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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:31:35 AM EST
[#1]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One of the coolest things we never should have made. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:32:02 AM EST
[#2]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I remember reading a story about some people driving on a road when that happened and one of the passengers was blind. The story was that the flash was so bright that the blind passenger actually saw it. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:33:01 AM EST
[#3]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not if they had not been invented.  Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: The rest of the world would have had them anyway 
You’ve got to be trolling. Nazi’s? They started in ‘39, same year we did. We beat them to it, in no small part to the our allies sabotaging the nazi effort. And because ‘Murica Climb back in your yurt and cuddle your safety blanky |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:33:17 AM EST
[#4]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Not if they had not been invented. While I agree it was bad that we used it, it was clearly the lesser of two evils. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:37:54 AM EST
[#5]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Maybe it did it’s job preventing another global war? And it did it’s job stopping the madness the imperial Japanese started, saving several hundred thousand more American deaths in the process possibly. I still cant believe people still think they will launch them all at once in a future conflict. Too many 80s scare movies. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:38:56 AM EST
[#6]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
One of the coolest things we never should have made. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:39:30 AM EST
[#7]
Quote HistoryQuoted: How is what a question in my mind? Your statement and the inner workings of my mind do not correlate synonymously. As impressive as a nuclear weapon is, eventually it is going to be very bad for the world. So as of now they have definitely saved more lives than they taken given mutually assured distruction scenarios and the tensions that have risen between the U.S and Russia/USSR in particular. The two dropped in WWII took fewer lives than alternative solutions were going to take. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:41:46 AM EST
[#8]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I guess it depends on your definition of the word. If you were one of the 500,000 GIs who would have died during a mainland invasion I think the option would have the weight of being "forced". We are still issuing purple hearts that were originally minted for that planned invasion. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:45:57 AM EST
[#9]
A small piece of Trinitite is one of the coolest things I own. I'd like to get some Hiroshimite and Nagasakite to round it out.
My neighbor in the mid 2000's was a marine during the war. Fought at Iwo, and rode through the harbor at Hiroshima after the war. Said the city looked like a tornado made of fire hit it. It's amazing to have known someone that lived through and saw the things that he did. RIP Maurice. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:46:17 AM EST
[#10]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Japanese weren’t surrendering. Hell, they didn’t surrender after we dropped the first one. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:49:47 AM EST
[#11]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Why is that? Pretty much ended the wars of 10s of millions dying and pushed them into smaller scale conflicts |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:49:53 AM EST
[#12]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Allegedly and speculatively but thats a different conversation, forced means just that. Conventional bombings (may have been sufficient to level the entire country) and ground assault may or may not have yielded the numbers spoken of here but again thats a different conversation that I bet its too late to be certain of. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: I guess it depends on your definition of the word. If you were one of the 500,000 GIs who would have died during a mainland invasion I think the option would have the weight of being "forced". We are still issuing purple hearts that were originally minted for that planned invasion. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:51:15 AM EST
[#13]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Nuclear weapons were an inevitability. Their potential was theorized decades before we actually built one. We were fortunate to get there first and build that deterrent before some other country hostile to us did. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:51:48 AM EST
[#14]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Allegedly and speculatively but thats a different conversation, forced means just that. Conventional bombings (may have been sufficient to level the entire country) and ground assault may or may not have yielded the numbers spoken of here but again thats a different conversation that I bet its too late to be certain of. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:52:17 AM EST
[#15]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Forget the invasion of Japan. Had the US and USSR not had MAD, we would've gone toe to toe with them multiple times in a conventional meat grinder. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:52:31 AM EST
[#16]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Meh. Someone was going to make it first. Better us than "them". |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:53:26 AM EST
[#17]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
No, it was a choice between that or sending several hundred thousand US soldiers to invade Japan, which most certainly would have resulted in mass casualties on our side. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:54:45 AM EST
[#18]
Efforts to impede the Nazi's and the Japs' efforts to build a nuclear weapon are detailed in this book, along with a lot of other unusual missions.
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:54:57 AM EST
[#19]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You’ve got to be trolling. Nazi’s? They started in ‘39, same year we did. We beat them to it, in no small part to the our allies sabotaging the nazi effort. And because ‘Murica Climb back in your yurt and cuddle your safety blanky |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:55:36 AM EST
[#20]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Absolutely, but that's not what i was saying. That Nuke's will lead to humankinds destruction? |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 9:59:27 AM EST
[#21]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You proceed on the false assumption that other countries have them because we did first. The atomic genie was out of the bottle prior to WW2. Pop quiz: is the human race better or worse off because of the invention of gunpowder? Pop quizzes should have a definitive answer not based on biased opinions but for the record I am happy with the invention of gunpowder, that shits fun. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:00:20 AM EST
[#22]
Like many things of that era...it was all developed with pencil and paper and pure human intellect.
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:00:44 AM EST
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Maybe it did it’s job preventing another global war? And it did it’s job stopping the madness the imperial Japanese started, saving several hundred thousand more American deaths in the process possibly. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:01:18 AM EST
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Absolutely, but that's not what i was saying. 
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:01:54 AM EST
[#25]
Made possible by beautiful plutonium made right here at the Hanford Site
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:02:45 AM EST
[#26]
Quote HistoryQuoted: According to the letter that Albert Einstein wrote to FDR in 1939 the Nazis were already were working on them. Not as far along as they thought, but getting there. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:04:19 AM EST
[#27]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The Trinity fireball http://www.atomicarchive.com/Photos/Trinity/images/SB27.jpg A subsequent nuclear test. https://i.stack.imgur.com/2mt4P.jpg The shot tower can barely be seen below the fireball. The bright protrusions coming from the fireball are the tower guy wires being vaporized by the intense X-ray radiation. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:04:27 AM EST
[#28]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
8/6/45 |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:05:55 AM EST
[#29]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Yeah, we all know that but we certainly were not forced. We had a new weapon and we wanted to try it out, the Japanese just gave us a reasonable opportunity. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
The Japanese would not give up, even when they were beaten. They would do anything to stave off defeat. Futile banzai charges, waves of kamikaze attacks. https://i.guim.co.uk/img/media/e040c00349732a663f3d1e1f7ade3bcaacc6b627/195_87_1793_1346/master/1793.jpg?width=700&quality=85&auto=format&fit=max&s=69593e5b085b00e602f75b8a4ea263cdhttp://darbysrangers.tripod.com/Okinawa/0e77c120.gif https://49fe30bb3aa7406c16dc-5c968119d095dc32d807923c59347cc2.ssl.cf1.rackcdn.com/2015.063.016_1.jpg 
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:07:02 AM EST
[#30]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
90% of the Japanese merchant marine was sunk so food from the continent was not forthcoming. Considering we could have been more humane and defoliated that island; starving millions of Japanese indiscriminately, I think the bomb was more merciful. We were also going to use poison gas if we invaded. This was not to harm the Japanese military (they had gas masks) but the civilian infrastructure that supported the military effort. Dropping the bomb was more humane. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:07:14 AM EST
[#31]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I think there were some critical defections of scientists from Germany that played a hand too. 
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:09:39 AM EST
[#32]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Stoner appears to be appropriate in more ways than one with some of the replies |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:11:08 AM EST
[#33]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What was your grand plat to bring the war to the fastest conclusion with the least amount of casualties on both sides? After being given the chance to surrender Japan mobilized it's entire population to fight the Allies to the last man, woman and child for their Emperor. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:11:19 AM EST
[#34]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Made possible by beautiful plutonium made right here at the Hanford Site |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:11:57 AM EST
[#35]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You’re right. It would have been better if we let the Germans get one first. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:13:27 AM EST
[#36]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
You’ve got to be trolling. Nazi’s? They started in ‘39, same year we did. We beat them to it, in no small part to the our allies sabotaging the nazi effort. And because ‘Murica Climb back in your yurt and cuddle your safety blanky |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:14:10 AM EST
[#37]
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:15:07 AM EST
[#38]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Thats when we used it. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:15:38 AM EST
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
The rest of the world would have had them anyway Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: Oh sure, and now the rest of the world has them. Its only a matter of time before a despot comes to power and shit goes off like the 4th. It wasn’t some secret concept that nobody else ever dreamed up. The Germans also had an active nuclear program as did the Japanese and the Soviets. Nuclear weapons were going to happen with or without us. Being the first to the party undoubtedly spared us from being the victim of them. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:16:09 AM EST
[#40]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Do you know how foolish that sounds, and why? Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
Stoner appears to be appropriate in more ways than one with some of the replies |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:16:21 AM EST
[#41]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not if they had not been invented. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: The rest of the world would have had them anyway |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:16:25 AM EST
[#42]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Sorry, but of those working on the bomb, we were fortunate to be the first. The bomb would have been invented anyway. Hitler would have been happy to use it. So would the Japanese (Germany was sending a U-boat, U-235, that had uranium aboardship). If the Japanese had it, bye bye 3rd (or 5th, depending on the admiral in command) Fleet. While I agree it was bad that we used it, it was clearly the lesser of two evils. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:16:36 AM EST
[#43]
The ATOMIC AGE brought to your living room window! Fun times!
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:16:58 AM EST
[#44]
Quote HistoryQuoted: You mean other than the fact it saved millions of lives? |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:18:40 AM EST
[#45]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
I do not troll. Not invented means just that. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
You’ve got to be trolling. Nazi’s? They started in ‘39, same year we did. We beat them to it, in no small part to the our allies sabotaging the nazi effort. And because ‘Murica Climb back in your yurt and cuddle your safety blanky Period. Man will always push to make shit that will destroy ourselves. Have you not seen terminator? |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:19:51 AM EST
[#46]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Well I disagree with you here. Since two were dropped to end WWII they have SAVED LIVES. Your eventuality has yet to materialize so cannot be proven. So as of now they have definitely saved more lives than they taken given mutually assured distruction scenarios and the tensions that have risen between the U.S and Russia/USSR in particular. The two dropped in WWII took fewer lives than alternative solutions were going to take. 
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:19:53 AM EST
[#47]
There is some weapons grade derp in this thread.
My dad was at Parris Island when the bombs were used. He’d have probably bought the farm if they hadn’t been dropped. The Japanese earned every last fission event that happened over their savage asses. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:21:13 AM EST
[#48]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Not if they had not been invented. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted: The rest of the world would have had them anyway Do you have such a scenario or are pontificating on the impossible? |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:22:43 AM EST
[#49]
Quote HistoryQuoted:
Im not disagreeing with any of that other than we had people on the project that absolutely wanted to see those bombs in operation. Quote HistoryQuoted:
Quoted:
NO, that is a decades-later modern Liberal interpretation. The truth is that even with the firebombing of Japanese cities, the Japanese would not give up. The firebombing of Tokyo in March of '45 had, 88 to 97,000 people killed 40,000 to 125K were injured, and over a million residents lost their homes but they still would not surrender. The atomic bombs gave us the one plane, one bomb, one city solution that saved valuable American lives and shortened the war. THAT is the Truth. ETA: better numbers. |
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Posted: 7/16/2019 10:22:57 AM EST
[#50]
Quote HistoryQuoted: I greatly admire your determination to prove your ignorance. Applying the same level to a more useful purpose might result in a cure for cancer or some other equally desirable out come. |
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