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Posted: 11/14/2023 12:57:59 PM EDT
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted: "It's one thing to burn down the outhouse. It's another thing entirely to install indoor plumbing." It's always been easier and more fun to destroy than create. "Fixing the initial problems," in this context, is also going to call for CoC violations. I'll speak plainly. A Presidential election was stolen from the incumbent and a dementia patient installed instead. Those who did that have not only not been punished, they've been rewarded. Nothing meaningful has been done to ensure this won't be repeated, and indeed, the incumbent is facing several show trials for behavior less criminal than that of his predecessors, and far less criminal than the corrupt behavior of the current Oval Office inhabitant. You tell me how you can fix those initial problems under the current framework. If you can't, then maybe that's why people are wishing that the current framework be torn down. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: To me it means people are delusional and idiots. They think if they burn something all the way down, ie destroy most of it, that something better will magically replace it with even less effort that it would have taken to fix the initial problems they were complaining about. "It's one thing to burn down the outhouse. It's another thing entirely to install indoor plumbing." It's always been easier and more fun to destroy than create. "Fixing the initial problems," in this context, is also going to call for CoC violations. I'll speak plainly. A Presidential election was stolen from the incumbent and a dementia patient installed instead. Those who did that have not only not been punished, they've been rewarded. Nothing meaningful has been done to ensure this won't be repeated, and indeed, the incumbent is facing several show trials for behavior less criminal than that of his predecessors, and far less criminal than the corrupt behavior of the current Oval Office inhabitant. You tell me how you can fix those initial problems under the current framework. If you can't, then maybe that's why people are wishing that the current framework be torn down. To begin the election still had something like 68% voter turn out. What is easier, getting more people to vote or decades of revolution and civil war? Another complain about the last Presidential election was "we had a bad candidate". Ok, what is harder the citizens getting slightly more political and helping better candidates run or decades of revolution and civil war? People are too lazy to even vote...do you really think they will put in any more effort to rebuild from scratch? |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 12:58:46 PM EDT
[#2]
It means - Wakanda
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Posted: 11/14/2023 12:59:35 PM EDT
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Re: consent of the governed. Do you believe you're speaking for the majority of those around you? What if the people who burn it all down are of the opposite side of what you envision? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: http://www.legislature.mi.gov/documents/historical/Declaration_of_Independence.htm#:~:text=%2D%2DThat%20to%20secure%20these,Government%2C%20laying%20its%20foundation%20on It's right here before our own very eyes. The men who literally created our government understood what to do and that it would most likely have to be done again from time to time. That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security. Re: consent of the governed. Do you believe you're speaking for the majority of those around you? What if the people who burn it all down are of the opposite side of what you envision? I believe that the vast majority of Americans feel uneasy to various extents. I think that colonial America felt the same way the time the Declaration of Independence was written. Only 3 percent of patriots actually fought. Most were uneasy about the fight for freedom. I suspect if things got hot in our time, it would be the same spectrum of beliefs. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:01:23 PM EDT
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It doesn't really matter. Even if we were to start over from scratch, the culture that gave us the current political situation hasn't changed. The only real way to change a culture quickly enough to matter is genocide. This. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:03:55 PM EDT
[#5]
Most of us are not sure if we could “ burn it all down” as in gut the FBI…..We realize employees have vast protections ( until they don’t). We also realize courts in many areas will oppose burning it all down and find every reason to slow or stop down-sizing of any consequence.
Not so sure about DHS. How is it not just another FBI.? What particular viable mandate do they have that is not or could not be part of the FBI? Since it rode in on the coattails of the Patriot Act and ERISA courts I cannot support it as a worthwhile institution. ETA some folks like Obama will admit that burning it all down is what is being used against us…..reset |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:05:13 PM EDT
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted: There is a good reason for that. I think the Code of Conduct here prohibits people from spelling it out when they say that. At least that is my take when I see people say it. Like “define what it means so it can be a future reason for a ban later” thing? That would be most unfortunate. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:05:37 PM EDT
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How the heck do you think you can accomplish this surgical excision without killing the patient? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: No, the destruction of certain parts of it. (Which, as Lug and I have been trying to point out, is still a CoC violation.) The overarching federal government and accompanying bureaucratic state. Dissipation of what was formerly Federal government power to the States. Abandonment of the idea of an American Empire---even if that means the Chinese fill the vacuum---or alternatively, actually getting more tangible rewards in CONUS for establishing and maintaining the Pax Americana. But pick one. Different people will have establishment of different cultural norms, and disfavoring others, as a goal of whatever new government arises. Where it gets hilarious is where many of the people asking for this, still want the same government services and subsidies that they had before. Human nature, I guess. How the heck do you think you can accomplish this surgical excision without killing the patient? Is the Federal Government the United States? Or is the United States something else, that for various centralization efficiencies and, ironically, to stave off Communism in the 30s, has most of its governing power, and economic center of gravity post 9/11, within D.C.? Last one. Hypothetical. D.C. SOTU Address. Someone, using a few pre-placed "large" ex-Soviet warheads, turns D.C. (and Langley and Meade) into a greasy column of smoke heading to the Atlantic Ocean. What happens next? That would be an incredibly violent excision of most of the Federal Government's Officials.(Left as a further discussion exercise is the question, "But would it have removed its Leaders?") There is, "Continuity of Government," but I think by necessity you'd see a lot of formerly Federal power be forced to have to come from the States as a result. Would that kill the patient in your metaphor? I certainly think that whatever results after that as a Government for this landmass, it won't look like the USA ever again. From the point of view of the "burn it down" people though, the USA is on a path where very soon, it's also not going to look like the USA, and there is no way to bring that USA back, so what are you really losing? As I wrote in an earlier post, it's Bezhemov's demoralization. Honestly, if we're going to compare apocalyptic scenarios, I think the most likely one is a simple decline into a...neofeudalism is the term often used, but I see very little desire for noblesse oblige, or any other feudal obligation to their subjects, in this set of elites. Call it serfdom, instead. A rental serfdom embodying the worst features of Brazil the country and the movie. Massive sea of consuming peasants, tiny elite, massive corruption and a reliance on interpersonal relationships (or nepotistic corruption, depending on your POV), to traverse the giant incompetent, repressive bureaucracy. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:07:12 PM EDT
[#8]
Nothing good is what it means to me. I’d rather we not find out. If you’ve been in a collapsed country you know how ugly and devastating it is.
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:08:18 PM EDT
[#9]
 FULL INTERVIEW with Yuri Bezmenov: The Four Stages of Ideological Subversion (1984) |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:08:36 PM EDT
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The Phoenix rising out of the ashes of the past troubles and tribulations maybe? I've never used that term, but I guess it could very well mean different things to different kinds of individuals from many different and diversified kinds of places. Like, the difference between small town Texas and Chicago Illinois perhaps. Even in Illinois, yeah, you have the city. I'm about 45 minutes west outside of Chicago and it's different. It's the suburbs, but city folk call it country. You go 20 minutes west of me and you're in the real country. Go south a couple hours you're almost in a different state. Folks even have a southern accent. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:11:01 PM EDT
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Is the Federal Government the United States? Or is the United States something else, that for various centralization efficiencies and, ironically, to stave off Communism in the 30s, has most of its governing power, and economic center of gravity post 9/11, within D.C.? Last one. Hypothetical. D.C. SOTU Address. Someone, using a few pre-placed "large" ex-Soviet warheads, turns D.C. (and Langley and Meade) into a greasy column of smoke heading to the Atlantic Ocean. What happens next? That would be an incredibly violent excision of most of the Federal Government's Officials.(Left as a further discussion exercise is the question, "But would it have removed its Leaders?") There is, "Continuity of Government," but I think by necessity you'd see a lot of formerly Federal power be forced to have to come from the States as a result. Would that kill the patient in your metaphor? I certainly think that whatever results after that as a Government for this landmass, it won't look like the USA ever again. From the point of view of the "burn it down" people though, the USA is on a path where very soon, it's also not going to look like the USA, and there is no way to bring that USA back, so what are you really losing? As I wrote in an earlier post, it's Bezhemov's demoralization. Honestly, if we're going to compare apocalyptic scenarios, I think the most likely one is a simple decline into a...neofeudalism is the term often used, but I see very little desire for noblesse oblige, or any other feudal obligation to their subjects, in this set of elites. Call it serfdom, instead. A rental serfdom embodying the worst features of Brazil the country and the movie. Massive sea of consuming peasants, tiny elite, massive corruption and a reliance on interpersonal relationships (or nepotistic corruption, depending on your POV), to traverse the giant incompetent, repressive bureaucracy. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: No, the destruction of certain parts of it. (Which, as Lug and I have been trying to point out, is still a CoC violation.) The overarching federal government and accompanying bureaucratic state. Dissipation of what was formerly Federal government power to the States. Abandonment of the idea of an American Empire---even if that means the Chinese fill the vacuum---or alternatively, actually getting more tangible rewards in CONUS for establishing and maintaining the Pax Americana. But pick one. Different people will have establishment of different cultural norms, and disfavoring others, as a goal of whatever new government arises. Where it gets hilarious is where many of the people asking for this, still want the same government services and subsidies that they had before. Human nature, I guess. How the heck do you think you can accomplish this surgical excision without killing the patient? Is the Federal Government the United States? Or is the United States something else, that for various centralization efficiencies and, ironically, to stave off Communism in the 30s, has most of its governing power, and economic center of gravity post 9/11, within D.C.? Last one. Hypothetical. D.C. SOTU Address. Someone, using a few pre-placed "large" ex-Soviet warheads, turns D.C. (and Langley and Meade) into a greasy column of smoke heading to the Atlantic Ocean. What happens next? That would be an incredibly violent excision of most of the Federal Government's Officials.(Left as a further discussion exercise is the question, "But would it have removed its Leaders?") There is, "Continuity of Government," but I think by necessity you'd see a lot of formerly Federal power be forced to have to come from the States as a result. Would that kill the patient in your metaphor? I certainly think that whatever results after that as a Government for this landmass, it won't look like the USA ever again. From the point of view of the "burn it down" people though, the USA is on a path where very soon, it's also not going to look like the USA, and there is no way to bring that USA back, so what are you really losing? As I wrote in an earlier post, it's Bezhemov's demoralization. Honestly, if we're going to compare apocalyptic scenarios, I think the most likely one is a simple decline into a...neofeudalism is the term often used, but I see very little desire for noblesse oblige, or any other feudal obligation to their subjects, in this set of elites. Call it serfdom, instead. A rental serfdom embodying the worst features of Brazil the country and the movie. Massive sea of consuming peasants, tiny elite, massive corruption and a reliance on interpersonal relationships (or nepotistic corruption, depending on your POV), to traverse the giant incompetent, repressive bureaucracy. I have noted while asking for detail the OP has been unwilling to answer difficult questions himself. Convenient. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:11:05 PM EDT
[#12]
I thought it was just a euphemism for changing things. You can't actually burn it all down. Just like Drain the Swamp.
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:14:55 PM EDT
[#13]
Dismantling the educational and justice systems. Rebuild them for their intended purpose and not to serve “agendas”. A large part of our problems stem from the young never being taught what it truly means to be an American and the justice system rewards their resulting behavior. I do not want it “all burned down”. I still believe in “America “ as it was envisioned. We have strayed FAR from those ideals though.
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:17:14 PM EDT
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Is the Federal Government the United States? Or is the United States something else, that for various centralization efficiencies and, ironically, to stave off Communism in the 30s, has most of its governing power, and economic center of gravity post 9/11, within D.C.? Last one. Hypothetical. D.C. SOTU Address. Someone, using a few pre-placed "large" ex-Soviet warheads, turns D.C. (and Langley and Meade) into a greasy column of smoke heading to the Atlantic Ocean. What happens next? That would be an incredibly violent excision of most of the Federal Government's Officials.(Left as a further discussion exercise is the question, "But would it have removed its Leaders?") There is, "Continuity of Government," but I think by necessity you'd see a lot of formerly Federal power be forced to have to come from the States as a result. Would that kill the patient in your metaphor? I certainly think that whatever results after that as a Government for this landmass, it won't look like the USA ever again. From the point of view of the "burn it down" people though, the USA is on a path where very soon, it's also not going to look like the USA, and there is no way to bring that USA back, so what are you really losing? As I wrote in an earlier post, it's Bezhemov's demoralization. Honestly, if we're going to compare apocalyptic scenarios, I think the most likely one is a simple decline into a...neofeudalism is the term often used, but I see very little desire for noblesse oblige, or any other feudal obligation to their subjects, in this set of elites. Call it serfdom, instead. A rental serfdom embodying the worst features of Brazil the country and the movie. Massive sea of consuming peasants, tiny elite, massive corruption and a reliance on interpersonal relationships (or nepotistic corruption, depending on your POV), to traverse the giant incompetent, repressive bureaucracy. Death and destruction of a wide swath of the American public as a result of a failed state and violent civil war. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:18:01 PM EDT
[#15]
It means that person wants to see a complete collapse of law and society, "country in flames and blood in the streets" as you say, because they believe it will purge all the weak pussy-hat commies and out of that chaos, by some miracle and the grace of god, a new system will arise that fully embraces and embodies the ideals that the founding fathers wrote about. Because they think the whole country is made up of 2 strict groups. Purple hired, pussy-hat wearing, soy-latte sipping commies. And chiseled-chad, self sufficient, heavily-armed constitutionalists. So ofcourse the good guys win.
Somehow I'm highly doubtful that's how it would play out. Historically speaking, revolutions, especially ones rising out of complete collapse and chaos, typically end up with a government that's considerably worse than the one it replaced. But I guess if shit's fucked up beyond repair, all you can do is take your chances and hope things work out for the best. Is shit fucked up truly beyond repair right now? If it ain't it's certainly heading that way. Is your angus peppered? |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:19:26 PM EDT
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Even in Illinois, yeah, you have the city. I'm about 45 minutes west outside of Chicago and it's different. It's the suburbs, but city folk call it country. You go 20 minutes west of me and you're in the real country. Go south a couple hours you're almost in a different state. Folks even have a southern accent. Bolingbrook..? |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:21:40 PM EDT
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted: The version I'm fond of, "it's much easier to blow up trains than to get them to run on time." A regular refrain in reference to governments made up of former rebel groups. Burn it all down, what does that mean to me? Generally I think of it as the mass execution of political opponents. I also try not to call for it because 1. Mass murder is usually illegal. 2. There is no guarantee that it is going to go in a way that you will want. 3. As pussy as this sounds. My health is awful. I simply don't have the physical strengh to go out and kill large numbers of people. Even if they are unarmed. This large scale death is a thing simply because even if staunch, upstanding Republicans were to somehow seize control of the entire political establishment. Not bloody likely, but even if they did their enemies would still be in control of the mainstream media and many other things and would constantly be working to continue the current plans for the enslavement and large scale paring down of the human race. All that said, it is becoming more clear every day that various entities in this country and around the world want to enforce their whims with murderous force. There's a saying I've heard attributed to Trotsky. "You may not be interested in war, but war is interested in you." I hope that this comes across as a reasonable analysis of a very unreasonable subject. I think you put your finger on it, Kirby. I don't know why I called you Kirby. Guess I was quoting Eddie Sahakian talking to Kirby Allison about cigars. "Burning it all down" is the easy part, but HOW are you going to rebuild? Well, that's the problem with the world: people have different ideas concerning what they want out of life, and how they think it should work. It's easy to say "we will rebuild" but who is going to design the blueprints and who is going to manage the reconstruction? Rhetorical questions, of course. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:22:20 PM EDT
[#18]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Like “define what it means so it can be a future reason for a ban later” thing? That would be most unfortunate. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: There is a good reason for that. I think the Code of Conduct here prohibits people from spelling it out when they say that. At least that is my take when I see people say it. Like “define what it means so it can be a future reason for a ban later” thing? That would be most unfortunate. AWS probably has some new rules, or someone got a letter from the Lugenpresse about the site looking bad with this language. We’re also closing in on an election, so maybe the proud homo-sexuals of the FBI reached out? |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:24:06 PM EDT
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted: To begin the election still had something like 68% voter turn out. What is easier, getting more people to vote or decades of revolution and civil war? Another complain about the last Presidential election was "we had a bad candidate". Ok, what is harder the citizens getting slightly more political and helping better candidates run or decades of revolution and civil war? People are too lazy to even vote...do you really think they will put in any more effort to rebuild from scratch? I have been unable to find the number of total registered voters and would love to see the data. The numbers I’ve found is that 94% of registered voters cast ballots in the presidential election of 2020. Frankly I find that hard to believe their are MORE than 168,000,000 registered voters in this country and that only 6% abstained from voting that year. Not intending to thread slide, I’m just truly interested in seeing the data. That level of civic involvement just doesn’t compute with reason.https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-registered-voters-133/fact-check-133-million-registered-voters-argument-for-2020-election-recirculates-idUSL1N3762CG |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:32:49 PM EDT
[#20]
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:34:17 PM EDT
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Imagine you have a wood shed. The wood is rotted through and through and no paint job is going to restore structural integrity back to the structure. The only real solution is to tear it down and start over. Slapping good wood onto rotted wood or foundation does not fix the structure. Except what replaces it will not be a government that cares for or recognizes the BoR. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:39:33 PM EDT
[#22]
From the ashes rises the Phoenix. It’s to far gone to vote harder so the quicker it burns down the sooner it can be rebuilt.
Of course that all depends on who comes out the winner. Liberty Or WEF Two very different futures with so many moving parts in flux. One things for sure, within the next decade our world will be very different than anyone alive today has ever seen. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:41:35 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Except what replaces it will not be a government that cares for or recognizes the BoR. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Imagine you have a wood shed. The wood is rotted through and through and no paint job is going to restore structural integrity back to the structure. The only real solution is to tear it down and start over. Slapping good wood onto rotted wood or foundation does not fix the structure. Except what replaces it will not be a government that cares for or recognizes the BoR. How is that functionally different than what we have today? When was the last time the 10th Amendment was relevant? |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:43:28 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How is that functionally different than what we have today? When was the last time the 10th Amendment was relevant? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Imagine you have a wood shed. The wood is rotted through and through and no paint job is going to restore structural integrity back to the structure. The only real solution is to tear it down and start over. Slapping good wood onto rotted wood or foundation does not fix the structure. Except what replaces it will not be a government that cares for or recognizes the BoR. How is that functionally different than what we have today? When was the last time the 10th Amendment was relevant? A bunch of us would be thrown in prison or taken out back and shot for saying the stuff we say on here with whatever new government that comes. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:43:40 PM EDT
[#25]
Depending on the context, it means it needs to be totally destroyed, razed to the ground, to rebuild.
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:44:14 PM EDT
[#26]
If it's all gonna suck it might as well be exciting too.
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:44:55 PM EDT
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You have stated why you're angry, and I agree with you on those things. You didn't define how a tea party of sorts would change that. Angry? I am stating the obvious. The fix is somewhere between the Boston tea party & the American revolution. History shows what's coming if things are not improved. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:48:48 PM EDT
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Our protectors have become our masters. The Liberty Tree needs watering. I can’t speak to before I was born, but in my 51 years, Republicans have NEVER been our protectors. Sure, they are there to wipe their brow after a harrowing vote where the left got what they wanted again and are quick to remind you how bad it could have been if they hadn’t been there to oppose them, but even when they had Majorities in my life they did fuck all for Domestic Policy. They answer to the same donor class… left wing, right wing, Same Chicken. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:52:32 PM EDT
[#29]
The Purge, until all the purging is done.
Start anew with a new Constitution, and fresh memories of what happened to those who pushed things too far. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 1:55:53 PM EDT
[#30]
Still working on this flex, OP?
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Posted: 11/14/2023 2:02:56 PM EDT
[#31]
The 'elites' are probably confident they can continue to choreograph the decent into a dystopian tyranny and turn the majority of people into drones within a hive built to serve every decadence and indulgence of the 'elites'.
There is a really small chance that control slips from their hands and they too are consumed in the chaos. That's what burning it all down means to me. I would rather see a return to rational thought, the civil society, and rule of law. I am not giving up hope on that yet. Got to hold on to something a little positive for now. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 2:03:58 PM EDT
[#32]
Sure. I’ll bite (though I’ve never used that terminology).
Those who still give a shit about the Constitution, founding principles, and Western Civilization in general need to create parallel institutions. This means organizing locally, and having those local organizations at least loosely connected to state-level organizations. Yeah, we'll need to revive the idea of the local militia. Organized training must occur in order to protect these parallel institutions. Mass civil non-compliance and non-participation must then occur. Stop paying taxes. Stop observing unconstitutional mandates. Stop participating in and empowering the corrupted institutions. Withdraw the consent of the governed. It’s not so much burning it down as it is building scaffolding around it and dismantling it while putting up new walls and structural elements. Any attempts at violent coercion by the corrupted government and cultural institutions must be met with force. That’s where things get sticky I guess. Either way, the takeaway is: we must have parallel institutions and structures in place before we can dismantle the corrupted ones. Without that, any iteration is “burning it down” is doomed to failure. And yes, the Republican Party is still a viable vehicle with which to accomplish at least some of those goals, but only if those who are unsatisfied with the GOP’s performance become involved themselves and take personal responsibility for the health of their communities. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 2:11:29 PM EDT
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: It doesn't really matter. Even if we were to start over from scratch, the culture that gave us the current political situation hasn't changed. The only real way to change a culture quickly enough to matter is genocide. The only way things get fixed is if lots and lots of people are gone. Anyone looking forward to going down that road? I'm not. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 2:14:35 PM EDT
[#34]
Quoted: I thought about adding a poll but that's just lazy and doesn't provide nuance. There have been a bunch of threads complaining about weak Republican leadership and I keep hearing "burn it all down" as a solution for the problems that people see. Maybe I'm misinterpreting what people mean by that, so I'd like to get people to explain what they mean by that term in the most specific way possible. It could mean anything from "write an angry letter to your congressman" to "I want to see the entire country in flames and blood running in the streets". My interpretation when I see someone post that has always skewed toward that latter since "burn it all down" is sort of an apocalyptic vision. Maybe I'm wrong though. If you offer your definition, I would also like you to think about the end goal you have in mind that the burning down is done. What does the country look like, why does it look like it does after it's all said and done, and what is better about it - that sort of thing. Not today Mr. Three Letter Man... not today... 
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Posted: 11/14/2023 2:16:37 PM EDT
[#35]
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Posted: 11/14/2023 2:21:13 PM EDT
[#36]
Government broke . No welfare checks or federal retirement checks. No money to pay the military. Soviet style
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Posted: 11/14/2023 2:23:41 PM EDT
[#37]
Quote HistoryQuoted: A bunch of us would be thrown in prison or taken out back and shot for saying the stuff we say on here with whatever new government that comes. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Imagine you have a wood shed. The wood is rotted through and through and no paint job is going to restore structural integrity back to the structure. The only real solution is to tear it down and start over. Slapping good wood onto rotted wood or foundation does not fix the structure. Except what replaces it will not be a government that cares for or recognizes the BoR. How is that functionally different than what we have today? When was the last time the 10th Amendment was relevant? A bunch of us would be thrown in prison or taken out back and shot for saying the stuff we say on here with whatever new government that comes. You don’t think that’s coming? Why do states take people out back and shoot them? Usually it’s for presenting a perceived challenge to state authority (or to seize their wealth). It’s why Jan 6 protestors were treated differently than BLM protesters even though BLM was much more destructive and deadly. As the wheels start to come off - and they will because things are unraveling faster than they can be put back together- the government will come after any challenger or potential challenger. That means any parallel organization - local governments not aligned with the Federal one, charities, church organizations not bending the knee, corporations doing the same, etc. They will use the full power of the state to destroy any competition even as the state is coming apart. This is what anarcho-tyranny is. Eta the government doesn’t need to take wealth directly anymore, it doesn’t by stealth by printing money. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 2:41:06 PM EDT
[#38]
I've grown to realize that what it really means is that the person who's saying it has just about come to the realization that 90% of people don't give a single solitary fuck about 95% of things and because of that the only way meaningful change could occur is if they were forced to care by destroying what exists.
The rotten house analogy is apt when you also consider the tenants malaise and apathy; or worse, their willingness to ignore reality and believe that the house is not only just fine, but ideal. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 2:43:11 PM EDT
[#39]
I should add (to my above post, but in a different post as I don't want to take away from that one) that there's a good possibility it'll be "burned down" without the intervention of anyone on the right. I don't *think* that's how it'll go down if the current course remains unaltered, but I put the chances at non-0, and definitely in the double digits.
In the event that that happens, if we don't have parallel institutions ready to rock, it'll all devolve into chaos and the likely result will be more tyranny in the end. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 2:48:32 PM EDT
[#40]
Stop following rules and laws.
Reject the governments authority. Stop patronizing institutions that support the current framework of government. Basically, adopt full-blown anarchy and let the chips fall where they may. Not saying this is what I think people should do, but in my mind, this is what 'letting it all burn down' looks like. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 2:50:11 PM EDT
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted: This thread needs a smoking poll. What if you don't smoke? |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 2:50:42 PM EDT
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Burning it down will take to long. Where's the asteroid? Apophis is waiting |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 2:52:20 PM EDT
[#43]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I almost never use the expression "burn it all down" expression, so... In most cases, I don't think it literally involves fire. I think it usually means letting things collapse on their own. No bailouts. "Burn it down" sounds like an active measure, but it's more often passive. Take Bud Light for example. It's being "burned down" by people doing nothing. That's pretty close to my thoughts, but expressed better than I would have. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 3:01:09 PM EDT
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Imagine you have a wood shed. The wood is rotted through and through and no paint job is going to restore structural integrity back to the structure. The only real solution is to tear it down and start over. Slapping good wood onto rotted wood or foundation does not fix the structure. An apt description. Do you publish a newsletter? |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 3:09:51 PM EDT
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Stop patronizing institutions that support the current framework of government. But what about my sportsball and Disney+ subscription? |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 3:14:44 PM EDT
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted: But what about my sportsball and Disney+ subscription? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Stop patronizing institutions that support the current framework of government. But what about my sportsball and Disney+ subscription? Nope, your only option is to go full Koresh and live in a cabin in the woods. Perhaps you might get to listen to classical music from time to time. No pop music or pop culture. It’s corrosive to the soul and just not something that a stereotypical current era Giga Chad does. Also, no family, no women or children. They make you soft and what is coming will demand nothing less than constant violence, viciousness and cruelty. |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 3:26:00 PM EDT
[#47]
"Burn it down" is something a lot of frustrated people say without thinking of the ramifications. They "feel"(!) that they don't have much to lose if things go sideways. Most are wrong.
"Winners laugh, and losers say deal the cards " |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 3:27:48 PM EDT
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted: "Burn it down" is something a lot of frustrated people say without thinking of the ramifications. They "feel"(!) that they don't have much to lose if things go sideways. Most are wrong. "Winners laugh, and losers say deal the cards " Let me ask you something. Is our way of life sustainable on the current road? |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 3:38:50 PM EDT
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Let me ask you something. Is our way of life sustainable on the current road? |
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Posted: 11/14/2023 3:40:05 PM EDT
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Let me ask you something. Is our way of life sustainable on the current road? Sustainable is an interesting concept that means different things to different people. Is the North Korean nation sustainable? Probably not in any mathematical sense, but it just keeps blundering along. |
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