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Posted: 3/28/2007 4:24:57 PM EDT
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I am looking at Victors review of the MUM and PVS and the only BIG difference look to be weight and Gain. But with the MUM not having an adjustable gain and instead having an ABC system how much of a loss is the adjustable gain on the MUM's. What is the difference between the ABC system on the MUM's and the Adjustable Gain on the PVS. I really have no idea what one would do for the other as far as optics go but have a relative handle on the situation of gain in noise. Can someone please explain. Some actual pics might be helpful |
The adjustable is gain is simply (manually) turning the brightness of the image down or up. In urban environment this can help reduce the halo effect of street or porch lights and also let you see in the shadows a bit better. The MUM's do have an automatic brightness control that dims down the image automatically (slightly though). As far as optics, both use great glass and virtually no difference in apparent views if you using a similar spec'd tube. I personally like the versatility of the PVS-14 for weapon mounting, but if your near water like many of my customers it seems lately, the MUM is water proof down to 66', while the 14 down only to 6' for a half hour. Hope this helps. |
| They both are a good scope. I like the Mini but my only complaint is it does not have a threaded objective lens to add the Afocal lens for magnification. An adapter is available though. All things being equal I think the PVS-14 single battery has a slight advantage but its very slight. The Mini is smaller and lighter which is its main advantage over the PVS-14. The water proof feature is a plus also but how many peiople drop there scope in 66 feet of water or any water other than rain for that matter. I am a boater and the Mini is my choice for obvious reasons but the PVS-14 would be my runner up and a very very close one!! |
I think a bit of wording confusion....The manual gain in reality is an adjustable gain that the PVS-14's have. The MUM's do not have a manual/adjustable gain but they do have automatic brightnes control. (ABC) |
DON"T ASK ABOUT DROPPING NVDs into water... it happens. Luckily with my buddy and I it was only, at worst 15 or so feet of water. Unless your diving the thing, keep it tied to you somehow. The subject of waterproofness comes up from time to time and referances to the 66 feet waterproof rating of the MUM are touted. Here is a question, WHO HERE HAS ACTUALLY taken a MUM to 66 feet and used it? Did you adjust the objective focus while at that depth? Is that 66 feet rating operational or just transportable? Was it in salt water and did your On/Off switch survive afterward??? The PVS 14 is more water proof than ITTs rating. In fact I called ITT about the mythical "PVS 14Navy" that is waterproof to 66 feet. I asked what they did to meet this spec. I was thinking special O rings or something but NO KIDDING this is all it is. They test each batch of housings that come in and if the housings pass they get to be the 66 feet waterproof jobs. YES there is that much varience from production run to production run. ITT says they would like all PVS 14s to meet this spec but it is not a priority to them as they do not have that much of a call for it. So now that I have hijacked this thread on variable gain to talk about waterproofing, lets get back on track here. First off both 10160 tubes (MUM) and 11769 (PVS14) tubes have ABC. They are the same 18 mm core. The difference is in the power supply. The 11769 tube just has variable gain. ABC is not a substitue for variable gain. On the subject of reducing bloom. The adjustable gain will decrease the brightness of the image. I have come to this conclusion, when you turn down the brightness most of the bloom remains but it does lessen a small amount. The image overall gets a great deal darker. To get rid of bloom, if you have a spot in your tube, put the spot over the bloom, and the bloom will go away completely. See spots aren't all bad. The big advantage for me is an overall dimmer image. I want my aided eye to be as close as my none aided eye (adjusted to darkness) as possible if I have to come off goggles in a hurry for some reason. Really the question is do you want to be able to make the image brighter and darker? in most cases, it all comes down to preferance in the end. My roomate never touches his gain knob. He takes the thing out of his shirt pocket, turns his unit on to makes sure it is cranked all the way up and then shuts it off till he needs it. Me, I am the opposite I turn it down as much as I can and still see decently. It's all personal preferance in the end. IPSC_GUY SIERRA II ALPHA |
Guess I'll hijack back...  Many of my customers do dive with their MUM's in lakes and salt water. While in salt water it is recommended to use the sacrificial window. I've never asked the depth they were diving at but many of them are/were using the DVS-100 when they could buy the kit without the MUM. The full diving kit with a MUM was outrageous in price. I've also not had any issues reported with the power switch after any dives. Also glad to see the 66' PVS-14 was not a myth. I've reported on this system awhile back. I was told awhile back that it's a very expensive process due to the pass/fail rate was pretty high on the housings which corresponds (IMHO) to variances in the housing manufacturing tolerances. I find this hard to believe that ITT has open spec tolerances such as this. But then again, their housings are made overseas so not sure what tolerences the factory signed up to. As for ITT not having much need, the last I talked with their engineer, they had an order going out for 6,000 14's for the 66' rating. Then again 6,000 PVS-14's probably means not much call for it when your supplying the govy with 400.000+ units! Hope this helps.Vic |
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SO in the end it comes down to this Adjustable gain = your idea of bright ABC control = someone elses idea of bright I like the PVS but i do not like the Depth of the water rating. I guess it is all in perspective though. How much of our gear, if it is water proof, is only good to three feet of water, and how much does that gear cost with relation to the amount of water protection provided. Victor, How much would a 66 pvs 14 cost or can we lowly civis even get them? I would also like to try the gear out before i buy but no one in my area has any gear, i have tried my HT forum as well. I was wondering if anyone would have a couple of pics to post of the high and low end of the gain on the pvs and a few of the abc system on the MUM |
The 66' 14's are restricted units as far as I know (ITT's reg) not mine. As for getting pics of the low end gain of the 14, that would be difficult as you can turn the gain down to a black screen!  As for the ABC on either the MUM or the 14, once again, this would be difficult at the units would need a brighter than normal light source and think the digi camera would adjust for this making realistic pics difficult.  I know it's difficult to find units near ones home to look or test before buying...I've only had a handful of civilian customers come to my office to see before they bought. That is why I really try to have all my customers post up feedback and reviews with pics to help the next person. It really does help. I try to take all the pics I can to assist as well. Most times the camera NEVER does REAL justice in how good the units look!. Hope this helps. |
Just thought I'd throw in my 2 cents: -IMO, the variable gain feature on the PVS-14 is a major advantage. This feature allows me to drop to the lowest setting that still allows viewing of the target. This reduces noise, and scintillation and seems to make the image much clearer. This also allows the user to manually adjust the gain in different areas of terrain, i.e open field versus going down into heavy stands of trees. I believe that this makes the monocular much more versatile. -the variable gain also allows for "tweaking" of the brightness ratio between the monocular and reticle-aiming device (Aimpoint or EO). Sometimes you'll want the gain low, and the reticle brightness a little higher, and vice versa. -Since I have the 3X magnifier and use it often, I very much liked the threaded obj lens as this makes for a much more solid mount. - I have also found that, with the aid of an infrared illuminator (hereafter " IRI") reducing the gain, and using the IRI makes for a super-clear image on a moonless night. also, when you have the IRI on, and it reflects off of a tree, cactus stand, or other object when you swing the gun / sight toward a target, you can simply turn the gain on the scope down. This is useful, because at close ranges the IRI might bloom the scope a bit, but at much longer ranges, you will need every bit of that light to identify the target. - reducing the gain allows more of a balance between your aiming eye, and the unaided eye, which improves depth perception and navigation while walking on dark nights. I would never own another monocular without this feature. YMMV |
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