Posted: 9/23/2014 10:36:55 AM EDT
| Friend of mine shooting his PX4 Storm compact loaded it with 9mm luger 115gr Remington. Gun would not fire. Didn't seem to be striking the primer. Loads it with Winchester 9mm luger 115gr and works fine. Side by side there is a 1/4 maybe 1/8 inch length difference overall between the two rounds. Any ideas why they would be so different? Did he just get a bad batch? |
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Friend of mine shooting his PX4 Storm compact loaded it with 9mm luger 115gr Remington. Gun would not fire. Didn't seem to be striking the primer. Loads it with Winchester 9mm luger 115gr and works fine. Side by side there is a 1/4 maybe 1/8 inch length difference overall between the two rounds. Any ideas why they would be so different? Did he just get a bad batch? 1/4" is a LOT of difference ... |
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OAL is commonly different by a small amount between different brands because they use differently shaped bullets.
It's the case length that is important in 9mm. The chamber headspaces off the case mouth, so the case length should be fairly close to the same between the two. Aside from that, I would look at primer seating depth. |
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Yeah I know but Im not so good at posting pics here. You have to host them, right? I do have pics of the boxes and a side by side of the ammo. Quoted:
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pictures would be very useful. Of both the headstamp and the cases side by side. Yeah I know but Im not so good at posting pics here. You have to host them, right? I do have pics of the boxes and a side by side of the ammo. go to tinypic.com use the "for message boards" code copy and paste the boxes of ammo..that's ok. We would also need pictures of the cases side by side and the headstamp on the rounds. The box only tells us who made it, not the problem with these particular rounds. |
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Look at the height of the brass, not just the OAL. Headspace, my man. Headspace. Quoted:
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I would say slightly less than this. Look at the height of the brass, not just the OAL. Headspace, my man. Headspace. height of the brass looks to be the same. |
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height of the brass looks to be the same. Quoted:
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I would say slightly less than this. Look at the height of the brass, not just the OAL. Headspace, my man. Headspace. height of the brass looks to be the same. what did the primer look like on the rounds that didn't fire? did it have a full dent or was it different than the rounds that worked? |
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what did the primer look like on the rounds that didn't fire? did it have a full dent or was it different than the rounds that worked? Quoted:
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I would say slightly less than this. Look at the height of the brass, not just the OAL. Headspace, my man. Headspace. height of the brass looks to be the same. what did the primer look like on the rounds that didn't fire? did it have a full dent or was it different than the rounds that worked? I was not with him while this happened. Just trying to help him figure it out cause it didn't make sense to me. |
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go to tinypic.com use the "for message boards" code copy and paste the boxes of ammo..that's ok. We would also need pictures of the cases side by side and the headstamp on the rounds. The box only tells us who made it, not the problem with these particular rounds. Quoted:
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pictures would be very useful. Of both the headstamp and the cases side by side. Yeah I know but Im not so good at posting pics here. You have to host them, right? I do have pics of the boxes and a side by side of the ammo. go to tinypic.com use the "for message boards" code copy and paste the boxes of ammo..that's ok. We would also need pictures of the cases side by side and the headstamp on the rounds. The box only tells us who made it, not the problem with these particular rounds. Thanks for the linkl. That was easy |
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OAL is commonly different by a small amount between different brands because they use differently shaped bullets. It's the case length that is important in 9mm. The chamber headspaces off the case mouth, so the case length should be fairly close to the same between the two. Aside from that, I would look at primer seating depth. My first guess was that the shorter case is not close enough to the striker due to the headspacing. If you look at how shallow most primer strikes are, a small difference in case length can make a huge difference. OP, were there dents in the primers of the shorter rounds, or no mark at all? |
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I was not with him while this happened. Just trying to help him figure it out cause it didn't make sense to me. Quoted:
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I would say slightly less than this. Look at the height of the brass, not just the OAL. Headspace, my man. Headspace. height of the brass looks to be the same. what did the primer look like on the rounds that didn't fire? did it have a full dent or was it different than the rounds that worked? I was not with him while this happened. Just trying to help him figure it out cause it didn't make sense to me. That's a pretty big piece of the puzzle. I don't recall ever having a misfire and not checking the primer. Odd that he didn't check or didn't mention it. How noob is he? |
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If the primer was stuck solidly, then the primers are dead. And obviously if the primer wasn't struck, then it isn't going to go off. Does he have another gun chambered in 9mm that he can try the ammo in ? Does not have another gun in 9mm. This is his first handgun. |
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The Remington bullet looks to seated way too deep. |
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Does not have another gun in 9mm. This is his first handgun. Quoted:
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If the primer was stuck solidly, then the primers are dead. And obviously if the primer wasn't struck, then it isn't going to go off. Does he have another gun chambered in 9mm that he can try the ammo in ? Does not have another gun in 9mm. This is his first handgun. Hard and soft primers would do this with a soft firing pin strike. Need images of the primers |
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Within the last week, I've had:
8 failures to fire out of 150 rounds with Remington 158 SWC. (Solid primer strikes out of two different guns) 6 Winchester 5.56 rounds that detonated the primer but failed to fire. (The flash holes are not punched all the way through.  )
Apparently, quality control is down everywhere. |
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FYI, 9mm Luger headspaces on the case mouth, so case length is important.
I'm betting, however, that the ammo had primers that were too hard. A more telling observation would be to take the suspect Remington UMC ammo and try it in a different gun. That would help sort out whether it's an ammo issue or a gun issue. |
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Cases look the same... That they do. My guess is that the gun has an over size chamber and the rounds are head spacing on the bullet and the throat of the barrel instead of the mouth of the case. And that's why the Winchester rounds with the longer bullets that are seating out far enough for the striker to hit the primer will fire but short Remington rounds don't. He needs to do a chamber cast to check chamber and throat dimensions. Short version: the problem is with the gun, not the ammo. |
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Goes bang every time in my Glock...and my 228. What is the problem? Quoted:
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Remington 9mm ammo is utter crap ammo in my experience. I shoot thousands of rounds of 9mm per year; ill take aluminum cased ammo over Rem brass 9mm UMC, green box, etc. Goes bang every time in my Glock...and my 228. What is the problem? Same experience except my two 9's are a PM9 and a PX4. Never had a problem with Rem. UMC in my 380 either. |
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Goes bang every time in my Glock...and my 228. What is the problem? Quoted:
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Remington 9mm ammo is utter crap ammo in my experience. I shoot thousands of rounds of 9mm per year; ill take aluminum cased ammo over Rem brass 9mm UMC, green box, etc. Goes bang every time in my Glock...and my 228. What is the problem? Primarily used in G34, G17L, G19 and my MAX-11/31mk2 SUB GUN. Dead primers. Low charge weight. Slow velocity. Flash holes not "drilled" so primer doesn't ignite powder. Bullet depth seating variation. Crap accuracy. Just to name a few issues I've had. |