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Posted: 10/18/2011 4:39:44 PM EDT
| I formed some 308 brass to 6.5 Creedmoor but the necks are too thick. Tool recommendations and tips would be appreciated. Thanks |
| I have been using a Forster Neck turner. It is easy to set up and use. Once you set the wall thickness it does not change. You do have to buy a mandrel for each caliber |
| Ditto, same here with the forster. Although I have to admit that I might have to find a different one for my 50BMG. Not enough distance between the frame and the brass. The shaved brass gets between cutter and the frame. But I regress, this is a much larger cartridge and thus the case is much closer to the frame. So as the brass curls, it curls right into the frame. I am sure that a smaller cartridge will not have this problem. Otherwise I love the adjustment knob. makes it easy to walk in the cutter as you shave the brass in steps. |
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Turning necks on those cases will lead (eventually) to "the dreaded dount". You will also want to get an inside neck reamer. Wilson makes a good one, as do others.
As an alternative, get a bushing die with an appropriately sized bushing such that outside neck turning is not needed. That way, you'll not get a "donut". |
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Here is RCBS Case Neck Turner, P/N 98861. The tool threads into the end of the RCBS standard trim-pro, replacing the standard trim head. This will "peel" the OD and "Ream" the ID of the case neck.
I used this when making 7mm-08 cases from necked down .308 cases. The "doughnut" shows up inside the neck at the junction of the shoulder. The reamer takes care of that (with some difficulty). The peel function sets the neck thickness. The peel part is universal, the ream part is changed to suit the particular caliber. The reamers are ordered from RCBS as separate items. 
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Here is RCBS Case Neck Turner, P/N 98861. The tool threads into the end of the RCBS standard trim-pro, replacing the standard trim head. This will "peel" the OD and "Ream" the ID of the case neck. I used this when making 7mm-08 cases from necked down .308 cases. The "doughnut" shows up inside the neck at the junction of the shoulder. The reamer takes care of that (with some difficulty). The peel function sets the neck thickness. The peel part is universal, the ream part is changed to suit the particular caliber. The reamers are ordered from RCBS as separate items. http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh133/counterclockwisester/rcbscaseneckturner.jpg Can this be used by hand? I use possum hollow trimmers and don't have a trimmer with a hand crank. |
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Ditto, same here with the forster. Although I have to admit that I might have to find a different one for my 50BMG. Not enough distance between the frame and the brass. The shaved brass gets between cutter and the frame. But I regress, this is a much larger cartridge and thus the case is much closer to the frame. So as the brass curls, it curls right into the frame. I am sure that a smaller cartridge will not have this problem. Otherwise I love the adjustment knob. makes it easy to walk in the cutter as you shave the brass in steps. Off topic, but the K&M neck turner works great for the .50. I just got through with about 300 or so. |
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Here is RCBS Case Neck Turner, P/N 98861. The tool threads into the end of the RCBS standard trim-pro, replacing the standard trim head. This will "peel" the OD and "Ream" the ID of the case neck. I used this when making 7mm-08 cases from necked down .308 cases. The "doughnut" shows up inside the neck at the junction of the shoulder. The reamer takes care of that (with some difficulty). The peel function sets the neck thickness. The peel part is universal, the ream part is changed to suit the particular caliber. The reamers are ordered from RCBS as separate items. http://i255.photobucket.com/albums/hh133/counterclockwisester/rcbscaseneckturner.jpg Can this be used by hand? I use possum hollow trimmers and don't have a trimmer with a hand crank. I have used it by hand. You may be able to adapt it to a larger handle for hand use. |
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I use the K&M neck turner together with their carbide cutting pilot, pilot jack, and Ergo Holder - the tool works well. http://www.kmshooting.com/catalog/neck-turner-tools/micro-adjustable-neck-turner-with-carbide-pilot_power-adapter_and-shell-holder.html To get it motorized, I use the Sinclair "Driver and Caseholder” and this is an excellent combo with the K&M turner. http://www.sinclairintl.com/.aspx/pid=33962/Product/Sinclair-Driver-and-Caseholders Beware though if you intend to neck turn, you will need to also buy something to first expand the neck before turning, I use the K&M Expand Iron with their expand mandrel. http://www.kmshooting.com/catalog/case-neck-expanding-tools/expand-iron_complete.html |
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Quoted:
I use the K&M neck turner together with their carbide cutting pilot, pilot jack, and Ergo Holder - the tool works well.
http://www.kmshooting.com/catalog/neck-turner-tools/micro-adjustable-neck-turner-with-carbide-pilot_power-adapter_and-shell-holder.html To get it motorized, I use the Sinclair "Driver and Caseholder” and this is an excellent combo with the K&M turner. http://www.sinclairintl.com/.aspx/pid=33962/Product/Sinclair-Driver-and-Caseholders Beware though if you intend to neck turn, you will need to also buy something to first expand the neck before turning, I use the K&M Expand Iron with their expand mandrel. http://www.kmshooting.com/catalog/case-neck-expanding-tools/expand-iron_complete.html Thanks. I don't intend very high volume. How important is it to motorize the process? Thinking about this... at $80 with the carbide cutting pilot its a good bit more expensive than the RCBS but the RCBS gets some poor reviews on Midway 
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Quoted: Quoted: I use the K&M neck turner together with their carbide cutting pilot, pilot jack, and Ergo Holder - the tool works well. http://www.kmshooting.com/catalog/neck-turner-tools/micro-adjustable-neck-turner-with-carbide-pilot_power-adapter_and-shell-holder.html To get it motorized, I use the Sinclair "Driver and Caseholder” and this is an excellent combo with the K&M turner. http://www.sinclairintl.com/.aspx/pid=33962/Product/Sinclair-Driver-and-Caseholders Beware though if you intend to neck turn, you will need to also buy something to first expand the neck before turning, I use the K&M Expand Iron with their expand mandrel. http://www.kmshooting.com/catalog/case-neck-expanding-tools/expand-iron_complete.html Thanks. I don't intend very high volume. How important is it to motorize the process? Thinking about this... at $80 with the carbide cutting pilot its a good bit more expensive than the RCBS but the RCBS gets some poor reviews on Midway http://www.kmshooting.com/images/products/med_1996099288.jpg One can certainly do it by hand, but I think motorizing is useful if you think you are going to do quite a bit of brass - how much is a bit is a personal thing though. On the other hand, the sad truth is that the combine cost of the Sinclair driver and caseholder appears to pales when I looked at how much I had already spent on the other parts i.e. it was more expensive than I envisioned but as they say "in for a pound in for a penny”. I would also suggest you read some of the articles that are on 6mmBR.com. Here is one on "Neck Turning Basics” by German that covers some of the tools we have been talking about. Oh, BTW, if you neck turn, you will likely also need some sort of neck expanded to make sure the neck ID and neck tension is consistent. See what I mean by cost? http://www.6mmbr.com/neckturningbasics.html |
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Will this RCBS hand turner take the ream? http://lh3.googleusercontent.com/public/OJRQYlHIe6kU9yc5OPgm63pZIY3H_MvWnU-wz8gpn83oWxLCLBp0WsgJKkg-luNOA8b4Mpt2gqkDiuk4r6btMqEalsR4zDnIF091-dnsFCHjcNagqRWHKOlGFOZr4KwwoG9P07gvf6W-MUfrEH0XcoeRxSIk3yqZPTuv8SayMqzux22YOXPN0Yz1zR8PnKPsfQ You should probably check with RCBS about this. Nice folks in Oroville CA. It looks as they are using my idea of using old cast off keyless drill chucks from cordless drills to hold the case.  Torques can get on up there when you are reaming the doughnut out. A 3/8 chuck will hold a 5.56 nicely. A 1/2 chuck will hold the 5.56mm and 7.62mm, etc.
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It looks as they are using my idea of using old cast off keyless drill chucks from cordless drills to hold the case. Torques can get on up there when you are reaming the doughnut out. A 3/8 chuck will hold a 5.56 nicely. A 1/2 chuck will hold the 5.56mm and 7.62mm, etc.It’s a good idea – I like it! Holding the case around more of its circumference instead of just down there by the case head gives you a much truer hold. That is a weakness of all the caseholders I have seen and used. It’s not a horrible thing but I always thought that there should be a better way. Hey, I think I have an extra drill chuck around here somewhere….  |
| Ok slightly off topic but seems we are now talking about ways to hold the case you you can use a drill to spin the case in the neck turner. OK, I have the K&M case trimmer (length) and It comes with a device that holds the case via the head and extractor groove. |
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I've tired quite a few, and find this one to be the easiest to set up, repeat a setting, and consistent:
http://www.sinclairintl.com/.aspx/pid=35271/Product/Sinclair-Premium-Neck-Turning-Kit |
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Thanks again all. This is new to me and the videos below have been helpful. He also refers to my specific issue which is thick necks caused by forming one cartridge into another though focuses on turning the outside.
Couldn't figure out how to insert the video so have added links. Neck Turning 1 Neck Turning 2 Neck Turning 3 |
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Quoted:
Thanks again all. This is new to me and the videos below have been helpful. He also refers to my specific issue which is thick necks caused by forming one cartridge into another though focuses on turning the outside. Couldn't figure out how to insert the video so have added links. Neck Turning 1 Neck Turning 2 Neck Turning 3 OK, but ammoman says he likes "outside neck turning" and branches off there in his lecture. If you are downsizing necks, you really need to get the doughnut out by reaming the ID. Otherwise, the case with the doughnut can lock up your FL sizing die and expander in the press. 
Also, it looks as if he cranks it down .006 in .002 steps to get a nice turn or "peel" down to bright metal on the exterior of the neck. That should not be the objective. The objective should be to get the neck ID and OD or neck OD and neck thickness down to specified dimensions. The proper dimensions should result in an adequate clearance fit between the chamber free bore and neck OD, and a proper interference fit between bullet shank and neck ID for desired neck tension. In addition, the ID and OD should be concentric with the case shoulder (as much as practical) to minimize Run Out between bullet and case when assembled and loaded in the chamber. This last requirement is most difficult because it has the least control in any of the reforming schemes I have seen so far. I think some finicky reforming reloaders just selectively sort by measurement their batches to attain the RO limit they desire at this point. I have not verified this, but IMO, fireforming possibly could improve RO on the 2X pass. Others may have evidence to the contrary. |
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