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Posted: 2/21/2008 6:50:48 PM EDT
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www.botachtactical.com/ceprsc1.html The price of those look good considering how light weight those are. Getting 3.4 lb plates is really attractive I must admit, especially if you've ran around in 6 or 9 pound plates previously. But are these really Level III stand alone? Most poly plates I see require a Level IIIA insert to bring them up to true Level III spec. Oh, one other thing, since these are single curve, will I need to be worried about them fitting well in certain plate carriers or should they be good to go in most? These suckers are almost a full inch thick. I'd most likely opt for a basic Eagle carrier or something using a similar design and price point. If these are true Level III standalone, i.e. they'll stop SS109, 7.62X39 mild steel core and non-AP .308, I'll likely order a set of those. |
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Yes, they can be Level III stand-alone...to a point. Level III protocol ONLY requires that it stop six rounds of 7.62x51 ball ammo. That's it. Generally, "pure" poly plates won't stop the 5.56x45mm M855/SS109 rounds (i.e. 'green tip') or anything considered "improved penetration". Remember, this isn't a requirement of the NIJ rating protocol. So, yes, they are technically Level III. Being rectangular in shape, a 10x12" plate will not fit in the rear of a S/M Eagle Plate Carrier. Any 11x14" rectangular plate will not fit the rear of a L/XL Eagle Plate Carrier. This is due to the narrowing of the rear portion of the carrier's interior near the top, and requires "operator cut" plates. A 10x12" rectangular will fit a L/XL Eagle Plate Carrier. Poly plates are also heat susceptible, and can lose ballistic integrity if they get over 160-170 degrees Fahrenheit for any length of time (i.e. trunk of a car in Phoenix during summer). Polyethylene plates are 1/2 the weight but twice the thickness of comparable ceramic plates. But, as with all armor, it's a trade off of protection versus weight and mobility. If poly plates could do it all, don't you think they'd be everywhere? Each type of plate has it's pros and cons. Same with polytethylene. TimW Phoenix |
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There are horror stories with Botach, and there are satisfied customers. The main thread I keep coming to is to call them to ensure they have them in stock before actually placing the order. I've only ordered from them once, back in 2003, and got lucky and had no issues whatsoever. I then quit while I was ahead. :) |
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TimW, Thanks for the info. The Eagle S/M carrier happens to be the exact version I was interested in buying. So I guess these plates are a no go. And though I love the low weight these plates offer, if they won't stop the commonly available SS109/M855 loads, I would feel wearing them would be taking a somewhat foolish risk just to save a few pounds. BTW, aren't you from Practical Tactical? I was just browsing your site and saw some CPC/PPI ceramic plates that weigh 6.1 pounds and are triple curve for $250 each. Those are still several pounds lighter than most of the steel plates but appear to offer a higher level of protection than poly plates. They should also fit the Eagle S/M carrier. However, these are listed as Level III/Level IV. Does this mean I would still need a IIIA panel behind them in order to be protected from SS109? Or does it mean that a IIIA panel would only be needed in order to stop the .30 cal AP loads? I am not particularly worried about .30 cal AP where I am. But I would like protection from SS109 and 7.62x39 mild steel core. If these plates will do that without requiring I buy a Level IIIA insert, it looks like they would be a good weight/cost compromise. Thanks again for taking the time to answer my questions. Body armor is one area in which my knowledge is pretty limited. |
on page two of this thread they talk ( argue ) all about this. also some great info in general in it.AR15.COM :: Forums :: Good deal on this carrier and plates I bought at lunch today http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=6&f=10&t=236492&page=2 yes Tim is Practical Tactical, I'v order all sorts of stuff from him 
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I would recommend going with TimW...he always has great advices and knows his $## I'm saving my pennies to buy a set of plates for my Eagle S/M PC as well. a review can be found here: m4c my 0.02 
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I just ordered my plates for my eagle s/m carrier from Kejo. 160 a piece for level III ICW my level 2 vest and they were at my door and then in the carrier within a few days. |
Yes, I am Practical Tactical. Because I am not an advertiser here, I try not to step on the toes of the paying industry folks, as it's the right thing to do. As for the plates in question, yes, they require the use of a Level IIIA vest or plate backer to achieve EITHER level III or Level IV ratings. They are not, and never have been, stand-alone plates. As far as I am aware, there are no Level III stand-alone Ceramic plates, due to the nature of how ceramic plates work and the number of rounds required in the testing protocol. They do make Level IV stand-alone plates, but the testing requirements for level IV are such that they failed on rounds 5 and 6 when tested against the Level III procedure. If you're looking for Level III stand alone plates, you'll need to stick with polyethylene or steel, both of which have their drawbacks (i.e. no M855 for poly, and weight for steel), but also advantages (weight for poly, price for steel). TimW Phoenix |
I'm actually gonna take back my "careful" statement from earlier. I just ordered some Items from them a week ago and received them pretty quick.. Shipping time sucks cause Im all the way on the east coast exactly 3000 miles away.. But hey, they showed up in reasonable time and was exactly what I ordered.. CXS |
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