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Posted: 5/12/2007 5:35:32 AM EDT
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Anyone here own one? Are they worth the premium over the standered Colt M16? What type of finish do they have? I have read something that said a lot of Group Ind SS recievers were out of spec. Any truth to that? Pics would be nice. Thanks! |
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I've owned one for a few years. I wouldn't trade it for a factory Colt M16, but others may disagree - value most likely depends on the individual. Not sure what kind of finish is used on it/stainless steel. The following information is from an archived thread on Subguns.com. The first two paragraphs below were given by a person named Steve. He's very knowledgeable on the subject and provided lots of info. The third paragraph shows a reply from me. For a high res video of mine, click on the link: filebeam.com/b6fc64c1eea71a0b8db1ef6ae9ec976d It has some close up shots of the receiver. Dan Group Ind did the M-16's, Nuarmco did the M-15 (semi). Many of the group guns have/had problems as the machining was not done to spec. Most cases were minor and nothing that a good C2 couldn't correct. Each mfr made @ 100 apiece. I have a Nuarmco that was converted by Chasan Corp. Had the nomenclature and selector markings welded up and sent it to Norrell to be re-engraved "M16 A1", cal 5.56mm. Safe, semi and auto on both sides of receiver with "17-4ph stainless" under Chasan Corp's info. One thing about the stainless guns (many of them) is that the mag wells are VERY tight. I did qiute a bit of filing on mine (17-4 is very hard steel) to open it up enough to where the mags were pretty snug. An over pressure firing helped it along a little more by opening the mag well up another @.030" Now the mags slide in and out as they should.The M4 upper was destroyed. Testament to how strong the receivers are. It's hard to put a price on these as there are so few out there. Some might say that because of their rarity that they're worth more that a factory Colt, others would disagree. I sold my Colt M16 A1 and kept this one. I would not hesitate to put the price right up there with a Colt A1. These are truly unique weapons. Although I don't shoot it, I still have the upper that came with mine. Stainless A1 with a 24" stainless barrel. Steve Yes, the stainless steel receivers are almost 3x the strength of the aluminum. The stainless receivers have a Rockwell hardness of @45 so I'm told. They are cast from 17-4ph stainless steel. This is aircraft steel (stuff jet engine fan blades are made from as told by Lomont to me). I can personally vouch for the strength. Earlier in the year I was shooting mine (a Nuarmco that was converted by Chasan Corp) when BOOM!!! A round completely blew the head off of the cartridge. Bent and broke extractor, ballooned out the mag after blowing everything through the bottom, broke the bolt hold open catch off and impressioned it into the upper and bowed out the upper receiver. All it did to the lower was open it up width wise across the very bottom of the mag well was open it up about 25 thousands which was fine because the mag well was tight to begin with. Now the mags slide in and out very smooth. That is one of the issues with the stainless lowers, (both Group and Nuarmco) they are usually very tight in the mag well. I did alot of filing in mine by working the areas where the mag would make contact. The kaboom just helped it to its final dimensions. Stan Andrewski also told me that the Group guns DID have some problems with some dimensions being off here and there by a few thousandths. BUT he said they were not problems that any good C2 could not correct. He has one thats in the white (natural finish) that he and John have run tens of thousands of rounds through tiand zero signs of wear! THey have replaced the internals several times due to usage, but the receiver is still tight! I love mine, sold my Colt A1 and kept this one. I cant help but think that if I was shooting a Colt or other aluminum lower when that round let go, people would have seen a grown man cry :-( !! Also the slight extra weight seems to smooth things out when shooting. People that have shot mine with its 10.25 upper tell me that its the smoothest shooting M16 that they have ever fired. If you're thinking about getting one, I would not hesitate!! Steve As stated by Steve, some of the Group Industries receivers are out of spec. I had discussed this with one owner who had to have a Class 2 perform major work on his. Another case I know of was told to me by my Class III dealer. He had a customer who had bought one that had to be fixed by a Class 2 also. Both of them were Group Industries. If I remember right, both issues were found with the front and rear take down pins being out of place. They had to be welded over and drilled. Before I bought mine, I was able to inspect it. I made sure it hand-cycled properly, confirmed mag well size with a G.I. magazine, and placed another upper on it to check for fit. My Group Industries M16 has no issues whatsoever and is a great lower. I have four uppers and they all fit and function great. I weighed my steel lower against an aluminum one, and the steel weighed 14.47 ounces more. It is noticeably heavier. There are very few of these Group Industries stainless steel receivers. I can't confirm, but it has been said that there are 100. My serial number is A008X. Dan |
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