FDA declares popular alt-medicine kratom to be a deadly opioid - Page 3

General » General Discussion

Site Notices

[ARCHIVED THREAD] - FDA declares popular alt-medicine kratom to be a deadly opioid (Page 3 of 7)

Posted: 2/7/2018 3:32:25 PM EST

[#1]

Quote History

Quoted:
Oh, so it might help some people?

Quick, regulate it!

View Quote

Threatens big pharma.

This is a loss for freedom. It will now proceed to be demonized like devil weed.

Posted: 2/7/2018 4:24:05 PM EST

[#2]

Quote History

Quoted:
RIP @PeteCO

View Quote

Nope! Just fell asleep on my chair, relaxed a bit, but as far as I remember I didn't go on a killing spree, develop an addiction, become a Mexican drug cartel member, rape the dog, or develop unwholesome thoughts. Shocker.

Posted: 2/7/2018 4:29:05 PM EST

[#3]

I'm sure the government has killed more people. Can we ban them?

Posted: 2/7/2018 4:36:41 PM EST

[#4]

If they are trying to ban it...it means it works and Big Pharma doesn't like competition.

Posted: 2/7/2018 4:40:28 PM EST

[#5]

Posted: 2/7/2018 4:41:42 PM EST

[#6]

Quote History

Quoted:

Lol. Do you really request all this stuff? That has no bearing on your everyday life?

View Quote

"MUH REGULATIONS!"

lol

Posted: 2/7/2018 4:41:52 PM EST

[#7]

Had a guy a while back that hit several vehicles and kept on going. One followed him and got him stopped and called 911. When we began trying to talk to him, it was like his brain was on a loop. We'd ask him a question and he'd say" Good. Fine" to everything.

What's your name? I'm good, fine.
Do you know what day it is? Yeah. Good. I'm fine.
Do you know where you are? Yeah. I'm good. I'm fine.

Found a few bags of that stuff in his pocket. He'd just laugh occasionally and had to lay on the ground as he had trouble sitting up.

Posted: 2/7/2018 4:42:04 PM EST

[#8]

A good friend of mine had his life ruined and is now basically crazy from using that stuff. I don't know what's in it but it fucked him up good.

Posted: 2/7/2018 5:00:41 PM EST

[#9]

Quote History

Quoted:
A good friend of mine had his life ruined and is now basically crazy from using that stuff. I don't know what's in it but it fucked him up good.

View Quote

Maybe he was crazy before seeking something to treat his mental illness.

Posted: 2/7/2018 6:13:04 PM EST

[#10]

Quote History

Quoted:
Maybe he was crazy before seeking something to treat his mental illness.

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
A good friend of mine had his life ruined and is now basically crazy from using that stuff. I don't know what's in it but it fucked him up good.

Maybe he was crazy before seeking something to treat his mental illness.

This.

And maybe he was self-medicating with other substances on top of the kratom.

Posted: 2/7/2018 6:23:18 PM EST

[#11]

Nearly every single substance abuser I've caught has been a flaming pile of shit excuse for a human being.

Nearly every single substance abuser I've caught has kratom in their possession when I search them or their car.

At this point it's more than a coincidence that substance abusers always possess shit like this for "chronic pain". But Muh back aches!

Posted: 2/7/2018 7:20:36 PM EST

[#12]

Quote History

Quoted:
Nearly every single substance abuser I've caught has been a flaming pile of shit excuse for a human being.

Nearly every single substance abuser I've caught has kratom in their possession when I search them or their car.

At this point it's more than a coincidence that substance abusers always possess shit like this for "chronic pain". But Muh back aches!

View Quote

If you're a policeman, then it stands to reason that your sample of "substance abusers" is going to be mostly dominated by people who do shit to attract the attention of police.

In other words, your perception is probably skewed by selection bias.

Or do you consider the people in this very thread who say they use/have used kratom to be likely "flaming pile of shit excuses for human beings?"

Posted: 2/7/2018 8:25:40 PM EST

[#13]

Quote History

Quoted:
If you're a policeman, then it stands to reason that your sample of "substance abusers" is going to be mostly dominated by people who do shit to attract the attention of police.

In other words, your perception is probably skewed by selection bias.

Or do you consider the people in this very thread who say they use/have used kratom to be likely "flaming pile of shit excuses for human beings?"

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
Nearly every single substance abuser I've caught has been a flaming pile of shit excuse for a human being.

Nearly every single substance abuser I've caught has kratom in their possession when I search them or their car.

At this point it's more than a coincidence that substance abusers always possess shit like this for "chronic pain". But Muh back aches!

If you're a policeman, then it stands to reason that your sample of "substance abusers" is going to be mostly dominated by people who do shit to attract the attention of police.

In other words, your perception is probably skewed by selection bias.

Or do you consider the people in this very thread who say they use/have used kratom to be likely "flaming pile of shit excuses for human beings?"

Proud "flaming pile of shit excuse for a human being" here.

I don't drink. I don't do drugs - legal or illegal.

I started taking kratom around two months ago. It works well to give some relief for chronic back pain and arthritis. It doesn't get me high, give me a buzz or provide any other effects. It just cuts down on the pain a bit.

Posted: 2/7/2018 9:39:02 PM EST

[#14]

Quote History

Quoted:
Lol. Do you really request all this stuff? That has no bearing on your everyday life?

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:

There were 650 murders in Chicago in 2017. I’m sure the smoking and alcohol related deaths are greater than 44 in the time period the fda reviewed for kratom. I would really like to find out more about the fda review process and where they get their data from and the push to regulate this. I suspect a well placed foia could find out some answers @rogueboss

Lol. Do you really request all this stuff? That has no bearing on your everyday life?

Just because it doesn’t impact me doesn’t mean I’m not interested in reading and understanding the facts. I like to be informed and wish more people were. @rogueboss what line of work do you do? Don’t have to answer. Just interested.

Posted: 2/7/2018 9:40:34 PM EST

[#15]

Fer da chillrens!!!1!1!

Posted: 2/7/2018 9:45:32 PM EST

[#16]

Quote History

Quoted:
I was under the impression that opioids were opium derived drugs, like opium from the poppy plant.

Kratom is not even remotely related to the poppy plant. But now it's "deemed" an opioid?

How does that work?

Guess I'll have to go do some google chemistry.

So kratom is supposed to create an opioid-like reaction and break down into morphine ...hmmm. Suspicious chemistry is suspicious.

View Quote

That is opiates, opioids are anything that acts on the opioid receptors in your brain

Posted: 2/7/2018 9:46:08 PM EST

[#17]

Quote History

Quoted:
Had a guy a while back that hit several vehicles and kept on going. One followed him and got him stopped and called 911. When we began trying to talk to him, it was like his brain was on a loop. We'd ask him a question and he'd say" Good. Fine" to everything.

What's your name? I'm good, fine.
Do you know what day it is? Yeah. Good. I'm fine.
Do you know where you are? Yeah. I'm good. I'm fine.

Found a few bags of that stuff in his pocket. He'd just laugh occasionally and had to lay on the ground as he had trouble sitting up.

View Quote

Oddly, after taking some of it earlier, I'm good. Fine.

Weird.

Posted: 2/7/2018 9:52:03 PM EST

[#18]

Quote History

Quoted:
why cant people just stop taking mind altering substances?

... o wait, thats right, people are weak.

View Quote

Why can't people mind their own business, and respect the decisions others make about their own lives?

Posted: 2/7/2018 10:22:52 PM EST

[#19]

Quote History

Quoted:
Why can't people mind their own business, and respect the decisions others make about their own lives?

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
why cant people just stop taking mind altering substances?

... o wait, thats right, people are weak.

Why can't people mind their own business, and respect the decisions others make about their own lives?

People are ~~weak.~~ whack.

Posted: 2/7/2018 10:26:47 PM EST

[#20]

Let'em do it. Let'em do it all. Only thing we have to do is bury them. Sounds like a win to me.

Posted: 2/7/2018 10:45:56 PM EST

[#21]

Quote History

Quoted:
Oddly, after taking some of it earlier, I'm good. Fine.

Weird.

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
Had a guy a while back that hit several vehicles and kept on going. One followed him and got him stopped and called 911. When we began trying to talk to him, it was like his brain was on a loop. We'd ask him a question and he'd say" Good. Fine" to everything.

What's your name? I'm good, fine.
Do you know what day it is? Yeah. Good. I'm fine.
Do you know where you are? Yeah. I'm good. I'm fine.

Found a few bags of that stuff in his pocket. He'd just laugh occasionally and had to lay on the ground as he had trouble sitting up.

Oddly, after taking some of it earlier, I'm good. Fine.

Weird.

RIP.

Posted: 2/7/2018 10:51:56 PM EST

[#22]

Quote History

Quoted:
You've got opiates and opioids confused. It's a square vs rectangle type thing. All opiates are opioids, but not all opioids are opiates.

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
I was under the impression that opioids were opium derived drugs, like opium from the poppy plant.

Kratom is not even remotely related to the poppy plant. But now it's "deemed" an opioid?

How does that work?

Guess I'll have to go do some google chemistry.

So kratom is supposed to create an opioid-like reaction and break down into morphine ...hmmm. Suspicious chemistry is suspicious.

You've got opiates and opioids confused. It's a square vs rectangle type thing. All opiates are opioids, but not all opioids are opiates.

This. Opiate = opium-derived. Opioid = action at opioid receptors.

The k-opioid receptor responds to kratom and happens to be a receptor that plays a role in addiction/reward behavior.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4258993/

Posted: 2/7/2018 10:55:43 PM EST

[#23]

Quote History

Quoted:
Cocaine and Heroin come from plants in the same way that Everclear comes from plants. After a bunch of processing, extraction, distillation, isolating, and chemical reactions in a lab.

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:

In before OP learns that cocaine & heroin come from plants.

Cocaine and Heroin come from plants in the same way that Everclear comes from plants. After a bunch of processing, extraction, distillation, isolating, and chemical reactions in a lab.

That sounds similar to the way sugar is refined from cane or beets.

Posted: 2/7/2018 10:57:47 PM EST

[#24]

Quote History

Quoted:
Oh FFS. Save us from ourselves dear government!

View Quote

I said the same shit about narcan.

Posted: 2/7/2018 10:58:35 PM EST

[#25]

Big Pharma was losing money, can’t have that

Posted: 2/7/2018 11:00:42 PM EST

[#26]

Quote History

Quoted:

That sounds similar to the way sugar is refined from cane or beets.

View Quote

lol

I just made a cup of decaf with

2 drops of vanilla extract
teaspoon of brown sugar
couple of tablespoons of everclear

Hell yes. Drugs are awesome.

Posted: 2/7/2018 11:04:08 PM EST

[#27]

Quote History

Quoted:
Well, alcohol is actually covered in the constitution. Once banned, then ban reversed (18th amendment, then the 21st amendment), so it is actually covered constitutionally. Now, what is funny about that is that the states have some crazy ass laws on it, when if it is actually mentioned in the constitution, then it should be regulated by federal law.

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:
They better ban alcohol again then, by that logic.

Well, alcohol is actually covered in the constitution. Once banned, then ban reversed (18th amendment, then the 21st amendment), so it is actually covered constitutionally. Now, what is funny about that is that the states have some crazy ass laws on it, when if it is actually mentioned in the constitution, then it should be regulated by federal law.

Amazing that you reference the constitution without actually reading it. Read clause 2 of the repealing amendment.

Posted: 2/7/2018 11:04:09 PM EST

[#28]

How many people die every month in relation to alcohol?

Posted: 2/8/2018 12:44:33 AM EST

[#29]

Quote History

Quoted:

I said the same shit about narcan.

View Quote

Am I wrong to say Narcan should be outlawed and nature take its course?

Posted: 2/8/2018 12:57:34 AM EST

[#30]

Big pharma wants it banned. Can't have people going off their opioid pills.

Posted: 2/8/2018 12:59:10 AM EST

[#31]

Quote History

Quoted:
How many people die every month in relation to alcohol?

View Quote

Thousands. But funny how that goes totally ignored. Oh wait, it doesn't threaten Big Pharma! This country is so corrupt it is disgusting.

I've read Kratom helped a lot of addicts get off opiates by helping with withdrawal symptoms. Can't have that anymore.

Posted: 2/8/2018 1:01:12 AM EST

[#32]

Quote History

Quoted:
In before the Kratom neckbeards

View Quote

In after uneducated sheeple who listen to the MSM and big drug companies cheer them on to ban a harmless herbal remedy.

Posted: 2/8/2018 1:20:16 AM EST

[#33]

Quote History

Quoted:
Am I wrong to say Narcan should be outlawed and nature take its course?

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:

I said the same shit about narcan.

Am I wrong to say Narcan should be outlawed and nature take its course?

it was the same guys, all the damn time I was pushing Narcan on when I was cardiac tech. (ok paramedic 1) ....they had fucking bad veins.

Posted: 2/8/2018 1:31:51 AM EST

[#34]

Heard the name a few times here and there over the past few years. Didn't realize it had such a robust following. I assume people are cleaning out local stores before they pull it from the shelves?

Posted: 2/8/2018 2:53:32 AM EST

[#35]

Good. Drug abusers can get bent.

Posted: 2/8/2018 2:56:36 AM EST

[#36]

Quote History

Quoted:

Thousands. But funny how that goes totally ignored. Oh wait, it doesn't threaten Big Pharma! This country is so corrupt it is disgusting.

I've read Kratom helped a lot of addicts get off opiates by helping with withdrawal symptoms. Can't have that anymore.

View Quote

Sure, if you substitute one opioid for another, of course there isn't going to be withdrawal symptoms.

Love the conspiracy theories regarding Big Pharma, I'm sure its not drugged out thinking

Posted: 2/8/2018 9:03:36 AM EST

[#37]

Quote History

Quoted:
Sure, if you substitute one opioid for another, of course there isn't going to be withdrawal symptoms.

Love the conspiracy theories regarding Big Pharma, I'm sure its not drugged out thinking

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:

Thousands. But funny how that goes totally ignored. Oh wait, it doesn't threaten Big Pharma! This country is so corrupt it is disgusting.

I've read Kratom helped a lot of addicts get off opiates by helping with withdrawal symptoms. Can't have that anymore.

Sure, if you substitute one opioid for another, of course there isn't going to be withdrawal symptoms.

Love the conspiracy theories regarding Big Pharma, I'm sure its not drugged out thinking

Are you stating that "Big Pharma" companies don't invest a Loooooot of money buying politicians so they can have the laws stacked in their favor?

Posted: 2/8/2018 9:09:30 AM EST

[#38]

Quote History

Quoted:

Sure, if you substitute one opioid for another, of course there isn't going to be withdrawal symptoms.

Love the conspiracy theories regarding Big Pharma, I'm sure its not drugged out thinking

View Quote

There is no conspiracy, not one bit. Big business buys Congress critters to stack rules/regulations in their favor; similar things have been happening since the day currency of any sort has been established.

Remember the Golden Rule:
He who has the gold makes the rules

Posted: 2/8/2018 9:12:09 AM EST

[#39]

Quote History

Quoted:
Are you stating that "Big Pharma" companies don't invest a Loooooot of money buying politicians so they can have the laws stacked in their favor?

View Quote View All Quotes

View All Quotes

Quote History

Quoted:

Quoted:

Thousands. But funny how that goes totally ignored. Oh wait, it doesn't threaten Big Pharma! This country is so corrupt it is disgusting.

I've read Kratom helped a lot of addicts get off opiates by helping with withdrawal symptoms. Can't have that anymore.

Sure, if you substitute one opioid for another, of course there isn't going to be withdrawal symptoms.

Love the conspiracy theories regarding Big Pharma, I'm sure its not drugged out thinking

Are you stating that "Big Pharma" companies don't invest a Loooooot of money buying politicians so they can have the laws stacked in their favor?

Dude buys drugs on Alibaba. He doesn't make a lot of sense.

Posted: 2/8/2018 9:16:22 AM EST

[#40]

Quote History

Quoted:

Sure, if you substitute one opioid for another, of course there isn't going to be withdrawal symptoms.

Love the conspiracy theories regarding Big Pharma, I'm sure its not drugged out thinking

View Quote

Kratom is NOT an opiate, the effects of kratom are drastically different and less intense than opiates, and it's also not addictive, and there's no withdraw if you stop taking it. So it's great for getting OFF of opiates, and then once you're off, you can stop taking kratom.

Or, if you're not addicted to opiates, you can just take kratom to help relax, to relieve chronic pain, or for an energy boost if you need to get some motivation to get work done. Just like people who drink coffee, smoke, or have a beer.

I know kratom. I've taken it quite a few times. It sometimes gives me a very light buzz but not every time, it helps me relax and calm down if I'm anxious, and makes it easier to feel motivated to work if I need to work, or relax if I need to relax.

I once tried to take 2-3 times the normal dose just to see what happened, and it wasn't pleasant anymore - it was like I had had too much coffee.

Posted: 2/8/2018 9:22:08 AM EST

[#41]

Quote History

Quoted:
Had a guy a while back that hit several vehicles and kept on going. One followed him and got him stopped and called 911. When we began trying to talk to him, it was like his brain was on a loop. We'd ask him a question and he'd say" Good. Fine" to everything.

What's your name? I'm good, fine.
Do you know what day it is? Yeah. Good. I'm fine.
Do you know where you are? Yeah. I'm good. I'm fine.

Found a few bags of that stuff in his pocket. He'd just laugh occasionally and had to lay on the ground as he had trouble sitting up.

View Quote

Change the line "found a few bags of that stuff in his pocket" to "found a few bottles in his car" and I've seen almost that exact scenario play out. But the liquor has been deemed okay by the government.

Freedom!

Posted: 2/8/2018 9:23:33 AM EST

[#42]

Quote History

Quoted:
Nearly every single substance abuser I've caught has been a flaming pile of shit excuse for a human being.

Nearly every single substance abuser I've caught has kratom in their possession when I search them or their car.

At this point it's more than a coincidence that substance abusers always possess shit like this for "chronic pain". But Muh back aches!

View Quote

The lowest common denominator here is "flaming pile of shit". Rules and laws won't change that.

Posted: 2/8/2018 9:24:34 AM EST

[#43]

It acts as a stimulant but is an "opioid"!!??

Posted: 2/8/2018 9:50:41 AM EST

[#44]

Quote History

Quoted:

Kratom is NOT an opiate, the effects of kratom are drastically different and less intense than opiates, and it's also not addictive, and there's no withdraw if you stop taking it. So it's great for getting OFF of opiates, and then once you're off, you can stop taking kratom.

Or, if you're not addicted to opiates, you can just take kratom to help relax, to relieve chronic pain, or for an energy boost if you need to get some motivation to get work done. Just like people who drink coffee, smoke, or have a beer.

I know kratom. I've taken it quite a few times. It sometimes gives me a very light buzz but not every time, it helps me relax and calm down if I'm anxious, and makes it easier to feel motivated to work if I need to work, or relax if I need to relax.

I once tried to take 2-3 times the normal dose just to see what happened, and it wasn't pleasant anymore - it was like I had had too much coffee.

View Quote

Exactly. And Kratom is from the coffee family.

Posted: 2/8/2018 9:51:28 AM EST

[#45]

Quote History

Quoted:
It acts as a stimulant but is an "opioid"!!??

View Quote

That is such BS. Its not an opiod. An opioid is a synthetic opiate. Its also not an opiate. It just stimulates the same receptors on the brain that opiates do.

Posted: 2/8/2018 9:56:50 AM EST

[#46]

Now we can finally win the war on drugs

Posted: 2/8/2018 10:00:49 AM EST

[#47]

Quote History

Quoted:

Bulk pre ban opioids! Buy cheap, stack deep. Amiright?!

View Quote

My grandfather was a WWI vet and had gotten some morphine back in the 1920's in case there was a serious accident on the farm to 'treat' them until they could get them to a doc. The typical dark brown medicine bottle about 2" tall.

My fucking junkie cousin stole it.

Posted: 2/8/2018 10:13:59 AM EST

[#48]

Quote History

Quoted:
I was under the impression that opioids were opium derived drugs, like opium from the poppy plant.

Kratom is not even remotely related to the poppy plant. But now it's "deemed" an opioid?

How does that work?

Guess I'll have to go do some google chemistry.

So kratom is supposed to create an opioid-like reaction and break down into morphine ...hmmm. Suspicious chemistry is suspicious.

View Quote

"New research shows kratom acts in the brain just as other opioids do, FDA Commissioner Dr. Scott Gottlieb said in a statement"

Acts like an opiod.....LOL Notice he didn't say it was a opioid.