[ARCHIVED THREAD] - ATF checking on me (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 2/3/2005 5:01:15 PM EDT
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Recently I bought two commemorative Glock 17s from two different sellers at around the same time. One was an American Heroes G17. The other was a Glock Safety Shooting Foundation (GSSF) G17. Each has serial numbers unique to the commemorative series. The American Heroes serial number starts with USA and goes to 1000 (the number made). The GSSF serial number starts with GSSF and goes to I think 1000 ( the number made). Anyway, I bought both from out of state and had them sent to a local ffl that I use periodically. The ATF first calls him to find out about me because I purchased two firearms within 5 days. The ATF calls him a second time to tell him that the paperwork is incorrect because the serial numbers are not what they are used to seeing for Glocks. He explained to them that I am "okay" and that I go in there periodically for transfers. He also educates them about the Glock commemorative serial numbers. Did you guys know that they do these checks when you buy two guns within 5 days? Also, wouldn't you think that since firearms are their business, they might know a little something about Glock serial numbers? I just didn't appreciate them being nosey - I am about as upstanding a citizen as you can find. Comments? |
| I bought 2 glocks at the same time about 3 months ago, never heard anything from it. A year before I bought a 96F and Stampede on the same day from the same dealer, nothing came of it. 4 months ago I walked out from another dealer with 2 brand new in box 6920's. Nadda. That I know of anyhow. |
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Lawyer up. If you did not buy the firearms within 24 hours of each other, how did the .gov know that you purchased more than 1? Any federal records of gun purchases are to be destroyed within 24 hours. If the fed knows you bought 2 within 5 days, that means an illegal database. |
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Yes it does happen when you buy alot of guns in a single month. Either when he called them in for the Nics checks or sent the 4473's in a group it red flagged your record. They followed up with a conversation with the FFL and that will probably be the end of it. Next time wait a week. And I do believe the ATF does keep the 4473's for 90 days not 24 hours. The 24hr deal was something bush purposed but i don't remember if it made it. |
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The BATF probably got the report detailed below from your dealer and when entering the information someone said "Hmmmmm those serial numbers are far different from what I'm used to seeing for Glocks, I think we should take a look into this." The BATF not being familar with a serial number oddity that only occured in 2000 guns out of how many Glocks have been imported (over 200,000 pistols in 1999), is completely understandable. § 178.126a Reporting multiple sales or other disposition of pistols and revolvers. Each licensee shall prepare a report of multiple sales or other disposition whenever the licensee sells or otherwise disposes of, at one time or during any five consecutive business days, two or more pistols, or revolvers, or any combination of pistols and revolvers totaling two or more, to an unlicensed person : Provided, That a report need not be made where pistols or revolvers, or any combination thereof, are returned to the same person from whom they were received. The report shall be prepared on Form 3310.4, Report of Multiple Sale or Other Disposition of Pistols and Revolvers . Not later than the close of business on the day that the multiple sale or other disposition occurs, the licensee shall forward two copies of Form 3310.4 to the ATF office specified thereon and one copy to the State police or to the local law enforcement agency in which the sale or other disposition took place. Where the State or local law enforcement officials have notified the licensee that a particular official has been designated to receive Forms 3310.4, the licensee shall forward such forms to that designated official. The licensee shall retain one copy of Form 3310.4 and attach it to th e firearms transaction record, Form 4473, executed upon delivery of the pistols or revolvers. Example 1. A licensee sells a pistol and revolver in a single transaction to an unlicensed person. This is a multiple sale and must be reported not later than the close of business on the date of the transaction. Example 2. A licensee sells a pistol on Monday and sells a revolver on the following Friday to the same unlicensed person. This is a multiple sale and must be reported not later than the close of business on Friday. If the licensee sells the same unlicensed person another pistol or revolver on the following Monday, this would constitute an additional multiple sale and must also be reported. Example 3. A licensee maintaining business hours on Monday through Saturday sells a revolver to an unlicensed person on Monday and sells another revolver to the same person on the following Saturday. This does not constitute a multiple sale and need not be reported since the sales did not occur during five consecutive business days. |
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It's called "report of multiple sale or other disposition of pistols and revolvers" If more than one handgun is purchased within a five day period from the same FFL a special form is filled out listing all your info and what was purchased including serial numbers. This form is in triplicate- One is sent to the FBI the other is sent to the official designated by the state or local authorities to receive the form, the third is attached to your 4473 and held by the FFL. A friend of mine did a group buy with ammo. He ordered about 7000 rounds (mail order), but it was for four of us. He got a knock on his door from the FBI asking to see his firearms. They looked his storage facilities over and left. Remember, it's for the safety of the children. John |
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Well, I purchased four handguns within a weeks time. Two in one day, then 1 two days later and then another one a couple of days after that. I would have got them all the same day, but, I had to wait for the orders to come in. My dealer would tell me if anyone was checking up on me and so far, nada! 
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wrong psycho sammy If you purchase 2 or more pistols from your FFL dealer within 5 busisness days he has to fill out a multiple purchase form, a copy is kept locally, one sent to the BATFE by closing on that day,and a copy is sent to the CLEO. The form states who you are( just like a 4473) and the guns you bought. Its not an illegal database, or sum mumbo jumbo scheme, its the law and this is one way they track and bust people who sell guns to gangbangers or those acting as a dealer without an FFL |
Thanks for restating what was already stated twice above jimmyjoedickhead |
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Let me try to answer some of these questions and/or respond to some of these comments. 1) yes, I have dogs and I love them - they are like my kids (three Pit Bulls), why do you ask? 2) I have a ccw, but I still filled out yellow forms and local forms for each 3) my ffl is a good guy that I have been dealing with for years - he wouldn't drop a dime on me, but I have no doubt he would fill out whatever paperwork is required by the law 4) my ffl would not tell me to wait a week because he wouldn't want me to think that he was trying to circumvent the law - he knows that I would want to avoid even the appearance of impropriety 5) if agents come to my house, they had better have a warrant, I know the law and my rights and will not waive any of them 6) could not do private transfer because I bought these from out-of-state (commemorative Glocks are not that easy to find locally) 7) it's not that I could not buy these pistols, I did buy them - it is just annoying that these guys were calling and asking about me |
not a problem some just type faster, it wasn't posted when I started, see unlike your idiot comments, mine required thought, that takes time to formulate into a concise point instead of drivel and paranoia |
burn |
After four decades+ directly involved with Mil, FedGov and Civil Servants, that just struck me as really funny. Sorry. |
It is an idiot comment why? Because I did not know about the form to report multiple sales? Because in this instance you happened to know about the form? Was I wrong when I stated that a federal database was illegal? Was I wrong about the time period for destroying records? The others replied about the form without igorant comments, but you had to be a dick. Don't feel bad about the others responding faster. Next time, just stop patting yourself on the back because of your amazing knowledge base, and type with both hands. |
If you lived in IL, you'd get a nice red checkmark next to your name on the man's list. I have several next to mine 
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well you were wrong about plenty and giving a ton of false information to boot. What would have happened if he did take your adivce and contacted a lawyer, nothing except him paying money for some guy to sit there and do nothing. Please explain oh wise one what violations have occured? How can a lawyer make a difference? As you mentioned you didn't know about multiple purchase forms, perhaps you should inform yourself before you post remarks, that way we only assume your an idiot before you mark youself as an idiot. As for you "illegal database" it started in 1968 when it made serial numbers mandatory, in addition of requiring FFLs, this is not a case of some super secret plan, as stated before it has been used to bust gangs wo send in people to purchase them guns. There is more information tied to you by another "illegal database" is called your SSN. I suggest you loosen your tinfoil dunce cap, you have too much on and its warping my monitor image. |
Same here. I didn't realize until later that he was doing me a favor by not selling me two handguns at once. |
I gave no false information, my statements were correct. I siad they had to destroy the records and that a database was illegal. A ton of false information? You think a person should deal with the ATF without consulting a lawyer? Serial numbers are not put in a database of gun owners. As for the SSN, WTF are you talking about? Think before you post. |