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Posted: 1/26/2023 10:23:59 AM EDT
[#1]
That's crazy, OP.
It probably took them more time and effort in trying to hide the fact of what they were doing, then just doing it right to begin with. I hope it doesn't affect things on your end with the IRS. |
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Posted: 1/26/2023 10:36:43 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I'm going to also go to my bank and request all the checks I cashed through them. They keep them for 5 years. I called H&R after making this thread and they said my records have already been destroyed. my father has every w2 from the company since 2000. He had issues getting social security but they eventually passed it through when he submitted all of his W2s @TheOldRepublic I sent you a PM. I may know some folks you should talk to. |
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Posted: 1/26/2023 10:49:12 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I can get a few but not all of them. You can get a lot online now. Like someone said create your online account with SS and discoverable your latest annual report to see how far back this goes. It will show reported income for each year you worked. You can also get bank statements going back years from your online bank login. Paper trails are very hard to cover up or lose now. |
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Posted: 1/26/2023 11:01:12 AM EDT
[#4]
I read the first page only.
I met a guy about 10 years ago that got fucked by his employer for 30 years the same way. The employer was paying him, and showed him BS w2's and the owners wife was an accountant who "helped" him "file" his tax return every year. They would "file" his taxes and set it up for a refund to be deposited in to his checking account. The guy was not smart, and I mean on the bad side of the bell curve. He was a carpenter who just went and did framing and drywall work. He got in a car accident and had to stop working and went to file for SS disability. The irs had no record of him working for close to 30 years, and it all came crashing down on him. Some how he was able to "prove" his income and they went after the employer hard. I dont know how but he got everything owed to him for disability and SS. |
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Posted: 1/26/2023 11:14:43 AM EDT
[#5]
Lots of you say it's not OP's problem.
What you all don't realize - it is the OP's problem because $0 has been put into his social security, which means he'll get practically nothing social security-wise for retirement. It is a problem. |
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Posted: 1/26/2023 11:22:03 AM EDT
[#6]
OP, if you need a contact in the IRS, let me know. I know someone working in that office.
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Posted: 1/26/2023 11:36:14 AM EDT
[#7]
Tell them that your old employer donated to Trump and the RNC and that'll get the investigation rolling.
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Posted: 1/26/2023 12:50:53 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Lots of you say it's not OP's problem. What you all don't realize - it is the OP's problem because $0 has been put into his social security, which means he'll get practically nothing social security-wise for retirement. It is a problem. I made a social security account and all the income I made in those years is not there. This has happened to multiple people, including my dad. My dad appealed and submitted his W-2s and they eventually approved him with back pay. I'm under 30 years old so I have at least 30 years to work but this fucked up |
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Posted: 1/26/2023 12:59:29 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: That's crazy, OP. It probably took them more time and effort in trying to hide the fact of what they were doing, then just doing it right to begin with. I hope it doesn't affect things on your end with the IRS. Every time I hear an interview with a criminal it just sounds exhausting. |
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Posted: 1/26/2023 3:07:54 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I made a social security account and all the income I made in those years is not there. This has happened to multiple people, including my dad. My dad appealed and submitted his W-2s and they eventually approved him with back pay. I'm under 30 years old so I have at least 30 years to work but this fucked up Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Lots of you say it's not OP's problem. What you all don't realize - it is the OP's problem because $0 has been put into his social security, which means he'll get practically nothing social security-wise for retirement. It is a problem. I made a social security account and all the income I made in those years is not there. This has happened to multiple people, including my dad. My dad appealed and submitted his W-2s and they eventually approved him with back pay. I'm under 30 years old so I have at least 30 years to work but this fucked up Those 7 years would also affect your SSDI eligibility should shit go sideways. Hopefully your employer offers short and long term disability insurance as benefits. |
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Posted: 1/26/2023 3:09:59 PM EDT
[#11]
They sound like a ghost employer. IRS CI should be interested.
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Posted: 1/26/2023 3:13:09 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Ouch. How was this not somehow caught with your yearly tax filing? |
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Posted: 1/26/2023 3:25:41 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I made a social security account and all the income I made in those years is not there. This has happened to multiple people, including my dad. My dad appealed and submitted his W-2s and they eventually approved him with back pay. I'm under 30 years old so I have at least 30 years to work but this fucked up Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Lots of you say it's not OP's problem. What you all don't realize - it is the OP's problem because $0 has been put into his social security, which means he'll get practically nothing social security-wise for retirement. It is a problem. I made a social security account and all the income I made in those years is not there. This has happened to multiple people, including my dad. My dad appealed and submitted his W-2s and they eventually approved him with back pay. I'm under 30 years old so I have at least 30 years to work but this fucked up As I said, that's how you've been harmed, and why you and everyone else they did this to have cause to sue the company, likely to a level of personal liability. |
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Posted: 1/26/2023 3:32:03 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Ouch. How was this not somehow caught with your yearly tax filing? You guys asking this have to understand why it's your responsibility to determine your tax liability and voluntarily report it to the IRS. Our tax code is so fucking byzantine and nonsensical that even with todays information technology, the IRS has zero fucking idea who owes them what, until they apply resources to looking at a specific individual. I don't know the real numbers but I'd be willing to bet that if the NSA and DARPA were both directed to utilize 100% of their resources, ignore all privacy laws or limits, just to monitor citizens finances and report adherence to applicable taxes it would take them years and years to actually spit out 1 years worth of tax returns. That's why tax laws are guilty until proven innocent. The entire scheme fails if even a fraction of the population does a risk reward analysis and decides to actively not comply. It's like standing in a cloud of mosquitoes and trying to determine which one bit you 5 minutes ago. You could do it but either you witnessed it happening by coincidence, or you focused all of your attention on finding that individual. Unfortunately for us, the IRS thinks of us as mosquitoes and is inclined to just fuck everyone instead of those individuals doing the biting. |
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Posted: 1/26/2023 11:28:04 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: I didn't do anything wrong How the IRS sees things. https://64.media.tumblr.com/b901915aacecce2fc2d8b3caea523e3d/388212767382e5e0-33/s540x810/c1d36843d7071047116a6890b390c4d7cee6212e.gif Lol, that’s exactly the scene I was thinking of! |
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Posted: 1/26/2023 11:50:40 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There's no record I ever worked there. eta: They received nothing from the company regarding me. Did you fill out a time sheet? If so, those are legal documents which prove you worked there. Do you have direct deposit of your pay? If so, there's another legal record of employment. If you got handed a check, find some pay stubs. Get YOUR documentation together. I'll get back to you later with more information on how to proceed. |
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Posted: 1/27/2023 2:28:22 AM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Did you fill out a time sheet? If so, those are legal documents which prove you worked there. Do you have direct deposit of your pay? If so, there's another legal record of employment. If you got handed a check, find some pay stubs. Get YOUR documentation together. I'll get back to you later with more information on how to proceed. I have 5 pay stubs with federal withholding, social security and Medicare taken out of my check, so the company can not say I didn't work there or didn't have taxes withheld. I'm sure I will be able to find more. The bank has copies of checks I cashed from the company. I have pictures of weekly time cards as well. Thank you and thank you to everyone reaching out to me. |
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Posted: 2/1/2023 10:40:39 PM EDT
[#18]
Any updates?
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Posted: 2/4/2023 2:49:13 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Any updates? An Arfcomer provided me with a contact within the IRS criminal division. I'm confirming a few more former employees that are affected by this and then going to reach out. So far 4 others are confirmed. One guy has 15 years of no payments to social security. He worked there the whole time. |
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Posted: 2/4/2023 8:38:51 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: An Arfcomer provided me with a contact within the IRS criminal division. I'm confirming a few more former employees that are affected by this and then going to reach out. So far 4 others are confirmed. One guy has 15 years of no payments to social security. He worked there the whole time. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Any updates? An Arfcomer provided me with a contact within the IRS criminal division. I'm confirming a few more former employees that are affected by this and then going to reach out. So far 4 others are confirmed. One guy has 15 years of no payments to social security. He worked there the whole time.  I think seeing "$0" listed every year for "earnings taxed for Social security" would be an indicator that something isn't right. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 8:17:05 AM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: so did none of you guys look at your "your social security statement" that is mailed to you yearly show? https://blog.ssa.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/statement-redesign.jpg I think seeing "$0" listed every year for "earnings taxed for Social security" would be an indicator that something isn't right. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Any updates? An Arfcomer provided me with a contact within the IRS criminal division. I'm confirming a few more former employees that are affected by this and then going to reach out. So far 4 others are confirmed. One guy has 15 years of no payments to social security. He worked there the whole time. https://blog.ssa.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/statement-redesign.jpg I think seeing "$0" listed every year for "earnings taxed for Social security" would be an indicator that something isn't right. I've never seen that in my life and I've been working for 20+ years. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 9:12:53 AM EDT
[#22]
Quote HistoryQuoted: An Arfcomer provided me with a contact within the IRS criminal division. I'm confirming a few more former employees that are affected by this and then going to reach out. So far 4 others are confirmed. One guy has 15 years of no payments to social security. He worked there the whole time. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 9:32:12 AM EDT
[#23]
so, the IRS thinks you were unemployed all that time?
Do they owe you your money back? |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 9:58:02 AM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I've never seen that in my life and I've been working for 20+ years. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Any updates? An Arfcomer provided me with a contact within the IRS criminal division. I'm confirming a few more former employees that are affected by this and then going to reach out. So far 4 others are confirmed. One guy has 15 years of no payments to social security. He worked there the whole time. https://blog.ssa.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/statement-redesign.jpg I think seeing "$0" listed every year for "earnings taxed for Social security" would be an indicator that something isn't right. I've never seen that in my life and I've been working for 20+ years. I haven't been mailed that thing in many many years. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 10:55:01 AM EDT
[#25]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I haven't been mailed that thing in many many years. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Any updates? An Arfcomer provided me with a contact within the IRS criminal division. I'm confirming a few more former employees that are affected by this and then going to reach out. So far 4 others are confirmed. One guy has 15 years of no payments to social security. He worked there the whole time. https://blog.ssa.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/statement-redesign.jpg I think seeing "$0" listed every year for "earnings taxed for Social security" would be an indicator that something isn't right. I've never seen that in my life and I've been working for 20+ years. I haven't been mailed that thing in many many years. 12 years active duty and I have never seen that. Going to set up the account though.. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 10:58:47 AM EDT
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I haven't been mailed that thing in many many years. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Any updates? An Arfcomer provided me with a contact within the IRS criminal division. I'm confirming a few more former employees that are affected by this and then going to reach out. So far 4 others are confirmed. One guy has 15 years of no payments to social security. He worked there the whole time. https://blog.ssa.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/statement-redesign.jpg I think seeing "$0" listed every year for "earnings taxed for Social security" would be an indicator that something isn't right. I've never seen that in my life and I've been working for 20+ years. I haven't been mailed that thing in many many years. they stopped mailing them out in 2011. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 11:31:13 AM EDT
[#27]
First off OP, I would get in contact with the Taxpayer Advocate Service to see if they can help you. They are pretty independent and insulated from IRS management and can probably get you some help in determining if you have anything to worry about from the IRS.
Second, you need to understand, you are the victim in this situation. The withheld money, be it taxes, social security, etc. was YOUR money, not your employers. You reported it every year to the IRS so absent other info, you will not be the one paying it back to the government. Now having said that, you still have skin in the game to make sure you get credit from Social Security for the years you worked. IMO that will be more of a concern than the IRS. The IRS will need to inform SSA of the fraud and time/earnings to credit to your account. Unfortunately, if it is already being worked by IRS as a criminal case, that can take years to be resolved. The Taxpayer Advocate MIGHT be able to help in that part of your situation. Third, do not be surprised if the IRS CI agent will not talk to you. They really are not allowed to discuss ongoing criminal investigations. Good luck. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 11:54:13 AM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: they stopped mailing them out in 2011. I get one 1-2 times a year. I do work for the government though. Local municipality, one of the larger int he country, so not sure if that has anything to do with it. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 11:54:27 AM EDT
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If I'm reading this right, the company nave gave the irs the money they withheld from you. Get ready to write the IRS a check! Gonna have to go after the company to get your money back from them. Good luck But...why? according to the OP, the company deducted the money from his check and, as far as he knew, sent it to the IRS. IMO, the OP was acting in good faith throughout. If anything, the IRS should be pursuing the company for the money owed, especially if the OP can produce the W2s stating that the money was taken out of the check. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 12:06:03 PM EDT
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They would hand out W2s yearly and I would file either turbo tax or H&R Block. As far as I know I don't owe the IRS anything. I never made anything more than $40,000/ year with this company Did you upload copies of w2 to either? |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 12:07:02 PM EDT
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I haven't been mailed that thing in many many years. They "went green" awhile ago. You have to make an account to view it online. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 1:11:44 PM EDT
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I get one 1-2 times a year. I do work for the government though. Local municipality, one of the larger int he country, so not sure if that has anything to do with it. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: they stopped mailing them out in 2011. I get one 1-2 times a year. I do work for the government though. Local municipality, one of the larger int he country, so not sure if that has anything to do with it. I still get one mailed to me about once a year, that's why I mentioned it. didn't know they dont send them to everyone. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 2:24:23 PM EDT
[#33]
The way I see this the OP is going to have to jump through a bunch of hoops to make the tax folks satisfied .
Whatever he can't prove could possibly put some liability on himself and his SS acount could come up short and reduce his future SS payments (as they are based on income ) . Another issue altogether is any company pulling this type of fraud is likely on the edge and when they go under his job will disappear . Document and prove whatever he can but start looking for a new job . |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 3:31:30 PM EDT
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted: But...why? according to the OP, the company deducted the money from his check and, as far as he knew, sent it to the IRS. IMO, the OP was acting in good faith throughout. If anything, the IRS should be pursuing the company for the money owed, especially if the OP can produce the W2s stating that the money was taken out of the check. Because it's up to the taxpayer to ensure the tax gets paid. It's no different than in pre-online payment days if you dropped a check for your mortgage or credit card or utility bill into the mail and it was stolen before it got to the bank. The bank or utility didn't get paid, so you still owe. If this fraud has been going on for 15 years I'd bet the employer doesn't have enough cash to cover the outstanding tax and FICA bills for all the employees. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 4:05:31 PM EDT
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Because it's up to the taxpayer to ensure the tax gets paid. It's no different than in pre-online payment days if you dropped a check for your mortgage or credit card or utility bill into the mail and it was stolen before it got to the bank. The bank or utility didn't get paid, so you still owe. If this fraud has been going on for 15 years I'd bet the employer doesn't have enough cash to cover the outstanding tax and FICA bills for all the employees. This involves employer trust fund withholding. That makes a big legal difference. OP had no reason to suspect fraud, he filed his taxes with the employer provided W-2. The withheld money is legally his earnings, once it goes into the trust fund, it becomes the responsibility of the employer to render the payment to the government. The IRS will be looking to the employer to make everyone whole. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 4:08:27 PM EDT
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted: they stopped mailing them out in 2011. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Any updates? An Arfcomer provided me with a contact within the IRS criminal division. I'm confirming a few more former employees that are affected by this and then going to reach out. So far 4 others are confirmed. One guy has 15 years of no payments to social security. He worked there the whole time. https://blog.ssa.gov/wp-content/uploads/2021/10/statement-redesign.jpg I think seeing "$0" listed every year for "earnings taxed for Social security" would be an indicator that something isn't right. I've never seen that in my life and I've been working for 20+ years. I haven't been mailed that thing in many many years. they stopped mailing them out in 2011. Obama was saving money. They expect you to check it on line. |
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Posted: 2/5/2023 4:08:49 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How did you file tax returns without a W-2? Also, if they were withholding payroll taxes, and not sending them to the IRS, you may still be liable for the uncollected amounts, but even, then you should of been filing annual tax returns with a W-2, and the IRS should've kicked back at some point a notice, that they had not received payment. You need a Tax Attorney. You probably will need to get a settlement with the IRS to pay back the withholding your are missing, and you will need to go after your former employer for the money they stole. In other words; you fucked. Lots and lots of lawyers OP. Like.....now. |
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Posted: 2/25/2023 12:58:50 AM EDT
[#38]
@TheOldRepublic any updates?
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Posted: 2/28/2023 8:24:56 PM EDT
[#39]
@TheOldRepublic any updates?
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Posted: 3/3/2023 4:00:29 AM EDT
[#40]
I finally got in touch with the IRS CI we all originally talked to. Told her the situation. She asked me to gather a list of employees affected by this. It's up to about 15 people now.
She told me she would reach out to her "civil counter part" and see what recourse if any we had. She told me there's a grand jury investigation underway and that they take time. (Debating whether I should post that) Thats all she could tell me. I filed and received a tax return for 2022 and had no issues @Bubbles @NHGUNNER |
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Posted: 3/3/2023 4:04:32 AM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: In other words; you fucked. Lots and lots of lawyers OP. Like.....now. Ive talked to many lawyers. Told them the amount of people affected and how. None of them could help me. I'm kinda in disbelief about that. If anyone has any advice on what we should do, I'm all ears. |
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Posted: 3/3/2023 4:09:17 AM EDT
[#42]
My bros boss did same thing , hos boss owef more than a million in back taxes , he is currently a fugitive last i heard. My brother was cleated of any wrong doing.
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Posted: 3/3/2023 4:16:51 AM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: My bros boss did same thing , hos boss owef more than a million in back taxes , he is currently a fugitive last i heard. My brother was cleated of any wrong doing. Did he get what he paid into social security back? Besides seeing them retire and rot in federal prison, my biggest concern is getting the 7 years of SS credit that was taken out of my check. |
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Posted: 3/3/2023 9:54:31 AM EDT
[#44]
Myself I would most likely hunt them down and make their life a living hell.
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Posted: 3/22/2023 11:34:52 AM EDT
[#45]
Any news?
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Posted: 3/22/2023 11:41:22 AM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There's no record I ever worked there. eta: They received nothing from the company regarding me. If they claim you never worked there, how can they also claim you had income from them? Can't have it both ways -- "You never worked there" AND "You owe taxes for working there". Which is it? Are they claiming you worked "under the table" and committed a crime by falsifying 1099 income as fraudulently created W2? You have at least some exposure if you do not have at least 7 years of tax records retained -- it might be worth a $500 trip back to ID to gather those docs. I believe "7 years retention" is the requirement, unless it has changed recently. It's a sticky wicket certainly, and I'm sure its going to be a genuine pain to work out, but I'm not seeing an avenue where they can claim you did anything wrong (excepting the lack of your personal tax records, of course, and if they are claiming you created fraudulent W2 statements and submitted them as genuine) |
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Posted: 3/22/2023 11:43:46 AM EDT
[#47]
The key here is to check you Social Security account every year to make sure the numbers match.
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Posted: 3/22/2023 8:21:16 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If they claim you never worked there, how can they also claim you had income from them? Can't have it both ways -- "You never worked there" AND "You owe taxes for working there". Which is it? Are they claiming you worked "under the table" and committed a crime by falsifying 1099 income as fraudulently created W2? You have at least some exposure if you do not have at least 7 years of tax records retained -- it might be worth a $500 trip back to ID to gather those docs. I believe "7 years retention" is the requirement, unless it has changed recently. It's a sticky wicket certainly, and I'm sure its going to be a genuine pain to work out, but I'm not seeing an avenue where they can claim you did anything wrong (excepting the lack of your personal tax records, of course, and if they are claiming you created fraudulent W2 statements and submitted them as genuine) They have record from me throughout the years when I filed my W-2. The company sent them no records and didn't pay anything they took from me to the IRS, SS, or Medicare.I just received a tax return from my other jobs. I'm in good standing with the IRS. I have stubs that prove I wasn't working under the table and taxes were taken from every check |
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Posted: 3/22/2023 8:23:52 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Myself I would most likely hunt them down and make their life a living hell. They haven't retired yet. I'm waiting to hear they were arrested by the feds for 100s of thousands in tax fraud. Have their assets seized and retire in club pen. never thought I'd root for the damn feds but I hope they get them soon |
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Posted: 3/22/2023 9:09:21 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They have record from me throughout the years when I filed my W-2. The company sent them no records and didn't pay anything they took from me to the IRS, SS, or Medicare.I just received a tax return from my other jobs. I'm in good standing with the IRS. I have stubs that prove I wasn't working under the table and taxes were taken from every check You should be able to get the past 7 years of 1040's from your tax preparer. Once you have those, set up an appointment with the regional SSA office. Give them the stack of 1040s and the ci contact/case number. They should be able to add them, at least pending the ci case, or give you the forms you need. If that creates road blocks, go to the county clerk's office, and ask a few of them which SSA lawyer they would use if they had to file for SSI/SSDI. That should get you started. |
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