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Posted: 12/25/2013 2:07:45 PM EDT
| i have a kenitic frankford arsonal pullet, but alot of times i get sick of banging the thing all over the place... is the hornady cam lock puller worth it or does the collet leave bullet marks ? |
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One thing you got to remember is the bullet you pull regardless of the method has already been seated in a case and that my friend will leave markes on the case bearing surface which is frankly much more important than slight marks on the ogive. The reason is because the bearing surface smoothness affect neck tension and that can potentially affect MV and POI. What you have to accept is if you seat a bullet and pull it, it is no longer an unblemish bullet and is best used as foulers or for plinking. But buy the Hornady, it's a lot easier than a kinetic and less messy.... |
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That’s is correct. Pulled bullets are great for plinking or short distance stuff but for precision long distance – no. For one thing, ignoring the blemish, mil pulldowns come from a huge number of different bullet lots which mean their bearing surface length is all over the place, I know, I have measured them. If bearing surface lengths are significantly different, and I am talking about more than 10 thousands, this will affect seating depths, case volume, , chamber pressure, MV, and you got the idea…. |
| I used a kinetic hammer puller for years and wore out several collets banging away trying to pull .223 bullets. Bought a RCBS puller with .223 and .308 collets and have kicked myself for waiting so long. Pulls bullets easily and I don't get bullet deformation, leaves the powder in the case rather than in the puller and sprinkled all over the floor. Worth every penny. I hear it doesn't work as well on pistol bullets which don't have much of a gripping surface. It's the trick for pulling light weight .223 bullets which don't pull easily banging around with the kinetic puller. Looks like the Hornady puller would be slightly easier to clamp but I have no complaints with the RCBS. |
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Quoted: I just got a RCBS one and it is awesome. No pull marks at all. Wish I would have gotten one 30 years ago. The hammer thing is a joke compared to the collet.  Recently had to pull about 400 22-250s and invested n the RCBS. Would not want to pull that many with a hammer style puller.
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Quoted: Is it harder to pull a bullet that has been crimped? I have quite a few that I think might be over charged. And will the bullets be worth a damn still? I think they were pulled bullets to begin with (gun show specials). Seat the bullets a little deeper to break the crimp/sealant loose. Kinetic pullers are a must for pistol rounds, not enough parallel shank on the bullet to get a collet on. Collet puller for rifle rounds.
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Another thing on the collet pullers.
If you polish the inside of the collet, ALONG the cuts,it usually doesn't leave marks,, unless you really crank down on them. I always seat the bullet a little deeper to break tension between the bullet and brass before I pull. |
Hell I like it so much I pull bullets just for the hell of it now. 
For the last 30 years I have been buying some of the black tip 30-06 AP ammo at gun shows every time I go and pulling the bullets. Now I am pulling the green tip bullets from M 855 and reloading them in my cases with my powder with near 1 or 1.5 moa accuracy with the new load. Its just so easy with the collet puller. |
I have a old 30cal. collet puller and a Frankford arsenal hammer. But most of the time i just use my Rockchuker with the shell holder / without a die and a washer & pliers. It leaves the powder in the case and is way faster than any collet setup. I have not been able to see any accuracy degradation due to the jaw marks on the bullet in 30 years of doing this method. It even works with some pistol rounds
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Really depends on what you are going to use the bullets for. For foulers or plinking, they are absolutely GTG. Now if you are thinking of shooting 600 yards, that is a completely different story.... Looking at a bullet for marks tells you very little. If you are really serious in testing to see if something important has changed, measure the bearing surface length of the bullet before and after pulling, or new ones from a box and ones that have been pulled with a collet and you will see that there is significant changes to the length of the bearing surface. BTW, that number tells you how much surface contact your rifling when you fire it and it does not take much imagination to see that changes in bearing surface length will change you MV which is critical for long distance precision shooting. |
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Quoted:
Really depends on what you are going to use the bullets for. For foulers or plinking, they are absolutely GTG. Now if you are thinking of shooting 600 yards, that is a completely different story.... Looking at a bullet for marks tells you very little. If you are really serious in testing to see if something important has changed, measure the bearing surface length of the bullet before and after pulling, or new ones from a box and ones that have been pulled with a collet and you will see that there is significant changes to the length of the bearing surface. BTW, that number tells you how much surface contact your rifling when you fire it and it does not take much imagination to see that changes in bearing surface length will change you MV which is critical for long distance precision shooting. There is no way you are going to change the LENGTH of the bearing surface of a jacketed bullet by pulling it with the correct collet puller or kinetic puller. If you did you would at least need an optical comparator to see it. It's hard to argue with your theory about pulled bullets being less accurate but you have gone too far with this bearing surface stretching. BTW: I kinetic pull mil-surp 7.62x54R and reload the powder and bullet into a brass boxer primed case and they are MORE ACCURATE. |
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Quoted: There is no way you are going to change the LENGTH of the bearing surface of a jacketed bullet by pulling it with the correct collet puller or kinetic puller. If you did you would at least need an optical comparator to see it. It's hard to argue with your theory about pulled bullets being less accurate but you have gone too far with this bearing surface stretching. BTW: I kinetic pull mil-surp 7.62x54R and reload the powder and bullet into a brass boxer primed case and they are MORE ACCURATE. Quoted: Quoted: Really depends on what you are going to use the bullets for. For foulers or plinking, they are absolutely GTG. Now if you are thinking of shooting 600 yards, that is a completely different story.... Looking at a bullet for marks tells you very little. If you are really serious in testing to see if something important has changed, measure the bearing surface length of the bullet before and after pulling, or new ones from a box and ones that have been pulled with a collet and you will see that there is significant changes to the length of the bearing surface. BTW, that number tells you how much surface contact your rifling when you fire it and it does not take much imagination to see that changes in bearing surface length will change you MV which is critical for long distance precision shooting. There is no way you are going to change the LENGTH of the bearing surface of a jacketed bullet by pulling it with the correct collet puller or kinetic puller. If you did you would at least need an optical comparator to see it. It's hard to argue with your theory about pulled bullets being less accurate but you have gone too far with this bearing surface stretching. BTW: I kinetic pull mil-surp 7.62x54R and reload the powder and bullet into a brass boxer primed case and they are MORE ACCURATE. |
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Quoted:
Kinetic pullers are a must for pistol rounds, not enough parallel shank on the bullet to get a collet on. Collet puller for rifle rounds. I use the RCBS collet puller for just about everything, rifle and pistol. The only bullets it seems to have trouble with are cast lead, can't seem to get a grip. |
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The reason the length of the bearing surface is longer is NOT because the bullet was pulled. The reason is because when you grab the bullet with the collet, you excert significant pressure on it. Remember a bullet is a soft bag of lead surrounded by a copper jacket. When you squeeze hard on the jacket, it imparts a lot of pressure on the soft lead which respond by expanding like a ballon in the area which you are not squeezing which is the area immediately close to the bearing surface which increase it's diameter. It is this additional increase diameter area you will find when you measure bearing surface length. Trust me, I've done it and it's real. Measure it yourself if you are not a believer. Quoted:
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Really depends on what you are going to use the bullets for. For foulers or plinking, they are absolutely GTG. Now if you are thinking of shooting 600 yards, that is a completely different story.... Looking at a bullet for marks tells you very little. If you are really serious in testing to see if something important has changed, measure the bearing surface length of the bullet before and after pulling, or new ones from a box and ones that have been pulled with a collet and you will see that there is significant changes to the length of the bearing surface. BTW, that number tells you how much surface contact your rifling when you fire it and it does not take much imagination to see that changes in bearing surface length will change you MV which is critical for long distance precision shooting. There is no way you are going to change the LENGTH of the bearing surface of a jacketed bullet by pulling it with the correct collet puller or kinetic puller. If you did you would at least need an optical comparator to see it. It's hard to argue with your theory about pulled bullets being less accurate but you have gone too far with this bearing surface stretching. BTW: I kinetic pull mil-surp 7.62x54R and reload the powder and bullet into a brass boxer primed case and they are MORE ACCURATE. OK tell me what you are measuring with. |
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Quoted: OK tell me what you are measuring with. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Really depends on what you are going to use the bullets for. For foulers or plinking, they are absolutely GTG. Now if you are thinking of shooting 600 yards, that is a completely different story.... Looking at a bullet for marks tells you very little. If you are really serious in testing to see if something important has changed, measure the bearing surface length of the bullet before and after pulling, or new ones from a box and ones that have been pulled with a collet and you will see that there is significant changes to the length of the bearing surface. BTW, that number tells you how much surface contact your rifling when you fire it and it does not take much imagination to see that changes in bearing surface length will change you MV which is critical for long distance precision shooting. There is no way you are going to change the LENGTH of the bearing surface of a jacketed bullet by pulling it with the correct collet puller or kinetic puller. If you did you would at least need an optical comparator to see it. It's hard to argue with your theory about pulled bullets being less accurate but you have gone too far with this bearing surface stretching. BTW: I kinetic pull mil-surp 7.62x54R and reload the powder and bullet into a brass boxer primed case and they are MORE ACCURATE. OK tell me what you are measuring with. |
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