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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:45:57 PM EST
[#1]
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I guess I did. I don't understand what I said that you are upset about. (And I wasn't talking about Dave_A) Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Well I've been told (to paraphrase), as long as people are adults and don't fall for it, then nothing will happen. If they do fall for it, then it shows they don't have control. Adults can post without breaking the rules. With your attitude Dave_A should be let back in GD right? Dave_A did nothing wrong, OTHER posters just couldn't be adults. Your response to me, in the context I had posted was about people getting in trouble for responding to trolls. Which means, your response to me, seemed to place the fault on those reacting to being trolled. So do you actually feel that way, or were you trying to give some sage advice without taking the entirety of the discussion into context? |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:46:06 PM EST
[#2]
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He hasn't logged in since 2018. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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A couple few years ago, I actually floated the idea of letting him back in. 
I have a feeling he was just young, and making immature mistakes because like a lot of people in their early 20's (me included), he thought he was more clever than he really was. I'm sure he's grown up quite a bit over the last 8 years since he got the 'ol heave-ho. Were I to wager a guess though, I think he's long since given up on the place and stopped caring. Asked him why he doesn't just start a new account, he said he won't be back in GD without being invited (or unlocked I guess). He was quite the troll, but unlike the share blue here he at least has some integrity, it would seem. I left WA this year. I used to check the WAHTF on occasion and he would sometimes show up, nowhere near as much as he did in GD though. Maybe he's blasting on some other forum, or maybe he's just gotten a life.
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:47:23 PM EST
[#3]
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Email him Quote HistoryQuoted:
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He hasn't logged in since 2018. 
1. I don't have his email address (only staff can see that). 2. Only the staff member who locked him out of GD can bring him back (Aimless). Mods don't have the ability. 3. I floated the idea of unlocking him a couple few years ago, before I was a moderator. Knowing what I know now, bringing him back would make my job a fucking nightmare, even if Dave_A behaved like a saint. He would be trolled relentlessly, because arfcommers have loooooong memories and don't forgive.
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:47:25 PM EST
[#4]
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not everyone with a different opinion is a troll. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:47:34 PM EST
[#5]
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Oh, that's the dismissive attitude I love from people who think it's a posters fault for getting baited by trolls, instead of the trolls fault for attempting to bait posters into catching warnings. With your attitude Dave_A should be let back in GD right? Dave_A did nothing wrong, OTHER posters just couldn't be adults. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Well I've been told (to paraphrase), as long as people are adults and don't fall for it, then nothing will happen. If they do fall for it, then it shows they don't have control. Adults can post without breaking the rules. With your attitude Dave_A should be let back in GD right? Dave_A did nothing wrong, OTHER posters just couldn't be adults. 
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:48:23 PM EST
[#6]
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Few things:
1. I don't have his email address (only staff can see that). 2. Only the staff member who locked him out of GD can bring him back (Aimless). Mods don't have the ability. 3. I floated the idea of unlocking him a couple few years ago, before I was a moderator. Knowing what I know now, bringing him back would make my job a fucking nightmare, even if Dave_A behaved like a saint. He would be trolled relentlessly, because arfcommers have loooooong memories and don't forgive.
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:49:23 PM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I guess I did. I don't understand what I said that you are upset about. (And I wasn't talking about Dave_A) |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:49:34 PM EST
[#8]
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Absolutely. If you can't control yourself, push away from the keyboard and go outside. The other day I decided to step away from these threads for a day. People need to learn self control and realize that not everyone with a different opinion is a troll. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:51:16 PM EST
[#9]
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Are you aware ignorance of the law is no excuse! Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Well I've been told (to paraphrase), as long as people are adults and don't fall for it, then nothing will happen. If they do fall for it, then it shows they don't have control. Adults can post without breaking the rules. With your attitude Dave_A should be let back in GD right? Dave_A did nothing wrong, OTHER posters just couldn't be adults. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:52:00 PM EST
[#10]
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Few things:
1. I don't have his email address (only staff can see that). 2. Only the staff member who locked him out of GD can bring him back (Aimless). Mods don't have the ability. 3. I floated the idea of unlocking him a couple few years ago, before I was a moderator. Knowing what I know now, bringing him back would make my job a fucking nightmare, even if Dave_A behaved like a saint. He would be trolled relentlessly, because arfcommers have loooooong memories and don't forgive. If the Sr staff member responsible for locking someones account is no longer on staff, do the remaining staff play rock paper scissors to see who makes the decision to allow the poster back in? |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:52:54 PM EST
[#11]
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People know. Calling everyone that disagrees with you a troll is just a weak attempt to get them in trouble so they shut up. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:54:33 PM EST
[#12]
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Absolutely. If you can't control yourself, push away from the keyboard and go outside. The other day I decided to step away from these threads for a day. People need to learn self control and realize that not everyone with a different opinion is a troll. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:55:11 PM EST
[#13]
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Trivia question If the Sr staff member responsible for locking someones account is no longer on staff, do the remaining staff play rock paper scissors to see who makes the decision to allow the poster back in? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Few things:
1. I don't have his email address (only staff can see that). 2. Only the staff member who locked him out of GD can bring him back (Aimless). Mods don't have the ability. 3. I floated the idea of unlocking him a couple few years ago, before I was a moderator. Knowing what I know now, bringing him back would make my job a fucking nightmare, even if Dave_A behaved like a saint. He would be trolled relentlessly, because arfcommers have loooooong memories and don't forgive. If the Sr staff member responsible for locking someones account is no longer on staff, do the remaining staff play rock paper scissors to see who makes the decision to allow the poster back in?
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:55:50 PM EST
[#14]
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As a long time member... this shit is getting more and more obvious. The shareblue type trolling is out of fucking hand. Moderators sticking their heads in the sand about it isn't so great either. I'm not necessarily in the "mods are complicit" camp... but the recent heavy handed moderation, and the lack of firm statements and stances about freedom of speech and lack of support for civil-disobedience where needed, from the owners/leaders of the site is troubling. Paul's bullshit thread was enough to make me want to puke. I spend less time here, and more time elsewhere... I'm sure that others are doing the same. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted: Mod in training or a 2nd mod account. Pretty easy to see Reminds me of a FL guy that i wont mention I'm not necessarily in the "mods are complicit" camp... but the recent heavy handed moderation, and the lack of firm statements and stances about freedom of speech and lack of support for civil-disobedience where needed, from the owners/leaders of the site is troubling. Paul's bullshit thread was enough to make me want to puke. I spend less time here, and more time elsewhere... I'm sure that others are doing the same. PLEASE, staff/ mods, take note. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:55:57 PM EST
[#15]
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What law? It's a web forum, not a dick. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Well I've been told (to paraphrase), as long as people are adults and don't fall for it, then nothing will happen. If they do fall for it, then it shows they don't have control. Adults can post without breaking the rules. With your attitude Dave_A should be let back in GD right? Dave_A did nothing wrong, OTHER posters just couldn't be adults. 
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Posted: 10/20/2019 2:57:44 PM EST
[#16]
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Absolutely. If you can't control yourself, push away from the keyboard and go outside. The other day I decided to step away from these threads for a day. People need to learn self control and realize that not everyone with a different opinion is a troll. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:00:04 PM EST
[#17]
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No, posting contrary to what the mob is posting doesn't make you a troll |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:02:02 PM EST
[#18]
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Then maybe he's lost interest, like you said. I left WA this year. I used to check the WAHTF on occasion and he would sometimes show up, nowhere near as much as he did in GD though. Maybe he's blasting on some other forum, or maybe he's just gotten a life. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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A couple few years ago, I actually floated the idea of letting him back in.
I have a feeling he was just young, and making immature mistakes because like a lot of people in their early 20's (me included), he thought he was more clever than he really was. I'm sure he's grown up quite a bit over the last 8 years since he got the 'ol heave-ho. Were I to wager a guess though, I think he's long since given up on the place and stopped caring. Asked him why he doesn't just start a new account, he said he won't be back in GD without being invited (or unlocked I guess). He was quite the troll, but unlike the share blue here he at least has some integrity, it would seem. I left WA this year. I used to check the WAHTF on occasion and he would sometimes show up, nowhere near as much as he did in GD though. Maybe he's blasting on some other forum, or maybe he's just gotten a life.
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:02:50 PM EST
[#19]
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I'd use what wtfboomer has been doing in these threads as a baseline. He is like the private that hangs outside officer clubs on base in the hope of being invited in by saying the right things. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:03:14 PM EST
[#20]
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He's the thing we need in GD right now.Let loose the floodgates. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Few things:
1. I don't have his email address (only staff can see that). 2. Only the staff member who locked him out of GD can bring him back (Aimless). Mods don't have the ability. 3. I floated the idea of unlocking him a couple few years ago, before I was a moderator. Knowing what I know now, bringing him back would make my job a fucking nightmare, even if Dave_A behaved like a saint. He would be trolled relentlessly, because arfcommers have loooooong memories and don't forgive. 
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:03:33 PM EST
[#21]
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Technically, they didn't. We were purchased by their parent company. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted: Once they break the huddle , the blitz of newspeak will be mind boggling . @WILSON |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:05:03 PM EST
[#22]
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Absolutely. If you can't control yourself, push away from the keyboard and go outside. The other day I decided to step away from these threads for a day. People need to learn self control and realize that not everyone with a different opinion is a troll. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Well, the topic was people trolling, and being successful in getting people to bite. So by your saying don' blame others, are you implying it's the person being trolled's fault if they fall for it? |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:05:26 PM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Bring him and DanTSX back, and make them both mods. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:05:38 PM EST
[#24]
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yep |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:07:01 PM EST
[#25]
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Could you imagine both of them running around GD while this episode unfolds Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Bring him and DanTSX back, and make them both mods. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:07:11 PM EST
[#26]
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The trick with this, is that "trolling" is so subjective, that I'm not even sure how a prohibition on it can be enforced without making a lot of mistakes. If you think moderation is over the top now, just wait until we start handing out warnings for what we perceive as trolling. For my part, I'm more inclined to err on the side of caution (i.e. moderate using a less is more philosophy), rather than warn somebody for trolling mistakenly. Out of curiosity though, if you were in my shoes, how would you decide when a comment is trolling and deserves a warning? Dave_A trolling Justice23 trolling |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:07:43 PM EST
[#27]
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I don't think he is trolling in the classic sense.. He is like the private that hangs outside officer clubs on base in the hope of being invited in by saying the right things. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I'd use what wtfboomer has been doing in these threads as a baseline. He is like the private that hangs outside officer clubs on base in the hope of being invited in by saying the right things. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:07:54 PM EST
[#28]
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Few things:
1. I don't have his email address (only staff can see that). 2. Only the staff member who locked him out of GD can bring him back (Aimless). Mods don't have the ability. 3. I floated the idea of unlocking him a couple few years ago, before I was a moderator. Knowing what I know now, bringing him back would make my job a fucking nightmare, even if Dave_A behaved like a saint. He would be trolled relentlessly, because arfcommers have loooooong memories and don't forgive. Considering how our gov. and legal system is set up, thought this site would be similar in some way. idk, w/e |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:09:41 PM EST
[#29]
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Maybe he finally got laid? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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A couple few years ago, I actually floated the idea of letting him back in.
I have a feeling he was just young, and making immature mistakes because like a lot of people in their early 20's (me included), he thought he was more clever than he really was. I'm sure he's grown up quite a bit over the last 8 years since he got the 'ol heave-ho. Were I to wager a guess though, I think he's long since given up on the place and stopped caring. Asked him why he doesn't just start a new account, he said he won't be back in GD without being invited (or unlocked I guess). He was quite the troll, but unlike the share blue here he at least has some integrity, it would seem. I left WA this year. I used to check the WAHTF on occasion and he would sometimes show up, nowhere near as much as he did in GD though. Maybe he's blasting on some other forum, or maybe he's just gotten a life.
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:11:19 PM EST
[#30]
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Also, I'd have a commanders intent/ mission statement for the site for posters, mods, and SS to circle back to, as well as a list of guiding principles that drive the site agenda, expectations of the members, as well as expectations for mods/SS that members can hold them accountable to. Also wouldn't hurt to have a few alt accounts that do some soft trolling around the site to keep mods and SS on their toes, sort of the forum equivalent of pen testing.
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:12:57 PM EST
[#31]
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That surprises me. I would have thought a permanent ban would require a majority vote of a high percentage. Not just one person. Considering how our gov. and legal system is set up, thought this site would be similar in some way. idk, w/e Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Few things:
1. I don't have his email address (only staff can see that). 2. Only the staff member who locked him out of GD can bring him back (Aimless). Mods don't have the ability. 3. I floated the idea of unlocking him a couple few years ago, before I was a moderator. Knowing what I know now, bringing him back would make my job a fucking nightmare, even if Dave_A behaved like a saint. He would be trolled relentlessly, because arfcommers have loooooong memories and don't forgive. Considering how our gov. and legal system is set up, thought this site would be similar in some way. idk, w/e *Edit to clarify; in regards to whether the BOR was necessary. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:21:08 PM EST
[#32]
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Doubtful they could foresee these current conditions when they set up the site. Much like our founders suggested that the public would never elect someone who would abuse the system. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Few things:
1. I don't have his email address (only staff can see that). 2. Only the staff member who locked him out of GD can bring him back (Aimless). Mods don't have the ability. 3. I floated the idea of unlocking him a couple few years ago, before I was a moderator. Knowing what I know now, bringing him back would make my job a fucking nightmare, even if Dave_A behaved like a saint. He would be trolled relentlessly, because arfcommers have loooooong memories and don't forgive. Considering how our gov. and legal system is set up, thought this site would be similar in some way. idk, w/e Edit--nvm, I just figured out what you are saying |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:24:00 PM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You have something there on your chin |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:28:31 PM EST
[#34]
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I agree, but the mob pays the bills here. Of course not. This isn't your site; its not my site. We are guests here. Some of us pay a bit more than others so we can hang a bit of flair under my name. I don't pretend that that gives me any special rights or privileges in what amounts to another persons house. The hosts have made it clear what their expectations of the guests are. If the house rules aren't to a guests satisfaction, they can find another house party to crash. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:29:10 PM EST
[#35]
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Make scenes, but the conditions in this country and the leftist/Marxist attack and take over of all social media has been going on for at least 10 years. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Few things:
1. I don't have his email address (only staff can see that). 2. Only the staff member who locked him out of GD can bring him back (Aimless). Mods don't have the ability. 3. I floated the idea of unlocking him a couple few years ago, before I was a moderator. Knowing what I know now, bringing him back would make my job a fucking nightmare, even if Dave_A behaved like a saint. He would be trolled relentlessly, because arfcommers have loooooong memories and don't forgive. Considering how our gov. and legal system is set up, thought this site would be similar in some way. idk, w/e I expect this is what the owners and staff are wrestling with; how much "real" pro-2A talk to allow and how much to stifle in an effort to self preserve. I have no doubt the owners and at least a majority of the staff understand the true intent of the 2A. Preserving this platform in overwhelmingly hostile waters is a tightrope though. I don't envy them right now. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:34:30 PM EST
[#36]
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Indeed! Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Well I've been told (to paraphrase), as long as people are adults and don't fall for it, then nothing will happen. If they do fall for it, then it shows they don't have control. Adults can post without breaking the rules. With your attitude Dave_A should be let back in GD right? Dave_A did nothing wrong, OTHER posters just couldn't be adults. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:36:12 PM EST
[#37]
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Just because you pump your gas at your local Citgo station, do you have the right to make decisions for the company ( assuming you aren't a major stockholder and just J.Q. Citizen )? Of course not. This isn't your site; its not my site. We are guests here. Some of us pay a bit more than others so we can hang a bit of flair under my name. I don't pretend that that gives me any special rights or privileges in what amounts to another persons house. The hosts have made it clear what their expectations of the guests are. If the house rules aren't to a guests satisfaction, they can find another house party to crash. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I agree, but the mob pays the bills here. Of course not. This isn't your site; its not my site. We are guests here. Some of us pay a bit more than others so we can hang a bit of flair under my name. I don't pretend that that gives me any special rights or privileges in what amounts to another persons house. The hosts have made it clear what their expectations of the guests are. If the house rules aren't to a guests satisfaction, they can find another house party to crash. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:37:39 PM EST
[#38]
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Holee Fuk, I said as much back in the day and it wasn't well received. EdSrs generally assertion that there doesn't need to be apologies among friends, certainly let me know where I was left in that conversation. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Also, I'd have a commanders intent/ mission statement for the site for posters, mods, and SS to circle back to, as well as a list of guiding principles that drive the site agenda, expectations of the members, as well as expectations for mods/SS that members can hold them accountable to. Also wouldn't hurt to have a few alt accounts that do some soft trolling around the site to keep mods and SS on their toes, sort of the forum equivalent of pen testing. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:39:26 PM EST
[#39]
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And when the hosts decide to change the rules in the middle of the party, they can't be upset when the guests want an explanation. Or, if they're REALLY enthusiastic, they can decide to host their own party next Friday and stock the beer they want and play the music they prefer.. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:39:50 PM EST
[#40]
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Just because you pump your gas at your local Citgo station, do you have the right to make decisions for the company ( assuming you aren't a major stockholder and just J.Q. Citizen )? Of course not. This isn't your site; its not my site. We are guests here. Some of us pay a bit more than others so we can hang a bit of flair under my name. I don't pretend that that gives me any special rights or privileges in what amounts to another persons house. The hosts have made it clear what their expectations of the guests are. If the house rules aren't to a guests satisfaction, they can find another house party to crash. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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I agree, but the mob pays the bills here. Of course not. This isn't your site; its not my site. We are guests here. Some of us pay a bit more than others so we can hang a bit of flair under my name. I don't pretend that that gives me any special rights or privileges in what amounts to another persons house. The hosts have made it clear what their expectations of the guests are. If the house rules aren't to a guests satisfaction, they can find another house party to crash. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:41:29 PM EST
[#41]
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Not really. They're guests. If the host decides to switch the party soundtrack from classic rock to polka music, or switch to cheaper beer at the tap, the guests can go find another party more to their liking. Or, if they're REALLY enthusiastic, they can decide to host their own party next Friday and stock the beer they want and play the music they prefer.. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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And when the hosts decide to change the rules in the middle of the party, they can't be upset when the guests want an explanation. Or, if they're REALLY enthusiastic, they can decide to host their own party next Friday and stock the beer they want and play the music they prefer.. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:43:17 PM EST
[#42]
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Yeah, really. Especially when the guests are the ones paying for it with memberships and advertising. You can't make all of the people happy all of the time. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:45:29 PM EST
[#43]
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Well then, another nugget of wisdom pops up. You can't make all of the people happy all of the time. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Yeah, really. Especially when the guests are the ones paying for it with memberships and advertising. You can't make all of the people happy all of the time.  Attached File |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:45:48 PM EST
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Just because you pump your gas at your local Citgo station, do you have the right to make decisions for the company ( assuming you aren't a major stockholder and just J.Q. Citizen )? Of course not. This isn't your site; its not my site. We are guests here. Some of us pay a bit more than others so we can hang a bit of flair under my name. I don't pretend that that gives me any special rights or privileges in what amounts to another persons house. The hosts have made it clear what their expectations of the guests are. If the house rules aren't to a guests satisfaction, they can find another house party to crash. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:45:52 PM EST
[#45]
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Pete Brownell would demand a refund. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Quoted: Bring him and DanTSX back, and make them both mods. He’d have to pay return shipping on this mob too
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:47:25 PM EST
[#46]
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Well then, another nugget of wisdom pops up. You can't make all of the people happy all of the time. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Yeah, really. Especially when the guests are the ones paying for it with memberships and advertising. You can't make all of the people happy all of the time. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:51:57 PM EST
[#47]
Analogies get twisted into red herrings too much.
Arfcom is a social construct that depends on the viability of the social structure to maintain revenue. Revenue that comes from both the members and the advertisers. The one draws the other and it would take some very in depth analysis, plus some historical financial data, plus some judgement calls to draw conclusions. Which we do not have. The social framework is being rewritten / re-interpreted. The question is, will it have a detrimental effect on the website. Both as the social construct it is, and the business it is. Historically it will not. This isn’t the first shakeup. But time will tell. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:57:07 PM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: No, the issue is that a SS made some bold faced lies and it's not the first time that this same SS has done it. Remember the British cop photo thread? The same SS/mod happens to be an LEO/retired LEO/or extreme supporter of LEO (I don't care which) and all this happened in a thread about an LEO shooting a citizen in their own home that had broken no laws. But because a mod was critical of the officer, TBS lied about the mod and either demoted him to member or things were said in the super secret mod forum and the former mod finally said "fuck it, I'm out". From what has been posted, I believed the mod resigned instead of toeing the party line. This site has normally been a pro 2A, semi pro LEO place. Some of the SS/mods are turning on the pro 2A members (the law is the law) and causing an anti LEO attitude to plant it's seeds. The management needs to decide, quickly, whether this site is going to be a pro 2A site or a pro LEO site. Yes, they are competing ideologies and can sometimes coexist but at the lowest level are against each other. |
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Posted: 10/20/2019 3:58:24 PM EST
[#49]
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We all know who’s going to win that one. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: No, the issue is that a SS made some bold faced lies and it's not the first time that this same SS has done it. Remember the British cop photo thread? The same SS/mod happens to be an LEO/retired LEO/or extreme supporter of LEO (I don't care which) and all this happened in a thread about an LEO shooting a citizen in their own home that had broken no laws. But because a mod was critical of the officer, TBS lied about the mod and either demoted him to member or things were said in the super secret mod forum and the former mod finally said "fuck it, I'm out". From what has been posted, I believed the mod resigned instead of toeing the party line. This site has normally been a pro 2A, semi pro LEO place. Some of the SS/mods are turning on the pro 2A members (the law is the law) and causing an anti LEO attitude to plant it's seeds. The management needs to decide, quickly, whether this site is going to be a pro 2A site or a pro LEO site. Yes, they are competing ideologies and can sometimes coexist but at the lowest level are against each other. 
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Posted: 10/20/2019 4:00:57 PM EST
[#50]
Don't worry, "If you don't like it you can leave." is exactly what the users are hearing. I think that's exactly the message that the new ownership intends to send, though.
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