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Posted: 9/1/2015 10:25:23 AM EDT
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I know this has been hashed over a million times, and Ive read most of the threads.
I need to pick up an 8# of powder for loading 308. Id prefer if I can run this thru a Hornady drop as hand trickling sucks. Bullet weights will range from 150 to 175gr. Not super interested in chasing as much FPS as I can get, loading for accuracy. Would prefer to not have compressed loads. Rifle is a Savage Model 10 with a 26" Criterion 10 twist barrel. I use LC 7.62X51 brass, so I drop all charge weights 2gr and work up from there. Primers are CCI 200's. Right now Im just loading plinkers with H335 with Hornady 150gr FMJBTs mostly because I keep alot of both on hand, H335 for 223 and 150's for my 300 BO. I have narrowed it down to: IMR 4166 - "new" IMR powder, burn rate somewhere between H4895 and Varget, looks to be somewhat bulky so compression might be an issue at the top end? H4895 - an old standard, according to Hodgdon should be a lower pressure load compared to the others here so brass life could be better 8208 XBR - "new" powder, meters good, I use this for my "accuracy" loads in my AR for 60gr+ bullets so I keep a pound or 2 on the shelf all the time. CFE 223 - ball powder. Seems to consistently yield the highest FPS of the 4 powders but at the highest charge weight. Have heard it can have pressure issues? 4064 and Varget is very hit or miss, trying to stick with components that are in stock more often than not. Im leaning toward 8208 XBR, I have some on hand, it meters nice. I have not used it for 308 yet. 4895 is a pretty standard powder, and is versatile, but Im not afraid to try something new. Will 4166 get me better performance than 8208? I can buy a single pound of it and do some testing but would prefer to hear some thoughts from other guys that have used 4166. |
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Quoted:
:) I figured 8208 but I wanted some feedback on 4166. Quoted:
Quoted:
Your right, this is a once a week thread. IMR-8208 XBR. Varget for metering issues unless you have a $300 powder trickler. :) I figured 8208 but I wanted some feedback on 4166. I have worked up loads with 4166 along side of 4064 and varget. Its almost identical to 4064. My go to powders for my 308 are varget and 4064. If both out, will use 4166. Always see this instock. |
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Never used 8208XBR, but it looks like it would meter about the same as IMR4064 and N140.
IMR4064 and N140 have been as available on line as any powders, perhaps moreso. I've never had to wait more than a couple of weeks to see some in stock at PV or elsewhere. If you're constrained to LGSs, your experience may be different. IMR4064 is used in FGMM ammo - I'd consider that a pretty strong endorsement. For me, IMR4064 and N140 under 168gr Sierra and 167gr Scenar produce similar excellent results out of my 26" CZ750. But then again, I trickle up charges carefully.. |
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H-335 is perfect for 150gr class of bullets In .308/7.62x51. No it's not the first choice for accuracy for most people but it's because of it not being as temperature stable as other powders. But for good accuracy and dead on metering from most powder dispensers it's hard to beat H-335.
During a recent load work up using Hornady 150gr SST in a M1A "Loaded" I had to try several powders just to find one that would shoot better groups than my H-335 load. As it turns out that was Varget but I believe it was at the expense of some velocity. This is judging my data alone I haven't had a chance to chronograph it yet. Motor |
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Quoted: Never used 8208XBR, but it looks like it would meter about the same as IMR4064 and N140. IMR4064 and N140 have been as available on line as any powders, perhaps moreso. I've never had to wait more than a couple of weeks to see some in stock at PV or elsewhere. If you're constrained to LGSs, your experience may be different. IMR4064 is used in FGMM ammo - I'd consider that a pretty strong endorsement. For me, IMR4064 and N140 under 168gr Sierra and 167gr Scenar produce similar excellent results out of my 26" CZ750. But then again, I trickle up charges carefully.. IMR 8208 XBR is a short cut extruded and measures much better than IMR-4064. |
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BTW.... never compress Ball Powders.
I know you said you didn't want to load any compressed loads.... but Ball powder can clump easier when compressed. Possibly Resulting in less than proper combustion.... hangfires ... think early OEM Winchester brand .458 Win. Mag loads. |
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Here are my own personal favorites for .308:
H4895 - My go-to powder. It meters well, and is always consistent for 308. I will always keep H4895 stocked. Reloader 15 - I've also used this with excellent results. Works well with .223 too. Varget - this would be my #1 powder choice if it wasn't so unavailable. If you can find an 8lb jug, buy it. |
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Quoted:
Here are my own personal favorites for .308: H4895 - My go-to powder. It meters well, and is always consistent for 308. I will always keep H4895 stocked. Reloader 15 - I've also used this with excellent results. Works well with .223 too. Varget - this would be my #1 powder choice if it wasn't so unavailable. If you can find an 8lb jug, buy it. These are my choices for 308 as well. I scored a bunch Varget FTF from a guy on the EE. 
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4064 works great for me. It is the first powder I purchased and havn't bothered trying another yet for 308. I don't load a ton of 308, so throwing a charge then trickling a few tenths of a grain in doesn't really bother me and I can still get quite a few loaded in a short time.
43.6grs of 4064 and 168gr SMK or 168gr NCC Loaded to a COAL of 2.815 = MOA or less as long as I don't screw it up. I do use XBR8208 for precision 223 loads since I do those on my LNL and can get a consistent powder throw. Great powder as well, but more expensive locally so I will stick to using it for 223 to get more rounds per pound. |
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I'm planning to use a lot of 4064 because of posts like yours and what high master shooters told me about it being the best for 30.06 garand match loads.
I tried 8208 and it was accurate in lighter .308 bullets for my AR10 but it develops high pressures before I hit good velocity in bullets over 155 gr. Varget is great but I can get the 4064 a lot cheaper and I have the time to trickle powder charges for accuracy. |
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Quoted:
BTW.... never compress Ball Powders. I know you said you didn't want to load any compressed loads.... but Ball powder can clump easier when compressed. Possibly Resulting in less than proper combustion.... hangfires ... think early OEM Winchester brand .458 Win. Mag loads. I don't know if you realize this but there are many loads in major published reloading manuals that use compressed charges of ball powder. I don't think they would publish this data if it was harmful. In fact compressed charges of ball powder is very common in both rifles and pistols. Just one example: 35.5gr of Leverevolution is listed as a compressed load in 30-30 Win with the 160gr FTX. 37gr IS THE MAX LOAD. For .308 Win if you use Winchester-760 or H-414 the max loads are compressed clear up to and including loads with 200gr bullets. Motor |
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LC brass and Varget can get crunchy real easy with the heavier bullets.
I was forced to use some H335 with some 150's and it worked fine but had some serious fireballs now and then, even with an 18" barrel. It wasn't a hot load either. I can't find Varget for shit around here so I picked up some TAC. It is working better than the H335 but I don't know if I would use it for heavier bullets than 155's. |
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I had the same thing happen with cfe223 in a 223, below max load by a good bit and super high pressure when warm outside, spooky. Quoted:
Varget and IMR 4064 are working great for me. Just started messing with AR-Comp and it seems pretty good so far. CFE223 gave me some blown primers with what should have been a mild load. |
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My problem with CFE223 was with .308 loads. I haven't tried it in .223 and probably won't. If anyone in the Northern Nevada area wants what's left of the pound they can have it. If not I will probably sprinkle it on a few plants for fertilizer.
Quoted:
I had the same thing happen with cfe223 in a 223, below max load by a good bit and super high pressure when warm outside, spooky. Quoted:
I had the same thing happen with cfe223 in a 223, below max load by a good bit and super high pressure when warm outside, spooky. Quoted:
Varget and IMR 4064 are working great for me. Just started messing with AR-Comp and it seems pretty good so far. CFE223 gave me some blown primers with what should have been a mild load. |
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Quoted:
My problem with CFE223 was with .308 loads. I haven't tried it in .223 and probably won't. If anyone in the Northern Nevada area wants what's left of the pound they can have it. If not I will probably sprinkle it on a few plants for fertilizer. Quoted:
My problem with CFE223 was with .308 loads. I haven't tried it in .223 and probably won't. If anyone in the Northern Nevada area wants what's left of the pound they can have it. If not I will probably sprinkle it on a few plants for fertilizer. Quoted:
I had the same thing happen with cfe223 in a 223, below max load by a good bit and super high pressure when warm outside, spooky. Quoted:
Varget and IMR 4064 are working great for me. Just started messing with AR-Comp and it seems pretty good so far. CFE223 gave me some blown primers with what should have been a mild load. Can you give me specific load weights? I bought a point and already rolled 20 rounds of .308 |
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Quoted:
I had the same thing happen with cfe223 in a 223, below max load by a good bit and super high pressure when warm outside, spooky. Quoted:
I had the same thing happen with cfe223 in a 223, below max load by a good bit and super high pressure when warm outside, spooky. Quoted:
Varget and IMR 4064 are working great for me. Just started messing with AR-Comp and it seems pretty good so far. CFE223 gave me some blown primers with what should have been a mild load. How many grains? What projectile? |
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I had pressure signs, including a blown primer, with 47gr behind a 168gr Match HPBT at 2.800". According to the Hodgden website this should have been just above a starting load. Observed in 3 different rifles with my Remington 700 being the most tolerant.
I understand Hornady for the CFE223 data starts much lower. |
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Quoted: I had pressure signs, including a blown primer, with 47gr behind a 168gr Match HPBT at 2.800". According to the Hodgden website this should have been just above a starting load. Observed in 3 different rifles with my Remington 700 being the most tolerant. I understand Hornady for the CFE223 data starts much lower. What was the headstamp of the cases you were using? |
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I've heard that about FC cases but personally have never had a problem with them loading moderate amounts of Varget, 4064 or RE15. The CFE223 loads were clearly over pressure.
That said I also have a good pile of Lake City match LR brass that I'll be prepping soon. |
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Quoted:
I had the same thing happen with cfe223 in a 223, below max load by a good bit and super high pressure when warm outside, spooky. Quoted:
I had the same thing happen with cfe223 in a 223, below max load by a good bit and super high pressure when warm outside, spooky. Quoted:
Varget and IMR 4064 are working great for me. Just started messing with AR-Comp and it seems pretty good so far. CFE223 gave me some blown primers with what should have been a mild load. Interesting… I had the same issue with some loads that I just started working up. I was using WCC cases, 27gr, Hornady 55gr FMJ. It was hot outside (95ish) and I was shooting a suppressed 10.5" upper. I was surprised that it showed those pressure signs. |
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I only load 308 for extreme accuracy so metering doesn't matter to me.
If I want to plink, I shoot my 223. If I want accuracy, I shoot my 308. 4064 is my goto powder for almost anything around 30 caliber. I use it for 30-06, 308, 7.7 Japanese, 6.5 Swiss, etc.. It is very accurate, affordable, and compatible with a whole lot of rounds. I like stocking the least diverse powder selection I can and I buy in bulk to save $$. I personally would stick with 4064 and forget metering or just buy a charge master. |
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