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Posted: 9/18/2019 8:37:50 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
It's probably a combination of posturing and practicality. There are a lot of independent issues that ban be hammered out while still waiting on GM. Skilled trades rationalization, plant utilization, product allocation, Alternative Work Schedules, local specific issues, and a bunch of other stuff can still be agreed to in spirit while waiting on the wages, medical, and non-legacy employee issues. The union only really has one strike card and they played it. They're going to stay busy, but they're going to maintain pressure on GM to see who blinks first. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I read today that Ford has tentative agreements on 11 of 20 major issues, FCA is also reporting that they’re making good progress, but didn’t give specifics. Both of those deals are dependent upon the GM contract being approved. They are patterned on the GM contract, so until the GM contract gets the nod, Ford and FCA are in limbo. The union only really has one strike card and they played it. They're going to stay busy, but they're going to maintain pressure on GM to see who blinks first. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 8:38:58 PM EDT
[#2]
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I seriously doubt they will strike too, that just weakens the UAW position. Right now their whole war chest is available to use against GM. Another company striking just depletes it faster Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I read today that Ford has tentative agreements on 11 of 20 major issues, FCA is also reporting that they’re making good progress, but didn’t give specifics. Both of those deals are dependent upon the GM contract being approved. They are patterned on the GM contract, so until the GM contract gets the nod, Ford and FCA are in limbo. The membership is frustrated, confused, and disorderly. They have little confidence in UAW leadership and want to strike as striking is the only weapon they know how to use. They'd strike in spite of UAW, not on behalf of UAW. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 8:45:58 PM EDT
[#3]
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Go read some of the articles with interviews from members at Ford and FCA. The membership is frustrated, confused, and disorderly. They have little confidence in UAW leadership and want to strike as striking is the only weapon they know how to use. They'd strike in spite of UAW, not on behalf of UAW. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I read today that Ford has tentative agreements on 11 of 20 major issues, FCA is also reporting that they’re making good progress, but didn’t give specifics. Both of those deals are dependent upon the GM contract being approved. They are patterned on the GM contract, so until the GM contract gets the nod, Ford and FCA are in limbo. The membership is frustrated, confused, and disorderly. They have little confidence in UAW leadership and want to strike as striking is the only weapon they know how to use. They'd strike in spite of UAW, not on behalf of UAW. A wildcat strike would result in a lot of unemployed people. Most employees that I've talked to just want to get it all over with. ETA: Granted, that number is in the single digits, but between that and FB, I think I have a pretty good handle on the Louisville plants. For all I know every employee in Michigan may want a strike. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 8:48:23 PM EDT
[#4]
The fists in the air
The red shirts The blocking of vehicles entering plants Tell me all i need to know |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 8:51:06 PM EDT
[#5]
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Well unions were called guilds before they were called unions. Guilds existed long before socialism. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Just for the record people didn't start labeling unions as socialist till the Cold War. Organized labor has been a cornerstone of Marxism as long as there has been Marxism. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 8:52:00 PM EDT
[#6]
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The fists in the air The red shirts The blocking of vehicles entering plants Tell me all i need to know 
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Posted: 9/18/2019 8:54:07 PM EDT
[#7]
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I'm hearing that police have started making arrests regarding that. https://media.giphy.com/media/2pjspMQCi70k/giphy.gif |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 8:55:00 PM EDT
[#8]
Rumor has it GM is shopping sites in Alabama.
The UAW is grinding itself into obsolescence |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 8:56:55 PM EDT
[#9]
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Rumor has it GM is shopping sites in Alabama. The UAW is grinding itself into obsolescence Hopefully they'll have better luck in Alabama. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 8:57:54 PM EDT
[#10]
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Please, guys, take it to The Pit. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Ok, let's finish it. I'll bet accounts. You keep claiming I'm some $15 an hour guy, I'll be happy to send one of the mods employment verification that I'm not and if I can't they can nuke my account. If I can prove it, your account gets nuked. Sound fun?  
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Posted: 9/18/2019 8:59:53 PM EDT
[#11]
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Sorry about your girl. Please stop |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:01:47 PM EDT
[#12]
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Rumor has it GM is shopping sites in Alabama. The UAW is grinding itself into obsolescence |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:01:48 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They have a facility here in TN, but it got Hopefully they'll have better luck in Alabama. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:06:11 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Alright I like where you said "The only places I worked where people had your toxic attitude were large companies with low skill work forces." I've worked at Honda a non union company with lower expectations, and then on to a union company who held a higher standard then them. I like that. Talking out of your ass where you haven't a clue. Didn't realize you included the civic and crv in that. My crv has been fine, but that's a small sample size. How about the Ford fiesta and focus dual clutch transmissions? They more reliable than the civic? How about the jeep 9 speeds that were being replaced with 12k miles? How about the 4 cylinder equinox engines that had constant engine problems with no known fix. Or the Chevy Cruze? Anyone knowledgeable or skilled in automobiles would get the Toyota and Honda. I got my ase master cert at 21 though so what do I know. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:06:41 PM EDT
[#15]
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dude did this for street cred. "hey members - see how far i'll go to fight for you?" what a load of shit Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Breaking! Spring Hill's UAW president arrested during GM strike SPRING HILL Amid the GM strike, UAW Local 1853's president was arrested on Wednesday afternoon. President Tim Stannard was taken into custody by the Maury County Sheriff's Department. Within the last 24 hours, Sheriff Bucky Rowland says at least eight picketers have been arrested for impeding traffic. News 2 is working to learn why Stannard was arrested. Maury County Mayor Andy Ogles has been on scene much of Wednesday and he called the situation volatile at times. Ogles says he is trying to deescalate tensions and keep people from getting arrested. Sheriff Rowland says the UAW members have generally been cordial and his officers are trying to stay out of the mix, but when demonstrators block vehicles on the roadway, that's when the problem has boiled over. what a load of shit |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:06:56 PM EDT
[#16]
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I'm a union worker. Just buy foreign. Fuck America am I right? When this country collapses, and when you're in the shit hole with the rest of us, I hope you can look back and think "I sure showed them!". |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:11:02 PM EDT
[#17]
Good. You get a job to trade your labor for the pay offered. You stop working, the trade is off.
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:12:19 PM EDT
[#18]
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Or you can close down and reopen elsewhere. That's precisely what Estes Express Lines did with one of there locations in Cali that decided to unionize there... |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:14:36 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I drive a 99 4Runner. FUAW. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:15:19 PM EDT
[#20]
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@40xb That's precisely what Estes Express Lines did with one of there locations in Cali that decided to unionize there... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Or you can close down and reopen elsewhere. That's precisely what Estes Express Lines did with one of there locations in Cali that decided to unionize there... |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:20:07 PM EDT
[#21]
I'm fine with that.
You're not entitled to a job anymore than you're entitled to particular level pay or benefits. Those things can change and should be able to change. You accept a job with is a trade for your time and abilities for pay. If you stop working, the trade is off as far as I am concerned. I can see no reason to keep paying for someone that is not working. The workers have every right to strike, but they must accept the consequences of what happens if you choose not to show up for work. They should also accept and meet with no reprisal, anyone that walks past them willing to work for less. Actions have consequences. I'm a glass is half empty type of person and there is not one week I have mini freak out over what would happen if I lost by job especially as a I save for a house. I have very little self confidence so don't think for a moment I'm just talking down to anyone and think I am high and mighty. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:34:36 PM EDT
[#22]
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If GM can just hold it together for 7 - 10 weeks, UAW will accept whatever they offer. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I read today that Ford has tentative agreements on 11 of 20 major issues, FCA is also reporting that they’re making good progress, but didn’t give specifics. Both of those deals are dependent upon the GM contract being approved. They are patterned on the GM contract, so until the GM contract gets the nod, Ford and FCA are in limbo. The union only really has one strike card and they played it. They're going to stay busy, but they're going to maintain pressure on GM to see who blinks first. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:35:33 PM EDT
[#23]
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Stupid question probably, but if they were to open a totally new plant, would it automatically be UAW, or do they have to vote on it? |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:36:45 PM EDT
[#24]
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That depends entirely on the issues at stake. I was surprised they resorted to a strike so quickly, so it could go either way. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I read today that Ford has tentative agreements on 11 of 20 major issues, FCA is also reporting that they’re making good progress, but didn’t give specifics. Both of those deals are dependent upon the GM contract being approved. They are patterned on the GM contract, so until the GM contract gets the nod, Ford and FCA are in limbo. The union only really has one strike card and they played it. They're going to stay busy, but they're going to maintain pressure on GM to see who blinks first. They could have continued past the contract expiration date, operating under the terms of the previous contract, while negotiating. That would have been a show of good faith. Instead the UAW went straight for the nuclear option. Hopefully GM retaliates by playing their own nuclear card - dragging this out for enough weeks to cause the average UAW member to risk crossing the picket line instead of losing their houses, cars, etc. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:37:50 PM EDT
[#25]
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Go read some of the articles with interviews from members at Ford and FCA. The membership is frustrated, confused, and disorderly. They have little confidence in UAW leadership and want to strike as striking is the only weapon they know how to use. They'd strike in spite of UAW, not on behalf of UAW. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I read today that Ford has tentative agreements on 11 of 20 major issues, FCA is also reporting that they’re making good progress, but didn’t give specifics. Both of those deals are dependent upon the GM contract being approved. They are patterned on the GM contract, so until the GM contract gets the nod, Ford and FCA are in limbo. The membership is frustrated, confused, and disorderly. They have little confidence in UAW leadership and want to strike as striking is the only weapon they know how to use. They'd strike in spite of UAW, not on behalf of UAW. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:43:58 PM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I pay 1700 a month  
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:45:24 PM EDT
[#27]
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Why do we believe the media when they report what we want to hear but dismiss them as MSM liars when they say shit we don't want to hear? The majority of the rank and file don't want to strike. They will if they think they have to, but almost no one is looking to do so. Everyone who went on strike and didn't want to are guilty by association. Like that? They have the right to association, and we have the right to judge that association. Plain and simple if the majority of the rank and file didn't want to strike then wtf are they striking for? |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:50:46 PM EDT
[#28]
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Pretty simple answer. Dont want to strike, then dont. Dont want to go to jail for slinging dope, then dont. Everyone who went on strike and didn't want to are guilty by association. Like that? They have the right to association, and we have the right to judge that association. Plain and simple if the majority of the rank and file didn't want to strike then wtf are they striking for? Don’t want to go on strike, just show the hell up for work. If it really is “95% of the rank-and-file”, what’s the problem? |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 9:57:21 PM EDT
[#29]
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This. Don’t want to go on strike, just show the hell up for work. If it really is “95% of the rank-and-file”, what’s the problem? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Pretty simple answer. Dont want to strike, then dont. Dont want to go to jail for slinging dope, then dont. Everyone who went on strike and didn't want to are guilty by association. Like that? They have the right to association, and we have the right to judge that association. Plain and simple if the majority of the rank and file didn't want to strike then wtf are they striking for? Don’t want to go on strike, just show the hell up for work. If it really is “95% of the rank-and-file”, what’s the problem? It’s probably an even mix of union haters, and union thugs, those that are lukewarm to the union most likely make up the majority. The second will turn on the first, and the third will probably split between the two. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 10:15:23 PM EDT
[#30]
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You Sir are a patriot. None of your money is going to the Democrap Party. None of mine is either. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: I drive a 99 4Runner. FUAW. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 10:17:45 PM EDT
[#31]
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It is surprising to me as well. They could have continued past the contract expiration date, operating under the terms of the previous contract, while negotiating. That would have been a show of good faith. Instead the UAW went straight for the nuclear option. Hopefully GM retaliates by playing their own nuclear card - dragging this out for enough weeks to cause the average UAW member to risk crossing the picket line instead of losing their houses, cars, etc. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I read today that Ford has tentative agreements on 11 of 20 major issues, FCA is also reporting that they’re making good progress, but didn’t give specifics. Both of those deals are dependent upon the GM contract being approved. They are patterned on the GM contract, so until the GM contract gets the nod, Ford and FCA are in limbo. The union only really has one strike card and they played it. They're going to stay busy, but they're going to maintain pressure on GM to see who blinks first. They could have continued past the contract expiration date, operating under the terms of the previous contract, while negotiating. That would have been a show of good faith. Instead the UAW went straight for the nuclear option. Hopefully GM retaliates by playing their own nuclear card - dragging this out for enough weeks to cause the average UAW member to risk crossing the picket line instead of losing their houses, cars, etc. I despise GM far more than its lowly workers that 99% of have nothing to do with which you accuse. FGM |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 10:28:35 PM EDT
[#32]
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I'm a union worker. Just buy foreign. Fuck America am I right? When this country collapses, and when you're in the shit hole with the rest of us, I hope you can look back and think "I sure showed them!". By your responses, it looks like you’ve read, studied, and regurgitated the bullshit they’ve given you. And when we’re in the “shit hole”, Union slugs are gonna be the last people thriving. You guys can’t wipe your own ass without one brudda holding the TP and anotha brudda spreading your cheeks. I’ve NEVER known lazier, less productive, less efficient, and more entitled people in my life (that willingly give money to anti gun pols while they’re at it). I’m certain that the ONLY people that think union workers are good at what they do are union workers. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 10:38:23 PM EDT
[#33]
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Lol, are you in GM management or something dude? I despise GM far more than its lowly workers that 99% of have nothing to do with which you accuse. FGM Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I read today that Ford has tentative agreements on 11 of 20 major issues, FCA is also reporting that they’re making good progress, but didn’t give specifics. Both of those deals are dependent upon the GM contract being approved. They are patterned on the GM contract, so until the GM contract gets the nod, Ford and FCA are in limbo. The union only really has one strike card and they played it. They're going to stay busy, but they're going to maintain pressure on GM to see who blinks first. They could have continued past the contract expiration date, operating under the terms of the previous contract, while negotiating. That would have been a show of good faith. Instead the UAW went straight for the nuclear option. Hopefully GM retaliates by playing their own nuclear card - dragging this out for enough weeks to cause the average UAW member to risk crossing the picket line instead of losing their houses, cars, etc. I despise GM far more than its lowly workers that 99% of have nothing to do with which you accuse. FGM |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 10:42:57 PM EDT
[#34]
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Are you a UAW member? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I read today that Ford has tentative agreements on 11 of 20 major issues, FCA is also reporting that they’re making good progress, but didn’t give specifics. Both of those deals are dependent upon the GM contract being approved. They are patterned on the GM contract, so until the GM contract gets the nod, Ford and FCA are in limbo. The union only really has one strike card and they played it. They're going to stay busy, but they're going to maintain pressure on GM to see who blinks first. They could have continued past the contract expiration date, operating under the terms of the previous contract, while negotiating. That would have been a show of good faith. Instead the UAW went straight for the nuclear option. Hopefully GM retaliates by playing their own nuclear card - dragging this out for enough weeks to cause the average UAW member to risk crossing the picket line instead of losing their houses, cars, etc. I despise GM far more than its lowly workers that 99% of have nothing to do with which you accuse. FGM |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 10:46:55 PM EDT
[#35]
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Would have to vote. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Stupid question probably, but if they were to open a totally new plant, would it automatically be UAW, or do they have to vote on it? |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 10:47:52 PM EDT
[#36]
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Nope, just a realist. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I read today that Ford has tentative agreements on 11 of 20 major issues, FCA is also reporting that they’re making good progress, but didn’t give specifics. Both of those deals are dependent upon the GM contract being approved. They are patterned on the GM contract, so until the GM contract gets the nod, Ford and FCA are in limbo. The union only really has one strike card and they played it. They're going to stay busy, but they're going to maintain pressure on GM to see who blinks first. They could have continued past the contract expiration date, operating under the terms of the previous contract, while negotiating. That would have been a show of good faith. Instead the UAW went straight for the nuclear option. Hopefully GM retaliates by playing their own nuclear card - dragging this out for enough weeks to cause the average UAW member to risk crossing the picket line instead of losing their houses, cars, etc. I despise GM far more than its lowly workers that 99% of have nothing to do with which you accuse. FGM I'm also a capitalist that doesn't lose any sleep over the plight of communists. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 10:51:12 PM EDT
[#37]
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Well my union was actually started by the big fire sprinkler companies in the early 1900s. They started my union to help them with the lobotomy's prices across the country. Just for the record people didn't start labeling unions as socialist till the Cold War. There's a lot of ignorance towards unions on this site. I can work union for top dollar pay, health, and retirement. Or I can work rat for $10-$15 an hour less and no Benefits. Easy choice for me. |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 10:52:28 PM EDT
[#38]
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Here in WI Mercury Outboard Motors made the announcement to do so when they called the bluff of their union. The union buckled and accepted the offer. This was 9 years ago or so. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Or you can close down and reopen elsewhere. That's precisely what Estes Express Lines did with one of there locations in Cali that decided to unionize there... |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 10:55:42 PM EDT
[#39]
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This. Don’t want to go on strike, just show the hell up for work. If it really is “95% of the rank-and-file”, what’s the problem? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Pretty simple answer. Dont want to strike, then dont. Dont want to go to jail for slinging dope, then dont. Everyone who went on strike and didn't want to are guilty by association. Like that? They have the right to association, and we have the right to judge that association. Plain and simple if the majority of the rank and file didn't want to strike then wtf are they striking for? Don’t want to go on strike, just show the hell up for work. If it really is “95% of the rank-and-file”, what’s the problem? 
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Posted: 9/18/2019 10:56:27 PM EDT
[#40]
GM is probably sitting on 90 - 120 day supply of vehicles and they are flush with cash that the UAW members made for them. They could take this down to the wire..we'll see.
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Posted: 9/18/2019 10:57:30 PM EDT
[#41]
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Rumor has it GM is shopping sites in Alabama. The UAW is grinding itself into obsolescence |
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Posted: 9/18/2019 11:10:56 PM EDT
[#42]
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I also posted a link earlier about when Olin decided to build a new factory after the union got too greedy. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Or you can close down and reopen elsewhere. That's precisely what Estes Express Lines did with one of there locations in Cali that decided to unionize there... The Mercury one stuck out to me because it showed how bad that particular union was. IIRC the plant was like 75% union and the company made them contract offer that needed to shuffle some numbers around. I think it was a small increase in insurance and a lesser percentage increase in raises for the future. The union heavily voted no and wouldn't budge. Mercury tried to talk more but the union wouldn't listen and they clearly didn't care about the jobs of the other 25%. So once Mercury called their bluff the union scrambled and "re-voted" and they accepted the terms. It just stood out to me as a bad situation seeing how those union workers let their greed show to the point of losing their jobs but effectively ruining the jobs of the other 25% employed there as well. they had no respect from me with that attitude and their actions. |
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Posted: 9/19/2019 1:45:13 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Guilds are not the same thing as labor unions. They are much more like trade unions -- which is not the topic of this thread. I swear to god the use of the word "union" should be banned unless the person precedes it with either "trade" or "labor" to avoid confusion |
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Posted: 9/19/2019 1:52:17 AM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If GM can just hold it together for 7 - 10 weeks, UAW will accept whatever they offer. |
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Posted: 9/19/2019 6:36:43 AM EDT
[#45]
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It is surprising to me as well. They could have continued past the contract expiration date, operating under the terms of the previous contract, while negotiating. That would have been a show of good faith. Instead the UAW went straight for the nuclear option. Hopefully GM retaliates by playing their own nuclear card - dragging this out for enough weeks to cause the average UAW member to risk crossing the picket line instead of losing their houses, cars, etc. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I read today that Ford has tentative agreements on 11 of 20 major issues, FCA is also reporting that they’re making good progress, but didn’t give specifics. Both of those deals are dependent upon the GM contract being approved. They are patterned on the GM contract, so until the GM contract gets the nod, Ford and FCA are in limbo. The union only really has one strike card and they played it. They're going to stay busy, but they're going to maintain pressure on GM to see who blinks first. They could have continued past the contract expiration date, operating under the terms of the previous contract, while negotiating. That would have been a show of good faith. Instead the UAW went straight for the nuclear option. Hopefully GM retaliates by playing their own nuclear card - dragging this out for enough weeks to cause the average UAW member to risk crossing the picket line instead of losing their houses, cars, etc. |
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Posted: 9/19/2019 12:41:42 PM EDT
[#46]
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Posted: 9/19/2019 5:28:44 PM EDT
[#47]
 Failed To Load Title |
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Posted: 9/19/2019 5:33:51 PM EDT
[#48]
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The problem is when those that are striking start to physically threaten those that want to work, and their families. |
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Posted: 9/19/2019 6:28:49 PM EDT
[#49]
I recall watching Charles Payne on Fox Business suggesting that GM has a lot of inventory for this time of year and could last for quite a while. Just sayin.
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Posted: 9/19/2019 6:34:50 PM EDT
[#50]
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I recall watching Charles Payne on Fox Business suggesting that GM has a lot of inventory for this time of year and could last for quite a while. Just sayin. |
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