Armory Sponsor
Posted: 12/7/2008 6:52:19 PM EDT
|
I'm not looking to spend an arm and a leg on a kit, but I want something that is efficient. This will be my first time reloading rifle ammunition (.223). I don't need all the bells and whistles either. I'm looking at a few of Lee's basic kits. Would any of these suffice without anything extra being purchased? What can I purchase to measure the ammo length? Please, only give suggestions/advice if you've used these. I don't want a bunch of hear-say forum product bashing info. Thanks.
www.ableammo.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=54890 www.ableammo.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=54894 www.ableammo.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=104971 |
|
http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=104971
Lee anniversary kit. Link not working for me either. Lots of edits. ClayWagner, just name the kit, there are people around here that will know the various kits and advise. Read the Forum Resources at the top of the page, find the one about buying reloading tools. |
| Can't see the press you're considering because the links don't work. If you're just loading a few rounds at a time a single stage press is fine. If you like to shoot alot and load a couple of hundred rounds before you go to the range you might consider a progressive press. I started out with a Hornady LnL and have been very happy. If you want to measure accuracately you'll likely end up with calipers. They work for lots of things. I have an RCBS digital because it has a BIG easy to see read out. As far as extras, you're going to need a lot of tools to reload safely and accurately. You'll need something to clean your case, a case trimmer, champer/dedurring tool, crimp reamer, powder scale, calipers, case guage (a must for ARs), bullet puller, pocket cleaner, and several reloading manuals. And this is a basic short list. |
|
Speaking of LEE kits............
.........the Lee Breech Lock Press 50th Anniversary Kit #90050 ($88.99).......it's a standard press and it comes with a scale, powder measure/hopper, primer seater tool, plus a few extras. Sounds like everything except for the dies ($22.59) and brass trimming case length gauge ($4.59). Total $116.17 w/o shipping.
Or, the kit that I prefer........the Lee Breech Lock Press Challenger Kit #90030 ($100.79).......it's just like the 50th Anniversary Kit but it has a separate hand primer tool w/ a variety of shell holders. Then, I'll need to add dies ($22.59) and brass trimming case length gauge ($4.59). Total $127.97 w/o shipping. I could add a LEE manual ($12.99) or I could just use the supplied data sheet that comes with the LEE dies. BTW, LEE prices vary, so shop around. And, I'm not mentioning where I saw these prices (as of 12-5-08) because, the seller was "out of stock" on some of the items mentioned. And, there is always USED equipment. HTH. Aloha, Mark PS.........checkout the kits here...... http://www.leeprecision.com/cgi/catalog/browse.cgi Don't buy at RETAIL prices. Shop Around. |
|
Sorry, I was trying it on someones IPhone. Here they are. I plan on shooting ~150-200 rounds each time I go out (2-4/month). Looks like all I need is a case gauge. What do you use to clean the brass without a tumbler?
http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=54890 http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=54894 http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=104971 |
|
Using a progressive the first time out..............can be "troublesome" for some.
Of course, some folks have done it w/ a progressive press to start. But, IMHO........... As a "first press," get a bench mounted single station press. LEARN the techniques of adjustments and "problem solving." Later, IF/WHEN, you want more production......consider a progressive press. Aloha, Mark PS.......I have three (9mm, 38 special/.357 mag, and 45 ACP) Lee M1000 presses (pre Pro 1000) they work real well for straight wall pistol cases. Some folks have found it difficult to use. Such is personal experience. YMWV. All the more reason to LEARN on a single station press. 
|
|
What can I purchase to measure the ammo length?
A Digital Caliper from Harbor Freight is "good enough" considering the price of under $17.00 when on sale. But, if you were speaking about checking your brass re-sizing.........then, I'd suggest a simple and cheap, Wilson Style gauge. http://www.sinclairintl.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?category=REMTHT&type=store HTH. Aloha, Mark |
|
I think I'll do that. After reading around it seems learning on a single stage is most ideal. I've loaded shotgun ammo for a couple years, but that apples to oranges. looks like all I need is a case gauge and die with this kit. Simple and on the cheap side too. I'm still curious though, how do you clean cartridges without a tumbler?
http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=104971 |
|
Clean brass w/o a tumbler?
1) Inspect and clean the cases. I use a liquid brass cleaner (Birchwood Casey # 33845 CCI). Follow the mixing instructions on the package. After the soak/cleaning, the cases are removed from the solution, rinsed and air dried. The solution is re-usable. IF, you want to use an oven for drying, use the lowest heat setting.
Why a liquid brass cleaner? Well, it eliminates the need to buy a tumbler (or vibratory machine). I don’t have to buy media and I save on electricity. There is the added bonus of no noise and/or dust in my work space. And, if I were to tumble/clean de-primed brass, I would have to worry about stuck media in primer pockets and flash holes. I clean (and inspect) brass as a first step. Then later, I'll clean brass again, after I'm finished with the re-size step. To get the lube off. And, IF you want to save even more $. You can just wash your brass in hot water with a little dish detergent and vinegar added to the water. The amount of the mix ain't critical. The brass doesn't have to glint in the sun to be "clean." Aloha, Mark |
| Thanks, Mark. I thought it was a necessity, but I guess it's more of a recommendation. I actually think I'm going with the Lee Progressive 223 Kit (found for ~$145). It appears I should also get a double disk kit while I'm at it. I figured I didn't want to spend 8 hours a week on loading 200 rounds, plus I have experience in reloading. Any thoughts/suggestions? |
|
Quoted:
Thanks, Mark. I thought it was a necessity, but I guess it's more of a recommendation. I actually think I'm going with the Lee Progressive 223 Kit (found for ~$145). It appears I should also get a double disk kit while I'm at it. I figured I didn't want to spend 8 hours a week on loading 200 rounds, plus I have experience in reloading. Any thoughts/suggestions? Lee says........ Load Master & Pro 1000 difference
The Main difference between the Load Master and the Pro-1000 is that the Load Master is designed to handle rifle and pistol, and the Pro 1000 is designed primarily for pistol cartridges, but will reload rifle cartridges up to 2 5/16" in overall length. The Load Master is a five station press, the Pro 1000 is three. Both include automatic indexing, automatic primer feed and case feed, and both can be fitted with an automatic bullet feed. Both come set up with everything you need to start loading the caliber chosen. People who wish to load rifle or use the Lee Carbide Factory Crimp dies for handgun loading opt for the Load Master. Caliber changer overs for both presses can be done in less than five minutes. The Load Master is a little more costly to purchase and to change calibers. Both presses are designed for experienced reloaders. That is not to say that a first time reloader shouldn't order one, but one should have good mechanical aptitude to start with a progressive. IIRC, with the .223 LEE Pro kit, the powder measure may be somewhat of a limiting factor. Yes, you may need to buy the add on double disk kit. Contact LEE to double check. And, IF you plan on changing calibers to a longer cartridge (than 2 5/16") or IF you want to use the LEE FCD..........don't get the LEE Pro. Aloha, Mark PS........... LEE 4275 HIGHWAY U HARTFORD WISCONSIN 53027 262-673-3075 Voice 262-673-9273 FAX For a review of the LEE Pro 1000........ http://www.geocities.com/leereloading/leepresses.htm |
|
Hmm...It's a pickle. I'm really not sure what to get. I guess the Load Master would make my options bigger. I plan on getting a Dillion, but way in the future. I want to use 55 gr M-193 bullets and CCI primers, not sure which powder yet. Any suggestions on what and where to get the reloading components? Is there also a place for used reloading equipment besides the EE? I never seem to see presses selling there.
Thanks |
|
Quoted:
.... What can I purchase to measure the ammo length? Please, only give suggestions/advice if you've used these. I don't want a bunch of hear-say forum product bashing info. I have used a Dillon dial caliper to measure for years. They work great. The dial type are perfectly fine. I find that case guages are best for judging the resizing, but for overall length and trim length I use the dial calipers. |
|
I want to use 55 gr M-193 bullets and CCI primers, not sure which powder yet. Any suggestions on what and where to get the reloading components?
I'd buy a pound first (locally).......H335 or W748 would be my first choices (since it's ball powders). In fact, in order to save on haz mat fees.......I'd buy all of my 1 pound cans locally. Experiment, to find out what powder you and your rifle likes. Then, IF I liked a certain powder.......I'd consider a #8 keg. BTW........I've found that buying an 8 lb can at Sportsman's Warehouse (w/coupon, $10 off) is close enough to Internet prices (w/ haz mat fees & shipping). YMWV. HTH. Aloha, Mark |
| I think I will use CCI primers, 55 gr M193 bullets, and TAP powder. Are these efficient and inexpensive choices for reloading components? Where's the best place to buy from? Midway? Is it an absolute necessity to get calipers over a case gauge? Where are some places to get used presses? Gunbroker.com? I still don't know if I want the single-stage or load master progressive...any comments/suggestions on people who've used both or have constructive criticism would be greatly appreciated. I would like the freedom to delube and further investigate the casings between operations for the single-stage, not to mention it is inexpensive and less parts. Then again, time is very important to me which makes the progressive more appealing. |
|
I tried giving away a full Lee single Loader set (first set I ever owned) when I moved about a year and a half ago. Nobody would even take it, so it went into the local landfill. If I still had it I would send it to you free of charge.
It was a good set to start and learn on. But you will quickly want to upgrade. I would at least get a Redding Uniflow powder measure. The lee measure will be the first thing you want to upgrade. Trust me. |
|
Quoted:
I think I will use CCI primers, 55 gr M193 bullets, and TAP powder. Are these efficient and inexpensive choices for reloading components? Where's the best place to buy from? Midway? Is it an absolute necessity to get calipers over a case gauge? Where are some places to get used presses? Gunbroker.com? I still don't know if I want the single-stage or load master progressive...any comments/suggestions on people who've used both or have constructive criticism would be greatly appreciated. I would like the freedom to delube and further investigate the casings between operations for the single-stage, not to mention it is inexpensive and less parts. Then again, time is very important to me which makes the progressive more appealing. When learning, Just follow the book. Probably the best book out there for beginners is the Hornady Book. Sinclair International sells the best case / bullet gages, but they are pricey and you are just learning. Look for a stoney point gage on E-bay. It will do everything you need and then some. |
|
I think the Lee Classic Turret press would be the way to. It works as a semi-progressive, but can be used as a single stage.
The single stage operations have always been a little tedious for me. I have the Loadmaster, and when it is running smoothly it puts the rounds out. But it has it's quirks, especially the priming system. Some sessions it works great, others keeps me constantly cussing. The turret press seems to be the best compromise by keeping things simple. Yes, i have experience with all three of the above mentioned Lee products. I never tried the 1000 series though, it only has three stations and i need at least 4 stations. The loadmaster i actually use all five holes in the turret- 1. Decap die 2. Hollow size die over priming station 3. Powder through expander die 4. Seating die 5. Factory crimp die Check out this video of the turret press in use: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zOpN9iYOyE8 |
|
Quoted:
I think I will use CCI primers, 55 gr M193 bullets, and TAP Tac powder. Are these efficient and inexpensive choices for reloading components? Start with Hornaday 55 gr FMJBT, same but better than "M193 bullets" Tac is a great choice, cases use Win, Rem, LC, WCC, PMC, S&B, ect. The only bad choice is FC and Americ. Primers, CCI 400, Win SR, Rem 7 1/2, Wolf SRM, or Wolf "223 rem". Get a quality reloading manual, Hornaday, Sierra, Speer. Get the same brand as the bullets you are using. Where's the best place to buy from? Midway? Many choices, Midway is good. Is it an absolute necessity to get calipers over a case gauge? Get both, you will need both. Where are some places to get used presses? Gunbroker.com? Local fun show. I still don't know if I want the single-stage or load master progressive...any comments/suggestions on people who've used both or have constructive criticism would be greatly appreciated. Many have started with a Dillon 550 progressive. It can be used as a single stage until you are up to speed. Nothing wrong with a single stage press, I have both and use both. I would like the freedom to delube and further investigate the casings between operations for the single-stage, not to mention it is inexpensive and less parts. Then again, time is very important to me which makes the progressive more appealing. With a progressive loading rifle rounds, the process goes like this, my method for 223: Tumble clean brass in walnut with polish. Spray on Dillon lube. Size/decap with a Hornaday FL die in a Rockchucker (single stage). Tumble off lube with plain corn cob. Time for brass prep. Case inspection, check for splits, ect, minor dents ok. Check case in case gauge for headspace and if case needs to be trimmed. Trim case to 1.750. Debur inside and outside of neck. Remove primer crimp if necessary. Clean flashole, clean primer pocket. Uniform primer pockets on match loads. On 550 Prime, drop powder, seat bullet, crimp (I crimp FMJBT's with cannelure, match loads no crimp) Inspect loaded round. I pay particular attention to primer seating depth. I check every round for primer to be .002 below case head. Just because a progressive is used doesn't mean that you can't insure quality. To get more responses, first double space between sentences. You post will be much easier to read. Try to limit yourself to one or two questions. Go to the top of the page under Forum Resources and read all the info up there. Most of your questions will be answered there. Study the "what equipment to buy" lists. Read the "loading 223 on a 550" tutorial. Get a copy of "ABC's of Reloading". Step by step instruction with pics. Good luck |
|
Quoted:
Is it an absolute necessity to get calipers over a case gauge? I'd recommend both. You need the case guage to set your resizing die to get the correct case size. You need the dial caliper to guage overall length, including the bullet seating length. I know you said your time is important but I would recommend a good single stage press first. You need to learn all the stages of reloading and a single stage is best for that. I have 2 progressive presses and I still use my single stage RCBS Rockchucker for a lot of things even today. You will always find a use for a single stage press. |
|
Thanks for the information. Then it's final. I know I'll use a single stage in the future,
maybe not this one. My shopping list will include the single stage kit, 223 die kit, 223 case gauge, and some calipers. I'm sure it will only grow from there. Now I just need to find some free/cheap brass at the local ranges ;). |
|
Quoted:
Thanks for the information. Then it's final. I know I'll use a single stage in the future, maybe not this one. My shopping list will include the single stage kit, 223 die kit, 223 case gauge, and some calipers. I'm sure it will only grow from there. Now I just need to find some free/cheap brass at the local ranges ;). You don't want to do that...go with the 4 hole turret press...you will be able to make more ammo in the time you save from dicking around with the measurements involved with a single stage press. I can't imagine loading with any other press that is fast, pre measured dies, and allows me to still have control over all functions. |
Armory Sponsor