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Posted: 7/24/2024 12:07:21 PM EDT
[#1]
I'm not familiar with 10 codes or radio chatter, but why would the words "self-inflicted" appear twice on 911 dispatch, @5:04 and @5:19? Can someone shed some light?
 911 dispatch audio offers timeline of fatal shooting of Sonya Massey |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 12:09:00 PM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Quite a statement from the sheriff Apologies if previously posted. The Body Worn Camera footage has now been released, and the public can see what we saw: Sonya Massey lost her life due to an unjustifiable and reckless decision by former Deputy Sean Grayson. Grayson had other options available that he should have used. His actions were inexcusable and do not reflect the values or training of our office. He will now face judgment by the criminal justice system and will never again work in law enforcement. Ms. Massey needlessly lost her life, and her family deserves answers. I trust the legal process will provide them. This incident does not reflect the values or actions of our law enforcement community. It was a tragic decision made by an individual who had the training, tools, and experience to know better. We are committed to upholding a standard that prevents such tragedies from occurring in the future. Thank you. Sheriff Jack Campbell |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 12:19:32 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: He's going to jail. He should. They should have left immediately after they found no prowler. He was fishing. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 12:21:00 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No true Scotsman.... Quote HistoryQuoted: No true Scotsman.... Quoted: Not sure if serious. But if you are I gotta know due your screen name. Do you have the Gadsden Flag sticker right next to the TBL decal, or are they in opposite corners of your rear window? Quoted: The Illinois State Police did the investigation and reached that conclusion. The sheriff was not involved, other than referring it to the state police. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 12:24:05 PM EDT
[#5]
He had to get it on?
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Posted: 7/24/2024 12:25:05 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: For the sake of conversation, let's say that you're correct that she did attempt to throw the pot. You're leaving out everything that led up to that point. - Cop was aggressive / rude with her from the jump - At one point she was walking back into the house and said "I love you all"....this could have been the end of the whole thing. So far it doesn't seem like she's aggressive or planning an ambush with a pot of water like one poster suggested - The cops brought up the water on the stove and let her go take the pot off the stove, they must not have felt too threatened yet or she wouldn't have been allowed to handle it. - She removes the pot, sits it down and says "I rebuke you in the name of Jesus" because the second cop took a step back - The cop apparently not knowing that phrase is not a physical threat, pulls his gun and threatens to shoot her in the face - She put her hands up, apologized and dropped to her knees At no point did she seem aggressive, a little off but it seems safe to assume cops have conversations with people every day that are a little off. The whole situation went south when the cop lost his shit because he didn't know the definition of rebuke. I would guess that the vast majority of people would not make completely rational decisions when a conversation transitions from "nice conversation, even if a little off" to "I'll shoot you in the fucking face" with a gun pointed at them within 2 seconds.....let alone someone who's obviously struggling a bit. I don't believe this was 1st degree murder.....but watching the video it's clear to me that the reason this escalated the way it did is on the cop. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: You guys are seriously baffling. It absolutely shows her grabbing it and throwing it. That's how it ends up a few feet in front of her on top of a chair, after she left it on the counter when she got on her knees. lol nope. The prosecution has to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that it was not self defense. Defendant doesn't have to prove shit in America. The only thing baffling is people justifying this shoot. I'm not arguing whether it's justified or not, I'm pointing out the plainly obvious. Before you can even consider whether it was justified or not, you have to know what actually happened, and what actually happened is she threw the pot. For the sake of conversation, let's say that you're correct that she did attempt to throw the pot. You're leaving out everything that led up to that point. - Cop was aggressive / rude with her from the jump - At one point she was walking back into the house and said "I love you all"....this could have been the end of the whole thing. So far it doesn't seem like she's aggressive or planning an ambush with a pot of water like one poster suggested - The cops brought up the water on the stove and let her go take the pot off the stove, they must not have felt too threatened yet or she wouldn't have been allowed to handle it. - She removes the pot, sits it down and says "I rebuke you in the name of Jesus" because the second cop took a step back - The cop apparently not knowing that phrase is not a physical threat, pulls his gun and threatens to shoot her in the face - She put her hands up, apologized and dropped to her knees At no point did she seem aggressive, a little off but it seems safe to assume cops have conversations with people every day that are a little off. The whole situation went south when the cop lost his shit because he didn't know the definition of rebuke. I would guess that the vast majority of people would not make completely rational decisions when a conversation transitions from "nice conversation, even if a little off" to "I'll shoot you in the fucking face" with a gun pointed at them within 2 seconds.....let alone someone who's obviously struggling a bit. I don't believe this was 1st degree murder.....but watching the video it's clear to me that the reason this escalated the way it did is on the cop. I'm not arguing any of that. The fact that she 100% threw the pot is my only point. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 12:27:48 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Had she actually "come at him" with a pot of boiling water, that would be different. But he created distance, and maintained plenty of distance. Then instead of backing away, he appears to begin to advance on her right before firing She didn't have it in her hands when he advanced. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 12:44:52 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm mostly sad that the sheriff got hoodwinked so easily, while the arfcom sleuths so quickly and easily found the killing justified and maybe even heroic lol The demeanor of the supervisor is also telling when he sees the scene and the cop describes his justification for shooting the woman. He asks, “You shot her?” When the cop says, “yeah”, all he says is “alright”, looks at the shooter and steps past him to address the other officers outside. I’m sure the supervisor gave the sheriff a heads up on the mess before any body cams were reviewed. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 12:47:54 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Huh? It's a type of logical fallacy. I'm saddened but not surprised to hear it's foreign to you. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 12:51:44 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So, you're agreeing with me? The sheriff is throwing his deputy under the bus instead of pushing back. The deputy jumped in front of a bus. I can't blame the sheriff for not joining him. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 12:53:04 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not familiar with 10 codes or radio chatter, but why would the words "self-inflicted" appear twice on 911 dispatch, @5:04 and @5:19? Can someone shed some light?  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfh9vmQUyjcI sounds like the supervisor talking to dispatch and dispatch answering that it was. Without radio IDs though it's tough to know for sure. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 1:03:05 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Huh? That's a strange reaction to a neutral truth. So, you're agreeing with me? The sheriff is throwing his deputy under the bus instead of pushing back. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: No true Scotsman.... Quoted: Not sure if serious. But if you are I gotta know due your screen name. Do you have the Gadsden Flag sticker right next to the TBL decal, or are they in opposite corners of your rear window? Quoted: The Illinois State Police did the investigation and reached that conclusion. The sheriff was not involved, other than referring it to the state police. So after a 3rd party investigation concludes this shooting was questionable at best, you think the sheriff should push back? That would send an awesome message to the public. 
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Posted: 7/24/2024 1:03:27 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Huh? That's a strange reaction to a neutral truth. So, you're agreeing with me? The sheriff is throwing his deputy under the bus instead of pushing back. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: No true Scotsman.... Quoted: Not sure if serious. But if you are I gotta know due your screen name. Do you have the Gadsden Flag sticker right next to the TBL decal, or are they in opposite corners of your rear window? Quoted: The Illinois State Police did the investigation and reached that conclusion. The sheriff was not involved, other than referring it to the state police. The way you are licking boots makes sense now. You had as much reading comprehension of Atlas Shrugged when you chose your user name as you do understanding what happened in this incident. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 1:04:42 PM EDT
[#14]
Where are they getting these psychos for cops? Don't answer, I guess I know. Attitude, tats, big mouth, he is the whole package. They will put him in for a long time. I am OK with that, and other police should be too. He ruins the reputations of the better officers. I know police are not the sharpest knives in the drawer; but we really need to do better.
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Posted: 7/24/2024 1:41:25 PM EDT
[#15]
I understand what you mean, but I think we should be careful not to let isolated incidents reflect the broader reality of law enforcement professionals.
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Posted: 7/24/2024 1:59:50 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Huh? That's a strange reaction to a neutral truth. So, you're agreeing with me? The sheriff is throwing his deputy under the bus instead of pushing back. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: No true Scotsman.... Quoted: Not sure if serious. But if you are I gotta know due your screen name. Do you have the Gadsden Flag sticker right next to the TBL decal, or are they in opposite corners of your rear window? Quoted: The Illinois State Police did the investigation and reached that conclusion. The sheriff was not involved, other than referring it to the state police. He's throwing the dude under the bus because he thinks he deserves to be thrown under the bus. Hell the dude climbed under the bus himself. Even the other deputy present at the shooting was in disbelief that the guy shot her in the head. He was having trouble collecting himself. I'm willing to bet he threw the other dude under the bus too in his statement. There was no reason to create the situation in the first place when all she did was say she rebukes him in the name of Jesus. I wasn't really familiar with the term. But here's what it means. He took it as a threat and in turn threatened her with being shot in the head. Problem is, it wasn't a threat. It was an expression of criticism. Which is understandable when you invite someone in your home and they insult you by acting of afraid of you taking a steaming pot off the stove. 
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Posted: 7/24/2024 2:03:14 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I understand what you mean, but I think we should be careful not to let isolated incidents reflect the broader reality of law enforcement professionals. When that becomes a two way street maybe. Maybe. Not everyone law enforcement enciunters are trying yo kill them. Yet for officer safety they are taught to treat us that way. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 2:44:02 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Quite a statement from the sheriff Apologies if previously posted. The Body Worn Camera footage has now been released, and the public can see what we saw: Sonya Massey lost her life due to an unjustifiable and reckless decision by former Deputy Sean Grayson. Grayson had other options available that he should have used. His actions were inexcusable and do not reflect the values or training of our office. He will now face judgment by the criminal justice system and will never again work in law enforcement. Ms. Massey needlessly lost her life, and her family deserves answers. I trust the legal process will provide them. This incident does not reflect the values or actions of our law enforcement community. It was a tragic decision made by an individual who had the training, tools, and experience to know better. We are committed to upholding a standard that prevents such tragedies from occurring in the future. Thank you. Sheriff Jack Campbell The shooting seems to reflect the values of many LEO on this forum. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 4:07:07 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not familiar with 10 codes or radio chatter, but why would the words "self-inflicted" appear twice on 911 dispatch, @5:04 and @5:19? Can someone shed some light? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lfh9vmQUyjc3-FRANK-## is an EMS unit Radio Call Sign as assigned by IDPH, 3F19 in this case. Springfield is a little weird because they have 3 private ambulance companies along with City and County Fire departments, and for some reason all the EMS units use their IDPH numbers instead of the typical "MEDIC x/y/z" over the radio. And if CMED is anything like our county dispatch...LEO, FIRE and EMS channels don't talk well with each other. I've had bad info relayed by dispatch playing the inter-agency telephone game. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 4:16:54 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Another thing that shouldn't have been done was hiring this cop in the first place, since this was his 6th department since 2021 with multiple resignations and two DUI convictions. Shocking, since he clearly is a people person. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/277223/GTK5YWbXAAIBa11-3274831.jpg To be fair, Pawnee, Kincaid, Virden and Auburn are all little poe-dunk towns south of Springfield. He may have had the goal of working for Springfield PD or Sangamon County SO, and worked his way through the small town PDs trying to climb the ladder. That's not THAT unusual around here. No doubt his disciplinary records for all of them will be FOIA'd by the media. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 4:49:39 PM EDT
[#21]
So Boiling Water is a Lethal Threat? Um-kay...technically, yeah...if sufficient volume at sufficient temperature was aspirated into his open mouth to cause tracheal/pharyngeal swelling. But practically? I don't think she's got it in her. It's painful, abso-fuckin-lutely! He might had got blisters on his face.
 This was sub-212 degree water...NOT 350-400 degree fryer oil. NOT battery acid or lye. And if the "Reasonable belief of death or great bodily harm" holds up...what are you actually preventing? You fire after she throws...guess what? That water is still coming at you!! so either a) you step back and the water misses you. Charge her with Agg Assault b) don't move, water hits you. Charge her with Agg Battery c) you close distance, shoot her and the water STILL misses you (as if it wasn't really a danger). YOU get charged with Murder 1. d) you move back, magical lady strength throws 100gal of magical super-thermal liquid directly at your face. You mag dump lady into oblivion. Super Lethal Liquid STILL hits you...because bullets don't block liquid. And FYI, Illinois does not have "Premeditation" in it's Murder 1 clause. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 4:58:16 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It's a type of logical fallacy. I'm saddened but not surprised to hear it's foreign to you. Quote HistoryQuoted: It's a type of logical fallacy. I'm saddened but not surprised to hear it's foreign to you. Quoted: So after a 3rd party investigation concludes this shooting was questionable at best, you think the sheriff should push back? That would send an awesome message to the public. Did I overestimate average human intelligence again? Quoted: I wasn't really familiar with the term. But here's what it means. He took it as a threat and in turn threatened her with being shot in the head. Problem is, it wasn't a threat. It was an expression of criticism. Which is understandable when you invite someone in your home and they insult you by acting of afraid of you taking a steaming pot off the stove. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/277223/rebuke-3275782.png |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 4:58:46 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So Boiling Water is a Lethal Threat? Um-kay...technically, yeah...if sufficient volume at sufficient temperature was aspirated into his open mouth to cause tracheal/pharyngeal swelling. But practically? I don't think she's got it in her. It's painful, abso-fuckin-lutely! He might had got blisters on his face. This was sub-212 degree water...NOT 350-400 degree fryer oil. NOT battery acid or lye. And if the "Reasonable belief of death or great bodily harm" holds up...what are you actually preventing? You fire after she throws...guess what? That water is still coming at you!! so either a) you step back and the water misses you. Charge her with Agg Assault b) don't move, water hits you. Charge her with Agg Battery c) you close distance, shoot her and the water STILL misses you (as if it wasn't really a danger). YOU get charged with Murder 1. d) you move back, magical lady strength throws 100gal of magical super-thermal liquid directly at your face. You mag dump lady into oblivion. Super Lethal Liquid STILL hits you...because bullets don't block liquid. And FYI, Illinois does not have "Premeditation" in it's Murder 1 clause. Anyone who doesn't believe a pot of boiling water can cause life changing and disfiguring injuries is lying or incredibly naive. I'm not trying to convince you it was a good shoot but let's be honest |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 5:12:18 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Isn't the justification always along the lines of "to prevent death or serious bodily injury" Anyone who doesn't believe a pot of boiling water can cause life changing and disfiguring injuries is lying or incredibly naive. I'm not trying to convince you it was a good shoot but let's be honest In the right context, yes, as I tried to point out (with hyperbole, but hey, its GD). I'm saying, that context isn't here... what little water she did manage to throw, barely made it over the counter. The deputy MIGHT have got his boots wet. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 5:16:08 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: He's throwing the dude under the bus because he thinks he deserves to be thrown under the bus. Hell the dude climbed under the bus himself. Even the other deputy present at the shooting was in disbelief that the guy shot her in the head. He was having trouble collecting himself. I'm willing to bet he threw the other dude under the bus too in his statement. There was no reason to create the situation in the first place when all she did was say she rebukes him in the name of Jesus. I wasn't really familiar with the term. But here's what it means. He took it as a threat and in turn threatened her with being shot in the head. Problem is, it wasn't a threat. It was an expression of criticism. Which is understandable when you invite someone in your home and they insult you by acting of afraid of you taking a steaming pot off the stove. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/277223/rebuke-3275782.png Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: No true Scotsman.... Quoted: Not sure if serious. But if you are I gotta know due your screen name. Do you have the Gadsden Flag sticker right next to the TBL decal, or are they in opposite corners of your rear window? Quoted: The Illinois State Police did the investigation and reached that conclusion. The sheriff was not involved, other than referring it to the state police. He's throwing the dude under the bus because he thinks he deserves to be thrown under the bus. Hell the dude climbed under the bus himself. Even the other deputy present at the shooting was in disbelief that the guy shot her in the head. He was having trouble collecting himself. I'm willing to bet he threw the other dude under the bus too in his statement. There was no reason to create the situation in the first place when all she did was say she rebukes him in the name of Jesus. I wasn't really familiar with the term. But here's what it means. He took it as a threat and in turn threatened her with being shot in the head. Problem is, it wasn't a threat. It was an expression of criticism. Which is understandable when you invite someone in your home and they insult you by acting of afraid of you taking a steaming pot off the stove. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/277223/rebuke-3275782.png Funny enough based on context she may not have even been talking to them. She says it when she grabs the pot. If it was hot and over filled. She may have splashed some on herself. Anyone familiar with the religious context of the statement would know it's not uncommon for people to say it in regards to a difficult or painful situation and not simply at an individual. Or in a TLDR. Black church folk often say that in the place of cursing because it's like mantra or ward against negative emotions. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 5:27:32 PM EDT
[#26]
Johnnie Miller (in response to death threats from a large angry man):
I'm standing my ground. Take your swing. Jury: You provoked and escalated Aaron Howard into coming at you with a bat. Murder. Sean P. Grayson (in response to a woman saying "I rebuke you in the name of Jesus" with her back turned to him): You better fucking not. I swear to God, I'll shoot you right in the fucking face. (I misremembered it, originally I thought the rebuke was in response to the f-bombs, but it was in response to him backing away when she moved the pot, and to me it sounded like the two of them were joking about his fear of hot water until he started with the f-bombs) |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 6:07:45 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I know what the fallacy is. I don't understand how it is relevant to pointing out that sometimes cops are thrown under the bus by their leadership. Everybody spotted that the line describing being on opposite sides of a counter as being in separate rooms is dishonest and misleading and dismissed the report as being a pre determined stab in the back. Anybody that read farther saw that the comparison of moving for visibility to stepping in front of a car in motion is both absurd and a have-your-cake-and-eat-it-too admission that she was in fact a lethal force threat. Did I overestimate average human intelligence again? You really didn't know what rebuke means? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: It's a type of logical fallacy. I'm saddened but not surprised to hear it's foreign to you. Quoted: So after a 3rd party investigation concludes this shooting was questionable at best, you think the sheriff should push back? That would send an awesome message to the public. Did I overestimate average human intelligence again? Quoted: I wasn't really familiar with the term. But here's what it means. He took it as a threat and in turn threatened her with being shot in the head. Problem is, it wasn't a threat. It was an expression of criticism. Which is understandable when you invite someone in your home and they insult you by acting of afraid of you taking a steaming pot off the stove. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/277223/rebuke-3275782.png @Mods Will you please police the damn troll? He is continuously arguing against all facts presented to him in an effort to be an ass. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 6:36:27 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I know what the fallacy is. I don't understand how it is relevant to pointing out that sometimes cops are thrown under the bus by their leadership. Do you believe that the sheriff is an officer who's word should be trusted like other cops? |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 6:38:09 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You really didn't know what rebuke means? It's okay. At least he didn't murder anyone over it. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 7:00:48 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: @Mods Will you please police the damn troll? He is continuously arguing against all facts presented to him in an effort to be an ass. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: It's a type of logical fallacy. I'm saddened but not surprised to hear it's foreign to you. Quoted: So after a 3rd party investigation concludes this shooting was questionable at best, you think the sheriff should push back? That would send an awesome message to the public. Did I overestimate average human intelligence again? Quoted: I wasn't really familiar with the term. But here's what it means. He took it as a threat and in turn threatened her with being shot in the head. Problem is, it wasn't a threat. It was an expression of criticism. Which is understandable when you invite someone in your home and they insult you by acting of afraid of you taking a steaming pot off the stove. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/277223/rebuke-3275782.png @Mods Will you please police the damn troll? He is continuously arguing against all facts presented to him in an effort to be an ass. That’s not the way things work around here or he would have been gone long ago. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 7:37:30 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In the right context, yes, as I tried to point out (with hyperbole, but hey, its GD). I'm saying, that context isn't here... what little water she did manage to throw, barely made it over the counter. The deputy MIGHT have got his boots wet. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Isn't the justification always along the lines of "to prevent death or serious bodily injury" Anyone who doesn't believe a pot of boiling water can cause life changing and disfiguring injuries is lying or incredibly naive. I'm not trying to convince you it was a good shoot but let's be honest In the right context, yes, as I tried to point out (with hyperbole, but hey, its GD). I'm saying, that context isn't here... what little water she did manage to throw, barely made it over the counter. The deputy MIGHT have got his boots wet. What actually happened doesn't matter much, it's about his perception of what was going to happen and whether it was reasonable. If she had shot at him and missed you wouldn't say "What little rounds she managed to fire barely impacted the floor right in front of him. The deputy MIGHT have felt some spalling". We know if he was 50ft away and she had boiling water, it would not be reasonable to fear death or great bodily harm. At what range does it become reasonable? Good question. I suspect expert witnesses will be tasked with coming up with an approximation. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 7:38:06 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: @Mods Will you please police the damn troll? He is continuously arguing against all facts presented to him in an effort to be an ass. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: It's a type of logical fallacy. I'm saddened but not surprised to hear it's foreign to you. Quoted: So after a 3rd party investigation concludes this shooting was questionable at best, you think the sheriff should push back? That would send an awesome message to the public. Did I overestimate average human intelligence again? Quoted: I wasn't really familiar with the term. But here's what it means. He took it as a threat and in turn threatened her with being shot in the head. Problem is, it wasn't a threat. It was an expression of criticism. Which is understandable when you invite someone in your home and they insult you by acting of afraid of you taking a steaming pot off the stove. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/277223/rebuke-3275782.png @Mods Will you please police the damn troll? He is continuously arguing against all facts presented to him in an effort to be an ass. They'd all die on pg 1 if the contrarian bots didn't gin up replies with absolute nonsense that people feel compelled to refute. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 7:49:41 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What actually happened doesn't matter much, it's about his perception of what was going to happen and whether it was reasonable. If she had shot at him and missed you wouldn't say "What little rounds she managed to fire barely impacted the floor right in front of him. The deputy MIGHT have felt some spalling". We know if he was 50ft away and she had boiling water, it would not be reasonable to fear death or great bodily harm. At what range does it become reasonable? Good question. I suspect expert witnesses will be tasked with coming up with an approximation. No expert witnesses are going to convince a jury the shooting was justified. Maybe the defense can find a loser doctor to claim the cop overdosed on his testosterone gel or some other nonsense to explain the unwarranted aggression and murderous behavior? |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 8:17:47 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: He had to get it on? Now hopefully a big bubba he illegally steamrolled gets it on, daily. |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 8:31:17 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm 60:40 that it's a bot account designed to prolong these types of threads. They'd all die on pg 1 if the contrarian bots didn't gin up replies with absolute nonsense that people feel compelled to refute. Are you not entertained? |
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Posted: 7/24/2024 8:58:45 PM EDT
[#36]
Strange, in this Land of Freedom, that we've created a privileged class whose primary function is to save their lives at the cost of others.
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Posted: 7/24/2024 10:54:46 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Are you not entertained? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I'm 60:40 that it's a bot account designed to prolong these types of threads. They'd all die on pg 1 if the contrarian bots didn't gin up replies with absolute nonsense that people feel compelled to refute. Are you not entertained? 
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Posted: 7/24/2024 10:55:53 PM EDT
[#38]
Sgt arrives on scene:
“Where the gun?” Biff: “There is no gun, she brewed some coffee and spoke tongues and tried to splash me.” Sgt: “Ok boys, put up the tape” thinks to himself: “These gen Z JBT are some real retards.” |
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Posted: 7/25/2024 2:32:10 AM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Isn't the justification always along the lines of "to prevent death or serious bodily injury" Anyone who doesn't believe a pot of boiling water can cause life changing and disfiguring injuries is lying or incredibly naive. I'm not trying to convince you it was a good shoot but let's be honest Distance is taught when you have a person armed with a knife. Same situation here and there was a phyiscal barrier she would have had to go around to close distance. Officer was the aggressor here. |
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Posted: 7/25/2024 2:34:47 AM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Anyone trying to justify this just stop. They literally could have just left if they thought she was a problem. They had no reason to even be in her house demanding ID to begin with. I hope that asshole rots in jail Yep. It was a bullshit shoot. He had legs to backup with. Big dumb fuck wanted to get some life fire practice. |
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Posted: 7/25/2024 2:41:36 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The shooting seems to reflect the values of many LEO on this forum. Quote HistoryQuoted: The shooting seems to reflect the values of many LEO on this forum. Who? What “values” do you think this represents? I have yet to see anyone defend it especially after the BWC was released Quoted: So Boiling Water is a Lethal Threat? Um-kay...technically, yeah...if sufficient volume at sufficient temperature was aspirated into his open mouth to cause tracheal/pharyngeal swelling. But practically? I don't think she's got it in her. It's painful, abso-fuckin-lutely! He might had got blisters on his face. This was sub-212 degree water...NOT 350-400 degree fryer oil. NOT battery acid or lye. And if the "Reasonable belief of death or great bodily harm" holds up...what are you actually preventing? You fire after she throws...guess what? That water is still coming at you!! so either a) you step back and the water misses you. Charge her with Agg Assault b) don't move, water hits you. Charge her with Agg Battery c) you close distance, shoot her and the water STILL misses you (as if it wasn't really a danger). YOU get charged with Murder 1. d) you move back, magical lady strength throws 100gal of magical super-thermal liquid directly at your face. You mag dump lady into oblivion. Super Lethal Liquid STILL hits you...because bullets don't block liquid. And FYI, Illinois does not have "Premeditation" in it's Murder 1 clause. The lady didn’t have it in her hands at the time she was shot. |
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Posted: 7/25/2024 3:19:29 AM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Uhhm kay yes believe beyond reasonable doubt? Video does not support use of force! Me? Personally? In that situation? Would have laughed my ass off at the pathetic attempt at throwing boiling water at me! Then again? Why would she feel the need to do it in the first place? Doesn't make sense! Because two people are in her home pointing guns at her? And one of them has just threatened to shoot her in the face? |
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Posted: 7/25/2024 3:22:12 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: He should. They should have left immediately after they found no prowler. He was fishing. Shooting her in the face for holding a pot of water was straight up murder. |
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Posted: 7/25/2024 9:29:06 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Who? What “values” do you think this represents? I have yet to see anyone defend it especially after the BWC was released The lady didn’t have it in her hands at the time she was shot. You might want to reread the thread |
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Posted: 7/25/2024 9:40:49 AM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm 60:40 that it's a bot account designed to prolong these types of threads. They'd all die on pg 1 if the contrarian bots didn't gin up replies with absolute nonsense that people feel compelled to refute. I think there is some truth to that. |
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Posted: 7/25/2024 10:06:01 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What actually happened doesn't matter much, it's about his perception of what was going to happen and whether it was reasonable. If she had shot at him and missed you wouldn't say "What little rounds she managed to fire barely impacted the floor right in front of him. The deputy MIGHT have felt some spalling". We know if he was 50ft away and she had boiling water, it would not be reasonable to fear death or great bodily harm. At what range does it become reasonable? Good question. I suspect expert witnesses will be tasked with coming up with an approximation. Perception eh? Let's say Officers respond to shoplifter call at Lowes. Your argument of "reasonable" would legitimize the same reaction to any customer in the store with any perceived weapon. Nevermind, they aren't even the suspected shoplifter. The victim in this case was not suspected of any wrongdoing. Just like any customer in the Lowes scenario. Bob, who just bought an axe would be DRT with your position. |
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Posted: 7/25/2024 12:25:34 PM EDT
[#47]
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Posted: 7/25/2024 12:34:15 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sgt arrives on scene: “Where the gun?” Biff: “There is no gun, she brewed some coffee and spoke tongues and tried to splash me.” Sgt: “Ok boys, put up the tape” thinks to himself: “These gen Z JBT are some real retards.” The look on all those cops faces standing there outside and not saying a word when he walked out was very telling. They all knew he was going to be toast for that.  Attached File |
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Posted: 7/25/2024 1:53:58 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Sounded like she poured the water down the sink. Or was that just crappy audio? I heard the same thing. I'm curious about that part as well. |
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Posted: 7/25/2024 2:07:32 PM EDT
[#50]
First degree murder might be a tall ask for a conviction...maybe voluntary manslaughter is more fitting.
Either one I won't really lose sleep over. Cop is a POS and deserves to be in jail for a long time. |
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