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[ARCHIVED THREAD] - KRISS (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 6/16/2009 1:09:51 PM EDT
Anyone get there hands on one yet? I saw one at my gun shop today and think that I really need it.
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A local shop had one a few months ago and I got to play around with it for a couple hours. For a price tag of $1600 I'll pass. While it's great to see new ideas come through the pipe and companies trying to innovate designs this thing was too awkward and clumsy to justify it the first time around. The magazine it uses is it's biggest draw while the Beretta Cx4 only uses the 8rd. Cougar mags IIRC. If KRISS took the guts of this and stuffed into another more marketable package I think it might do a lot better, but for now it'll just be another novelty carbine.
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Right now they seem hard to get. I think TDI is having trouble keeping up with demand.
With the exception of hunting arms and issue weapons, all guns are toys. I don't get the people that think some semi auto replicas of full auto guns are indispensable, like AR or AK replicas, but turn their noses up at the Kriss. |
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Definitely agree with folks about the semi-auto thing. When you combine the fact that as civilians you can only get it semi-auto and then you can't even get it without the long barrel without the added expense and effort of an SBR it kind of makes it one of those "ahh, no thanks" type of things.
Magpul worship does happen, but that's partly because they've been a good company to folks. If Magpul started screwing people bad they'd lose their fan base. Although I will admit that if I was Travis Haley I'd avoid giving some folks here personal information for fear they would start going through my garbage for hair clippings or something. 
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| WHY have they not released a pistol version of it!!? For all the following that exists for pistol AR's- not to mention those who love MACs, UZIs, etc (admittedly even if just for fun) you'd think they'd take that angle instead of just slapping a full-length barrel shroud to make it look suppressed. Knock that stock off, plug the rear of the receiver, and your GTG. |
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They probably will release a pistol version. The stock goes on with a push pin and pops off instantly. I think it is a very cool modern carbine for an up to date weapon, it is very light and handles quick and points well. The 16" barrel version is very light weight and not muzzel heavy at all, and because of it's length it is like having a supressed weapon with out paying the NFA tax!
Very cool gun, and I can't wait to see how they apply the Vector technology in other weapons too. |
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Quoted:
Your full auto argument is full of holes. Why do you own your ar15 if it's not full auto? The KRISS was designed, or so we're told, to overcome the issue of "muzzle rise" when firing a short barreled .45 ACP submachinegun. Make it semi-automatic and it is basically just a pistol with a stock and a really long barrel. That's all well and good, but at the price tag that the KRISS comes with it doesn't exactly motivate me to want one desperately. If you want a semi-auto pistol caliber carbine there are plenty of more affordable alternatives. MSAR will be coming out with their Modular Carbine System hopefully before the end of the year or by early next year and it will give you a semi-auto bullpup with no SBR required and downward ejection using Glock magazines made in the common Glock calibers that you covert yourself with ease for around $900 to $1,000. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Your full auto argument is full of holes. Why do you own your ar15 if it's not full auto? The KRISS was designed, or so we're told, to overcome the issue of "muzzle rise" when firing a short barreled .45 ACP submachinegun. Make it semi-automatic and it is basically just a pistol with a stock and a really long barrel. That's all well and good, but at the price tag that the KRISS comes with it doesn't exactly motivate me to want one desperately. If you want a semi-auto pistol caliber carbine there are plenty of more affordable alternatives. MSAR will be coming out with their Modular Carbine System hopefully before the end of the year or by early next year and it will give you a semi-auto bullpup with no SBR required and downward ejection using Glock magazines made in the common Glock calibers that you covert yourself with ease for around $900 to $1,000. I stand by my statement. Even on semi auto the gun will benefit from the design. People put way to much into full auto around here, it's over rated. If your not using suppressive fire, full auto is a toy that just waste ammo for when you actually need it. One can say any sub gun is basically a pistol with a stock and a long barrel 
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Quoted:
Quoted:
Your full auto argument is full of holes. Why do you own your ar15 if it's not full auto? The KRISS was designed, or so we're told, to overcome the issue of "muzzle rise" when firing a short barreled .45 ACP submachinegun. Make it semi-automatic and it is basically just a pistol with a stock and a really long barrel. That's all well and good, but at the price tag that the KRISS comes with it doesn't exactly motivate me to want one desperately. If you want a semi-auto pistol caliber carbine there are plenty of more affordable alternatives. MSAR will be coming out with their Modular Carbine System hopefully before the end of the year or by early next year and it will give you a semi-auto bullpup with no SBR required and downward ejection using Glock magazines made in the common Glock calibers that you covert yourself with ease for around $900 to $1,000. The MSAR is never going to come out, its a gun in a long line of vaporware that will never reach the market. I was at the NRA show and they didnt even have a prototype out to show, if it was coming out this year I am pretty sure they would want to show it off. And I highly doubt they are going to get it under 1000, it would be nice if they could though, but im not holding my breath. |
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Hey is that carbine chambered in .45 or something else? It looks like a more aesthetic 16" barrel version!
The Kriss in semi auto form isn't the most practical thing when compared to cheaper pistol caliber carbines. However, I really commend them for offering something to us lowly citizen gun owners. A lot of defense oriented companies like HK and Colt refuse to release their latest designs to the public or they give us half assed versions like the SL8. We should all appreciate companies that are on our side! I really like the MSAR pistol caliber carbine and it is innovative with its ability to change calibers. I don't think it is vaporware at this point. I think MSAR got trapped in the whole "two weeks" thing and the obama gun rush which forced them to allocate all production capacity to their rifles. They have been promising a release this summer, but they are setting up a new factory to produce this rifle. I don't think we will see this carbine until 2010 at the earliest, but I am confident that it will be a good product! |
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Quoted:
Hey is that carbine chambered in .45 or something else? It looks like a more aesthetic 16" barrel version! The Kriss in semi auto form isn't the most practical thing when compared to cheaper pistol caliber carbines. However, I really commend them for offering something to us lowly citizen gun owners. A lot of defense oriented companies like HK and Colt refuse to release their latest designs to the public or they give us half assed versions like the SL8. We should all appreciate companies that are on our side! I really like the MSAR pistol caliber carbine and it is innovative with its ability to change calibers. I don't think it is vaporware at this point. I think MSAR got trapped in the whole "two weeks" thing and the obama gun rush which forced them to allocate all production capacity to their rifles. They have been promising a release this summer, but they are setting up a new factory to produce this rifle. I don't think we will see this carbine until 2010 at the earliest, but I am confident that it will be a good product! While H&K tends not to care about their civilian enthusiasts, both the SL8 and USC were born of necessity so that H&K could deliver something to civilians despite the heavy restrictions that are placed on firearms by our government. H&K guns are subject to importation laws so we are barred by law from importing cool guns like the G36 or UMP. I'm surprised HK gave us anything in our current climate. They are doing the best they can under the circumstances. The only way civilians will ever get HK94s, G36s, HK21s, UMPs, etc... is if they build a factory in America. And I doubt it's economically feasible, it's not like the demand isn't there. I'm no HK fanboy. I'll probably never own one unless they start making cheap HK94s and UMPs stateside (government dependent). I just wanted to point out that little fact. (You can also get Colts, FNs, Rugers, S&Ws, etc... I don't see any firearms maker being "anti-gun" anymore, the market and demand are just too strong. It's the laws that get in the way). |
| I bought one 2 weeks ago, I live in Va Beach were they make them, TDI was using our local range to test the units, I was able to shoot the SBR a few times, it was fun. The gun dont climb!! you can really keep the gun on target, in full auto! at 1300 RPM, mine has the 16inch barrel, I use a Burris 135 red dot, and at 25 yards, on a bipod 13 rounds in a in a quarter to half dollar size group, easy to clean, uses glock-21 mags, and I got some 28 round mags also, even in semi auto it is fun, I met some of the people that work there and make them they are good folks, been real nice and helpful with any questions I had, |
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The MSAR is never going to come out, its a gun in a long line of vaporware that will never reach the market. I was at the NRA show and they didnt even have a prototype out to show, if it was coming out this year I am pretty sure they would want to show it off. And I highly doubt they are going to get it under 1000, it would be nice if they could though, but im not holding my breath. [/quote] Would you care to make a sporting wager? 
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| I like mine although I haven't had it in my possession long. Bought it in Oct '08 as an impluse buy and loved it except for the 16" bbl. Functioned flawlessly out of the box and onto the range and put ragged holes in the target with irons. Sent it to TDI mid November to have it SBR'd. Finally got my Form 4 approved mid June '09 and I hope to pick it up next week from my SOT. My friend already saw it and says it looks awesome. It's been a long 8 months without it but the wait should be worth it. The balance should be a lot better with the 5.5" bbl although it wasn't too bad with the 16" and bbl shroud. I'm not interested in it being FA, especially with the ammo costs today. Quick double and triple taps should be a breeze. Love how it has 30rd mags with the extensions (have 8 of them) and all are compatible with my G21SF. Will be switching the MI BUIS with the Magpuls and adding an Eotech to it as well. The KRISS is one of those love em or hate em carbines. Personally I find the design and looks cool. |
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I personally think the KRISS is atleast 10 years to late. SMG's have very little to offer over a carbine or a sub-carbine and its been proven time and time again that .45 ACP isn't the best caliber for the application, atleast in a military context. *There are going to be .45 fans that say what about the Reising or M1? I will direct them to research done by Aberdeen about the efficacy of the caliber in SMG's*
I don't know about you, but I found all calibers of the UMP to be infinitely controllable and closed bolt blow-back is an extremely simple and reliable operating system. The cyclic rate of the KRISS is also much to high for 99% of applications and end users. 650 has been considered/proven to be the "sweet spot". I am always excited when new operating systems or weapons come out, but I balance that with real-world practicality. A 5.56 sub-carbine like a Swiss Arms 553 or HK G36C would be a much better choice than the KRISS, the same could be said of the UMP for the vast majority of teams/operators. |
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Pistol calibers are going the way of the Dino folks.
Especially in a Military context. Home Defense it would be a viable option still for some folks who have determined rifle or PDW caliber not fit for their needs, but the sheer length of the KRISS without an SBR make it IMHO not ideal. It is better to be able to shoulder a pistol carbine even if semi-automatic for a number of reasons over a pistol, but if it's ridiculously long you kind of defeat the purpose. |
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I can tell you that many many forgien militaries are still buying SMGs. The M4 filling the SMG role is not as accepted abroad as it is in the US. Body Armor is a fact now. As it becomes more proliferated and eventually more readily available on the black market pistol calibers will become increasingly obsolete for military use. Days of pistol calibers on the battle field are numbered. |
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Quoted: The MSAR is never going to come out, its a gun in a long line of vaporware that will never reach the market. I was at the NRA show and they didnt even have a prototype out to show, if it was coming out this year I am pretty sure they would want to show it off. And I highly doubt they are going to get it under 1000, it would be nice if they could though, but im not holding my breath. [/quote] Would you care to make a sporting wager? [/quote]Yeah, if he's wrong you owe me an MCS  |
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With the general trend moving from SMG to short-barreled assault rifle, this isn't going anywhere. The company won't sustain itself on offering a single avant garde design like this. Anything in a rifle caliber is going to be incredibly cumbersome, too much so for any meaningful LE or .mil interest.
I'm guessing that this is a company that won't be around for more than a year or two. Way too late to the party. |
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Quoted:
With the general trend moving from SMG to short-barreled assault rifle, this isn't going anywhere. The company won't sustain itself on offering a single avant garde design like this. Anything in a rifle caliber is going to be incredibly cumbersome, too much so for any meaningful LE or .mil interest. I'm guessing that this is a company that won't be around for more than a year or two. Way too late to the party. Even with the decline in use of PCC/SMGs the PDW is gaining a following. Chamber the KRISS in 5.7 and there very well may be a LE market. And even though you say it may be too cumbersome they have proof of concpet. Their bolt design may be able to work well with rifle cartridges. |
I absolutely love mine. Its isnt long range and yeah I would love to own the SBR version in FA but unfortunately I live in Kalifornia and well you all know how F'd Up this state is.....anyways. It is extremely light, quiet and accurate for a pistol caliber rifle. Havent had any jams or misfires of any kind.
http://i274.photobucket.com/albums/jj256/nbritt7/Kriss1.jpg |
[ARCHIVED THREAD] - KRISS (Page 1 of 2)
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