Posted: 12/18/2012 9:24:41 PM EDT
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http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/cndy/2012-12/19/content_16030669.htm
Does not refer to every fat person but to gut bacteria that causes fat. |
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http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/cndy/2012-12/19/content_16030669.htm Does not refer to every fat person but to gut bacteria that causes fat. I subscribe to the basic theory calories in < calories out in order to lose weight. That being said there is something very different on how people are put together. My wife for example can eat whatever she wants whenever she wants. She is 5'3" and 100 lbs soaking wet. Me 5'8" 180 lbs I could stand to drop a couple lbs but am far from being a fat body. I eat ok...keep calories around 1700 a day most from good fat and protein and get to the gym 5 days a week. My wife does not work out and eats 3x as much as I do and it is junk food. Her entire family is like that. So something is off...maybe genetics...maybe bacteria. |
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The paper was published on Dec 13 in the journal of the International Society for Microbial Ecology.
It showed that a pathogen, or infectious agent, isolated from the gut of an obese human induced obesity and insulin resistance in germ-free mice. In the clinical study, researchers found an excessive growth of endotoxin-producing bacteria, accounting for 35 percent of the gut bacteria, in an obese patient whose initial weight was 175 kg. After an intervention with specialized nutritional formula, the bacteria decreased to non-detectable amounts and the patient lost 51.4kg. It provided the key piece of evidence. The patient also recovered from hyperglycemia and hypertension. The intestinal bacterium involved was Enterobacter cloacae. Maybe it's the Molson's XXX I've been drinking since I got home 4 hours ago that makes this less impressive, but isn't E cloacae one of the most common gram negative bacteria in the gut of every human being? |
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Quoted: Quoted: http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/cndy/2012-12/19/content_16030669.htm Does not refer to every fat person but to gut bacteria that causes fat. I subscribe to the basic theory calories in < calories out in order to lose weight. That being said there is something very different on how people are put together. My wife for example can eat whatever she wants whenever she wants. She is 5'3" and 100 lbs soaking wet. Me 5'8" 180 lbs I could stand to drop a couple lbs but am far from being a fat body. I eat ok...keep calories around 1700 a day most from good fat and protein and get to the gym 5 days a week. My wife does not work out and eats 3x as much as I do and it is junk food. Her entire family is like that. So something is off...maybe genetics...maybe bacteria. Gross oversimplification though. You aren't wrong, it's just not exactly correct when we look at "health". It's a bit like throwing a ball in the air and claiming it comes down because of gravity. You observe an action and reaction, but simple observation and repeatable outcome isn't the same thing as understanding the full process. The problem is that the math behind "gravity" or even the science behind your ability to observe the experiment fills volumes in med school, give mathematicians night sweats, and makes physics students drink. I'm not saying you are wrong. Deprive the average person of enough calories and they will lose weight and muscle. Eat too many calories and you will gain fat. Ball goes up, ball comes down. Finding biological shortcuts that have a repeatable outcome is on par with making your ball float halfway through the experiment. Your ability to convert raw material to energy as a biological entity is nothing short of a miracle. Using a bit of French bread, some grapes, and a slice of ham is what is powering me to have a conversation with you electronically over the internet using rapid chemical reactions to drive the muscles in my hands and eyes in concert with my brain. If I type you a message and send it, it works. The science and application of the understanding of how and why I am able to type is much more complicated than the mundane act itself. Same with weight loss. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/cndy/2012-12/19/content_16030669.htm Does not refer to every fat person but to gut bacteria that causes fat. I subscribe to the basic theory calories in < calories out in order to lose weight. That being said there is something very different on how people are put together. My wife for example can eat whatever she wants whenever she wants. She is 5'3" and 100 lbs soaking wet. Me 5'8" 180 lbs I could stand to drop a couple lbs but am far from being a fat body. I eat ok...keep calories around 1700 a day most from good fat and protein and get to the gym 5 days a week. My wife does not work out and eats 3x as much as I do and it is junk food. Her entire family is like that. So something is off...maybe genetics...maybe bacteria. Individuals vary. But every fat person I know eats a large pizza like its a fucking snack, so lets start there. |
| Sounds like it may be plausible. There are is a lot of bacteria in your intestines, some are very important and help you digest foods and also keep you healthy. If you get too much of the wrong kind, all kinds of things can go wrong with your health, dysentery, diarrhea, infections in your intestines etc. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
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http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/cndy/2012-12/19/content_16030669.htm Does not refer to every fat person but to gut bacteria that causes fat. I subscribe to the basic theory calories in < calories out in order to lose weight. That being said there is something very different on how people are put together. My wife for example can eat whatever she wants whenever she wants. She is 5'3" and 100 lbs soaking wet. Me 5'8" 180 lbs I could stand to drop a couple lbs but am far from being a fat body. I eat ok...keep calories around 1700 a day most from good fat and protein and get to the gym 5 days a week. My wife does not work out and eats 3x as much as I do and it is junk food. Her entire family is like that. So something is off...maybe genetics...maybe bacteria. Gross oversimplification though. You aren't wrong, it's just not exactly correct when we look at "health". It's a bit like throwing a ball in the air and claiming it comes down because of gravity. You observe an action and reaction, but simple observation and repeatable outcome isn't the same thing as understanding the full process. The problem is that the math behind "gravity" or even the science behind your ability to observe the experiment fills volumes in med school, give mathematicians night sweats, and makes physics students drink. I'm not saying you are wrong. Deprive the average person of enough calories and they will lose weight and muscle. Eat too many calories and you will gain fat. Ball goes up, ball comes down. Finding biological shortcuts that have a repeatable outcome is on par with making your ball float halfway through the experiment. Your ability to convert raw material to energy as a biological entity is nothing short of a miracle. Using a bit of French bread, some grapes, and a slice of ham is what is powering me to have a conversation with you electronically over the internet using rapid chemical reactions to drive the muscles in my hands and eyes in concert with my brain. If I type you a message and send it, it works. The science and application of the understanding of how and why I am able to type is much more complicated than the mundane act itself. Same with weight loss. Regardless of your background, we all know that gross overeating is the usual cause of obesity. If it wasn't, these gastric bypass surgeries would be failures, but at least in the short term they work. Until the fatty figures out to eat small portions non fucking stop all day. |
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according to the Atkins diet book, Dr. Atkins theorized that yeast in the gut led to sugar cravings and other things.
on a different note, my dentist told me at one point that Alzheimer's research was suggesting that a bacteria or virus inside the mouth traveled down a nerve along side the jaw, through the skull, and then entered the brain. |
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'Proper' weight and good health aren't necessarily interchangable either. Just like the guy above who said his wife eats 3x as much as him and a lot of it junk food. She may outwardly appear healthy but if she isn't getting enough of proper nutrients then her body will eventually start breaking down at the cellular level and become diseased.
A lot of stuff on the market today is no longer food for our bodies but food like stuff. 
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Quoted: I deal with a lot of forgieners(korean,Japanese, Thai, German) and apparently Americans are the ones with glandular problems and bateria making them fat. We have a lot more additives in our food that other countries don't allow- hormones, GMO shit, etc. my kid went to the UK this summer and lost 7 pounds without a significant diet change. I think our food is poison. |
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I deal with a lot of forgieners(korean,Japanese, Thai, German) and apparently Americans are the ones with glandular problems and bateria making them fat. We have a lot more additives in our food that other countries don't allow- hormones, GMO shit, etc. my kid went to the UK this summer and lost 7 pounds without a significant diet change. I think our food is poison. That is true but all the people I'm useing for my little anacdotal survery live in the U.S. I have noticed when we go out to eat that they all eat about half of what's on their plate while all of us Americans eat EVERYTHING. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I deal with a lot of forgieners(korean,Japanese, Thai, German) and apparently Americans are the ones with glandular problems and bateria making them fat. We have a lot more additives in our food that other countries don't allow- hormones, GMO shit, etc. my kid went to the UK this summer and lost 7 pounds without a significant diet change. I think our food is poison. That is true but all the people I'm useing for my little anacdotal survery live in the U.S. I have noticed when we go out to eat that they all eat about half of what's on their plate while all of us Americans eat EVERYTHING. LOL, there's THAT, too.....  |
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Sounds like it may be plausible. There are is a lot of bacteria in your intestines, some are very important and help you digest foods and also keep you healthy. If you get too much of the wrong kind, all kinds of things can go wrong with your health, dysentery, diarrhea, infections in your intestines etc. This is what I got from it too. |
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What is pertinent from the article and research, IMHO. A real specific bacteria mentioned.
"Zhao found out that a particular kind of intestinal bacteria called enterobacter cloacae could cause obesity because its extracted endotoxin activates a gene that helps generate fat and deactivates a gene that causes fat to be consumed, according to the report. In the study, Zhao found that by reducing the enterobacter cloacae in a subject by changing a subject's diet, he could stimulate weight loss. One volunteer weighing 174.8 kilograms lost 51.4 kilograms and recovered from hyperglycemia and hypertension after going on a diet of whole grains, traditional Chinese medicinal foods and prebiotics for 23 weeks, according to the ISME article." There was a study also, with mce bred to be resistant to obesity and this bacteria overcame that resistance. Lots of food for thought.... 
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'Proper' weight and good health aren't necessarily interchangable either. Just like the guy above who said his wife eats 3x as much as him and a lot of it junk food. She may outwardly appear healthy but if she isn't getting enough of proper nutrients then her body will eventually start breaking down at the cellular level and become diseased. A lot of stuff on the market today is no longer food for our bodies but food like stuff. Maybe...her whole family is as healthy as can be...from old to young...they all eat like shit. Their weight is good, blood surgar is great, perfectly healthy people. |
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SO they took a fat person with X,Y, and Z bacteria in their gut. Fed them a nutrition shake that lacked a key nutrient that Z needed and they lost weight. BUT what isnt addresed is what was the BMR of the patient before, what was the expended calories each day, waht was the caloric intake of the shake. I can produce repeatable results using DNP, and you can eat whatever you want, problem is 5% of people wont make it through the trial and the remainder will feel like crap for the 4 weeks (also sweat yellow, have a 103ish fever, sleepless, feel like they cant get enough air, nothing bad), but people will lose weight like crazy.. on the order of half a pound a day IIRC.
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But every fat person I know eats a large pizza like its a fucking snack, so lets start there. Yep, I have no problem believing that some people can eat more than the usual amount of food and not be as big as a house, I've seen it. But I have yet to see a fat person who doesn't eat like a fat person. ps - I'm a fat person. |
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Yep, I have no problem believing that some people can eat more than the usual amount of food and not be as big as a house, I've seen it. But I have yet to see a fat person who doesn't eat like a fat person. ps - I'm a fat person. This has been my experience as well. Disclaimer -- I am not a fat person, but I'm trying my best to become one.
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