Attached File

Yeah I’ve heard of it

Forgive the intrusion. Different poster here.

I appreciate your intellectual honesty and take it at face value.  You’ve commented about the reasons you left the Church, and as has been the case with others I’ve talked to the reasons seem primarily related to administration and the actions of people rather than doctrine.

The gospel of Christ is perfect, but the people, the people are another thing all together. Look at the Bible, and its records of the monumental screwups even made by holy prophets.

People screw up. Ask imperfect people to administer a perfect gospel and there are going to be mistakes made. Some unintentional, some intentional. The gospel is true. It’s people who aren’t.

I wish you the best.

Not allowed to thrust more than 2x total length of male member.

This is interesting.  As a doctor they are a mandatory reporter but he was acting in a role as a church member.  

I would have contacted my own lawyer and the AMA for guidance.  And called my friend who is a cop.  Just saying.

I thought 'Buffering' was a sex technique

Dixie State University recently rebranded itself as Utah Tech University as a result of the cultural revolution of the past two years. Won't surprise me if BYU eventually rebrands itself too, although it may take more than 5-10 years; there would be *far* more pushback.

No thrusting... You don't get flagged until the 3rd pump.

No intrusion at all. I appreciate it.

I have MANY problems with LDS and even Christian  doctrine.

The doctrine of Christ is far from perfect in any of the 20,000 different forms it is preached in today.

I accepted them as mysteries and things I did not understand when I was in.

Now that I take a neutral approach there are many that are in question, wrong, and even harmful.

I do not know what Christ himself actually taught because I wasn’t there. I am open to god in whatever form he exists.

He knows my heart and all he has to do is make himself known to me. So far he hasn’t.

I still hope that he will. But I’m okay if he doesn’t.

If Mormonism is true he has a lot of explaining to do. Well that or he’s just an asshole.

But I will never again give my literal belief without literal experience.

No man gets to speak for god in my life. If god wants my attention he has my address.


It’s actually not the people that I have problems with aside from some notable apologists and leaders
who should know better. It’s mostly the doctrine and history. And what they lied about and covered up.

Yes people make mistakes and I’ve never expected anyone to be perfect. Not even the prophet.

However when someone claims to speak for god and your salvation is based on doing what God tells you to do that’s the part they aren’t allowed to get wrong.

And the prophets themselves set that standard and then routinely spit on it.

I'm curious what religion or denomination you went to after you left the mormon church or did you just say screw it to all of them ?

Also curious why you left, and what woke you up if you don't mind ?

Not judging, or ever been a mormon. Just genuinely curious.

@Lungbuster

LOL.  I know them from Big Bang Theory, but had no idea those two were a comedy team.
Riki Lindhomme is HOT!

Where does this shit come from?

Sounds like something Bill Clinton came up with.

Down under there was a really strong bloke,
looking for a good warm soak.
He spied a red roo underneath a oak,
and gave it a tender hard deep poke.

Kate Micucci is pretty funny, too.

During her Conan interview a few years back, she mentioned that she had a monthly music show called "Playing with Micucci"...

That’s a long story.

Mormon heuristics give great tools for tearing down all other religions in their claim of absolute truth.

Most exmormons leave religion entirely. And a lot of them become commie statist assholes too as they rebel against the conservative culture and throw the baby out with the bath water. But that’s a generalization and biased by online interactions on Reddit etc.

In reality most exmormons I’ve met keep the good stuff they had and just are happy (if cynical) real people.

Organized religion as a whole is garbage. IMHO.

I am in a wait and see place when it comes to God. If he wants me he knows where to find me. He also knows that when I believe something I give it everything I have. I’m a great catch if there’s a god that cares.

I find a lot of value in unorganized non practicing (no magic) norse paganism. Lots of great values of independence courage and doing what’s right.  Most importantly the value doesn’t hinge on literal belief in the gods. Just living an awesome life worthy of notice by the gods of there are any.

Admittedly it’s more outlook and philosophy than religion. There is no dogma.

I was awakened by the church triangulating left to appease feminists and changing their secret temple ceremony to be less sexist.

Thing is, I agree with the changes, but I and many others had built relationships and treated our wives wrongly because of what was taught. (Ironically my wife is still very much in the church) suddenly I was the asshole and the church was praised for being more progressive. (Late as always just like they were with nazism and racism)

But church leadership lied about the reasons for the changes and the question I had, made me start doing research into other questions that had piled up.

What I found in church sources (since you are forbidden from reading “anti Mormon lies”) is that the church had systematically lied about a lot of its history, (polygamy including that Joseph smith married and had sex with at least 10 women who were married to other men and more than a few underage girls) it has a secret platinum tier membership of anointed who are told they will go to heaven regardless of their sins, lies about not having a paid clergy etc.

That’s the tip of the iceberg. There are so many lies it’s incredible. There are multiple podcasts and thousands of hours and books written to expose them all.

Exmormon are held to an amazingly high standard of truth because any inaccuracy allows us to be written off liars and agents of Satan. Just like Manlet tried to do to me in this thread.

There are notable exceptions but I’ve found exmormons universally care about one thing. Absolute truth. Those that I know are the most honest people I know. They won’t sugarcoat things or try to be nice. But they will not lie.

The prophets refuse to address most of the issues openly even though they claim to speak with god so they should be able to easily solve things.

Instead they have unofficial apologists carrying water for them and their justifications and word games are stupid and weak. It’s actually hilarious and drives any thinking person further away because it just exposes the lies.

I left before it was leaked how much money the church has hoarded. But it’s hundreds of billions of dollars and they give less than 1% to help other people. Recently it was further exposed that they are laundering much of it through Australia to avoid taxes there.

The church lies and does the wrong thing at every opportunity. It is run by lawyers and Pharisees and lays heavy burdens on the people. The antithesis of Christ.

It meant everything to me. I mourn the illusion.

But modern prophets hold no value and do not prophecy see or reveal anything. That’s their job description.

Working back it is rife with scandal and lies and spin.

Joseph Smith was a horrible human being. He was a convicted con artist who lied, stole, cheated, and fucked his way through the American frontier and used God’s name to do it.

I am a better man than him or any subsequent church leader.

I don’t need them.

My understanding is that the LDS Church opposes mandatory reporting laws.  I believe this is a fact.

Kirton McConkie is the retained LDS law firm.  There is a hotline for church leaders to call when there are reports of sexual abuse.  From what I understand, the advice is to not report unless legally required.

I would expect the one true church of Jesus Christ to operate on a higher standard.

I haven't read the rest of the thread and don't purport to speak for Valravn -- at all.  But, many if not most most Mormons who leave the faith eventually move to an agnostic or atheistic position.  I personally wish this wasn't  the case.

But, when you believe you have been lied to or the facts were misrepresented it is easy to question everything.  When you realize the Book of Mormon is a work of fiction and apply the scholastic tools -- it is a slippery slope to judge the bible in the same way.

Im not saying this is right or wrong.  Just what I have experienced in my own family after they realized the church and Joe Smith was bullshit.  

Oh hell, at a young age like that, if I got it in, there definitely would be something "soaked".

I would like to subscribe to your newsletter.  This is absolute truth.  I would add that Joe Smith was a serial adulterer who fucked underage girls.  And lied to Emma.  And then had very convenient revelations that blamed Emma to cover his tracks.  This guy was priceless.  And fucked up my extended family nearly 200 years later.

Yes she is!

This

People treat their wives like crap and cause issues in their families, then blame a Church or a Prophet who's been dead for almost 200 years.   Fortunately, they aren't the majority.

Those same tools used to discredit Mormonism can be used to discredit any religion, simply because religion isn't based on logic or science.

All religions are based on faith and feelings; while there may be some scientific evidence to support certain aspects of one's faith -- for example, there is historical evidence Jesus was a real person -- ultimately it boils down to what one believes is true.  And there's no way to conclusively prove or disprove that.

In a way, Mormonism has an advantage over many other religions in that members are invited to think and "find out the truth for themselves" through their own study and comparison of doctrines.  While this results in a small percentage going the way of Valravn, it also results in a greater percentage becoming even more convinced of the "truth".  Which is why the LDS Church continues to thrive in spite of defections and the confident predictions of the Salt Lake Tribune editorial staff.

I'd soak that!

Good spin.

Let’s dissect that a little shall we?

Who’s example should I follow?  

Christ wasn’t married despite what Mormonism taught once but no longer teaches (Brigham taught that Christ was a polygamist)

Paul wasn’t very kind to women and even speaks against marriage.

Joseph Smith?  At least one documented illicit affair BEFORE god supposedly authorized polygamy. Then went on to marry other mens wives and underage girls, use lies and coercion to force them into marriage, and slander those who rejected him.

All of these things are documented in church released materials that they can no longer hide.

I can go down the line with virtually every prophet and find outdated or outright foolish and abusive teachings about marriage that they spouted and have been subsequently passed over.



To be clear I did not abuse my wife. However we built a relationship based on her relationship with god being filtered through me based on the instruction we received in your temple.

Reading modern day prophets expounding in this oath further cemented that for us.

It was wrong.

It always felt icky. But I accepted it because I trusted and had spiritual experiences that confirmed the church was true.

Then the church changed the covenant in the temple.

The same covenant Joseph Smith and subsequent prophets said was eternal and could not be altered.

They changed the fundamental nature of that covenant.

Again while this was good, all it really did was make me question all of the other mysteries I had been placing in my shelf.

My initial question wasn’t the church’s damnation.

The answers to the others absolutely were.

I only really know them from this amazing Norm MacDonald clip (second half).

I understand that and pretty similar to what I thought you'd say minus some of the specifics about your awakening.

I attend an independent Baptist church but I do not consider myself a Baptist but a Christian.

I think there is a huge amount of harm and corruption that comes from large organized religious bodies that are run top down with one centralized location.. The church should be an independent local body. Not taking their orders from Rome, Salt Lake, or the Southern Baptist convention. Also much easier for the left to get in from the inside and corrupt it which is happening right now with most if not all of the major hierarchical religions that used to be strong platforms of morality and order. ( even if some of those running them were hypocrites )

Some great points. All thought I will take issue with a few things.

That’s the problem with religion as a whole and it lays responsibility at the feet of an uncaring god for all of the evil committed in his name.

If there is no way to know objective truth (no I don’t worship science either) and something as important as eternal salvation hinges on correct interpretation of your feelings it is super vulnerable to abuse.

And a god that will punish you for eternity for
Not believing the exact right things about him with all the options out there but believing your way to the right answer?  That’s patently unfair and that god is an asshole.

We are not given any reliable tool for knowing truth yet expected to pass the exam?  And apostates like me under Mormon doctrine go to outer darkness and are worse off than hitler or Charles Manson because we had the truth and rejected it.

Seems like under that system God hates those who are cursed to know the truth more than anyone.  Literally no advantage to having that truth in this life since those without it can just accept it later.

Why does god hate born Mormons?

Also define thrive when it comes to the church please.

Money?  Yeah they have thrived there.

Membership?  Not really. Less than 30% of men are serving missions now compared to over 53% a decade ago and over 64% when I served.

You claim over 16 million members but based on the admitted numbers of wards and branches the math works out to maybe 4 million active Mormons tops.

The true church is supposed to fill the whole earth yet it doesn’t make up even 1% of the population.

So if god does love Mormons more than anyone else he really is an elitist.  

Aside from financially (thanks to tax free and commanded tithing) church growth isn’t even the modest geometric growth you would expect from a well run corporation. It’s really only growing in Africa now and maybe a few other poorer countries where they don’t have access to all of the truth in the internet in their language yet.

The church is hemmoraging it’s most faithful and it really seems to be picking up steam.

@4:50 Lexi admits to doing it. Great video on soaking.

https://youtu.be/d0rsI9W9BsE

Church members do many things.    I'm helping someone overcome a nicotine addition now.  We certainly aren't perfect.  That doesn't mean it's "a thing" or condoned.

ExMos do even more things.  They leave the Church, but never really leave the Church.

Is there a soaking category on the hub?

I heard you let it soak a little longer after you finish if you want your wife to have boys.

I get that when naïve repressed Mormons start doing things that are questionable Or pushing boundaries they may engage in things like that.

The point is that when this is brought up as a topic there is a certain percentage of people who act like soaking is Mormon doctrine or accepted by the church or the majority of its members. Which it isn’t.

It’s just people rationalizing behavior they shouldn’t have to rationalize for their first time. Some decide to stop and go no further and try to find repentance and others just move on to having sex. Rationalization doesn’t last for long.

It’s quaint, and it’s funny. And doubly so because the church started as a commie frontier sex cult.

Penetration however slight is sufficient to complete the act.

When your founding leader destroyed a printing press, smuggled guns into a jail, shot three people, and got yeeted for his trouble these things happen.

Oh, and this is a gun site. The original story of Joseph Smith's death is ballistically impossible.

Hi Guys checking in


Former Mormon was in many leadership roles.

Wife is a returned missionary-shes smoking hot no pics leg humpers.  We never soaked before we got married but I made it to 2nd base.....alot.

Left the church after finding out about the lies....yes lies...the hidden facts, the denials and the gas lighting...

Presented this to.my wife and she really struggled and I really thought our marriage would end.

But I drew a line in the sand and decided that I have seen too much of God in my life to ever leave him.  So I focused hard on my studies of Christ and his life and I see the issues but I find that I still beleive in the resurrection and consider myself a faithful desciple.

Yeah super hard to find a church but There are many groups of people that beleive and want to do good things in the community.  I associate with then and do all I can to treat my neighbors well, help the down trodden etc.

But nothing gets me hot like an active Mormon that tells me there were no lies, that the prophets are called of God yadi yadi yadi.   Such liars.  

Peace out

There was a Mormon apostle that would argue with you not too many years ago who tried to argue at his excommunication hearing for adultery and set a number inches standard for penetration to be a violation of the law of Chasity.

As I recall he tried to argue that because he didn’t pass that point he hadn’t violated the law.

Weird micropenis flex. ??

I will try to look up the facts of that story and if I have made a mistake in any way I will correct myself. Standby.

Ah perfect example.

Active Mormon saying that if you are an exmormon you do even more sinning that if you are still in the church.

How dare you presume to know such things when men of the church with callings have molested, murdered, fornication and theived, this is the problem with the church it brainwashed em.

I see we’ve watched the same documentary today. Fascinating. Inside job by a future Mormon prophet.

https://whokilledjosephsmith.com/

Taylor shot first.

Prophets are called of God.

Men are men.  Men are imperfect.  All men sin.  Good men repent when they do.  Most ExMos don't.

True Prophets are yes.

Mormon ones are installed after years of cultivating the necessary skills and legalistic double speak to only protect the church

So they claim.

Problem comes when proof is required.

A statement that bold needs backing up or it is indistinguishable from a scam

See you on the other side man.  Won't need to use a handshake to get there.

Latter-day Saint Prophets are called by God.

I'm sure we will.

Yep the porn equivalent to blood on the lens after a cqb scene