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Posted: 2/18/2010 4:02:33 PM EDT
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We all know why we carry a shtf weapon in the car. I wanna use my sub 2000 as mine. I got a friend & we were talking about having one in the car & playing "devils advocate" for different situations ... the question of what happens if you get pulled over popped up.
I'm planning on carrying a backpack with the sub 2000 & 4 mags (100 rds total) with a few other items in it. Gun will be unloaded but in same bag as ammo. How legal will that be ? I tend to have a lead foot at times but have no other "quirks" that might get me stopped. I guess I'm looking at is it worth the hassle to do it ? I usually have a handgun on me anyway. Any opinions or thoughts are welcome. Thanks. |
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You can as many guns and ammo as your car will hold as long as they are legal to have in the first place. While it may look suspecious to have a bugout bag and weapon in your car, it really is none of his business and you do not have to have any justification.
Now remember to check out your state laws, some states may have regulations about the transportation of firearms....most don't. |
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I frequently transport an AR, cased and empty, but with mags in pockets of the rifle case. To my knowledge it is legal to do this in PA. Presume you have a PA CCW, which should forgive some sins at least.
Why would the po-lice search your vehicle in any case? Moon |
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You carry a pistol so you'll actually make it to your car, right?
Or in a state where you can't carry and it won't matter? If so, "peaceful journey" or whatever that law is is honored in most places, but your trunk gun needs to be in a locked container and/or trigger locked. If it's a trunk proper, you'll probably be okay. If it's a hatchback or SUV in the back, you'll be less okay. So - lock it in a container - have the key with you. If you need to bug out, at that time put the Sub 2000 into your bug out bag. There are some caveats to peaceful or peacible journey laws depending on where you are, so be sure to read up on the jurisdictions you travel, but other than DC, NJ, NYC, and CA, you should be alright. The thing to look for is what that state defines as "traveling through" (and so protected) and what is not. And lastly, if you're asked to consent to a search, say no, because that's your right, and your saying no does not constitute probable cause. The whole reason you're asked is because the officer does not have probable cause. |
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Quoted:
Maybe I'm out of line I don't see the purpose of a PCC as a trunk gun. You already will have a pistol caliber on you, your handgun. The scenarios abound......a freak storm cuts power, just as the Detroit Pistons win the championship (or lose––doesn't matter) and a riot breaks out.....the police, having a labor contract that is delayed 2 years+ due to management (or the union––doesn't matter) step down from the job en masse...the Nat'l Guard is called out, but it's discovered they are mostly in Iraq/A-Stan, and those who are left don't have a current recall phone list....plus they have a 72hr response time.... That's when your car breaks down about 3 miles from home. A rifle would be a good thing right about then....btw this type of scenario has happened several times in the recent history of the US, (Rodney King riots, several race riots in the midwest, etc) so it's not a totally outrageous thing. |
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In, NY, a weapon carried in the vehicle may not be loaded , unless of course you have a CCP.
A magazine that has ammuntion in it, even in the trunk will get you arrested for illegal pocession, unless you have a CCP for that weapon. It is ok to drive around with a rifle in your trunk , it just can't be loaded, Again loaded is defined as having a magazine loaded even if it is stored seperatly from the rifle. Answer that I believe should be ok is stripper clips. Takes a few seconds longer, but should get the job done. Note NY City has its own rules.Basically if you don't have a city license for any weapon don't take it with you unless your traveling through the city to anoher destination. Sucks for me Because I live 3 miles from the NYC , city limits so I am always doing something that will take into , the city even if it is going to a particular supermarket. Note Federal rules re traveling between jurisdictions with firearms do apply. So if I were driving to PA from my Long island home via NYC , I can have a trunkload of assault weapons , which are illegal in NYC but ar elegal where I live and in PA. |
| In pa as long as you have a carry permit you can have a pistol and loaded mags in the same compartment of the vehicle. I think with rifles the rule is no loaded rifles allowed. The rifle can be in the pass. compartment, but loaded mags need to be in a different locked area, such as the trunk. I would check out the PA fire arms owners assoc. website for more info. |
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I think his point was: Why not have a rifle in a rifle caliber? Quoted: Quoted: Maybe I'm out of line I don't see the purpose of a PCC as a trunk gun. You already will have a pistol caliber on you, your handgun. The scenarios abound......a freak storm cuts power, just as the Detroit Pistons win the championship (or lose––doesn't matter) and a riot breaks out.....the police, having a labor contract that is delayed 2 years+ due to management (or the union––doesn't matter) step down from the job en masse...the Nat'l Guard is called out, but it's discovered they are mostly in Iraq/A-Stan, and those who are left don't have a current recall phone list....plus they have a 72hr response time.... That's when your car breaks down about 3 miles from home. A rifle would be a good thing right about then....btw this type of scenario has happened several times in the recent history of the US, (Rodney King riots, several race riots in the midwest, etc) so it's not a totally outrageous thing. |
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In, NY, a weapon carried in the vehicle may not be loaded , unless of course you have a CCP . The License to Carry in NY State has absolutely no bearing on rifles or shotguns in NY State. The license to carry a concealed weapon applies only to the registered handguns that correspond to that specific license. Meaning you can only carry concealed the handguns/pistols that you have on your own permit. Meaning you can't carry your fathers big old Smith 456 unless it happens to be listed on your permit. A loaded rifle or shotgun cannot legally be carried in a vehicle in NYS unless you are an exempt person such as a LEO, etc. A magazine that has ammuntion in it, even in the trunk will get you arrested for illegal pocession, unless you have a CCP for that weapon.
Incorrect. On all counts. You can have loaded AR, AK and Glock mags in your trunk. They just cannot be inserted in the firearm. I carry my CCW handgun mags anywhere in my vehicle. Again, the concealed carry pistol permit only relates to handguns/pistols. It is ok to drive around with a rifle in your trunk , it just can't be loaded, Again loaded is defined as having a magazine loaded even if it is stored seperatly from the rifle.
Incorrect. See above. Answer that I believe should be ok is stripper clips. Takes a few seconds longer, but should get the job done.
No difference between clips or mags, as both are ammunition feeding devices. Note NY City has its own rules.Basically if you don't have a city license for any weapon don't take it with you unless your traveling through the city to anoher destination.
Sucks for me Because I live 3 miles from the NYC , city limits so I am always doing something that will take into , the city even if it is going to a particular supermarket. Note Federal rules re traveling between jurisdictions with firearms do apply. So if I were driving to PA from my Long island home via NYC , I can have a trunkload of assault weapons , which are illegal in NYC but ar elegal where I live and in PA. This info is almost completely incorrect. See above. |
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A loaded rifle or shotgun cannot legally be carried in a vehicle in NYS unless you are an exempt person such as a LEO, etc. A magazine that has ammuntion in it, even in the trunk will get you arrested for illegal pocession, unless you have a CCP for that weapon.
Incorrect. On all counts. You can have loaded AR, AK and Glock mags in your trunk. They just cannot be inserted in the firearm. I carry my CCW handgun mags anywhere in my vehicle. Again, the concealed carry pistol permit only relates to handguns/pistols. It is ok to drive around with a rifle in your trunk , it just can't be loaded, Again loaded is defined as having a magazine loaded even if it is stored seperatly from the rifle.
Incorrect. See above. [ I disagree, PL 265.00(15) states: "Loaded firearm" means any firearm loaded with ammunition or any firearm which is possessed by one who, at the same time, possesses a quantity of ammunition which may be used to discharge such firearm. Having loaded mags in your trunk with the firearm they go with almost certainly means you possess a loaded firearm under NY law. |
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A loaded rifle or shotgun cannot legally be carried in a vehicle in NYS unless you are an exempt person such as a LEO, etc. A magazine that has ammuntion in it, even in the trunk will get you arrested for illegal pocession, unless you have a CCP for that weapon.
Incorrect. On all counts. You can have loaded AR, AK and Glock mags in your trunk. They just cannot be inserted in the firearm. I carry my CCW handgun mags anywhere in my vehicle. Again, the concealed carry pistol permit only relates to handguns/pistols. It is ok to drive around with a rifle in your trunk , it just can't be loaded, Again loaded is defined as having a magazine loaded even if it is stored seperatly from the rifle.
Incorrect. See above. [ I disagree, PL 265.00(15) states: "Loaded firearm" means any firearm loaded with ammunition or any firearm which is possessed by one who, at the same time, possesses a quantity of ammunition which may be used to discharge such firearm. Having loaded mags in your trunk with the firearm they go with almost certainly means you possess a loaded firearm under NY law. You are still incorrect whether you agree or not. "Firearm" as a term in the Penal Code does not mean what you think it does. Suffice it to say without getting this into a more protracted NY State legalese definition thread, you can have a rifle or shotgun in your car in the trunk with loaded mags in that same compartment. As long as the ammunition feeding device is not inserted into the shotgun or rifle while its in your trunk you are good to go. You can legally drive around with a rifle in a gun rack outside of a rifle case if you are so inclined. |
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A loaded rifle or shotgun cannot legally be carried in a vehicle in NYS unless you are an exempt person such as a LEO, etc. A magazine that has ammuntion in it, even in the trunk will get you arrested for illegal pocession, unless you have a CCP for that weapon.
Incorrect. On all counts. You can have loaded AR, AK and Glock mags in your trunk. They just cannot be inserted in the firearm. I carry my CCW handgun mags anywhere in my vehicle. Again, the concealed carry pistol permit only relates to handguns/pistols. It is ok to drive around with a rifle in your trunk , it just can't be loaded, Again loaded is defined as having a magazine loaded even if it is stored seperatly from the rifle.
Incorrect. See above. [ I disagree, PL 265.00(15) states: "Loaded firearm" means any firearm loaded with ammunition or any firearm which is possessed by one who, at the same time, possesses a quantity of ammunition which may be used to discharge such firearm. Having loaded mags in your trunk with the firearm they go with almost certainly means you possess a loaded firearm under NY law. You are still incorrect whether you agree or not. "Firearm" as a term in the Penal Code does not mean what you think it does. Suffice it to say without getting this into a more protracted NY State legalese definition thread, you can have a rifle or shotgun in your car in the trunk with loaded mags in that same compartment. As long as the ammunition feeding device is not inserted into the shotgun or rifle while its in your trunk you are good to go. You can legally drive around with a rifle in a gun rack outside of a rifle case if you are so inclined. I am not so inclined, but I agree that you are correct that "firearm" has a narrower definition than I had assumed, and I don't see anything in NYPL saying you can't have a rifle in your trunk with loaded mags. So it seems you're right. |
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A loaded rifle or shotgun cannot legally be carried in a vehicle in NYS unless you are an exempt person such as a LEO, etc. A magazine that has ammuntion in it, even in the trunk will get you arrested for illegal pocession, unless you have a CCP for that weapon.
Incorrect. On all counts. You can have loaded AR, AK and Glock mags in your trunk. They just cannot be inserted in the firearm. I carry my CCW handgun mags anywhere in my vehicle. Again, the concealed carry pistol permit only relates to handguns/pistols. It is ok to drive around with a rifle in your trunk , it just can't be loaded, Again loaded is defined as having a magazine loaded even if it is stored seperatly from the rifle.
Incorrect. See above. [ I disagree, PL 265.00(15) states: "Loaded firearm" means any firearm loaded with ammunition or any firearm which is possessed by one who, at the same time, possesses a quantity of ammunition which may be used to discharge such firearm. Having loaded mags in your trunk with the firearm they go with almost certainly means you possess a loaded firearm under NY law. You are still incorrect whether you agree or not. "Firearm" as a term in the Penal Code does not mean what you think it does. Suffice it to say without getting this into a more protracted NY State legalese definition thread, you can have a rifle or shotgun in your car in the trunk with loaded mags in that same compartment. As long as the ammunition feeding device is not inserted into the shotgun or rifle while its in your trunk you are good to go. You can legally drive around with a rifle in a gun rack outside of a rifle case if you are so inclined. I am not so inclined, but I agree that you are correct that "firearm" has a narrower definition than I had assumed, and I don't see anything in NYPL saying you can't have a rifle in your trunk with loaded mags. So it seems you're right. Thank you. I was not trying to be rude or cause offense. I was just trying to help out fellow NY'ers better understand what they can and cannot do according to the law. I currently enjoy the use of a Kel Tec Sub2000 pistol caliber carbine as my "trunk gun". I keep 3 loaded magazines in the truck but not in the mag well. I take my Sub2000 out of my vehicle at home/I don't leave it in over night.  |
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Quoted: Maybe I'm out of line I don't see the purpose of a PCC as a trunk gun. You already will have a pistol caliber on you, your handgun. Not out of line at all, many feel that way about PCCs in general regardless of purpose/use. IMHO, a PCC is a great supplement to a handgun that shares the same ammo (even better still if it shares the same mags) and can give greater accuracy/control/range (and sometimes terminal ballistics, depending on the load) than the corresponding handgun. It can make a whole lot of sense in a vehicle if (1) the user in question is more familiar/capable with a PCC than a rifle, (2) if the PCC in question is more concealable than a traditional rifle and concealment is expected to be an issue, and/or (3) if the daily bug-route would involve terrain and expected situations that shouldn't require a full-powered rifle. For all of the reasons above, my wife keeps a KT SUB-9 that uses the same mags as her S&W 9mm carry guns in her SUV all the time. That said, even though I own several PCCs that will utilize my Glocks' 9mm mags, I always keep an AR in my vehicles, personally. I am well-trained/-practiced on the AR platform and own many; she is not, but is quite effective with her SUB (within the limits of the platform, of course) and with an 870 (we keep one of those in all of the vehicles as well). For us, it's that simple. FWIW, when I travel out of town on business in a motor pool vehicle or travel with others in their vehicles and toting an AR & its gear isn't a practical option for me, then is when I will put a handy little KT folder (mine use Glock mags, as I carry Glocks) and a 6-pack of G18 mags in my luggage –– small and handy really fits that particular bill for me. |
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Quoted: I'd be a bit paranoid about keeping guns in my car. It's already been broken into and stolen once (got it back, thank God), but I'd hate to have some scumbag get his hands on my guns. Just my 2 cents. I've kept multiple firearms and other gear in all of my vehicles 24/7 for three decades now without the first incident. Probably has a lot to do with where I go (or not) and park (or not), and I harbor no illusion that it can't happen to me. Might happen tomorrow, in fact, but I would write the loss off as the an acceptable cost for always being prepared/having gear with me. This gets hotly debated here from time to time but, IMHO, it is a very personal and subjective issue/decision. YMMV, as always. |
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