[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Making hard cider (Page 1 of 3)
Posted: 5/8/2016 8:15:40 PM EDT
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Yesterday I discovered how cheap/easy it'd be to make hard cider. Already have a nearly endless supple of gallon jugs (my wife drinks Carlo Rossi wine). Just need to order the yeast, airlock, stopper and a hydrometer/graduated cylinder.
Once I get a few good batches of the dry stuff I'll look into kegs/CO2 to make the sweeter cider we're used to (i.e. Woodchuck). My main concern is the stopper and airlock. Are all carboys/jugs the same size at the mouth or is there a size to consider? It'd suck to buy the airlock and then the hole in the stopper is too big/small for it to fit right....or it not being big enough or too big to fit the jug. For those of you with experience, please share your thoughts. Here's the airlock... http://www.ebay.com/itm/S-Shape-Bubble-Fermentor-Airlock-w-Grommet-Air-Lock-Home-Brew-Wine-EK-/141962823421?hash=item210da4c6fd:g:gt8AAOSw0QFXCDyl Which stopper will fit both the airlock and the jug?.... http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rubber-Stoppers-Bungs-Drilled-and-Solid-Stoppers-Carboy-Bung-Your-Choice-/251937108181?var=&hash=item3aa89f30d5:m:mi3DeuvE5Cz8Rd4XRJfM2lA Thanks! -Emt1581 |
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I recommend you find a local brew shop and go to them to get started. Amazon might be a better choice for getting the equipment. They'll probably have listed what size stopper you need.
Do yourself a favor and look up "edwort's apfelwein" and get a batch of that started. |
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Quoted:
I recommend you find a local brew shop and go to them to get started. Amazon might be a better choice for getting the equipment. They'll probably have listed what size stopper you need. Do yourself a favor and look up "edwort's apfelwein" and get a batch of that started. Yup, and go over to homebrewtalk.com. The arfcom of brewing |
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I like to use a three piece airlock for primary fermentation. Something like this.
As for your stopper, "Drilled" should generally fit any airlock. The size you need I'm afraid I can't answer. I second going to a local brewing store. It's more expensive, but probably not once you factor in shipping. I also didn't see any mention of yeast. Get a good yeast from the brewing store too. |
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the yeast you use will greatly affect the outcome. I see a lot of folks using champagne yeast, but it creates a very dry cider as it leaves less residual sugar. I have had the most success with a Cotes de Rhone yeast.
Also gotta make sure your juice is preservative free or it won't ferment. For your first steps into this, you really don't need the hydrometer. And if buying a carboy, there are now "largemouth" ones, which I recommend.... much easier to clean. But all you really need is a five gallon bucket, and if it has a spigot, so much the better. You don't have to keg to carbonate.... that just requires priming and bottling. |
| Not sure where you are getting your carboys from as I have only ever gotten 5 gallon carboys and they are heavy as shit before you put anything into them. I have a buddy that home brews a lot and he uses the 5 gallon plastic buckets from Lowes/Home Depot after sterilizing them to ferment shit in. |
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Quoted:
the yeast you use will greatly affect the outcome. I see a lot of folks using champagne yeast, but it creates a very dry cider as it leaves less residual sugar. I have had the most success with a Cotes de Rhone yeast. Also gotta make sure your juice is preservative free or it won't ferment. For your first steps into this, you really don't need the hydrometer. And if buying a carboy, there are now "largemouth" ones, which I recommend.... much easier to clean. But all you really need is a five gallon bucket, and if it has a spigot, so much the better. You don't have to keg to carbonate.... that just requires priming and bottling. Sweet and carbonated cider is easiest with a keg. Otherwise you end up having to pasteurize bottles. |
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Sweet and carbonated cider is easiest with a keg. Otherwise you end up having to pasteurize bottles. Quoted:
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the yeast you use will greatly affect the outcome. I see a lot of folks using champagne yeast, but it creates a very dry cider as it leaves less residual sugar. I have had the most success with a Cotes de Rhone yeast. Also gotta make sure your juice is preservative free or it won't ferment. For your first steps into this, you really don't need the hydrometer. And if buying a carboy, there are now "largemouth" ones, which I recommend.... much easier to clean. But all you really need is a five gallon bucket, and if it has a spigot, so much the better. You don't have to keg to carbonate.... that just requires priming and bottling. Sweet and carbonated cider is easiest with a keg. Otherwise you end up having to pasteurize bottles. Or with exploded bottles.... |
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Or with exploded bottles.... Quoted:
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the yeast you use will greatly affect the outcome. I see a lot of folks using champagne yeast, but it creates a very dry cider as it leaves less residual sugar. I have had the most success with a Cotes de Rhone yeast. Also gotta make sure your juice is preservative free or it won't ferment. For your first steps into this, you really don't need the hydrometer. And if buying a carboy, there are now "largemouth" ones, which I recommend.... much easier to clean. But all you really need is a five gallon bucket, and if it has a spigot, so much the better. You don't have to keg to carbonate.... that just requires priming and bottling. Sweet and carbonated cider is easiest with a keg. Otherwise you end up having to pasteurize bottles. Or with exploded bottles.... There's another point. Plastic bottles. You can squeeze them to tell how carbonated your stuff is. Supremely useful if you want to get to the drinking bits asap. |
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Sweet and carbonated cider is easiest with a keg. Otherwise you end up having to pasteurize bottles. Sanitize, not pasteurize. It's easy and simple... you're sanitizing the rest of your gear anyway.. And you'll only get bottle bombs if you put in too much priming sugar. Never had one; although I switched to kegging because it's easier. You can get carboys made of polycarbonate now... very light and won't break like the glass ones can. |
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Quoted: I recommend you find a local brew shop and go to them to get started. Amazon might be a better choice for getting the equipment. They'll probably have listed what size stopper you need. Do yourself a favor and look up "edwort's apfelwein" and get a batch of that started. |
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I have about 8 bottles from 2011 in my cabinet. It should get better with age... Right? Quoted:
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I recommend you find a local brew shop and go to them to get started. Amazon might be a better choice for getting the equipment. They'll probably have listed what size stopper you need. Do yourself a favor and look up "edwort's apfelwein" and get a batch of that started. Im interested to see a response here. I'd think it'd turn into vinegar or something else after a certain time period. -Emt1581 |
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I recommend you find a local brew shop and go to them to get started. Amazon might be a better choice for getting the equipment. They'll probably have listed what size stopper you need. Do yourself a favor and look up "edwort's apfelwein" and get a batch of that started. just remember the last part of eds recipe "you are not allowed to call him a "motherfucker". And while it is great, you will. speed I buy all my stuff from midwest supplies |
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Im interested to see a response here. I'd think it'd turn into vinegar or something else after a certain time period. -Emt1581 Quoted:
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I recommend you find a local brew shop and go to them to get started. Amazon might be a better choice for getting the equipment. They'll probably have listed what size stopper you need. Do yourself a favor and look up "edwort's apfelwein" and get a batch of that started. Im interested to see a response here. I'd think it'd turn into vinegar or something else after a certain time period. -Emt1581 Mine has been in the bottle for 15 months and it has become much better. Fresh there isn't a whole lot of apple flavor, but now there is more. I've read that it peaks at 1 - 2 years. I imagine the 2011 apfelwein is pretty good. |
| 5 Gallons of Trader Joe's apple juice or any other that DOESN't have potassium sorbate in it. One pack of Cote des Blanc yeast and wait 30 days. It will be clear, no need to rack to a secondary. I make make mine in a Cornelius keg and serve from same keg. |
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I use a Burton/English type ale yeast for a slightly sweeter, more Strongbow-type cider.
I've had good success with Nottingham when it comes to dry yeast, or you can use any of the many liquid yeasts out there. Keep the fermenter cool (65*F-ish or below) or the esters get out of control with these yeasts. It just so happens my basement is perfect nearly year-round, so I'm fortunate. |
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OP, try a few 1 gallon batches with different yeast strains. Check out the recipes page on homebrewtalk.com to see what people are using. My first couple of batches were Nottingham ale yeast. Turned out OK. I'm trying Safale this go round. Cider is cheap to make so experiment and have fun. As to aging it: I didn't like my last batch (oxidized I think), but I left it in the fridge for a year. Tasted better after aging for a year. |
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Quoted: Or with exploded bottles.... Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: the yeast you use will greatly affect the outcome. I see a lot of folks using champagne yeast, but it creates a very dry cider as it leaves less residual sugar. I have had the most success with a Cotes de Rhone yeast. Also gotta make sure your juice is preservative free or it won't ferment. For your first steps into this, you really don't need the hydrometer. And if buying a carboy, there are now "largemouth" ones, which I recommend.... much easier to clean. But all you really need is a five gallon bucket, and if it has a spigot, so much the better. You don't have to keg to carbonate.... that just requires priming and bottling. Sweet and carbonated cider is easiest with a keg. Otherwise you end up having to pasteurize bottles. Or with exploded bottles.... thought the fermentation had stopped, racked it into bottles and corked them. Woke up in the middle of the night to a dull "thud" coming from the spare bathroom that I was using as a storage area. |
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I appreciate those who advised calling a local supply shop. Turns out they are significantly cheaper and yielded what seems to be good advice on parts/yeast/etc. I'll stop by over the next week and pick up what I need.
Once I buy the supplies from them (hardware) I'll look online for a larger yeast order. That is the one thing they weren't necessarily gouging but I've seen prices online significantly less. I'll buy a few packs from them for a buck a piece and then search around online for more of whichever ends up tasting the best. I plan to try a few different ones. Seems like, since the apples/juice/temps/light/etc. will be the constant, the only variable left to determine the flavor will be the yeast. I asked the shop if there was a way to replicate the yeast, kinda like a bread starter. He said it was so cheap, it wasn't really worth the hassle. That true? Thanks -Emt1581 |
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Sanitize, not pasteurize. It's easy and simple... you're sanitizing the rest of your gear anyway.. And you'll only get bottle bombs if you put in too much priming sugar. Never had one; although I switched to kegging because it's easier. You can get carboys made of polycarbonate now... very light and won't break like the glass ones can. Quoted:
Sweet and carbonated cider is easiest with a keg. Otherwise you end up having to pasteurize bottles. Sanitize, not pasteurize. It's easy and simple... you're sanitizing the rest of your gear anyway.. And you'll only get bottle bombs if you put in too much priming sugar. Never had one; although I switched to kegging because it's easier. You can get carboys made of polycarbonate now... very light and won't break like the glass ones can. I think he is in fact talking about pasteurizing in this case. If you want sweet and bubbly apple cider you have to kill the yeast before they eat all the sugar. |
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I think he is in fact talking about pasteurizing in this case. If you want sweet and bubbly apple cider you have to kill the yeast before they eat all the sugar. Quoted:
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Sweet and carbonated cider is easiest with a keg. Otherwise you end up having to pasteurize bottles. Sanitize, not pasteurize. It's easy and simple... you're sanitizing the rest of your gear anyway.. And you'll only get bottle bombs if you put in too much priming sugar. Never had one; although I switched to kegging because it's easier. You can get carboys made of polycarbonate now... very light and won't break like the glass ones can. I think he is in fact talking about pasteurizing in this case. If you want sweet and bubbly apple cider you have to kill the yeast before they eat all the sugar. How is that done? Is that where the keg and CO2 come in.... or is there heating involved? Thanks -Emt1581 |
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How is that done? Is that where the keg and CO2 come in.... or is there heating involved? Thanks -Emt1581 Quoted:
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Sweet and carbonated cider is easiest with a keg. Otherwise you end up having to pasteurize bottles. Sanitize, not pasteurize. It's easy and simple... you're sanitizing the rest of your gear anyway.. And you'll only get bottle bombs if you put in too much priming sugar. Never had one; although I switched to kegging because it's easier. You can get carboys made of polycarbonate now... very light and won't break like the glass ones can. I think he is in fact talking about pasteurizing in this case. If you want sweet and bubbly apple cider you have to kill the yeast before they eat all the sugar. How is that done? Is that where the keg and CO2 come in.... or is there heating involved? Thanks -Emt1581 I believe there are two ways to get a sweet and bubbly hard cider. One would be to let the yeast consume all the sugar, then kill the yeast, add more sugar and then force carbonate with CO2. Another approach would be to let the yeast work until there's still some sugar left, bottle and let the yeast continue to work until the bottles are carbonated, and then kill the yeast in the carbonated bottle by heating the finished cider. Alternatively you could (especially with your relatively small batches) bottle condition and then just put the finished cider in the fridge. That won't kill the yeast, but can slow it down enough that you should be able to drink it before the bottle pops. The problem is once you cap the bottle, its kind of a guessing game. In my case, i guessed wrong and some bottles exploded before I got the yeast killed off, and I never tried again. I've only tried it once, unsuccessfully, but I'm thinking of trying the flat, dry version posted above. ETA: Evidently you can also let the yeast eat all the sugar, then back sweeten with Stevia. Then you can prime and bottle as normal. |
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Hard cider is about the easiest alcohol to make to me.
Few months ago I bought 7 gallons of cider straight from the orchard during an apple pressing. Took it home, filtered it into a fermentation bucket, added an old fashioned English yeast. Fermented for 3 weeks, transferred to a second carboy for a week. Then kegged it, back sweetening with a gallon of apple cider. I didn't think it was sweet enough so I added a half cup of agave and it is perfect. Really good, it sits in my keezer now. I should have let it sit in the keezer for a week before kegging and it would have been a bit more clear but it is still really clear. I'll work on that the next time. |
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Im interested to see a response here. I'd think it'd turn into vinegar or something else after a certain time period. -Emt1581 Quoted:
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I recommend you find a local brew shop and go to them to get started. Amazon might be a better choice for getting the equipment. They'll probably have listed what size stopper you need. Do yourself a favor and look up "edwort's apfelwein" and get a batch of that started. Im interested to see a response here. I'd think it'd turn into vinegar or something else after a certain time period. -Emt1581 Doesnt that involve oxygen? Fizzy cider shouldnt have much... |
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The apple juice we buy gallons of for my son contains Ascorbic Acid and Malic Acid... does that mean it won't work for making hard cider? Thanks -Emt1581 Yes, those are fine. I make sometimes, a gallon at a time. A balloon with a pinhole in it, placed over the jug top, makes a fine "airlock." |
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For your first batch I'd suggest fermenting with an English Ale yeast like Nottingham or S-04 and then bottling without sweetening. Those yeasts should leave some sugars and they may be enough for your tastes. If not, you could do like I sometimes do and pour a little simple syrup in the glass before pouring the bottle. A wine or champagne yeast will probably ferment the juice completely dry.
I've tried sweetening with xylitol and wasn't happy with the results. Some people use Splenda, but I understand there can be an odd taste. If you're up for it, jump into kegging or try pasteurizing and you can sweeten however you like. You can read up all about cider making here: http://www.homebrewtalk.com/forumdisplay.php?f=32 |
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That would be encouraging something illegal in the United States of America. Freeze fractioning, or something. Doesn't eliminate or reduce the methanol. You might look that up. Quoted:
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Freeze it! Applejack FTW That would be encouraging something illegal in the United States of America. Freeze fractioning, or something. Doesn't eliminate or reduce the methanol. You might look that up. What?? Does that turn cider into hard liquor or what?...and is it seriously that simple....just freezing it?!? Interesting if so but I find it hard to believe. Thanks -Emt1581 |
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Yup, and go over to homebrewtalk.com. The arfcom of brewing Quoted:
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I recommend you find a local brew shop and go to them to get started. Amazon might be a better choice for getting the equipment. They'll probably have listed what size stopper you need. Do yourself a favor and look up "edwort's apfelwein" and get a batch of that started. Yup, and go over to homebrewtalk.com. The arfcom of brewing this and this |
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What?? Does that turn cider into hard liquor or what?...and is it seriously that simple....just freezing it?!? Interesting if so but I find it hard to believe. Thanks -Emt1581 Quoted:
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Freeze it! Applejack FTW That would be encouraging something illegal in the United States of America. Freeze fractioning, or something. Doesn't eliminate or reduce the methanol. You might look that up. What?? Does that turn cider into hard liquor or what?...and is it seriously that simple....just freezing it?!? Interesting if so but I find it hard to believe. Thanks -Emt1581 Freezing the cider freezes everything except the alcohol. It does not seperate the ethanol from the methanol. Methanol is "bad, m'kay." Freeze fractioning can be researched. Videos on youtube by "big seque" show how it's done, but it is legal in the U.K., not in the U.S. |
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Went to the brew store tonight...what an experience!!!
Walked in and it was pretty much anything and everything you could need to brew beer, cider, wine, etc. First we got the stoppers, airlocks, cleaner, hydrometer/cylinder, and Nottingham ale yeast. Then I learned pretty much the same gear would be needed to make my own lager....just need the ingredients and a fridge. Even gave me a magazine that outlines everything for free. Tiny batches it seems like a REALLY cheap and fun hobby. But I saw the bigger equipment. Can easily jump from a few bucks to thousands. A couple questions.... 1. The yeast. It's in a little vacuum sealed packet. I was told I could use that packet for up to 5 gallons. But once I open it and take a table spoon or so out...can I just fold the opening and throw it in the fridge or does it need something else to keep it fresh for a few months? 2. The cleaner. It says "no rinse needed". The guy said to mix a table spoon of it with water and then wash everything in the solution to clean. And then to repeat the process to sanitize (or was it sterilize?). Does that sound right or is there more to it than that? 3. The airlock...it's a 3-piece. Do I just fill the cup with a little water and that's it? I figure I'll get everything cleaned and started tomorrow or sometime over the weekend. Then I'll fill it with the juice, yeast and seal it up with the airlock....then let it sit for a month in my basement. Then hopefully I'll come back to hard cider. Thanks -Emt1581 |
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Buy apple juice on sale. 1 packet of montrachet yeast. Carboy all clean and sanitized.. pour apple juice in carboy. Last bottle of apple juice pour about 1/2 of it in your carboy then add about 1/4 cup of dextrose per gallon total in carboy and add yeast. Shake well, now add to carboy. Place fermentation lock on and give carboy a good swirl. Wait 5 days or so.. prepare to get hammered. |
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1. The yeast. It's in a little vacuum sealed packet. I was told I could use that packet for up to 5 gallons. But once I open it and take a table spoon or so out...can I just fold the opening and throw it in the fridge or does it need something else to keep it fresh for a few months? I would fold it and place it in a sanitized mason jar. Or use the whole pack and then look up yeast washing or yeast recycling for extra $$ savings. 
2. The cleaner. It says "no rinse needed". The guy said to mix a table spoon of it with water and then wash everything in the solution to clean. And then to repeat the process to sanitize (or was it sterilize?). Does that sound right or is there more to it than that? Follow the instructions. Alot of people (myself) use OxyClean Versitile to clean and StarSan to sanitize. If you mix up StarSan with distilled water it will be good for a long time. I mix 2.5 gallons and keep it in a separate bucket and reuse it over and over. Again, $$ savings. 3. The airlock...it's a 3-piece. Do I just fill the cup with a little water and that's it? Pour vodka or StarSan up to the line that says FILL |
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Freezing the cider freezes everything except the alcohol. It does not seperate the ethanol from the methanol. Methanol is "bad, m'kay." Freeze fractioning can be researched. Videos on youtube by "big seque" show how it's done, but it is legal in the U.K., not in the U.S. Quoted:
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Freeze it! Applejack FTW That would be encouraging something illegal in the United States of America. Freeze fractioning, or something. Doesn't eliminate or reduce the methanol. You might look that up. What?? Does that turn cider into hard liquor or what?...and is it seriously that simple....just freezing it?!? Interesting if so but I find it hard to believe. Thanks -Emt1581 Freezing the cider freezes everything except the alcohol. It does not seperate the ethanol from the methanol. Methanol is "bad, m'kay." Freeze fractioning can be researched. Videos on youtube by "big seque" show how it's done, but it is legal in the U.K., not in the U.S. Finally found his vid...and others like it. Secue01 is his name by the way. Very interesting! And as he point out around the 15min mark...there is the same methanol in the original cider...as well as the same ratios of ethanol and futile alcohols. So this might increase the speed of methanol entering the body if you were bold enough to chug it. But it doesn't seem any different from how much you would get over time from the cider. But again that's just going off of what he seemed to say. -Emt1581 |
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Just started my first batch.
No bubbles yet. The airlock is my main concern. How long does it take for bubbles to start coming out? I put some vodka in and then, as suggested, I poured some vodka in then dropped the dome on top. With the dome in and the vodka in, the vodka is within a millimeter (under) the line. And the dome is slightly tilted. Did I do it right or am I going to hear the stopper shoot out and break something in the near future? Thanks -Emt1581 |
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Sounds right. I don't know what yeast you used, but 24 hours is not uncommon. Oh ok. Good to know. I shook it up 3 times already trying to get a few bubbles. I'll let it go down the basement until sunday. If no bubbles by then I'll probably shout at it to get it going. 
I used Nottingham Ale yeast. C'mon bubbles!!! Thanks -Emt1581 |
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Lots of info can be found here: http://www.homebrewtalk.com/forum.php Cider: |
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Quoted: That would be encouraging something illegal in the United States of America. Freeze fractioning, or something. Doesn't eliminate or reduce the methanol. You might look that up. Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Freeze it! Applejack FTW That would be encouraging something illegal in the United States of America. Freeze fractioning, or something. Doesn't eliminate or reduce the methanol. You might look that up. |