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Posted: 3/5/2023 8:23:30 PM EDT
I’ve seen this thread a bunch of times so far on GD.
Do people have short memories, or are they just ignorant? Infantry has always been the enemy of the tank. Tanks hate infantry and infantry hates tanks. But both together are a powerhouse. |
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The Marine Corps says that's a lie.
https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a31915295/marine-corps-tanks/ |
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Quoted: The Marine Corps says that's a lie. https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a31915295/marine-corps-tanks/ View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: The Marine Corps says that's a lie. https://www.popularmechanics.com/military/weapons/a31915295/marine-corps-tanks/ The Marines are shifting towards the ability to seize small islands in the South China Sea during wartime. Maybe they haven’t heard about tank floaties? |
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View Quote One is down and the other is up. |
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View Quote She was unbelievably hot in that movie. |
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Another one of these threads.
OK. Airpower kills both tanks and infantry. There I said it. |
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View Quote I got to see that as a double Feature in the drive in. The Wrath of Khan was first. My sisters & I were "supposed" fall asleep. Lol I loved that movie. |
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Quoted: Artillery is the Queen of Battle!!!! View Quote Fixed for you ?? They all support the Grunts/infantry |
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The tank is dying. Soon it will be dead.
For thousands of years the greatest warriors on earth rode into battle on the backs of barnyard animals and killed men with large knives. We don't do that anymore. They were famously defeated by men firing pointy sticks from contraptions made of animal guts and big sticks. Everything will come and go. Everything. There is nothing miraculous about an internal combustion engine moving a metal box with caterpillar tracks and a cannon. When a nine million dollar investment can be killed easily by a 2500 dollar investment, it is irresponsible to defend your nation with the nine million dollar investment. Its that simple. Its not that the tank is bad, it beats a sharp stick, but when I can generate much more combat power with a dollar doing other things, it is what it is. And oh by the way, nations that don't have tanks, like the Chinese, would love to cut corners and leap to the next thing. Moore's Law will kill the tank. If you don't understand the preceding sentence, google is your friend. The only think that will never go away is infantry, because infantry can be basically nothing, and "nothing" cant economically be destroyed. A nineteen year old kid with a rock is infantry. Everything else comes and goes. The problem isn't that the tank is dying, because it sure as hell is, it is that we don't know what is coming next. Uncertainty is a bitch and denial is free, and many are into the "bargaining" phase of "my combined arms" and denial of "Russians doing it wrong...we'll do it better" Its okay to grieve for Tank. He had a good run. Get to acceptance and understand high tech solutions are cheaper and better and the country will be better defended and better off. |
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How ‘bout all that shit together…
Infantry, artillery, tanks, planes, satellites, cruise missiles, drones, pointy sticks, script kiddies, electronic countermeasures, sonic electronic ball breakers, and harsh language… all talking together over a secure network, then each one drinking too much after kicking all that ass and telling everyone that will listen that they’re actually the best of them all, and that the rest are a bunch of freeloading pussies. |
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I'm currently reading the second of three volumes of The Last Lion: Winston Spencer Churchill It was very interesting to read about the role Churchill had in developing the Tank leading up to WW1. Know why it's called a tank? The British were developing a secret weapon to defeat the Germans in trench warfare. They made references to mobile water "Tanks" to carry drinking water to the troops fighting. Churchill was an incredible man and easily one of the greatest leaders in the last century.
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Artillery kills tanks and infantry. If you've never been rocketed, mortared, or under heavy tube artillery bombardment I don't think one can appreciate the power and effect of artillery. |
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Quoted: In Soviet war doctrine and trench warfare, this is true. In a fast paced mobile warfare, artillery would play a lesser role than it is in the Ukrainian conflict. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: Artillery is the King of Battle!!!! In Soviet war doctrine and trench warfare, this is true. In a fast paced mobile warfare, artillery would play a lesser role than it is in the Ukrainian conflict. You should look up the 3rd ID and 1st Marine Division’s AARs from OIF 1. |
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View Quote Must have been chilly on the set |
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Quoted: I’ve seen this thread a bunch of times so far on GD. Do people have short memories, or are they just ignorant? Infantry has always been the enemy of the tank. Tanks hate infantry and infantry hates tanks. But both together are a powerhouse. View Quote So why are posting it again? Site resources and all |
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Tanks
TOW missiles Mines Maverick Cluster bombs Hellfire 30mm Javelin Vehicles Aircraft Infantry Everything on the battlefield is designed to kill tanks |
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View Quote She spent the 80s perpetually cold. |
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Quoted: GD wants battleships back View Quote Lets see. You create a vehicle. It has power and propulsion to bear. It has so much power you armor it, put a big gun on it, and build your doctrine around it. In the '10s and '20s we start seeing really cheap airpower capabilities that can kill it at a fraction of the cost. Careers are tied up in it, we talk about putting organized AAA and counter air capes on top of the armor, and we talk about those who fail to do it are "doing it wrong" and "combined arms" and such. Pretty soon it will be apparent the growth potential in the airborne capes are bigger/better then the growth potential of the armored box that is the target. The airpower guys will get organized and demand more cash and resources and say if you build fleets of aerial delivered munitions that will be batter use of teh tech then the armored box. Young guys and forward thinking guys will fall in on the air platforms and that will be the new hotness. Of course, that's the battleship. It will be the tank. Its pretty much progressing the same. The same sorts of fallacies and precisely the same sorts of normalcy bias. |
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View Quote If you cant pose a competent counter argument, you prove my point. Thanks for playing. |
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Just wait until we have infantry tanks that launch drone tanks!
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Quoted: Artillery is the King of Battle!!!! View Quote Um... yea. Arty: " I'm 20 miles away. And will fire a shell from safety, powerful enough to level a house. And I have 20 friends right beside me doing the same. At you and your friends. Because fuck you." Arty has been king of the battlefield since invented - and still is. |
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Quoted: I’ve seen this thread a bunch of times so far on GD. Do people have short memories, or are they just ignorant? Infantry has always been the enemy of the tank. Tanks hate infantry and infantry hates tanks. But both together are a powerhouse. View Quote Yes. People see a short clip of a tank getting destroyed by a grenade from a drone and automatically think it's the end of an era for the tank. |
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Quoted: Artillery is the King of Battle!!!! View Quote This seems to be the case in Ukraine. Well, UAV supported artillery. Non-UAV aircraft are a liability because they'll be shot down by AA weapons if traveling too close to the front lines. All tanks there are shit because of modern ATGMs. Differences in small arms don't matter as long as they poke holes in people. |
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Quoted: We will be fine as long as the drones and arty don’t start working together. Man, that would be scary. View Quote View All Quotes View All Quotes Quoted: Quoted: Drones will takeover the battlefield and then the world!!!! We will be fine as long as the drones and arty don’t start working together. Man, that would be scary. Or autonomous drones with a rotary magazine of droppable munitions that follow you, as you run away. |
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Quoted: The tank is dying. Soon it will be dead. For thousands of years the greatest warriors on earth rode into battle on the backs of barnyard animals and killed men with large knives. We don't do that anymore. They were famously defeated by men firing pointy sticks from contraptions made of animal guts and big sticks. Everything will come and go. Everything. There is nothing miraculous about an internal combustion engine moving a metal box with caterpillar tracks and a cannon. When a nine million dollar investment can be killed easily by a 2500 dollar investment, it is irresponsible to defend your nation with the nine million dollar investment. Its that simple. Its not that the tank is bad, it beats a sharp stick, but when I can generate much more combat power with a dollar doing other things, it is what it is. And oh by the way, nations that don't have tanks, like the Chinese, would love to cut corners and leap to the next thing. Moore's Law will kill the tank. If you don't understand the preceding sentence, google is your friend. The only think that will never go away is infantry, because infantry can be basically nothing, and "nothing" cant economically be destroyed. A nineteen year old kid with a rock is infantry. Everything else comes and goes. The problem isn't that the tank is dying, because it sure as hell is, it is that we don't know what is coming next. Uncertainty is a bitch and denial is free, and many are into the "bargaining" phase of "my combined arms" and denial of "Russians doing it wrong...we'll do it better" Its okay to grieve for Tank. He had a good run. Get to acceptance and understand high tech solutions are cheaper and better and the country will be better defended and better off. View Quote The writing is on the wall, but it will be ignored by the people in charge. Chechen forces in Russia where using IEDs in the late 90s, but apparently the people in charge of US forces were too retarded to take note, and a bunch of US soldiers were maimed in conflicts shortly after that, because they failed to take note that, that way of fighting would spread into future conflicts. They eventually upgraded, but I guess it was kind of is unfortunate for all those soldiers in the meantime that suffered the consequences of a less than proactive leadership. It is blatantly obvious that COTS UAVs have changed modern warfare and if strategy isn't changed, the people in charge are fucking morons. |
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Tanks are only safe if you completely control the air and have lots of infantry support.
Otherwise they are a cremation waiting to happen! |
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Yes, artillery is the King of the battlefield and will be for the foreseeable future. Tanks are are not going anywhere and like artillery will be on the battlefield for the foreseeable future too. To believe tanks are obsolete is myopic and foolish!
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