my post to keep it from getting locked Saying where is fine, hot links no so much. With a name anyone should be able to type that into a search engine and find what they want. |
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Quoted:
That kind of makes no sense. Primers, powder and bullets will also be out of stock. Sure, you can stock up now. But you can also stock up on a few cases of ammo now. Quoted:
Quoted:
Get back to us on Nov 9, when all your ammo sites say "out of stock, no backorder" Do you not remember 2012, and empty ammo shelves??? I have tools and supplies to make ammo when the shelves are empty. And if Hillary wins, you can bet they will be empty. and possibly illegal. That kind of makes no sense. Primers, powder and bullets will also be out of stock. Sure, you can stock up now. But you can also stock up on a few cases of ammo now. I reload 223 at 17cpr, factory ammo is about 32cpr for brass cased ammo. Given an equal budget I can stock up twice the components versus factory. This advantage is what helps reloaders get through draughts in supply better. I know some want to argue about the value of their time...I factory that time at the same rate I get paid to sit on the couch and watch TV. |
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I know some want to argue about the value of their time...I factory that time at the same rate I get paid to sit on the couch and watch TV. Very true. The same people who "don't have time" to reload think nothing of spending weekends in the recliner watching dudes in tight pants chase a piece of pigskin up and down a field and also have tens of.thousands of posts on Internet forums. |
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Quoted:
I reload 223 at 17cpr, factory ammo is about 32cpr for brass cased ammo. Given an equal budget I can stock up twice the components versus factory. This advantage is what helps reloaders get through draughts in supply better. I know some want to argue about the value of their time...I factory that time at the same rate I get paid to sit on the couch and watch TV. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Get back to us on Nov 9, when all your ammo sites say "out of stock, no backorder" Do you not remember 2012, and empty ammo shelves??? I have tools and supplies to make ammo when the shelves are empty. And if Hillary wins, you can bet they will be empty. and possibly illegal. That kind of makes no sense. Primers, powder and bullets will also be out of stock. Sure, you can stock up now. But you can also stock up on a few cases of ammo now. I reload 223 at 17cpr, factory ammo is about 32cpr for brass cased ammo. Given an equal budget I can stock up twice the components versus factory. This advantage is what helps reloaders get through draughts in supply better. I know some want to argue about the value of their time...I factory that time at the same rate I get paid to sit on the couch and watch TV. The original statement still makes no sense. Nobody is arguing that it can be cheaper to reload. But if you don't shoot that much, it can make just as much sense to stock on a couple to a few cases of ammo. And if the shelves are empty, the shelves are empty. You got what you need, so it doesn't matter. If they come after the ammo, they are going to come after the components as well. |
I could not afford to shoot my surplus guns like my Garands, and the like. I like to grab a 50 cal can of enblocks and head to the range, or a can of 223 so my boy can shoot his AR. It is satisfying to fill a can or two with reloaded ammunition and toss it on the shelf next to the other six. 
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I pretty well cover cost of new DILLON 650 some 10yr ago loading 147gr for suppressor use.. think the number was around (4000) handload 9mm 147 FMJ.... this was back when Alabama Ammo was the fad for suppressor ammo (Special - K) ... I didnt buy into it..
Loading 45acp with lead will recoup your tooling expenses real fast.. I load my 30-06 165gr hunt ammo in my own prepped cases for 55-60% less than store bought ammo.. |
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Quoted:
To keep from getting this thread locked, I'll say that Mills Fleet Farm has a deal right now on a basic reloading package.. Reloader Special 5 Press Model 5-0-5 mechanical scale Speer reloading manual Universal case loading block Case lube kit Debur tool - .17 to .60 Powder funnel Small & medium case neck brushes Will not post links. If this is too on the line Dryflash, I can delete my post to keep it from getting locked That really isn't that good of a deal. Based on the original price, and the picture, the press is bottom of the line, not the Reloader Special, and most people won't use all the stuff in that kit long term, if at all. If I were to order that kit, I would verify it comes with the Reloader Special, not the the Partner, which is what is pictured. I tried crossing part numbers to other kits, but can't find any matches. If that kit comes with the Partner press, they would be just as well off getting the Lee Anniversary kit. It comes with a hand primer and a powder measure, in addition to the stuff above. Although, I don't recommend the Lee beam scale. Maybe it was just the one I had, but mine read about 2 grains different than my other scales or check weights. |
[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Expensive Loading (Page 1 of 2)
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