[ARCHIVED THREAD] - C5 goes down Update (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 4/3/2006 4:01:12 AM EDT
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Fox just reported that a C5 has crashes near Dover AFB. Injuries reported. Update FNC just showed live video of crash. Broken in half forward of wing. Went down at 6:45 am with 17 onboard. www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,190289,00.html |
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where is the tail. www.cnn.com/2006/US/04/03/c5.crash.ap.ap/index.html Giant C-5 military jet crashes in Delaware DOVER, Delaware (AP) -- A C-5 cargo plane carrying 17 people crashed near Dover Air Force Base early Monday, state officials said. There was no immediate word on fatalities. The plane, the military's largest, went down about 6:45 a.m., said Allen Metheny, assistant director in the state Department of Public Safety. He said some people were taken to hospitals with injuries, but he did not have numbers or details of the extent of the injuries. The plane broke into three pieces, with the cockpit separated from the fuselage and a wing shattered. It wasn't immediately clear whether the plane was taking off or landing when it crashed. |
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The flight deck appears intact in the picture, but the break split open the passenger compartment. No real sign of fire. The left wingtip looks like they foamed it, but that might have been precautionary with fuel leaking. There is a black streak across the wing from the No. 1 engine pylon. |
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The break in the forward section occured just forward of the crew rest area. A C5 carries up to 13 crewmembers on an augmented crew, only 3 are actively involved in flying at any one time and 2-3 are loadmasters in the "troop" or passenger comapartment which is behind the wing in the back of the jet. If you look at the wreck the slides are clearly visible coming down from the troop and the vey back of the crew rest area. That's good, means people got out. The troop compartment and crew rest area are not connected, the center wing box and flight control cables/hydraulics are in the middle over the wing. I'm not sure, believe I heard a few minutes ago that they were outbound fom Dover, declared an IFE (in flight emergency) and turned back. What bugs me is that the tail is so far away from the rest without a debris trail connecting the two. I saw video shot by friends in Germany (1991?)when the one went down coming out of Ramstein and the scene was way spread out, but was connected by debris and burned trees. The plane carries 13 crew, up to 75 passengers in the troop. There is an airbus config where the cargo box can be filled with airline seats, but it's used rarely if at all. You can see some pallets laying in the break between section, there is room for 36 pallets, 9'x9' each. I crew chiefed C5's for 2.5 years out of Travis in California. It's a big, complicated jet requiring a lotta maintenance. My prayers go out for the safety of the crew and passengers. |
Thanks, it's been a while since I crawled around a Fred. It made me appreciate my "little" KC-135. |
When I was stationed at Ramstein Air Base in Germany back in the mid-80's, we use to watch those big pigs take off headed back to the states with lots of gas and cargo. Was very interesting (and down right scary) on how much runway they would use getting off the ground. I can't count how many times they were hauling that big whale in the air with virtually no runway left. I shit you not..........it almost looked like they would snag the wires at the end of the runway.  vmax84 |
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From what I have seen in the footage is that they were trying to make it to the runway. The gear was down. It must have been in a very nose high attitude trying to make it the last couple hundred yards. The tail section hit first and broke off, while the rest of the plane continued (skid marks just under the right wing). It looks like the left gear failed and stubbed the wingtip causing a sudden whiplash that snapped the nose section off. Probably lucky they stopped where they did because there is a wooded area just ahead, most likely would have caused a fire from fuel tanks. |
Well, it's more than their usual, unaugmented, aircrew of seven. But far less than than their limit. C-5 Fact Sheet Edit to fix crew number and add link. |
Now the entire aircrew is going to have one more takeoff than landing in thier logs. |
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smilingbandit, thanks for the link! I saved that one. The number 17 can be any combination of crew and passengers. I 've been on missions where the crew put 2 passengers in the back with the loadmasters rotating through back their one at a time when we had room up front. I 've also had the troop full and more pax up front- depends on the crew, most want the rest area for their use. It gets tight when you start adding people up front, plus there's only so many ways out- you don't want a long line for the slides. You don't see any ropes hanging out the pilots windows- thery have them, but nobody wants to use them. |
Nope. Operation a C5 went down in Operation Babylift in 1975 and one crashed at Ramstein in Gulf War I. |
You don't see the left side of the cockpit section, but they may well have used the standard entry ladder. |
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Fox has video on line if anyone is interested. www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,190289,00.html |
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Can someone elaborate on the tail section missing? If it is 1/4 mile away, does that sound like it broke off? (even a s/a missile, however unlikely that may be?) I can't imagine it is flyable without the rear stabilizer. What is the likely scenario... once it came off, the plane went down right away, and it just happened to be close to the ground and the crash wasn't too severe? I have read how the B52's fly nose down. Does the C5 do anything similar? Could it fly without a tail for a mile or so? |
A SAM would go for the engines, not the tailcone. A likely senario is that when trying to make the runway after their IFE they we're able to maintain airspeed, in order to try to keep altitude the aircraft was placed in a more nose-up attitude, when the jet could no longer keep flying the back end hit the ground first and the tail fractured (I have a cool video of an MD-80's tail doing the same thing from a test flight). As this point the aircraft (sans tail) could contine to fly in ground effect for a short time until coming to a rest. BUFFs are the only plane I can think of that fly at that unusual attitude in level flight. |
Yeah, it does seem like a hundred years ago. I loved being at Ramstein (read in, I loved being based in Germany). Fun base to be at............lots of transport activity, and at the time I was there, a fun F-4 base. They were just bringing in the F-16's when I was leaving. Now, I guess the fighters are all gone. I guess time has a way of marching on.  But yeah, those dang things would just eat the runway up at times. I do remember one particular instance where we were talking to the crew chief of a C-5 and he said "watch this takeoff........we are gonna use a lot of runway". They had put a bunch of fuel on and lots of cargo. We climbed to the top of the big fuel tanks near the runway  (I worked in the lab for the fuels department, so we had a lot of access on the base) and watched him come lumbering down the runway. We were all crappin' our pants.......it just didn't look like he was gonna get in the air. At the last minute, the nose of the plane came up and that big whale just waddled into the air, barely clearing the arresting wires at the end of the runway. I will never forget that. Anyway, sorry to hijack the thread. Kinda fun to step back in time for a minute.  vmax84 |
I don't know how logs are kept, but--they landed.
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| An amazing aircraft,the C-5. When the C-5 first came out,the AF took it over to Cincinnati-Lunken(6000 ft runway,the TFs were manufactured at GE-Evandale,AF just had to show it off),with no problems. Show up at Lunken with a B-727-200,you'll get a nastygram from Lunken mgnt,due to the fact that the runways/taxiways can't handle the high wheel loadings. |
The pallets are 108" by 88' and up to 90' tall, maxing out at 10,000 lbs. The break in the tail section looks well behind the passenger compartment. The passenger compartment only goes a little ways towards the tail after the door with the slide open is. The crew section definitely got trashed, I'd guess it cracked around the lavatory and galley area, What strikes me as odd is that the rear ramp doors are opened, hydraulic problems are not an odd thing with these beasts, and maintinence is a constant battle. I am curious as to how many pallets were loaded and how well they stayed in place, I see a couple on the ground but that would be from the deck tearing out under them. Its odd how the nose is right next to the rest of the craft. possible that the tail broke, the crew tried to make an emergency landing and the nose hit... hard... first. Whatcha think snuffy, im an Air trans guy with the Port at travis. Hopefully nobody died, we are loosing to many people over here in the kitty box as it is. |