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Posted: 11/17/2022 7:44:04 AM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Bullshit EVs are the future and we need to stop using oil. howdareyou.jpg I hope you are joking soy man....if you are not, that is some sure fucked up thought process you got there Karen 
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Posted: 11/17/2022 8:08:45 AM EDT
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Like literally every leftist or Green movement it is utter bullshit. Climate Change, EVs, Peak Oil, windmills and solar, banning fertilizers, cow farts, it is all utter claptrap. People that believe in nothing will fall for anything. And it seems the moment almost any person buys an EV, they immediately become a convert and any questions about overall viability or reality that EV might NOT be the future, they turn into zealot liberals about it. "If you don't believe in the EV future, you are a luddite, moron, fool stuck ln the past that is not smart enough to love EV, like I love the one I bought! Follow the science, morons!!!" I kind of remember something that happened in the last couple years that was "Scientifically unquestionable" and the behavior of the adherents to that religion was very similar. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 8:10:01 AM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I didn't miss that, and I clearly posted data to that specific image that shows it is no longer correct. Big hint, my data is from 2022 and has larger reserves for lithium then your out dated data. But here, have yet another clue as at to what you are missing. Now think about that, what did I originally post, new mine + new technology. Now what does that do to the reserves you posted about based on older data? But more importantly pay attention to "Reserves data are dynamic" and "Reserves will be developed to the point of business needs." Full scale lithium mining is racist and not ESG compliant. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 11:31:48 AM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: So you just don't understand what you are posting. Let me give you a hint, this is from the core source you have been using, which they did update it in 2022: "World Resources: Owing to continuing exploration, identified lithium resources have increased substantially worldwide and total about 89 million tons. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Tell everyone you didn't read without saying you didn't read. I'd love to know how you could spin "this is the amount of raw minerals we require to do it, and there literally isn't that much available" into "we don't have enough *mining capacity* right now so we can't do it." So you just don't understand what you are posting. Let me give you a hint, this is from the core source you have been using, which they did update it in 2022: "World Resources: Owing to continuing exploration, identified lithium resources have increased substantially worldwide and total about 89 million tons. Picture: known reserves, 95 million tons Quoted: Now that one mine I posted is estimated at 32 million tons, which of course would adjust the currently just revised up number for the US from 9.1 million tons. But maybe you think the oil was going to run out in the 1970 's too. ... and I'll mindlessly just give you 95+32 million tons for 127 million tons. ... when you still need 940 million tons. I love how four months is now "old" data. Also I'm now too stupid to understand what "known reserves" means, just to suit your purposes.  I couldn't possibly understand that people explore looking for new reserves. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 11:44:16 AM EDT
[#5]
If we were serious, we'd do some of the following:
1) design electric vehicles for urban use that could run off of inductance coils with power supplied by lines buried in the streets. These would be inefficient, but would work 2) power these lines with nuclear energy 3) put the same lines on the interstates and major roadways. Also powered by nuclear power plants 4) have Battery powered EVs for rural / suburban use with a bunch of charging stations everywhere - power by nuclear energy 5) still have gasoline stations and ICE vehicles - there are some things that EV's cannot do yet. 6) phase all this in over DECADES, building infrastructure FIRST big-bang approaches almost always fail. Phased approaches with re-evaluation at each step generally succeed. but it isn't about success, it is currently about political power and lining the right pockets with tons of cash. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 12:00:58 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: They already asked people to not charge their cars during a shortage. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: That will be entertaining. One thing that California has is plenty of electricity......... They already asked people to not charge their cars during a shortage. Pretty soon they will stop asking & just shut off the charging stations of those they deem unworthy, it's coming sooner than most realize! |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 1:31:18 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If we were serious, we'd do some of the following: ... If we had been serious, we would have given no tax credit, no regulational favors, and not allowed the regulatory credits trading money-laundering scheme to have happened in the first place. Those things have made it impossible to tell what is really probable and what people want. Also, we wouldn't have the outright stupidity that is the new religion of climate change. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 1:32:33 PM EDT
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Pretty soon they will stop asking & just shut off the charging stations of those they deem unworthy, it's coming sooner than most realize! Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: That will be entertaining. One thing that California has is plenty of electricity......... They already asked people to not charge their cars during a shortage. Pretty soon they will stop asking & just shut off the charging stations of those they deem unworthy, it's coming sooner than most realize! Um ... I'm pretty sure they don't even have to go that far. Just disable charging in the cars themselves. IIRC tesla can already remotely control how fast your car is allowed to charge. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 1:43:34 PM EDT
[#9]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Um ... I'm pretty sure they don't even have to go that far. Just disable charging in the cars themselves. IIRC tesla can already remotely control how fast your car is allowed to charge. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: That will be entertaining. One thing that California has is plenty of electricity......... They already asked people to not charge their cars during a shortage. Pretty soon they will stop asking & just shut off the charging stations of those they deem unworthy, it's coming sooner than most realize! Um ... I'm pretty sure they don't even have to go that far. Just disable charging in the cars themselves. IIRC tesla can already remotely control how fast your car is allowed to charge. 
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Posted: 11/17/2022 1:45:59 PM EDT
[#10]
The electrical future still involves pumping out greenhouse gasses like sulfur hexafluoride, which is used in the electrical power industry.
CO2 isn't a proven threat, anyway. At least not in terms of global warming. It will only directly lead to mild warming. Claims of more than that are only based upon computer models of a system not fully understood. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 1:51:24 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: But maybe you think the oil was going to run out in the 1970 's too. The problem is the huge demand for lithium is driven by stupid government policy. If oil began to run out prices would drive a market solution. But the drive towards the battery powered future is a top down command and control push driven by an ideology not far from religion. If we removed the top down push the demand for lithium would drop since there would be no push to try to run the grid on batteries and the EV market would remain small in the near term. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 3:06:02 PM EDT
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Picture: known reserves, 95 million tons ... and I'll mindlessly just give you 95+32 million tons for 127 million tons. ... when you still need 940 million tons. I love how four months is now "old" data. Also I'm now too stupid to understand what "known reserves" means, just to suit your purposes. I couldn't possibly understand that people explore looking for new reserves. You still clearly dont understand it so I guess so. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 3:13:59 PM EDT
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The problem is the huge demand for lithium is driven by stupid government policy. If oil began to run out prices would drive a market solution. But the drive towards the battery powered future is a top down command and control push driven by an ideology not far from religion. If we removed the top down push the demand for lithium would drop since there would be no push to try to run the grid on batteries and the EV market would remain small in the near term. I dont have any issue with your core argument, Im not in favor of EV mandates at all. I happen to like my EV, but it is a luxury item for me. But all his argument amounts to is if we look at known capacity and reserves before we ramp up to meet a massive new demand we wont have enough. Umm no shit. But when has demand grown and supply not grown with it? It is a fantasy argument that has no basis in reality. Remember the US said peak oil was 1970, they swore by it cause they KNEW the reserves. Since then, for every barrel the US has sold we have discovered 2 more. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 5:17:54 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: None of that is specific to EVs. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: That will be entertaining. One thing that California has is plenty of electricity......... They already asked people to not charge their cars during a shortage. Pretty soon they will stop asking & just shut off the charging stations of those they deem unworthy, it's coming sooner than most realize! Um ... I'm pretty sure they don't even have to go that far. Just disable charging in the cars themselves. IIRC tesla can already remotely control how fast your car is allowed to charge. If you were only referring to people saying please don't refill your gas tanks during a gas shortage, you'd be right but ... ... the auto makers are not controlling how fast the gas can pump into your tank, and they don't control the gas pumps either. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 5:22:50 PM EDT
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You still clearly dont understand it so I guess so. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Picture: known reserves, 95 million tons ... and I'll mindlessly just give you 95+32 million tons for 127 million tons. ... when you still need 940 million tons. I love how four months is now "old" data. Also I'm now too stupid to understand what "known reserves" means, just to suit your purposes. I couldn't possibly understand that people explore looking for new reserves.Right. You ignore what's right in front of your face and you presume I couldn't possibly understand that people are constantly looking for more reserves to tap into and cheaper ways to get it and use it more efficiently ... and that means reality has to conform to your delusions. It's a special kind of block-headedness to try and say that "but you're not talking about production" when production is not what I was talking about in the first place. This is not complex. I said there's not enough. The stuff you cited said there wasn't enough. You cannot count things as resources that you don't even know exist and you can't estimate your ability to pull from those resources with processes you haven't even thought of yet. Delusion is pandemic these days. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 5:31:08 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I dont have any issue with your core argument, Im not in favor of EV mandates at all. I happen to like my EV, but it is a luxury item for me. But all his argument amounts to is if we look at known capacity and reserves before we ramp up to meet a massive new demand we wont have enough. Umm no shit. But when has demand grown and supply not grown with it? It is a fantasy argument that has no basis in reality. Quote HistoryQuoted: I dont have any issue with your core argument, Im not in favor of EV mandates at all. I happen to like my EV, but it is a luxury item for me. But all his argument amounts to is if we look at known capacity and reserves before we ramp up to meet a massive new demand we wont have enough. Umm no shit. But when has demand grown and supply not grown with it? It is a fantasy argument that has no basis in reality. Remember the US said peak oil was 1970, they swore by it cause they KNEW the reserves. Since then, for every barrel the US has sold we have discovered 2 more. There it is. You are counting things that do not exist, presuming they have to, and than backwards porting that into reality, because if you assume it, it has to happen. My saying "there isn't enough known reserve to do what they want to" in your mind has been expanded with ' Before we carry out shakespeare's saying on lawyers, we ought to do that for the english teachers and whoever thought it would be smart to get rid of logic classes as mandatory. Of course you can always ' 
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Posted: 11/17/2022 6:51:50 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Saying that there isn't enough in the total known to exist has "no basis in reality?" There it is. You are counting things that do not exist, presuming they have to, and than backwards porting that into reality, because if you assume it, it has to happen. My saying "there isn't enough known reserve to do what they want to" in your mind has been expanded with ' Before we carry out shakespeare's saying on lawyers, we ought to do that for the english teachers and whoever thought it would be smart to get rid of logic classes as mandatory. Of course you can always ' I'm not changing what you said, I'm not playing crazy tricks with you, I'm trying to get you to grasp that "known reserves" does not mean known abundance of something. Just because we don't have a mine there digging it up or extracting it or whatever method they use, doesn't mean it does not exist. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 7:04:23 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Um ... I'm pretty sure they don't even have to go that far. Just disable charging in the cars themselves. IIRC tesla can already remotely control how fast your car is allowed to charge. Tesla doesn't remotely control how fast your car is allowed to charge, the onboard computer may limit charging speed due to batter temps or amp draw on the charger being used. Not to mention that you can remove the cell modem (remote access) from a Tesla and the car works just fine, other than losing features that require cellular data like music streaming direct in the car. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 7:24:44 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: If you were only referring to people saying please don't refill your gas tanks during a gas shortage, you'd be right but ... ... the auto makers are not controlling how fast the gas can pump into your tank, and they don't control the gas pumps either. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: That will be entertaining. One thing that California has is plenty of electricity......... They already asked people to not charge their cars during a shortage. Pretty soon they will stop asking & just shut off the charging stations of those they deem unworthy, it's coming sooner than most realize! Um ... I'm pretty sure they don't even have to go that far. Just disable charging in the cars themselves. IIRC tesla can already remotely control how fast your car is allowed to charge. If you were only referring to people saying please don't refill your gas tanks during a gas shortage, you'd be right but ... ... the auto makers are not controlling how fast the gas can pump into your tank, and they don't control the gas pumps either. Can you cite? Only situation similar I’m aware of was Tesla at one point limiting capacity on some of the earlier cars. This was seemingly done to cars that had been more or less abused by bad charging habits. We’re talking 2015 and older cars. This was supposedly done to protect the health of the batteries. Nothing to do with speed of charging. ETA I had at the time a 2015 P85D which would have been a candidate for that action by Tesla in 2019. My car was not affected. Probably because I didn’t regularly DC fast charge to 100% or run it down to single digit state of charge like they tell you not to. By late 2021 and 70k miles my car had lost 7 or 8% of its original capacity. |
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Posted: 11/17/2022 7:37:37 PM EDT
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I dont have any issue with your core argument, Im not in favor of EV mandates at all. I happen to like my EV, but it is a luxury item for me. But all his argument amounts to is if we look at known capacity and reserves before we ramp up to meet a massive new demand we wont have enough. Umm no shit. But when has demand grown and supply not grown with it? It is a fantasy argument that has no basis in reality. Remember the US said peak oil was 1970, they swore by it cause they KNEW the reserves. Since then, for every barrel the US has sold we have discovered 2 more. We only know the known resources. A centralized top down push that assumes resources will expand to meet demand is foolish. If economics pushes solutions and it's market driven that's different. The key back up we have with oil is that it is market driven and if prices rise we will reinvest in something else. When the push is top down by central authorities the market won't respond correctly is the authorities don't allow it to. It doesn't matter if oil or lithium. It simply shouldn't be driven top down by government. Electric motors have real advantages, but in fuel storage gas is better than batteries. The decision should be left to the market. |
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