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Posted: 11/26/2021 5:41:59 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Does a threat need to be verbal? After being told to leave and refusing to do so, instead continue yelling, pointing, walking around…does that not seem threatening in such circumstance? Just watch the rekeita law break down Eta: no, it's not threatening to say you are going to subpoena everyone for keeping his kid from him. He doesn't mention anything violent until Napoleon comes out with a rifle |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 5:42:24 PM EDT
[#2]
It's amazing to see the change in the direction of GD's legal eagles from the 1st page to this one.
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Posted: 11/26/2021 5:42:33 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This looks more like a case where: the guy in black decides to go get a gun in an attempt to intimidate the guy in green into leaving Green shirt calls the bluff and chest bumping begins (black shirt doesn't act like he's concerned with weapon retention Black gets mad when he's spun into the yard and shoots green shirt Pretty much. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 5:42:44 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Just watch the rekeita law break down I did watch some and the main host favored black shirt. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 5:43:32 PM EDT
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thats true but what is your point? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Whatever terminology you want to use, it's clear to me the guy used his hands and fingers to (grab, grasp, hold) the shooter and the weapon in a manner that allowed him to pull the shooter towards him, spin him around 180 degrees, and launch him off the porch. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/367483/Screen_Shot_2021-11-26_at_10_52_53_AM-2181934.pnghttps://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/367483/Screen_Shot_2021-11-26_at_10_53_48_AM-2181935.pnghttps://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/367483/Screen_Shot_2021-11-26_at_10_53_21_AM-2181936.pnghttps://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/367483/Screen_Shot_2021-11-26_at_11_13_25_AM-2181938.png That was definitely after the first shot. All bets are off then. https://i.imgur.com/qEwFwky.gif Is it a "warning shot" or ND? Can anyone confirm either with vetted information? He was threatened, assaulted, and may have believed green shirt was following through and trying to disarm him. I can certainly see that as a possibility. The nudge by green shirt prior to the discharge is very visible as is black shirt’s reaction to that nudge. ETA: Black shirt’s focus was on green shirt’s face during that timeframe and black shirt felt green shirt made a move towards his firearm. This is on the tail side of green shirt’s threat to forcibly take his firearm from him and (??????). Thats true but what is your point? |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 5:44:44 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I did watch some and the main host favored black shirt. He did. Legally. Watch it all. They all agreed it will be a very difficult case for black shirt to win |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 5:46:43 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: He reacted to the gun pressure by raising his arm to remove the gun from his side not to take control of the firearm. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Whatever terminology you want to use, it's clear to me the guy used his hands and fingers to (grab, grasp, hold) the shooter and the weapon in a manner that allowed him to pull the shooter towards him, spin him around 180 degrees, and launch him off the porch. https://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/367483/Screen_Shot_2021-11-26_at_10_52_53_AM-2181934.pnghttps://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/367483/Screen_Shot_2021-11-26_at_10_53_48_AM-2181935.pnghttps://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/367483/Screen_Shot_2021-11-26_at_10_53_21_AM-2181936.pnghttps://www.ar15.com/media/mediaFiles/367483/Screen_Shot_2021-11-26_at_11_13_25_AM-2181938.png That was definitely after the first shot. All bets are off then. https://i.imgur.com/qEwFwky.gif Is it a "warning shot" or ND? Can anyone confirm either with vetted information? He was threatened, assaulted, and may have believed green shirt was following through and trying to disarm him. I can certainly see that as a possibility. The nudge by green shirt prior to the discharge is very visible as is black shirt’s reaction to that nudge. ETA: Black shirt’s focus was on green shirt’s face during that timeframe and black shirt felt green shirt made a move towards his firearm. This is on the tail side of green shirt’s threat to forcibly take his firearm from him and (??????). Thats true but what is your point? Possibly. But did black shirt know that, IF that is a true statement? Again, IF that is a true statement. ETA: That occurred on the tail end of green shirt running up into the porch and threatening. Words used and tone, body language, physical contact. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 5:47:53 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: He did. Legally. Watch it all. They all agreed it will be a very difficult case for black shirt to win Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I did watch some and the main host favored black shirt. He did. Legally. Watch it all. They all agreed it will be a very difficult case for black shirt to win Maybe. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 5:50:03 PM EDT
[#9]
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Posted: 11/26/2021 5:50:44 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Just watch the rekeita law break down Eta: no, it's not threatening to say you are going to subpoena everyone for keeping his kid from him. He doesn't mention anything violent until Napoleon comes out with a rifle Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Does a threat need to be verbal? After being told to leave and refusing to do so, instead continue yelling, pointing, walking arounddoes that not seem threatening in such circumstance? Just watch the rekeita law break down Eta: no, it's not threatening to say you are going to subpoena everyone for keeping his kid from him. He doesn't mention anything violent until Napoleon comes out with a rifle What we do know is, green shirt is the kind of guy who will run up to someone with a gun, yell `do it motherfucker, or i'll take it and use it' and get physical. Maybe black shirt knew that and decided being armed after whatever green shirt said was a good idea. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 5:57:18 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Whatever terminology you want to use, it's clear to me the guy used his hands and fingers to (grab, grasp, hold) the shooter and the weapon in a manner that allowed him to pull the shooter towards him, spin him around 180 degrees, and launch him off the porch. I assumed he threw the weapon with both hands and the shooter miraculously stayed attached. Those pics show him controlling the aim of the PCC with his right hand while wrapping his left arm around the shooter preparing for the toss. So now I think he threw the shooter to put some distance between them. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:00:15 PM EDT
[#12]
Classic example of “you can’t provoke the situation and claim self defense”
Nothing in that video warranted him to bring a gun out. You can’t use deadly force to threaten somebody who’s not been aggressive to leave your property. He showed utter disregard for human life by just bringing a gun into a verbal argument. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. He’s going to prison. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:06:35 PM EDT
[#13]
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:06:43 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Classic example of "you can't provoke the situation and claim self defense" Nothing in that video warranted him to bring a gun out. You can't use deadly force to threaten somebody who's not been aggressive to leave your property. He showed utter disregard for human life by just bringing a gun into a verbal argument. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. He's going to prison. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:07:49 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Per the widow: Christina Read and Kyle Carruth have been engaged in an ongoing affair, despite Kyle Carruth being married. On October 30, 2021, Chad Read informed Christina Read that he had evidence of her affair with Kyle Carruth and that he was going to go public with it. On November 5, 2021, after 4:00 p.m., myself and my minor son were physically present when Chad Read met with Christina Read at Kyle Carruth's residence at 2100 90th St, Lubbock, Texas. We were there to pick up Chad's youngest son. Chad was supposed to have custody of the child beginning at 3:15pm, but Christina stated that, she "wanted to see him" as her excuse to why she had not produced the child as ordered by the court at the time required. "I believe that Christina Read and Kyle Carruth engaged in a conspiracy to assault and/or murder Chad that day." -snip- "During the assault and murder, Christina Read was calm and didn't act surprised. She acted as though she knew what the plan was all along. She took no steps to stop Kyle Carruth from murdering Chad. following the assault and murder, Christina Read continued to remain calm, she didn't react, and she continued to record Chad as he laid there dying. Christina read did not take any steps to render aid to Chad." https://www.fox34.com/2021/11/24/attorney-chad-reads-widow-files-petition-take-custody-his-children-their-mother-releases-video-shooting/ Now its a party!! (Sorry, I'm a few pages behind....) |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:08:02 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This is where your train goes off the rails. If he has the right to use force, but not deadly force (I don't agree, but these were your words), he can't justify walking into the house and grabbing his rifle. He murdered the guy, plain and simple. As to justification, he doesn't have too justify it, it just has to be in legal possession. This appears to be the case here. The justification for the shoot was dead guy approaching him, telling him he was going to take his weapon and kill him, and then grabbing his weapon and throwing him around. It sounds like you may have an issue with how the Texas law is written out. I'll admit I don't like how it handles this situation because I would have done things much different. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:14:41 PM EDT
[#17]
He is going to jail and rightly so. He did not have to go into the house and get the rifle. It wasn't a lethal force situation all the way around that I can see by watching the video.
If I was on the jury depending upon the charge, I would probably vote "guilty". But... Dead guy should not have walked up and grabbed the rifle... That was foolish. He was trying to up the ante from the guy even bringing it out in the first place. Depending on how that was framed with Texas law, I don't know how I would have voted... Forget it. I don't know anymore... I would NOT have voted guilty on the Rittenhouse case. Patrick |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:16:45 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Classic example of “you can’t provoke the situation and claim self defense” Nothing in that video warranted him to bring a gun out. You can’t use deadly force to threaten somebody who’s not been aggressive to leave your property. He showed utter disregard for human life by just bringing a gun into a verbal argument. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes. He’s going to prison. Oh hell yes you can threaten deadly force after repeatedly telling somebody to leave. When somebody tells you to get off, you better leave the property. If you don’t, you just opened all kinds of lawful use of force to remove you. Try getting into an argument on a bouncer when he demands you leave. You don’t? They can use all force up to but not including deadly to remove you. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:18:04 PM EDT
[#19]
Just wow.
Purple people think you should be a victim on your own property, run inside till bad man leaves. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:18:58 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: He is going to jail and rightly so. He did not have to go into the house and get the rifle. It wasn't a lethal force situation all the way around that I can see by watching the video. If I was on the jury depending upon the charge, I would probably vote "guilty". Dead guy should not have walked up and grabbed the rifle... Depending on how that was framed with Texas law, I don't know how I would have voted... Forget it. I don't know anymore... I would NOT have voted guilty on the Rittenhouse case. Patrick texas is weird... |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:19:17 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Now its a party!! (Sorry, I'm a few pages behind....) Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Per the widow: Christina Read and Kyle Carruth have been engaged in an ongoing affair, despite Kyle Carruth being married. On October 30, 2021, Chad Read informed Christina Read that he had evidence of her affair with Kyle Carruth and that he was going to go public with it. On November 5, 2021, after 4:00 p.m., myself and my minor son were physically present when Chad Read met with Christina Read at Kyle Carruth's residence at 2100 90th St, Lubbock, Texas. We were there to pick up Chad's youngest son. Chad was supposed to have custody of the child beginning at 3:15pm, but Christina stated that, she "wanted to see him" as her excuse to why she had not produced the child as ordered by the court at the time required. "I believe that Christina Read and Kyle Carruth engaged in a conspiracy to assault and/or murder Chad that day." -snip- "During the assault and murder, Christina Read was calm and didn't act surprised. She acted as though she knew what the plan was all along. She took no steps to stop Kyle Carruth from murdering Chad. following the assault and murder, Christina Read continued to remain calm, she didn't react, and she continued to record Chad as he laid there dying. Christina read did not take any steps to render aid to Chad." https://www.fox34.com/2021/11/24/attorney-chad-reads-widow-files-petition-take-custody-his-children-their-mother-releases-video-shooting/ Now its a party!! (Sorry, I'm a few pages behind....) Fuckin a. I agree. Few people pages back, including me, thought the whole deal was a setup to kill the guy |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:19:31 PM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: He is going to jail and rightly so. He did not have to go into the house and get the rifle. It wasn't a lethal force situation all the way around that I can see by watching the video. If I was on the jury depending upon the charge, I would probably vote "guilty". Dead guy should not have walked up and grabbed the rifle... Depending on how that was framed with Texas law, I don't know how I would have voted... Forget it. I don't know anymore... I would NOT have on the Rittenhouse case. Patrick It was absolutely a THREAT of deadly force. He told him to leave. Many times. THREAT of deadly force is lawful at that point. When dead guy attempts to grab gun with clear verbal threats to use it against him…deadly force automatically authorized. Turn it around. A business owner tells you to leave the property. You don’t. He shows a side arm, says leave. You now go for his gun. You now get lawfully shot. When somebody tells you to get off the property, and you don’t. All kinds of use of force is now open. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:23:34 PM EDT
[#23]
Too bad black shirt didn’t recognize that there’s a time for a gun and there’s times where a gun isn’t appropriate. This was the latter
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:23:41 PM EDT
[#24]
On the rekeita stream, they said if green shirt was standing on the porch during the shoot, it could be legally considered burguraly at that point but he wasn't on the porch when shot, he was stepped down off it, he fell backwards half onto the porch after being shot.
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:25:35 PM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Now its a party!! (Sorry, I'm a few pages behind....) Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Per the widow: Christina Read and Kyle Carruth have been engaged in an ongoing affair, despite Kyle Carruth being married. On October 30, 2021, Chad Read informed Christina Read that he had evidence of her affair with Kyle Carruth and that he was going to go public with it. On November 5, 2021, after 4:00 p.m., myself and my minor son were physically present when Chad Read met with Christina Read at Kyle Carruth's residence at 2100 90th St, Lubbock, Texas. We were there to pick up Chad's youngest son. Chad was supposed to have custody of the child beginning at 3:15pm, but Christina stated that, she "wanted to see him" as her excuse to why she had not produced the child as ordered by the court at the time required. "I believe that Christina Read and Kyle Carruth engaged in a conspiracy to assault and/or murder Chad that day." -snip- "During the assault and murder, Christina Read was calm and didn't act surprised. She acted as though she knew what the plan was all along. She took no steps to stop Kyle Carruth from murdering Chad. following the assault and murder, Christina Read continued to remain calm, she didn't react, and she continued to record Chad as he laid there dying. Christina read did not take any steps to render aid to Chad." https://www.fox34.com/2021/11/24/attorney-chad-reads-widow-files-petition-take-custody-his-children-their-mother-releases-video-shooting/ Now its a party!! (Sorry, I'm a few pages behind....) Prosecuter (reusing line for GA Jogger Trial "Who brought the Rifle to the Party?" 
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:27:02 PM EDT
[#26]
The widow doesn't seem that shocked either.
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:27:41 PM EDT
[#27]
Dont know if bad shoot or not, i tend to think so, but it sure as fuck looks bad.
There was plenty of time to get your wife in doors, lock the house and call the law. GEEZE When assholes collide |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:28:21 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Dont know if bad shoot or not, i tend to think so, but it sure as fuck looks bad. There was plenty of time to get your wife in doors, lock the house and call the law. GEEZE When assholes collide She wasn't his wife. She's the woman black shirt was cheating on his judge wife with |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:28:39 PM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Green shirt gets physical, threatens to take an use gun. He looks down, raises arm. Reaches for magazine. It looks like Black shirt thought so as well, based on how he jerks the rifle back. Fires "warning" shot. Green shirt grabs gun, swings black shirt into yard. https://i.imgur.com/qEwFwky.gif Read the post I replied to... context is clear. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:29:09 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Oh hell yes you can threaten deadly force after repeatedly telling somebody to leave. When somebody tells you to get off, you better leave the property. If you don’t, you just opened all kinds of lawful use of force to remove you. Try getting into an argument on a bouncer when he demands you leave. You don’t? They can use all force up to but not including deadly to remove you. I worked as a Bouncer on one of the Busiest bar streets in Texas to pay for my higher education. You can Physically put hands on them to throw them out - but to use a baton, flashlight or other "weapon" and you'd go straight to jail & bar would get sued out of business. Use Deadly Force?  BIGGER_HAMMER 
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:29:56 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Oh hell yes you can threaten deadly force after repeatedly telling somebody to leave. No. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:30:21 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Uh, No... I worked as a Bouncer on one of the Busiest bar streets in Texas to pay for my higher education. You can Physically put hands on them to throw them out - but to use a baton, flashlight or other "weapon" and you'd go straight to jail & bar would get sued out of business. Use Deadly Force? BIGGER_HAMMER Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Oh hell yes you can threaten deadly force after repeatedly telling somebody to leave. When somebody tells you to get off, you better leave the property. If you don’t, you just opened all kinds of lawful use of force to remove you. Try getting into an argument on a bouncer when he demands you leave. You don’t? They can use all force up to but not including deadly to remove you. Uh, No... I worked as a Bouncer on one of the Busiest bar streets in Texas to pay for my higher education. You can Physically put hands on them to throw them out - but to use a baton, flashlight or other "weapon" and you'd go straight to jail & bar would get sued out of business. Use Deadly Force? BIGGER_HAMMER Yup, the rekeita stream covered that as well. You can use force but not deadly force |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:33:55 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Wow baby momma really knows how to destroy lives. Not to mention that cops don't care about enforcing visitation for dad's. Bad shoot, bad escalation on all sides, and screw the family courts/law/LEO for destroying one kids life by eliminating the father here and broadly speaking society's fatherhood. Tragedy all around. Meh. It's really got absolutely nothing to do with law enforcement. It's akin to them showing up to a construction site and forcing a contractor to use the right trim in a contract dispute. It's completely civil law in every state I'm aware of. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:33:56 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I worked as a Bouncer on one of the Busiest bar streets in Texas to pay for my higher education. You can Physically put hands on them to throw them out - but to use a baton, flashlight or other "weapon" and you'd go straight to jail & bar would get sued out of business. Use Deadly Force? BIGGER_HAMMER Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Oh hell yes you can threaten deadly force after repeatedly telling somebody to leave. When somebody tells you to get off, you better leave the property. If you don’t, you just opened all kinds of lawful use of force to remove you. Try getting into an argument on a bouncer when he demands you leave. You don’t? They can use all force up to but not including deadly to remove you. I worked as a Bouncer on one of the Busiest bar streets in Texas to pay for my higher education. You can Physically put hands on them to throw them out - but to use a baton, flashlight or other "weapon" and you'd go straight to jail & bar would get sued out of business. Use Deadly Force? BIGGER_HAMMER That’s my point. You can use force to remove them. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:35:17 PM EDT
[#35]
The plot thickens.
 We were there to pick up Chad's youngest son. Chad was supposed to have custody of the child beginning at 3:15pm, but Christina stated that, she "wanted to see him" as her excuse to why she had not produced the child as ordered by the court at the time required. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:35:57 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I worked as a Bouncer on one of the Busiest bar streets in Texas to pay for my higher education. You can Physically put hands on them to throw them out - but to use a baton, flashlight or other "weapon" and you'd go straight to jail & bar would get sued out of business. Use Deadly Force? BIGGER_HAMMER I see you have bouncer level reading skills. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:36:24 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Oh hell yes you can threaten deadly force after repeatedly telling somebody to leave. No. Is that No legally. Or no I dont think you should. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:36:35 PM EDT
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Yup, the rekeita stream covered that as well. You can use force but not deadly force Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Oh hell yes you can threaten deadly force after repeatedly telling somebody to leave. When somebody tells you to get off, you better leave the property. If you don’t, you just opened all kinds of lawful use of force to remove you. Try getting into an argument on a bouncer when he demands you leave. You don’t? They can use all force up to but not including deadly to remove you. Uh, No... I worked as a Bouncer on one of the Busiest bar streets in Texas to pay for my higher education. You can Physically put hands on them to throw them out - but to use a baton, flashlight or other "weapon" and you'd go straight to jail & bar would get sued out of business. Use Deadly Force? BIGGER_HAMMER Yup, the rekeita stream covered that as well. You can use force but not deadly force And that’s exactly what I said. Up to but not including deadly force. Deadly force was authorized when he verbally said I’m going to use youre weapon against you and laid hands on it. That’s a deadly threat. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:37:25 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Now its a party!! (Sorry, I'm a few pages behind....) Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Per the widow: Christina Read and Kyle Carruth have been engaged in an ongoing affair, despite Kyle Carruth being married. On October 30, 2021, Chad Read informed Christina Read that he had evidence of her affair with Kyle Carruth and that he was going to go public with it. On November 5, 2021, after 4:00 p.m., myself and my minor son were physically present when Chad Read met with Christina Read at Kyle Carruth's residence at 2100 90th St, Lubbock, Texas. We were there to pick up Chad's youngest son. Chad was supposed to have custody of the child beginning at 3:15pm, but Christina stated that, she "wanted to see him" as her excuse to why she had not produced the child as ordered by the court at the time required. "I believe that Christina Read and Kyle Carruth engaged in a conspiracy to assault and/or murder Chad that day." -snip- "During the assault and murder, Christina Read was calm and didn't act surprised. She acted as though she knew what the plan was all along. She took no steps to stop Kyle Carruth from murdering Chad. following the assault and murder, Christina Read continued to remain calm, she didn't react, and she continued to record Chad as he laid there dying. Christina read did not take any steps to render aid to Chad." https://www.fox34.com/2021/11/24/attorney-chad-reads-widow-files-petition-take-custody-his-children-their-mother-releases-video-shooting/ Now its a party!! (Sorry, I'm a few pages behind....) It looked planned to me. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:38:28 PM EDT
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted: And that’s exactly what I said. Up to but not including deadly force. Deadly force was authorized when he verbally said I’m going to use youre weapon against you and laid hands on it. That’s a deadly threat. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Oh hell yes you can threaten deadly force after repeatedly telling somebody to leave. When somebody tells you to get off, you better leave the property. If you don’t, you just opened all kinds of lawful use of force to remove you. Try getting into an argument on a bouncer when he demands you leave. You don’t? They can use all force up to but not including deadly to remove you. Uh, No... I worked as a Bouncer on one of the Busiest bar streets in Texas to pay for my higher education. You can Physically put hands on them to throw them out - but to use a baton, flashlight or other "weapon" and you'd go straight to jail & bar would get sued out of business. Use Deadly Force? BIGGER_HAMMER Yup, the rekeita stream covered that as well. You can use force but not deadly force And that’s exactly what I said. Up to but not including deadly force. Deadly force was authorized when he verbally said I’m going to use youre weapon against you and laid hands on it. That’s a deadly threat. I'm not so sure about that. The lawyers said the threats don't mean much. At least, that's what legalbytes said. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:39:35 PM EDT
[#41]
The black shirt guy fucked up going into the house to retrieve the firearm. I'd think he would have a better case if the gun was on him. I say black shirt is fucked. But it's "assholes collide" in Texas, so who knows.
Personally, besides possible jail time, I see dollar signs. Last thing I want to do is shoot someone. I'm certainly not doing it in that situation. I'd get my skanky whore in the house and lock the door. Call the popo and sit on the couch with my NV donned. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:41:50 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm not so sure about that. The lawyers said the threats don't mean much. At least, that's what legalbytes said. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Oh hell yes you can threaten deadly force after repeatedly telling somebody to leave. When somebody tells you to get off, you better leave the property. If you don’t, you just opened all kinds of lawful use of force to remove you. Try getting into an argument on a bouncer when he demands you leave. You don’t? They can use all force up to but not including deadly to remove you. Uh, No... I worked as a Bouncer on one of the Busiest bar streets in Texas to pay for my higher education. You can Physically put hands on them to throw them out - but to use a baton, flashlight or other "weapon" and you'd go straight to jail & bar would get sued out of business. Use Deadly Force? BIGGER_HAMMER Yup, the rekeita stream covered that as well. You can use force but not deadly force And that’s exactly what I said. Up to but not including deadly force. Deadly force was authorized when he verbally said I’m going to use youre weapon against you and laid hands on it. That’s a deadly threat. I'm not so sure about that. The lawyers said the threats don't mean much. At least, that's what legalbytes said. Threats alone. They also added once there was physical act, those threats carried weight. Not verbatim but I think the basic gist. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:43:22 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That’s my point. You can use force to remove them. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Oh hell yes you can threaten deadly force after repeatedly telling somebody to leave. When somebody tells you to get off, you better leave the property. If you don’t, you just opened all kinds of lawful use of force to remove you. Try getting into an argument on a bouncer when he demands you leave. You don’t? They can use all force up to but not including deadly to remove you. I worked as a Bouncer on one of the Busiest bar streets in Texas to pay for my higher education. You can Physically put hands on them to throw them out - but to use a baton, flashlight or other "weapon" and you'd go straight to jail & bar would get sued out of business. Use Deadly Force? BIGGER_HAMMER That’s my point. You can use force to remove them. But not Deadly Force - the law makes clear distinctions that I can't pull out a pistol & say - "Get out of this nightclub or I'll blow your brains out with this .45" |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:43:32 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: On the rekeita stream, they said if green shirt was standing on the porch during the shoot, it could be legally considered burguraly at that point but he wasn't on the porch when shot, he was stepped down off it, he fell backwards half onto the porch after being shot. I seem to remember that "burglary" in TX is trespass plus commission, or intent, of a second offense (arson, theft, etc) not just standing on a porch. Though I guess some one might could count the chest bump as "assault"... |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:44:52 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I seem to remember that "burglary" in TX is trespass plus commission, or intent, of a second offense (arson, theft, etc) not just standing on a porch. Though I guess some one might could count the chest bump as "assault"... But it is in this context |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:45:16 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: But not Deadly Force - the law makes clear distinctions that I can't pull out a pistol & say - "Get out of this nightclub or I'll blow your brains out with this .45" texas is weird... |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:46:19 PM EDT
[#47]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Threats alone. They also added once there was physical act, those threats carried weight. Not verbatim but I think the basic gist. I think it'll be argued whether or not green shirt was actually trying to act on the threat of taking the gun or was he just trying to get away from black shirt. Black shirt didn't seem to care about retaining his rifle when he went neck to nipples with green shirt. He didn't try to back away from green shirt. He even continued pressing forward on green shirt, firing at his feet, kept pressing forward and green shirt slung his ass out into the yard and turned to his whore ex wife then was shot |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:47:06 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I worked as a Bouncer on one of the Busiest bar streets in Texas to pay for my higher education. You can Physically put hands on them to throw them out - but to use a baton, flashlight or other "weapon" and you'd go straight to jail & bar would get sued out of business. Use Deadly Force? BIGGER_HAMMER Quoted: I see you have bouncer level reading skills. You can't USE Deadly Force to remove a Trespasser. You clearly have "Drunk" level knowledge of use of force laws in Texas.  Did I throw you out? If so sorry & no hard feelz. I was just a guy making his way through school the best way he can  ...BIGGER_HAMMER |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:47:29 PM EDT
[#49]
I dont know much about the law, but that shooter was a little faggot for escalating that to gun play.
Anybody who thinks that was a justified shooting is also a faggot. |
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Posted: 11/26/2021 6:50:07 PM EDT
[#50]
It doesn’t help Kyle’s case that the first thing he says after shooting Chad is “I told all of you to leave.” Suggesting his state of mind was to remove a trespasser not stop an imminent threat.
It’s still a tough call but I now think it will be ruled a legal shoot anyway. |
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