Posted: 1/16/2009 1:13:39 PM EDT
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I understand why the .mil uses them (out in cold weather on patrol, etc.).
I understand why terrorists and criminals use them (hide their identity). What I don't understand is why I see more and more law enforcement types wearing them (although I could see a need for park rangers, game wardens, border patrol and other folks outside for a long time.) If you are not out in the elements for extended periods, committing crimes, or terrorizing the populace why would you need to wear one? |
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If you are not out in the elements for extended periods, committing crimes, or terrorizing the populace why would you need to wear one? Because I am out in the elements for extended periods doing physical labor. You should try it sometime. Got enough of that in the USMC. Have at it. |
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Because the War on Drugs has led many police agencies to adopt a quasi military posture, and some of those guy need to hide their identities, as the people who's rights they are violating are some of the most heinous bastards in the country (and sometimes they accidentally kill granny).
Also, it's "gear" and lots of folks feel safer wearing more gear than less gear, even though they know that some gear doesn't really stop bullets. Also, they keep you face warm on a motorcycle in the winter. Narco Ninja Dog Approves 
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I eat it for dessert, or just a sweet and filling snack. http://www.gulluoglulondon.co.uk/pictures/01_baklava.jpg It's a little rich for my taste. Maybe I just haven't had the right recipe. 
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I understand why the .mil uses them (out in cold weather on patrol, etc.). I understand why terrorists and criminals use them (hide their identity). What I don't understand is why I see more and more law enforcement types wearing them (although I could see a need for park rangers, game wardens, border patrol and other folks outside for a long time.) If you are not out in the elements for extended periods, committing crimes, or terrorizing the populace why would you need to wear one? Specialized units that want to keep officers identities hidden to preserve undercover operations. Also, nomex is fire resistant... if you're raiding a meth lab the chances of an explosion occurring can be quite dangerous. Tactical units must secure the lab before the guys with HAZMAT suits can come in. 
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: If you are not out in the elements for extended periods, committing crimes, or terrorizing the populace why would you need to wear one? Because I am out in the elements for extended periods doing physical labor. You should try it sometime. Got enough of that in the USMC. Have at it. I intend to. You're missing out. |
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Currently: -4°F Clear
Currently: -20°C Clear Wind: South at 9 MPH Humidity: 59% Dewpoint: -15°F Barometer: 30.44 inches and falling Wind Chill: -20°F Wind: South at 14 KPH Humidity: 59% Dewpoint: -26°C Barometer: 1031 millibars and falling Wind Chill: -28° C Sunrise: 7:25 am Sunset: 4:49 pm ––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––- Because "a long time" can be measured in minutes. |
I'm ordering one just because you posted this thread and question its utility in certain peoples possesion.
It can be great for cold weather...It's going in my BOB. Also alot of SWAT members wear them because they are working undercover outside of the SWAT team, maybe doing drug stings and such. |
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Usually the Balaclava used is made of nomex and generally to prevent flash burns from distraction devices or the possible burns from a flash fire due to tear gas and potential other flash fires. Back when the trend started most SWAT teams and Other tac teams used nomex jumpsuits and gloves as well.
Sometimes a confidential informant will be disguised with a Balaclava. I have seen plain clothes use them from time to time when entering a warrant service etc. |
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I eat it for dessert, or just a sweet and filling snack. http://www.gulluoglulondon.co.uk/pictures/01_baklava.jpg Damn this thread is making me hungry, I need to find a good Greek restraunt around here. 
To the OP, I'm not really a fan of some of the more heavy handed tactics used by certain police agencies, but have you ever been in close proximity to a distractionary device or anything else that could send flash/flame or bits of debris at your face? Its not perfect, but certainly better the nothing. Identity protection comes into play in certain cases I would imagine as well. I'm not going to get into the middle of the shitstorm you seem to be trying to start, but as an unbiased observer I can see the practical reason they are worn. |
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Usually the Balaclava used is made of nomex and generally to prevent flash burns from distraction devices or the possible burns from a flash fire due to tear gas and potential other flash fires. Back when the trend started most SWAT teams and Other tac teams used nomex jumpsuits and gloves as well. Sometimes a confidential informant will be disguised with a Balaclava. I have seen plain clothes use them from time to time when entering a warrant service etc. Meth labs have been known to kaboom, too. |
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I eat it for dessert, or just a sweet and filling snack. http://www.gulluoglulondon.co.uk/pictures/01_baklava.jpg Damn this thread is making me hungry, I need to find a good Greek restraunt around here.
To the OP, I'm not really a fan of some of the more heavy handed tactics used by certain police agencies, but have you ever been in close proximity to a distractionary device or anything else that could send flash/flame or bits of debris at your face? Its not perfect, but certainly better the nothing. Identity protection comes into play in certain cases I would imagine as well. I'm not going to get into the middle of the shitstorm you seem to be trying to start, but as an unbiased observer I can see the practical reason they are worn. The few times I had to throw grenades and flash bangs I did my best to keep them away from my face... I just didn't see the point of using one to keep your identity secret if you are going to have to testify in court against someone anyway. Can you sit in a courtroom with a mask as a witness against someone? Wouldn't your name be in the court record? Maybe that's not how it works. That's why I asked. |
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Usually the Balaclava used is made of nomex and generally to prevent flash burns from distraction devices or the possible burns from a flash fire due to tear gas and potential other flash fires. Back when the trend started most SWAT teams and Other tac teams used nomex jumpsuits and gloves as well. Sometimes a confidential informant will be disguised with a Balaclava. I have seen plain clothes use them from time to time when entering a warrant service etc. Meth labs have been known to kaboom, too. Oh, go on! Its not like there is anything there to cause a flash fire!!! Just a potentially explosive atmosphere!!! 
The DEA CLET used to wear Nomex Head to toe AND had flash arrestors on the muzzles of their SMGs. Not Flash Hiders but Flash Arrestors. |
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Usually the Balaclava used is made of nomex and generally to prevent flash burns from distraction devices or the possible burns from a flash fire due to tear gas and potential other flash fires. Back when the trend started most SWAT teams and Other tac teams used nomex jumpsuits and gloves as well. Sometimes a confidential informant will be disguised with a Balaclava. I have seen plain clothes use them from time to time when entering a warrant service etc. Yeah, they are known as "secret police". |
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I eat it for dessert, or just a sweet and filling snack. http://www.gulluoglulondon.co.uk/pictures/01_baklava.jpg Damn this thread is making me hungry, I need to find a good Greek restraunt around here.
To the OP, I'm not really a fan of some of the more heavy handed tactics used by certain police agencies, but have you ever been in close proximity to a distractionary device or anything else that could send flash/flame or bits of debris at your face? Its not perfect, but certainly better the nothing. Identity protection comes into play in certain cases I would imagine as well. I'm not going to get into the middle of the shitstorm you seem to be trying to start, but as an unbiased observer I can see the practical reason they are worn. The few times I had to throw grenades and flash bangs I did my best to keep them away from my face... I just didn't see the point of using one to keep your identity secret if you are going to have to testify in court against someone anyway. Can you sit in a courtroom with a mask as a witness against someone? Wouldn't your name be in the court record? Maybe that's not how it works. That's why I asked. You name might be in court records, but your face isn't. If the drug dealers see an undercover agent's face, they are probably not going to associate with him, or sell him drugs any longer (or worse). Have you ever thrown a flash bang into an environment that could have caused an explosive fireball? (if you did, and didn't wear the appropriate protection, you're an idiot). A large portion of the clandestine meth labs that are found, are found when they explode. The very first meth lab raid I was associated with resulted in an explosion due to a booby trap that was set by the meth dealers. All of the tac gear that clandestine lab teams use is made of nomex so it doesn't burn or melt to your skin when that inevitable explosion occurs. If you don't want a flash burned face, you better be wearing a nomex balaclava (even if it upsets a few people who just don't like the way it looks). |
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Usually the Balaclava used is made of nomex and generally to prevent flash burns from distraction devices or the possible burns from a flash fire due to tear gas and potential other flash fires. Back when the trend started most SWAT teams and Other tac teams used nomex jumpsuits and gloves as well. Sometimes a confidential informant will be disguised with a Balaclava. I have seen plain clothes use them from time to time when entering a warrant service etc. Meth labs have been known to kaboom, too. Oh, go on! Its not like there is anything there to cause a flash fire!!! Just a potentially explosive atmosphere!!!
The DEA CLET used to wear Nomex Head to toe AND had flash arrestors on the muzzles of their SMGs. Not Flash Hiders but Flash Arrestors. I would want to wear ARFF turnouts if I had to go into a meth lab. 
I wear a RedHead balaclava in APG when I 'murder' turkey. 
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Usually the Balaclava used is made of nomex and generally to prevent flash burns from distraction devices or the possible burns from a flash fire due to tear gas and potential other flash fires. Back when the trend started most SWAT teams and Other tac teams used nomex jumpsuits and gloves as well. Sometimes a confidential informant will be disguised with a Balaclava. I have seen plain clothes use them from time to time when entering a warrant service etc. Meth labs have been known to kaboom, too. Oh, go on! Its not like there is anything there to cause a flash fire!!! Just a potentially explosive atmosphere!!!
The DEA CLET used to wear Nomex Head to toe AND had flash arrestors on the muzzles of their SMGs. Not Flash Hiders but Flash Arrestors. I would want to wear ARFF turnouts if I had to go into a meth lab.
Don't misunderstand, they do wear Gas Masks, every inch of skin is covered with Nomex though because in the event of a flash fire non aramid synthetics will melt and stick or worse to your skin, Nomex will not. Some of the youngsters will not recall this reference but back in 1980 at Princes Gate 22 SAS performed "Operation Nimrod" to end a hostage situation in the Iranian embassy in London. The 22 SAS were clad in the famous "Black Kit" and this was the first time they were seen on TV Dressed head to toe in Black Nomex jumpsuits Balaclavas, S2 Respirator, carrying MP5s with Kelites on top. They Rappelled down from the roof to balconies and made explosive entry to the building, Also two troopers were launching gas rounds into the structure from the street, in the assault phase of the op, some interior decor caught fire and flames and smoke were streaming out the windows. The SAS troops being the consumate professionals assaulted through the flames. One trooper became entangled in his Rappell kit and hung in the window in the flames for most of the assault. His Nomex kit saved him from some severe burns. Back with a pic in a jiffy if I can find one! |