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Posted: 8/18/2010 7:30:50 AM EDT
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I'm going to cross post this from GD just for a bit more coverage Also, if you've ever had a ND or even a true AD and are willing to share, I'll take that too especially if you have pics. Obstructed bore pics are welcome as well. Yeah, I know google but I'm looking for backstories as well.
Thanks in advance. Also, this is for a safety presentation for a friend, not me. I'm just trying to help him out in the fastest way possible. |
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Quoted:
I'm going to cross post this from GD just for a bit more coverage Also, if you've ever had a ND or even a true AD and are willing to share, I'll take that too especially if you have pics. Obstructed bore pics are welcome as well. Yeah, I know google but I'm looking for backstories as well.
Thanks in advance. Also, this is for a safety presentation for a friend, not me. I'm just trying to help him out in the fastest way possible. Well... Two months ago, I inspected a .270 Weatherby MK.V through which a .270 Win had been fired. The case split and vented gas into the action, blowing the magazine box out, breaking the wood stock top to bottom on the left. Last week I inspected a Savage 110 in .300 Win Mag which was fired with a friends reloaded which upon inspection after the fact were loaded with an unspecified pistol powder. The lugs in the receiver were set back .030". The bolt nose was rivet out, so while you could rotate the bolt you could not retract it. The barrels chamber was swelled to the point at which the barrel nut is now permanent part of the barrel. HOWEVER, the action did not vent gas at all, it all went out the muzzle. The shooter/owner did not know anything was wrong other then bolt would not budge in the condition it was brought to me in. He was unhurt. Apparently the friend who loaded the ammo, after the 110 was siezed solid, decided to try his loads in his BAR which is reported to me to be a total loss. I did not see in it person, but talked to the owner and loader in question on the phone. Considering what I saw done to the Sav.110 with the same ammo, I can only imagine the damage to a SLR. The BAR owner was hurt but not severely. Which brings me to today and the results of a combining a new Cristensen Arms "Extreme" in 300RUM with a relatives hand loads. The hand loads are reported to be "safe" in the relatives guns. I did inform him that he might want to suggest to his relative that he reexamine the "safety" of said hand loads. Any way, after they beat the bolt open and got the fired case out they brought the rifle to me. Ejector was riveted solid, had to be machined out, and the extractor will have to be replaced. Head space looks okay on this one, while |
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I've never had an AD or ND...but was on the receiving end of one.
My Carry Gun for the longest time was a S&W 657 3" .41 Magnum...from a special "Lew Horton Run". The trigger broke like glass and it was a dream to shoot. I came home one day and unholstered the gun, sat it on the kitchen table and went in the other room to watch a movie on TV. My then-girlfriend's nephew shows up an hour or so later to hang out. He was a good kid and at this point in his life he was 22 or 23 and had been in the National Guard for 5 or 6 years. He goes to the kitchen to get something to drink, sees my pistola on the table. He picks it up to look at it and apparently plays around with it for a few minutes. I hear a loud BANG and for some reason when I hear firewrorks I always think they're gunshots and when I hear gunshots I think the opposite. So I get up about to yell at this kid for lighting firecrackers off in the house and I see him holding his ears and see my revolver on the floor. 
I start scanning for a bullet hole and see a perfect 0.419" hole in the kitchen wall... perfectly in line with my melon on the other side. 
I was lucky, it was a Winchester Silvertip and it went through the drywall hit a stud and expanded; it did not penetrate to the otherside and never reached my cranium. Later his mother threw a bitchfit because he told her that a second before he had it pointed at his own head and when it fired he was surprised it had a "hair trigger". I told her that an Army NCO should have known better than to play with a gun at all and if he was going to pick one up to make sure it was unloaded first. Guess that's the difference between the Army and the Marines. My own "mishap" was a year or so later...shooting a 1911. I was a speed-shooter back then and had a squib get stuck in my barrel. I put another round behind it and split the bbl from the front of the chamber to the bore. I replaced the bbl and bushing and shot that gun for another 10,000 rounds. Lessons learned...even if you have no children and your only houseguests are sdults...make sure your guns are secure/unloaded/ Also, take your time when you're shooting...fast is good, safe is better. |
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AD/ND
Many years ago (1990's), I had a failure to feed in a 1911. Now failures in a 1911 are almost unheard of but I was using some of the old Speer 200 grain "flying ashcan" rounds that really had feed issues. So while I am puzzling about why the gun did not go bang and trying to figure it out, I managed to get the gun to go into battery. (of course my finger was still on the trigger and bang). Could have been ugly but fortunately the gun was NOT pointed quite at my head.  Um I know better now.
Barrel Obstruction I had one round of .38 special jam in the forcing cone of a revolver. gun went "foosh" instead of "bang". Bad/slow primer? Anyway the bullet got a good start and then the powder went off thus jamming the bullet in the forcing cone and allowing the gasses to vent out the cylinder gap. It was obvious something was wrong so I immediately inspected the weapon and found the bullet. Ka-BOOM Not mine. But a local shop where I used to buy guns had an AR-15 upper receiver on display. Owner was shooting reloads (which is fine) owner had been loading pistol ammo before he switched to .223 and had somehow managed to leave a little bit of Red Dot (an extremely fast pistol powder) in the measure. Receiver looked like someone had put a miniature grenade in the chamber and set it off, which is basically what had happened. |
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Was at the range a month or so ago and my friend had a bolt fed .22 magnum. As he was chambering a round , the rifle fired. Luckily it was pointed in a safe direction, though elevated. putting a new hole in the roof of the shed.
We were able to repeat this problem. I suspect the firing oin was stuck to to dirt/residue from the rimfires. I will have to ask him if he cleaned it or repaired it yet. |
| I was in Va on a traing deal, left a Rossi 12ga Coach Gun loaded and leaning against the wall in a corner barrels up in the bedroom for my wife. 12ga, 00 2 3/4 full power, exposed hammers down - not cocked.. Wife calls me about 10:30 PM a few days later, she was in the den, hears big boom. Somehow the gun slid on floor, hammers hit the floor and it set one off. Blew a nice hole in the baseboard on an outside wall. Have no idea why gun slid. No one else/dog/ect in house. Gun had been there for over thirty years. It stays in the corner but not loaded. |
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(1) last week shooting a TEC 9 would only shoot two then jam, about half-way thu the mag got a wierd bang. Out of Battery discharge case head blown half off, lost it in the grass. magazine feedlip bent straight up. (2)Several years ago shooting reloads (mine in my Glock 21) old tarnished Rem case give up the ghost blows out at the feed ramp and scorches my hand, blows magazinge into the ground. gun survived. (3)Remington 513T that had a trigger so light it would go bang if you slapped the side of the stock even with the safety engaged. Gun stolen in susanville CA-1976 no great loss. (4) Long time ago 1973 tried flour for a buffer in 12 guage result dramatically increased the headspace of a Stevens pump needed a new locking plate. (5)early 90's used a can of IMR 4895 that had been stored in a very humid place it rusted the inside of the can, blew extractor on a 1978 vintage M-70 30-06 case was belted and primer fell out. replaced extractor and spring gun OK.
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Before I knew better, I tried to decock a loaded 1911 one handed like in the movies. My thumb slipped off the hammer and the gun fired twice before I could control it. Both rounds fired into the dirt.
This is a friends Webly in .38 S&W. It is a reminder to NEVER shoot anyone elses reloads. 
First round from a box of gunshow reloads. |
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I was at a public range last summer. There were some guys a few spots down that I knew from every other saturday that summer.
Long story short, I watched one shoot the other on a purely ND. 9mm FMJ out of a S&W M&P while "clearing a jam". through one armpit, hit both lungs and the heart and out the other armpit. He died in my arms as I administered medical attention. July 20th was the one year anniversary of his death. His daughter turns 1 yr old next month. The only pictures I have are those that are burned into my memory. |
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In the military, had a group of guys come back from an alert while they were on call. One was going to take the normal down time to clean his 1911 before turning it into the arms room. He locked the slide back and saw nothing in the chamber so he let the slide go. He had forgotten to remove the mag. He pulled the trigger, bang. He stood there stunned for a second and again pulled the trigger and again another bang. At this point someone grabbed the pistol. No one was hurt but one round stopped in a vest that was laying on a bunk and the second round richocheted into a wall where it lodged.
I had a friend call, my wife picked up and she became excited after a few moments handing me the phone. My friend explained he had been showing a friend a pistol when it had went off. I asked if everyone was alright and he ssid his friend had been hit in his foot. My friend asked what he should do and I told him to take his friend to a hospital because he obsiously had been hit. The next day I get a call from my friend who explained that his friend was fine other than a splinter of wood from the table the bullet hit. When his freind went into the ER the staff pretty much laughed the whole thing off because the splinter was extremely small and took nothing more than a bandaid to fix after they removed the small splinter. My friend was pissed over it but I told him he better be glad because it could have been a lot worse than a splinter. Had another friend who was dicking around with his 9mm pistol as he sat in his car next to my car. I heard a dull thump. I looked over at him wondering what the noise was. His car had smoke lingering so I pretty much knew what he had done. I opened the door on his car and began to talk to him to make sure he was alright. He was having a real hard time hearing what I was saying after dischaging the pistol with his windows up. Just a few Dolomite |
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Only AD/ND I had was with a Garand....the safety is in front of the trigger (on the trigger guard itself), and one has to pull it backwards––in a trigger-ish motion––to activate it.
I was negotiating a steep hillside, went to put the safety on "just in case", but didn't look where my finger was...fwiw, my firing hand was *not* holding the rifle on the grip, it was near the rear sight area, so my "muscle memory" of the safety's location was not engaged... Put the "safety" on and....BOOM! Lessons learned: 1. Always hold the rifle as if you're about to shoot it––hand on pistol grip, or forward hand on handguard. Don't use unorthodox holding methods. 2. Visually check finger:trigger relationship before pressing/twitching anything. 3. Last but not least, always, always control where the muzzle is pointing. In this case, it was straight up (I never swing the muzzle horizontally)
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| Had a friend that got into reloading, he was almost always distracted while reloading which is a bad thing. He blew up two guns before he stopped reloading. The first on was a Marlin Camp Carbine in 9mm. Blew the stock right in two when he shot it. He didn't get hurt on that one. The second one was a Hi-Point 9mm. I was standing about 25 feet to his right shooting at a target. Heard a loader than normal bang and looked over. They he was standing with the high point in hi hands looking at us. The frame had split into three peices and the recoil spring was hangin out of the front of the gun. Part of the gun? had come back and hit him in the cheek causing him to bleed a bit. He sent that gun back and got a new one. I have not had a gun go kaboom. I have had a few shotgun shells go puff. When a shell sounds funny when it goes off it is wise to check the gun out before continuing. |
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In basic, had an ND with a blank. They had us walking back and forth across an open field all night. I guess the idea was to have us understand what it was like to move all night like that, but without the loss of control you might find trying to take 50 noobs through the woods.
Anyway, new to the M16, I wasn't all that familiar with the controls yet, but I knew that when on safe the selector should be horizontal. I kept checking it periodically. I was carrying with my finger resting just behind the mag release. I stumbled again, and clenched my hand shut, and my finger slipped that short distance onto the trigger. The rifle fired one shot; it was not on safe, it was on burst, and I just managed to get my finger off before it could fire all three. I figure there were two problems here. The first problem was that I was only familiar enough to know that horizontal was safe, but ignorant enough to know realize the positional difference between safe and burst. I thought I knew it was on safe, but all I really knew was that it was on safe OR burst. The other problem was that off the trigger isn't good enough. Fully extended would have put my finger on the mag release, which might have been better, but still bad in a different way. I prefer up above the mag release, or better yet, below the trigger guard. |
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Seen the following happen saw a Major ND their M9 5 times into a clearing barrel and reholster without putting the weapon back on safe heard (and shortly after saw) the selector on an M4 fail and cause a ND after a soldier tripped and fell, luckily happened with blanks and not live rounds had the following happen to me Posted this one once before. I purchased a Sig 229 at a gun show for what I thought was a steal, $200 with 5 factory high cap mags. First time out shooting it I had the gun pointed downrange and decocked after cambering a round and the gun went off. My finger was no where near the trigger either, and being like a kid who just touched a hot stove I tried the decocker again and had the same thing happen. Now wondering WTF was up with the gun I cleared it and put it away for fear of seeing what would happen if I were to actually try to shoot the thing. Turns out the guy I bought it from at the gun show had monkey fucked the thing so badly that it was no longer safe to shoot. I sent it back to sig for repair and in the end, pretty much ended up paying more than the price for a brand new 229 to get it fixed. It went back into the safe never to be brought out again. I ended up giving it to a friend of mine as compensation for helping me with some work when he expressed interest in it and asked why he'd never seen it before (he's seen my whole collection many times). He still owns it and still shoots it regularly. The following happened a few months prior, and this is what taught me to ALWAYS use the decocker on DA/SA guns. Had a ND at home once due to gross negligence on my part. I had just dissembled and cleaned the gun when something distracted me from what I was doing. I came back a few hours later and saw that the hammer was cocked on the gun. Thinking that it was empty and failing to check to make sure I pulled the trigger and BOOM!!! Round went into the floor, thankfully at a safe angle away from anything soft and squishy. Apparently just before I got distracted I loaded a mag and chambered a round, when I left the room I dropped the mag but didn't eject the round and decock the gun. Stupid I know, but I learned my lesson from that and double, triple, and quadruple check the chamber both physically and visually to make sure a gun is empty. I dug the slug out of the floor when we removed the carpet in the room, and it as well as the case sit ontop of my gunsafe as a reminder. Maybe one day I'll mount it on a piece of wood and write something like, "This is the result of complacency" on it. |
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