[ARCHIVED THREAD] - POTUS security breach question (Page 1 of 3)
Posted: 11/27/2009 7:09:04 PM EDT
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I've been reading a lot of backpedaling by the SS over the security breach surrounding that couple that bluffed there way into the WH state dinner.
SS released a statement saying that the couple never made contact with Obama so the threat was "minimal". Now a picture has surfaced of them shaking hands with O and serious fingerpointing has started. SS states that even though they "crashed" the party that they were still a minimal threat as they were thoroughly scanned and no weapons were detected. The picture that I saw showed no SS protection within a good 6 - 8 feet of POTUS. And if the couple had meant harm then getting close enough to shake his hand puts them well within the proximity to due great harm if they were trained for it. Well lets toss a couple of what-ifs - what if one or both of the couple were higly trained martial artists? What if the woman had her nails embedded with ricin poison, etc and scratched O? I'm guessing heads will roll within the SS detail over this- I dont care who the POTUS is this type of "oops" is unacceptable. So how can the SS service with a straight face release a statement that no one was in any danger when it was obvious no one gave this couple a second look once they were in? |
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Quoted: Well lets toss a couple of what-ifs - what if one or both of the couple were higly trained martial artists? What if the woman had her nails embedded with ricin poison, etc and scratched O? A well-trained assassin could have easily killed him or anyone else in the room with that level of proximity. The KGB has done it many times. No different than when he shakes hands at any other event. It is a known risk. They are just trying to make the sheep think he was still safe. By "ricin poison" I assume you are referring to Georgi Markov? |
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They went through the same stuff everyone else did So unless they had plastic knives and a death wish BHO was fine Some SS are now doing research instead of POTUS duty though Most political assassins seem to not let getting killed after the hit stop them. |
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Well lets toss a couple of what-ifs - what if one or both of the couple were higly trained martial artists? What if the woman had her nails embedded with ricin poison, etc and scratched O? A well-trained assassin could have easily killed him or anyone else in the room with that level of proximity. The KGB has done it many times. No different than when he shakes hands at any other event. It is a known risk. They are just trying to make the sheep think he was still safe. By "ricin poison" I assume you are referring to Georgi Markov? I think "ricin poison" referred to the poison extracted from Caster Beans..... |
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They went through the same stuff everyone else did So unless they had plastic knives and a death wish BHO was fine Some SS are now doing research instead of POTUS duty though Two people with training and a will to do it can kill/maim a man before you can shoot them in a crowd of heads of state. |
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I think nobody will admit this, and in fact would go to great lengths to deny it, but my personal suspicion is that Obama's security detail is generally less than enthusiastic about their jobs. I would be inclined to believe that most of them are disgusted with the man they have to protect and have little if any reason to like him. I believe that Obama shows them no respect, courtesy, or appreciation. And I think that an inevitable result of all that is a reduced level of attention to detail in their duties. I would not blame them. Granted, I'll never be on a Presidential protection detail. But if I were, and I was assigned to Ronald Reagan or a man of similar stature, I would have no problem taking a bullet for such a great man and genuine leader. But for this clown? I think I'd just have to duck. In actual fact if I were assigned to that detail, somebody would have screwed up as it's a job I wouldn't want. I would not protect THAT man from harm if it required putting myself in mortal danger to do so. I have no respect for him and consider him to be the most appalling political disaster America has yet seen. I would make a LOUSY bodyguard for him. I'm sure of that. CJ |
| It's disturbing that they weren't inviting and were able to talk their ways in. They still went through security so I don't see how the risk was that much greater than anyone else on the large guest list.Really, if someone wanted to kill the POTUS, it would happen, but at the end of the day it doesn't make much sense. I guess that's why only crazies kill US presidents. |
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Just a guess: The problem will be traced back to a failure at the Uniformed Division - not the agents. too late –– the SS has already rolled it up and tied it around their own necks: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_state_dinner_uninvited_guests (Secret Service Director Mark Sullivan) Sullivan said, "The preliminary findings of our internal investigation have determined established protocols were not followed at an initial checkpoint, verifying that two individuals were on the guest list.
"Although these individuals went through magnetometers and other levels of screening, they should have been prohibited from entering the event entirely. That failing is ours," he said. summary: protection detail lead will see out his days guarding a shed full of garden tools at camp david. those protection agents who forgot what the hell they were supposed to be doing at the ingress checkpoint will be reassigned to photocopying redacted historical documents, forever. ar-jedi |
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I think nobody will admit this, and in fact would go to great lengths to deny it, but my personal suspicion is that Obama's security detail is generally less than enthusiastic about their jobs. I would be inclined to believe that most of them are disgusted with the man they have to protect and have little if any reason to like him. I believe that Obama shows them no respect, courtesy, or appreciation. And I think that an inevitable result of all that is a reduced level of attention to detail in their duties. I think you don't understand the kinds of men and women who rise to the presidential protection detail. Regardless of how little the man is liked, his assassination would be FAR worse than anything he does while in office. Granted, I'll never be on a Presidential protection detail. But if I were, and I was assigned to Ronald Reagan or a man of similar stature, I would have no problem
taking a bullet for such a great man and genuine leader. But for this clown? I think I'd just have to duck. In actual fact if I were assigned to that detail, somebody would have screwed up as it's a job I wouldn't want. I would not protect THAT man from harm if it required putting myself in mortal danger to do so. I have no respect for him and consider him to be the most appalling political disaster America has yet seen. I would make a LOUSY bodyguard for him. I'm sure of that. So, I'm guessing you assume that when you run for Senate and win, your bodyguards will all agree with your policies and decisions? |
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Just a guess: The problem will be traced back to a failure at the Uniformed Division - not the agents. too late –– the SS has already rolled it up and tied it around their own necks: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_state_dinner_uninvited_guests (Secret Service Director Mark Sullivan) Sullivan said, "The preliminary findings of our internal investigation have determined established protocols were not followed at an initial checkpoint, verifying that two individuals were on the guest list.
"Although these individuals went through magnetometers and other levels of screening, they should have been prohibited from entering the event entirely. That failing is ours," he said. summary: protection detail lead will see out his days guarding a shed full of garden tools at camp david. those protection agents who forgot what the hell they were supposed to be doing at the ingress checkpoint will be reassigned to photocopying redacted historical documents, forever. ar-jedi The cited information doesn't disagree with my guess. The Uniformed Division *is* USSS. |
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I think nobody will admit this, and in fact would go to great lengths to deny it, but my personal suspicion is that Obama's security detail is generally less than enthusiastic about their jobs. I would be inclined to believe that most of them are disgusted with the man they have to protect and have little if any reason to like him. I believe that Obama shows them no respect, courtesy, or appreciation. And I think that an inevitable result of all that is a reduced level of attention to detail in their duties. I would not blame them. Granted, I'll never be on a Presidential protection detail. But if I were, and I was assigned to Ronald Reagan or a man of similar stature, I would have no problem taking a bullet for such a great man and genuine leader. But for this clown? I think I'd just have to duck. In actual fact if I were assigned to that detail, somebody would have screwed up as it's a job I wouldn't want. I would not protect THAT man from harm if it required putting myself in mortal danger to do so. I have no respect for him and consider him to be the most appalling political disaster America has yet seen. I would make a LOUSY bodyguard for him. I'm sure of that. CJ I can see the headline now: "POTUS shot during assassination attempt. Hit twice by assassin and 17 times by SS agent" |
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Quoted: I think nobody will admit this, and in fact would go to great lengths to deny it, but my personal suspicion is that Obama's security detail is generally less than enthusiastic about their jobs. I would be inclined to believe that most of them are disgusted with the man they have to protect and have little if any reason to like him. |
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I think nobody will admit this, and in fact would go to great lengths to deny it, but my personal suspicion is that Obama's security detail is generally less than enthusiastic about their jobs. i believe you have just grossly underestimated the level of professionalism of the protective agents of the united states secret service. similarly, if Obama commands the SEALs/Delta to a just mission, do they consider the source and act "less enthusiastic about the job"? ar-jedi |
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Just to throw a little curveball, what if the whole thing was a setup by Obama to discredit the Secret Service and to justify a need for his own "Praetorian Guard"?
We all know how he wants his own National Civilian Security Force. What better way to justify it than this? LC |
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Just to throw a little curveball, what if the whole thing was a setup by Obama to discredit the Secret Service and to justify a need for his own "Praetorian Guard"? We all know how he wants his own National Civilian Security Force. What better way to justify it than this? LC HAHA! you might want to read up on the shenanigans of the Praetorian Guard when they thought Ceasar was getting too upity. |
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Quoted: Just to throw a little curveball, what if the whole thing was a setup by Obama to discredit the Secret Service and to justify a need for his own "Praetorian Guard"? We all know how he wants his own National Civilian Security Force. What better way to justify it than this? LC WOW! That's some good tin foil! I know where he can get those guards: 
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Quoted: Quoted: I think nobody will admit this, and in fact would go to great lengths to deny it, but my personal suspicion is that Obama's security detail is generally less than enthusiastic about their jobs. I would be inclined to believe that most of them are disgusted with the man they have to protect and have little if any reason to like him. I believe that Obama shows them no respect, courtesy, or appreciation. And I think that an inevitable result of all that is a reduced level of attention to detail in their duties. I think you don't understand the kinds of men and women who rise to the presidential protection detail. Regardless of how little the man is liked, his assassination would be FAR worse than anything he does while in office. Granted, I'll never be on a Presidential protection detail. But if I were, and I was assigned to Ronald Reagan or a man of similar stature, I would have no problem taking a bullet for such a great man and genuine leader. But for this clown? I think I'd just have to duck. In actual fact if I were assigned to that detail, somebody would have screwed up as it's a job I wouldn't want. I would not protect THAT man from harm if it required putting myself in mortal danger to do so. I have no respect for him and consider him to be the most appalling political disaster America has yet seen. I would make a LOUSY bodyguard for him. I'm sure of that. So, I'm guessing you assume that when you run for Senate and win, your bodyguards will all agree with your policies and decisions? I'd be pretty sure to select people who generally agree with my positions, yes. It's a safe bet that high post count members of DU wouldn't be selected.  CJ |
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Quoted: Quoted: I think nobody will admit this, and in fact would go to great lengths to deny it, but my personal suspicion is that Obama's security detail is generally less than enthusiastic about their jobs. i believe you have just grossly underestimated the level of professionalism of the protective agents of the united states secret service. similarly, if Obama commands the SEALs/Delta to a just mission, do they consider the source and act "less enthusiastic about the job"? ar-jedi Have you read or even scanned the book "In the President’s Secret Service: Behind the Scenes with Agents in the Line of Fire and the Presidents They Protect" yet? If not, please do so and then get back to me on that, OK? CJ |
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I think nobody will admit this, and in fact would go to great lengths to deny it, but my personal suspicion is that Obama's security detail is generally less than enthusiastic about their jobs. i believe you have just grossly underestimated the level of professionalism of the protective agents of the united states secret service. similarly, if Obama commands the SEALs/Delta to a just mission, do they consider the source and act "less enthusiastic about the job"? ar-jedi Have you read or even scanned the book "In the President’s Secret Service: Behind the Scenes with Agents in the Line of Fire and the Presidents They Protect" yet? If not, please do so and then get back to me on that, OK?
CJ Oh.... well.... if a BOOK says that the USSS is unprofessional, it must be true...  Those men and women do their job - a little more gratitude and a little less tinfoil would probably be in order. I don't care how well-like the POTUS is, no one is "enthusiastic" about taking a bullet for another person.
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I honestly don't understand why the president is given the level of protection they are. "The president" is merely an office, and there are quite a lot of people ready to take the president's place at any given time.
Of course no human being is replaceable, but why should one person get all this protection? |
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I'm confused about the down side. If this guy dies in office, he will be remembered as "the fallen savior". One who was struck down in his prime before he could fulfil his destiny. If he lives through his term, he will be exposed as the naive, liberal, race whore that he really is. On the other hand, even Carter is trying to make a comeback. -Z |
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I think nobody will admit this, and in fact would go to great lengths to deny it, but my personal suspicion is that Obama's security detail is generally less than enthusiastic about their jobs. I would be inclined to believe that most of them are disgusted with the man they have to protect and have little if any reason to like him. Got a link ? I didn't know that kind of data was out there ? |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: I think nobody will admit this, and in fact would go to great lengths to deny it, but my personal suspicion is that Obama's security detail is generally less than enthusiastic about their jobs. I would be inclined to believe that most of them are disgusted with the man they have to protect and have little if any reason to like him. Got a link ? I didn't know that kind of data was out there ? |
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I honestly don't understand why the president is given the level of protection they are. "The president" is merely an office, and there are quite a lot of people ready to take the president's place at any given time. Of course no human being is replaceable, but why should one person get all this protection? Because we have elections and Presidents are elected by the people. It isn't a system of musical chairs where "lots of people" fill in for the President - like a talk show guest host. 
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Quoted: I've been reading a lot of backpedaling by the SS over the security breach surrounding that couple that bluffed there way into the WH state dinner. SS released a statement saying that the couple never made contact with Obama so the threat was "minimal". Now a picture has surfaced of them shaking hands with O and serious fingerpointing has started. SS states that even though they "crashed" the party that they were still a minimal threat as they were thoroughly scanned and no weapons were detected. The picture that I saw showed no SS protection within a good 6 - 8 feet of POTUS. And if the couple had meant harm then getting close enough to shake his hand puts them well within the proximity to due great harm if they were trained for it. Well lets toss a couple of what-ifs - what if one or both of the couple were higly trained martial artists? What if the woman had her nails embedded with ricin poison, etc and scratched O? I'm guessing heads will roll within the SS detail over this- I dont care who the POTUS is this type of "oops" is unacceptable. So how can the SS service with a straight face release a statement that no one was in any danger when it was obvious no one gave this couple a second look once they were in? The 'breach' was that they didn't have an invite... They still got the search/metal-detection/X-ray/etc.... treatment.... So they were no real 'threat' because they were 'clean', even though they were uninvited... Secret Service, unlike TSA, actually knows how to do their job.... The failure, was on the part of whoever handles the guest list... |
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I am sure that this couple was not threat.
But puttingforth the assertion that just because someone has gone through a security screen means that they pose no threat is just silly. The person is the weapon, not the tools that are brought to the fight. This couple was not a threat. The next couple to pull this off? Who knows. -Z |
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Quoted: I can't vouch for the info but I wouldn't be so surprised. Many (most?) govt employees will vote for the guy spending money on their department.Quoted: Quoted: Got a link ? I didn't know that kind of data was out there ?Quoted: Are you kidding? Statistically more USSS/PP folks voted for BHO than Bush. I think nobody will admit this, and in fact would go to great lengths to deny it, but my personal suspicion is that Obama's security detail is generally less than enthusiastic about their jobs. I would be inclined to believe that most of them are disgusted with the man they have to protect and have little if any reason to like him. |
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The 'breach' was that they didn't have an invite... They still got the search/metal-detection/X-ray/etc.... treatment.... So they were no real 'threat' because they were 'clean', even though they were uninvited... Secret Service, unlike TSA, actually knows how to do their job.... The failure, was on the part of whoever handles the guest list... Not totally correct - background checks are done on people attending events like this -not on the list = not 'clean' = potential danger |
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Well lets toss a couple of what-ifs - what if one or both of the couple were higly trained martial artists? What if the woman had her nails embedded with ricin poison, etc and scratched O? A well-trained assassin could have easily killed him or anyone else in the room with that level of proximity. The KGB has done it many times. No different than when he shakes hands at any other event. It is a known risk. They are just trying to make the sheep think he was still safe. By "ricin poison" I assume you are referring to Georgi Markov? Didn't the serial assassin in Molon Labe! kill a senator by shaking hands with him? Had poison and a liquid that helped the poison absorb into the skin in a tiny plastic pouch glued to his thumb. Shook hands, it oozed onto the senator's hand (his own was protected), and the senator just thought the guy was sweaty or washed his hands a lot. Then five minutes, dead. I may hate Obama's guts, but this kind of security breach is inexcusable. |
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I honestly don't understand why the president is given the level of protection they are. "The president" is merely an office, and there are quite a lot of people ready to take the president's place at any given time. Of course no human being is replaceable, but why should one person get all this protection? You win 100 internets for dumbest post of the week. |
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I honestly don't understand why the president is given the level of protection they are. "The president" is merely an office, and there are quite a lot of people ready to take the president's place at any given time. Of course no human being is replaceable, but why should one person get all this protection? Some animals are more equal than others. |