At my wit's end. Plumbing issue (Page 2 of 2)
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Originally Posted By skink: I am going to check it when I get home. I am going to call the plumber and see if I can reduce the pressure to 55 psi and see if that helps. If not, they are going to have to come back out. Your pipes are rated to more than 55psi... if you're losing water from a sealed system it's a leak. |
| Since you were leaking water at the higher pressure, my guess is that the water hammer pressure spike was relieved before any effects manifested themselves. At the lower pressure, you don't have that built-in relief so you get the full on water hammer. You may also have some secondary resonance effects going on. Expansion tanks, arrestors, and slow-closing valves should help relieve the problem. |
| When we built our house, we installed tee’s with short pieces of pipe, like reversed sediment traps, at every fixture except the washer, showers, and fridge to eliminate water hammer, at the advice of a plumber. Either we’ve never had any water hammer issues or it works. |
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Originally Posted By skink: I am going to check it when I get home. I am going to call the plumber and see if I can reduce the pressure to 55 psi and see if that helps. If not, they are going to have to come back out. There's a simple step you can take that will test this out and won't cost you anything. Partially shut down your meter, or homeowner valve if you have one. Keep dialing it down until the hammering stops. If you reach that point and the water pressure is still acceptable, leave it that way and you're done. |
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Originally Posted By skink: I am going to check it when I get home. I am going to call the plumber and see if I can reduce the pressure to 55 psi and see if that helps. If not, they are going to have to come back out. If anything… Take it to 80-85psi. Also, post a picture of what valve you had installed. Then I can look up the pressure drop chart for that particular valve. |
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Politicians should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers so we could see their corporate sponsors.
Politicians should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers so we could see their corporate sponsors.
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I have a call into my Watts rep (major producer of PRV’s) to pick his brain. Here is a submittal of one of the most common PRV’s on the market. https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.supplyhouse.com/product_files/es-lf25aub-prod2.pdf As you can see in the chart, the maximum pressure drop (PD) it goes to is 25psi. Since your PD is 55psi, you may need two PRV’s in series. I’ll report back when I get some clarification. |
What is a democrat? Someone who wants everything you have, except for your job.
Politicians should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers so we could see their corporate sponsors.
Politicians should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers so we could see their corporate sponsors.
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Originally Posted By ZW17: If anything… Take it to 80-85psi. Also, post a picture of what valve you had installed. Then I can look up the pressure drop chart for that particular valve. Originally Posted By ZW17: Originally Posted By skink: I am going to check it when I get home. I am going to call the plumber and see if I can reduce the pressure to 55 psi and see if that helps. If not, they are going to have to come back out. If anything… Take it to 80-85psi. Also, post a picture of what valve you had installed. Then I can look up the pressure drop chart for that particular valve. Almost every prv I’ve put in maxes out at 75. You can take the nut off the bolt the get to 80psi but not sure if that damages the valve. A lot of guys used to do that especially when people complain about flow. Which is one of the things people complain about with them. Most houses around hare are in the 85-90 range. Nobody really uses prvs. We put them on at 100ish. |
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Connect the pressure gauge to the washing machine water inlet. Drop the pressure down to 50psi and see if there's any improvement |
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"Mitch the almost dead democrat bitch"
2026, the bigger better democrat election fraud
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Originally Posted By ZW17: I have a call into my Watts rep (major producer of PRV's) to pick his brain. Here is a submittal of one of the most common PRV's on the market. https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.supplyhouse.com/product_files/es-lf25aub-prod2.pdf As you can see in the chart, the maximum pressure drop (PD) it goes to is 25psi. Since your PD is 55psi, you may need two PRV's in series. I'll report back when I get some clarification. I had a PRV in place that was installed around 2017. I didn't take a picture of it, but the one they replaced it with looks either the same or similar. I never had this issue prior to last Wednesday. Come to think of it, I had it replaced on 9/8 and did a load the next day. Then a week later (last Wednesday) I did one load and it was fine. It was on the second load that it all went to hell. I turned the inlet valve down almost all the way and it let me finish the load. But when I tested the washer after, it started hammering. |
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Originally Posted By boolzi: Almost every prv I’ve put in maxes out at 75. You can take the nut off the bolt the get to 80psi but not sure if that damages the valve. A lot of guys used to do that especially when people complain about flow. Which is one of the things people complain about with them. Most houses around hare are in the 85-90 range. Nobody really uses prvs. We put them on at 100ish. Fair point, I forgot they do max out at 75psi. I'm interested to hear what the Watts rep has to say. |
What is a democrat? Someone who wants everything you have, except for your job.
Politicians should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers so we could see their corporate sponsors.
Politicians should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers so we could see their corporate sponsors.
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Alright, just got off the phone with our rep and here are some notes I took after describing the issue... Is this only when the washing machine is running, or is this when any outlet is running (shower, hose bib, kitchen sink)? If it's only the washing machine, it very well could be the water solenoid... If it's every outlet, it's the PRV. Confirmed it can handle up to 300psi incoming pressure and safely knock pressure down to the range of 25-75psi with the factory setting being at 50psi. - Confirm flow direction. The arrow on the valve body must point toward the house/building. A PRV installed backward can chatter badly. - Verify it occurs under flow vs. at no flow. Open a bathtub or hose bib downstream wide open. If it chatters only while water is flowing, it is likely a bad/dirty seat module, restricted inlet screen, or valve instability under flow. If it chatters with everything closed, suspect thermal expansion/backflow interaction. - Back the setting down to 60 psi temporarily. Watts PRV's adjust from 25–75 psi, so 70 psi is within range but near the top end. If the chatter stops around 60 psi, it points to the valve/setting rather than a general piping hammer issue. - Check the integral stainless strainer and seat. That valve has a removable inlet strainer and replaceable seat module. A small piece of pipe dope, solder, scale, or debris can make a new PRV oscillate. - Check for a closed downstream system. If there is a check valve, backflow preventer, or water meter check downstream of the PRV, install/verify a properly charged potable-water expansion tank at the water heater. This valve has a thermal-expansion bypass, but that cannot solve every closed-system condition. -Make sure the main shutoff is fully open and nothing is restricting flow upstream. A partially closed ball valve, clogged meter screen, or an undersized/restricted supply can cause the PRV to flutter. - Make sure the installer did not overheat the valve if it was soldered in. The heat can ruin internal gaskets and components. A melted valve seat can cause chattering. - Once you confirm all these, and it still chatters, replace the valve with a new one. The part in red is the most common issue with replacements as working on the piping tends to break loose debris. He sees this more often than not and it's an easy fix. ETA: This is based off the assumption that you have a Watts LF25AUB-Z3 PRV. That is why it is important that you confirm the model you have. All this information is invalid if you have a different make/model. |
What is a democrat? Someone who wants everything you have, except for your job.
Politicians should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers so we could see their corporate sponsors.
Politicians should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers so we could see their corporate sponsors.
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We run 80 to 100 psi on our lines. Use to have pipes knocking in the wall when I took a shower. When I replaced the shower stall back in November, I noticed there was an attachment point in the wall for the pipe that had come loose. I reattached it. Haven't noticed the noise since. I also used to have a problem with an irrigation system in a greenhouse range. Not some backyard thing, think one acre under a plastic roof. 1.25" lines running at 80 psi, yeah, that caused some problems, did all kinds of things, never did get it sorted. There was just too much water slapping back and forth above ground with the valves turning off and on. I had theorized that I needed to double the amount of valves in the range to lessen the amount of rush when a valve opened on an empty line, hence, less energy, less hammer. Then we just stopped using it and it was no longer an issue. But again, it wasn't buried, it was up in the greenhouse framing, it had room to move. |
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One other thing I’d like to say about this situation… Fast acting solenoid valves can and do cause water hammer. It’s always better to use slow acting valves and actuators. A washer has a fast acting solenoid. Rule of thumb in the mechanical trades is that you always open and close a valve slowly to prevent hammer and blowouts. I once watched a guy open a butterfly valve in about 1 second, it had a 30HP pump running full bore behind it. The result was a blowout on a 10” sch80 PVC 90 degree elbow. It send that elbow to the moon. Fast acting anything involving pressurized water or gasses is not in anyone’s best interest. |
What is a democrat? Someone who wants everything you have, except for your job.
Politicians should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers so we could see their corporate sponsors.
Politicians should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers so we could see their corporate sponsors.
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Originally Posted By GUNSAP: If you figure out the leak issue and still getting the hammer sound, install a hammer valve. I had that issue with my washer and I installed a shark bite hammer valve and problem solved. |
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