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Posted: 3/4/2013 5:55:16 AM EDT
| I'm SBR'ing a dedicated .22 upper. It has a 4" barrel with a 7" VTAC FF rail. Obviously the barrel is shorter than the rail. For overall length of rifle should I measure to the end of the barrel or the end of the FF rail? I'm leaning towards the barrel but would like other opinions. |
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Quoted: I'm SBR'ing a dedicated .22 upper. It has a 4" barrel with a 7" VTAC FF rail. Obviously the barrel is shorter than the rail. For overall length of rifle should I measure to the end of the barrel or the end of the FF rail? I'm leaning towards the barrel but would like other opinions. I'm not positive but unless the VTAC is permanently mounted to the gun you can't use it to measure OAL. I would contact your local ATF branch if you get a chance for clarification. |
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I'm SBR'ing a dedicated .22 upper. It has a 4" barrel with a 7" VTAC FF rail. Obviously the barrel is shorter than the rail. For overall length of rifle should I measure to the end of the barrel or the end of the FF rail? I'm leaning towards the barrel but would like other opinions. I'm not positive but unless the VTAC is permanently mounted to the gun you can't use it to measure OAL. I would contact your local ATF branch if you get a chance for clarification. By that logic, then u shouldn't count the stock either? I would still guess barrel tip tho, since u can always remove the rail later. Honestly tho, I think it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. |
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I'm SBR'ing a dedicated .22 upper. It has a 4" barrel with a 7" VTAC FF rail. Obviously the barrel is shorter than the rail. For overall length of rifle should I measure to the end of the barrel or the end of the FF rail? I'm leaning towards the barrel but would like other opinions. I'm not positive but unless the VTAC is permanently mounted to the gun you can't use it to measure OAL. I would contact your local ATF branch if you get a chance for clarification. By that logic, then u shouldn't count the stock either? I would still guess barrel tip tho, since u can always remove the rail later. Honestly tho, I think it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. Why wouldn't you count the stock? If the stock was removed it wouldn't be a SBR(and wouldn't be subject to the NFA). With the rail, flashider, etc. removed it still is a SBR.And yes, it DOES matter, if you want to do this the legal way.The NFA world is not a guessing game. You either KNOW and follow the rules or risk prison time. OP- Measure from the end of the barrel(with no FH, etc. attached) to the end of the extended stock as per ATF rulings. |
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I'm SBR'ing a dedicated .22 upper. It has a 4" barrel with a 7" VTAC FF rail. Obviously the barrel is shorter than the rail. For overall length of rifle should I measure to the end of the barrel or the end of the FF rail? I'm leaning towards the barrel but would like other opinions. I'm not positive but unless the VTAC is permanently mounted to the gun you can't use it to measure OAL. I would contact your local ATF branch if you get a chance for clarification. By that logic, then u shouldn't count the stock either? I would still guess barrel tip tho, since u can always remove the rail later. Honestly tho, I think it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. Why wouldn't you count the stock? If the stock was removed it wouldn't be a SBR(and wouldn't be subject to the NFA). With the rail, flashider, etc. removed it still is a SBR.And yes, it DOES matter, if you want to do this the legal way.The NFA world is not a guessing game. You either KNOW and follow the rules or risk prison time. OP- Measure from the end of the barrel(with no FH, etc. attached) to the end of the extended stock as per ATF rulings. Stocks can be swapped out too was my point. An A2 or collapsable, then changed to a RRA fixed entry style, would differ in lengths. I'm just saying, point me in the direction to the guy who went to prison for a discrepancy like this and I will gladly STFU. The important part is that the receiver is registered...some people are just too paranoid that the ATF, who apparently have nothing better to do than to go door to door of NFA stamp holders with rulers and send ppl to prison for this. And FYI, an SBR, built first as a rifle, with the stock removed is still an SBR, not a pistol. 
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I'm SBR'ing a dedicated .22 upper. It has a 4" barrel with a 7" VTAC FF rail. Obviously the barrel is shorter than the rail. For overall length of rifle should I measure to the end of the barrel or the end of the FF rail? I'm leaning towards the barrel but would like other opinions. I'm not positive but unless the VTAC is permanently mounted to the gun you can't use it to measure OAL. I would contact your local ATF branch if you get a chance for clarification. By that logic, then u shouldn't count the stock either? I would still guess barrel tip tho, since u can always remove the rail later. Honestly tho, I think it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. Why wouldn't you count the stock? If the stock was removed it wouldn't be a SBR(and wouldn't be subject to the NFA). With the rail, flashider, etc. removed it still is a SBR.And yes, it DOES matter, if you want to do this the legal way.The NFA world is not a guessing game. You either KNOW and follow the rules or risk prison time. OP- Measure from the end of the barrel(with no FH, etc. attached) to the end of the extended stock as per ATF rulings. This really makes no sense if you are really going by the ATF law. You should NOT be able to measure this total before sending out the paperwork for the stamp. If you are able to do this you have in your possession an SBR. So clearly even if it is configured as a pistol, you would have to mount a stock(which you shouldn't have) to it to get this measurement. SO the ATF is either expecting everyone to take everyones word for it about the overall length on the internet(which would be a guess by the applicant) or they are expecting everyone to be in possession of parts that are illegal to have before the paperwork is even sent out. |
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I'm SBR'ing a dedicated .22 upper. It has a 4" barrel with a 7" VTAC FF rail. Obviously the barrel is shorter than the rail. For overall length of rifle should I measure to the end of the barrel or the end of the FF rail? I'm leaning towards the barrel but would like other opinions. I'm not positive but unless the VTAC is permanently mounted to the gun you can't use it to measure OAL. I would contact your local ATF branch if you get a chance for clarification. By that logic, then u shouldn't count the stock either? I would still guess barrel tip tho, since u can always remove the rail later. Honestly tho, I think it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. Why wouldn't you count the stock? If the stock was removed it wouldn't be a SBR(and wouldn't be subject to the NFA). With the rail, flashider, etc. removed it still is a SBR.And yes, it DOES matter, if you want to do this the legal way.The NFA world is not a guessing game. You either KNOW and follow the rules or risk prison time. OP- Measure from the end of the barrel(with no FH, etc. attached) to the end of the extended stock as per ATF rulings. This really makes no sense if you are really going by the ATF law. You should NOT be able to measure this total before sending out the paperwork for the stamp. If you are able to do this you have in your possession an SBR. So clearly even if it is configured as a pistol, you would have to mount a stock(which you shouldn't have) to it to get this measurement. SO the ATF is either expecting everyone to take everyones word for it about the overall length on the internet(which would be a guess by the applicant) or they are expecting everyone to be in possession of parts that are illegal to have before the paperwork is even sent out. I didn't say it made sense. This IS the gov. we're talking about after all. 
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I'm SBR'ing a dedicated .22 upper. It has a 4" barrel with a 7" VTAC FF rail. Obviously the barrel is shorter than the rail. For overall length of rifle should I measure to the end of the barrel or the end of the FF rail? I'm leaning towards the barrel but would like other opinions. I'm not positive but unless the VTAC is permanently mounted to the gun you can't use it to measure OAL. I would contact your local ATF branch if you get a chance for clarification. By that logic, then u shouldn't count the stock either? I would still guess barrel tip tho, since u can always remove the rail later. Honestly tho, I think it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. Why wouldn't you count the stock? If the stock was removed it wouldn't be a SBR(and wouldn't be subject to the NFA). With the rail, flashider, etc. removed it still is a SBR.And yes, it DOES matter, if you want to do this the legal way.The NFA world is not a guessing game. You either KNOW and follow the rules or risk prison time. OP- Measure from the end of the barrel(with no FH, etc. attached) to the end of the extended stock as per ATF rulings. This really makes no sense if you are really going by the ATF law. You should NOT be able to measure this total before sending out the paperwork for the stamp. If you are able to do this you have in your possession an SBR. So clearly even if it is configured as a pistol, you would have to mount a stock(which you shouldn't have) to it to get this measurement. SO the ATF is either expecting everyone to take everyones word for it about the overall length on the internet(which would be a guess by the applicant) or they are expecting everyone to be in possession of parts that are illegal to have before the paperwork is even sent out. Not true. There are ways to determine OAL of an SBR without being in possession of SBR-only parts. Easiest would be to measure the OAL of an already possessed 16" BBL rifle, then subtract the difference between the 16" BBL and proposed SBR. One could measure an existing SBR of similar configuration. One could be in possession of an AR15 pistol and an AR15 rifle, and measure the component parts. There are other ways as well, but these three examples are what instantly come to mind. |
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I'm SBR'ing a dedicated .22 upper. It has a 4" barrel with a 7" VTAC FF rail. Obviously the barrel is shorter than the rail. For overall length of rifle should I measure to the end of the barrel or the end of the FF rail? I'm leaning towards the barrel but would like other opinions. I'm not positive but unless the VTAC is permanently mounted to the gun you can't use it to measure OAL. I would contact your local ATF branch if you get a chance for clarification. By that logic, then u shouldn't count the stock either? I would still guess barrel tip tho, since u can always remove the rail later. Honestly tho, I think it doesn't really matter in the grand scheme of things. Why wouldn't you count the stock? If the stock was removed it wouldn't be a SBR(and wouldn't be subject to the NFA). With the rail, flashider, etc. removed it still is a SBR.And yes, it DOES matter, if you want to do this the legal way.The NFA world is not a guessing game. You either KNOW and follow the rules or risk prison time. OP- Measure from the end of the barrel(with no FH, etc. attached) to the end of the extended stock as per ATF rulings. This really makes no sense if you are really going by the ATF law. You should NOT be able to measure this total before sending out the paperwork for the stamp. If you are able to do this you have in your possession an SBR. So clearly even if it is configured as a pistol, you would have to mount a stock(which you shouldn't have) to it to get this measurement. SO the ATF is either expecting everyone to take everyones word for it about the overall length on the internet(which would be a guess by the applicant) or they are expecting everyone to be in possession of parts that are illegal to have before the paperwork is even sent out. Not true. There are ways to determine OAL of an SBR without being in possession of SBR-only parts. Easiest would be to measure the OAL of an already possessed 16" BBL rifle, then subtract the difference between the 16" BBL and proposed SBR. One could measure an existing SBR of similar configuration. One could be in possession of an AR15 pistol and an AR15 rifle, and measure the component parts. There are other ways as well, but these three examples are what instantly come to mind. Yes these are ways, but does the ATF expect that everyone that wants an SBR to have another AR before they decide to make an SBR? What if you planned your first AR to be an SBR? Had no friends with AR's? Located no where near a gunshop? BLSTexas....I dont want you to think I was attacking your post lol, I just meant the ATF expects info that they really shouldn't make people guess on....which is for the most part what they are doing. A simple (less than 30") should suffice. |
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<snip]> Yes these are ways, but does the ATF expect that everyone that wants an SBR to have another AR before they decide to make an SBR? What if you planned your first AR to be an SBR? Had no friends with AR's? Located no where near a gunshop? BLSTexas....I dont want you to think I was attacking your post lol, I just meant the ATF expects info that they really shouldn't make people guess on....which is for the most part what they are doing. A simple (less than 30") should suffice. Yes, there will always be exceptions to almost any "what if" scenario. But the point of my post was to show there are many, many ways to get accurate information for a Form 1/4 without breaking the law. |
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