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Posted: 2/6/2016 11:11:56 PM EDT
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So i am new to the forums and and am hoping some knowledgeable people can give me their opinions on what gunsmith school would be a good fit for me.
I greatly appreciate an opinions on the matter. Thanks Austin |
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Gunsmithing is a relatively unregulated profession, governed by reputations, rather than degrees or (simply) resumes. Training courses are all well and good, and all of the listed gunsmithing degree programs are worthy; but completing them alone will not guarantee you a job with top firms like a law degree from Harvard or Stanford would; or a computer science/engineering degree from a top research university.
You either have to work with/for a top gunsmith and build up a reputation in their shop, or open your own shop and do mundane stuff and innovate on your own until you make a name for yourself. |
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Ditto, you need to break your training down to something like an armorer parts changer on one side of the coin, then on the other side of the coin, trained to build a firearm from scratch instead (hence have the needed machine proven skills to start with to be hired into a shop to begin with).
With the later, this will get you into a full shop that does more than just changes parts, and you will learn the ins and out of the specialty of what the shop mostly focus on for firearms, and this will start to build you a reputation for when you venture out on your own instead. Hence take someone like Dave Dawson, who was with STI to begin with, then ventured out on his own to create Dawson precision. Also would be, Giacomo Arrighini, who became a Perazzi factory trained gunsmith to begin with, then started GIACOMO sporting USA afterwards. Short of such factory training to begin with as part of your reputation, then you have a hard road ahead of you trying to open up your own shop from the start, and will be a much longer/harder road trying to gain a reputation instead. Such as Bill Wilson from Wilson combat, and how just happened to have family money behind him to carry him through the lean time, and to help him once he did want to venture out on his own. Hence there are thousand of Bill Wilson type smiths that are very, very good at the firearms that they can produce, but without out the the needed money/backing to carry them until they have built a reputation through the lean times to establish a client base, all have pretty much folded up shop instead. So get the needed gun smiting machining skills needed that will get in the door of a shop/company to begin with to refine your skills and build the needed reputation to learn that end of the business, then you need to learn the financial end of the business as well; and once you have both and the needed funds/backing, then it time to venture out on your own with a demand for your specialty. |
| At your age I think you have way above average skills and experience compared to others thinking of going into gunsmithing. Just understand it it a blue collar career until and if you can build a reputation. If it is something you really enjoy and you can survive on blue collar wages then I say go for it. I am about to retire from the military and I am considering this route. I was a machinist for ten years before 9/11 then I went back in. If my wife deploys I will go full time at Trinidad State Junior college in Colorado, if she doesn't I will do the NRA summer program there or Murray State in Oklahoma and just tinker in my spare time after what ever job I get after that. I won't need to work but if I want to maintain my current standard of living I will have to do something. I am 49 so a little late in life but it is something I enjoy and already do some gun tinkering for friends and family. Even if you don't make it as a gunsmith you will have a really solid base in machining which can pay fairly well for non button pushing types. |
| You've got a very unique base of skills for someone your age and I can see why you'd want to venture down this path, I started down it at 18 actually. Here's my advice. Go get some skills in a field that you can fall back on should gunsmithing not be enough to pay your bills. Maybe look into machinst programs and get a degree/certification in CNC programming. Alternatively you could look into Engineering if you're good with math and the field interests you. |
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Thank you all for the responses so far.
I should further clarify my plan. I am also interested in firearm design. So if everything works the way i want first build a name for myself as a gunsmith then later on also get into the design. The local gunsmith that i know has agreed to let me work with him after i have some further training. I do have a backup plan i have my IT degree and in the future i plan on finishing my mechanical engineering degree. It also sounds like a lot of you all are saying the schooling isn't to important. Maybe just try to take some of the summer courses like Ultimate Bolt Action Rifle Accuracy: James Messer? I'm hoping to hear from Dfariswheel he sounds pretty knowledgeable. |
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I took eight En-R-A summer classes at Lassen. I like Bob Dunlap (he was the top instructor at Lassen before starting AGI), but I wanted a hands-on training program.
I then took to the two year program at TSJC and thought it was a better school than Lassen or CST. Find a school that meets your needs. Look at the instructors, their credentials (what associations are they members of and what training do they have). Is their program going to meet YOUR needs? MInd you, CST is more expensive (methinks than TSJC and you get charged for extra bench time). However, one of the most successful graduates from there now has his own factory with about twenty CNC machines that he doesn't run 24/7 to pay for themselves. He got what he needed out of it and made something of himself. You can attend the "best" school and get nowhere (depending on your motivation, drive and skills afterwards) and you can go to a lesser known school and become a shining star (depending on your motivation, drive and skill). I'm still learning too and the learning process doesn't stop. |
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I think you would do well to take the course work at Montgomery CC, TSJC, or Murray State.
I have taken classes at two of them and know one of the instructors at Murray, have taken a tour of the classrooms there, and met several of the staff. The summer program is a bargain, especially at Trinidad if you stay in the dorm. (Take a big roll of duct tape to fix the screens on the room. I didn't say it was luxurious, it's cheap.) |
| if you are looking into a future in design, I would highly suggest going through with the education and going to one of the schools. while it's not impossible, it is substantially more difficult to design and test a new product without a larger company backing you unless you happen to be independently wealthy, and most of those larger companies are either going to want either ample experience or education before letting you through the door. |
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I'm a 2nd semester student at the Pennsylvania Gunsmith School in Pittsburgh. It's a 16 month apprenticeship course that is designed to give working usable knowledge in firearm refinishing, repair, stock making, tool making, and firearm customization. It's a very well known school by small and large manufacturers and customization shops, and there are always reps coming in. A couple weeks ago we had a couple guys from Caesar Guerini come in and hire one of the graduates, and during the great american outdoor show, myself and another student were offered on the spot interviews with Shaw (the barrel makers). This week have Dean from Brownells doing a 2 day AR-15 armorers certification course, and they also do a course in alternative finishes like nitre bluing and proper gun-cote finishing.
The staff are very knowledgeable and the course of instruction is designed so that even the most non knowledgeable person can walk in off the street and learn the proper terms and techniques. Edit: I am just now realizing this is a really old thread.... |
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I recently retired from the Army and gunsmithing is something that I've had an interest in going to school for, for a while. I'd be interested in hearing the pros/cons of the different schools, specifically CST and Pennsylvania gunsmith school. I'm leaning towards the Pennsylvania school based on location, but I'm open to suggestions. I am not keen on returning to cali, however.
Maybe a stickied thread where the graduates of the schools could post, would keep this from being a recurring topic. |
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Quoted:
I recently retired from the Army and gunsmithing is something that I've had an interest in going to school for, for a while. I'd be interested in hearing the pros/cons of the different schools, specifically CST and Pennsylvania gunsmith school. I'm leaning towards the Pennsylvania school based on location, but I'm open to suggestions. I am not keen on returning to cali, however. Maybe a stickied thread where the graduates of the schools could post, would keep this from being a recurring topic. The moderator hates tacked threads. Did you read those that are tacked? |
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Quoted:
The moderator hates tacked threads. Did you read those that are tacked? Quoted:
Quoted:
I recently retired from the Army and gunsmithing is something that I've had an interest in going to school for, for a while. I'd be interested in hearing the pros/cons of the different schools, specifically CST and Pennsylvania gunsmith school. I'm leaning towards the Pennsylvania school based on location, but I'm open to suggestions. I am not keen on returning to cali, however. Maybe a stickied thread where the graduates of the schools could post, would keep this from being a recurring topic. The moderator hates tacked threads. Did you read those that are tacked? I did. Great threads for gunsmithingwork and tools, but not much for people looking for information on the schools. |
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Take the time to do research on the school and instructors.
Do you want to be taught by instructors that have at least a few years of verifiable experience in the business or students that recently graduated with minimal real world experience instructing you? I will tell you right now that CST was one of the highest rated Smithing schools in the nation. Was. A few years ago they went through a "reorganization" and lost their head instructor. The school has not recovered. I did a bit of work with a recent graduate. He's a good dude and clearly picked up a few skills but I was flabbergasted when he told me they taught nothing of Parkerizing and he had no real knowledge of the Kalishnakov platform. Are you kidding me? One of the most widely utilized finishing techniques and the most prolific firearm in the world and he was taught nothing in regards to them? Minimal education on FFL operations and management and in speaking with a couple of students they knew absolutely nothing on the nuances of NFA and Gunsmithing. Seems like a waste of time and money to me. |
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I have a buddy in my unit who is working on the SDI Associates in Firearms Technology degree program using his Army Tuition Assistance. I've read through some of his course material, and it seems pretty comprehensive for a distance learning course. My concern is the lack of face-to-face instructor feedback and the fact that you pretty much have to either own a well-stocked shop or know someone who does to complete the practical exercises.
I've considered taking it myself, because my current circumstances will not allow me to do a resident course, and there aren't any in the DFW area, anyway. One thing I would like to explore is hand engraving, but I have never seen any useful information resources on that subject, and wouldn't know where to turn for advice or training. It seems to be a carefully guarded secret knowledge, known only to a handful of spectral illuminati that mere mortals have heard of but never seen. |
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TSJC doesn't teach about the AK either.
That said, if Austin wants design as part of his studies, he should first learn German and learn it well. Then take two years here in America at a brick 'n mortar school so he has the technical background on fyre-arms behind him before going to the Austrian school in Ferlach for five years. Austria's Felach school has two progrms. The four year is for smithing and the five year is for smithing and design. |
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