[ARCHIVED THREAD] - Rule 2e?? (Page 1 of 2)
Posted: 1/18/2003 8:29:22 PM EDT
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WTF is up with this?? 2e) No attacks on members of Law Enforcement or Military. These people put their lives at risk every day for you, respect their efforts. Discussions pertaining to SPECIFIC incidents are allowed, but bashing our Armed Forces or LEOs simply because you got a speeding ticket will not be tolerated. I can understand the militray....but LEOs?? Hell, they got their own forum, now this?? How special are we going to treat them? Yeah, it's not my house so I have to live by the rules.....but this is rediculous. I am able to stand on my two feet and hold my ground, why can't they?? Soory, I respect Goatboy and always supported him. But this should go. Next I won't be able to bitch about my government either. And BTW.....I put my F'ing back on the line everyday at my job too. So where the hell is my special forum Huh?? Sgtar15 |
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Of all classes of Americans to need protection, LEO's are the last to need it. I'd only criticize military personel who had conducted themselves poorly, as I would do the same with LEO's. However, the difference in LEO's lies in the fact that they violate the constitution on a daily basis in various states and they deserve that ridicule on a case by case basis. If the new policy merely attempts to stop me from saying, "flatfoot pig" or something else stupid, then it is a good policy, unless a cop is really flat footed and generally has a look about him that can be described as "swine like." Anyway, I'd like more clarification on this policy as well. Forbidding "bashing" of LEO's because of a traffic stop just seems stupid. What better discussion to have than our PERSONNAL interactions and not just what we read in a story or see on tv?? For example, a thread started last week about the guy that was acting as a good samaritan and was then cuffed and held on the ground while he was "cleared" is a prime example of police misbehavior and should be thoroughly discussed. It can be very understandable in that instance for the author to be very unhappy and hostile. Would censoring him make much sense? Why should cops be above scrutiny? I'd really like a further clarification of this policy, so can someone tell us what its about? EDITED TO ADD: Sukebe, you're acting like a juvinile jackass, I hope you don't present yourself like this on the job also. |
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Quoted: Quoted: [lolabove] I support LEOs in general and dont mind them having their own forum...but your attitude SUCKS right here in this thread! Sad really. You have now seperated yourself. I just think it's funny that people get worked up over such trivial things. This is the internet for Christs sake! People who take things that seriously need to be laughed at. "You have now seperated yourself"[lol] Too funny man, really, you're killing me! |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: [lolabove] I support LEOs in general and dont mind them having their own forum...but your attitude SUCKS right here in this thread! Sad really. You have now seperated yourself. I just think it's funny that people get worked up over such trivial things. This is the internet for Christs sake! People who take things that seriously need to be laughed at. "You have now seperated yourself"[lol] Too funny man, really, you're killing me! So, by your logic, you don't want or need rule 2e then? |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: [lolabove] I support LEOs in general and dont mind them having their own forum...but your attitude SUCKS right here in this thread! Sad really. You have now seperated yourself. I just think it's funny that people get worked up over such trivial things. This is the internet for Christs sake! People who take things that seriously need to be laughed at. "You have now seperated yourself"[lol] Too funny man, really, you're killing me! So, by your logic, you don't want or need rule 2e then? No, I don't want it or need it. What matters is what the owners want or need. Clearly I can dish it out. I assure you, I can take it. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: [lolabove] I support LEOs in general and dont mind them having their own forum...but your attitude SUCKS right here in this thread! Sad really. You have now seperated yourself. I just think it's funny that people get worked up over such trivial things. This is the internet for Christs sake! People who take things that seriously need to be laughed at. "You have now seperated yourself"[lol] Too funny man, really, you're killing me! LOL...OK...continue to feed it then. Enjoy. |
| If you guys can wipe the tears from your eyes for a moment, I think the purpose of 2e is to try to prevent idiots posting things such as "JBT's should die tasting their own blood!", crap like that. I wouldnt take it to seriously, I dont think I need it, but GB thought it was necessary. |
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Quoted: If you guys can wipe the tears from your eyes for a moment, I think the purpose of 2e is to try to prevent idiots posting things such as "JBT's should die tasting their own blood!", crap like that. I wouldnt take it to seriously, I dont think I need it, but GB thought it was necessary. That type of conduct is already banned. Why the additional rule is needed, I don't know. This is an awfully good parallel to something we all bitch about here. Does anyone else get it? |
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Well, I might not start bashing LEOs because of a traffic ticket, but I sure would like to start bitching when they lie about seeing "seeds and stems" in my trash as an excuse for PC to gain illegal entry into my home and then drag me out of said home with a felony arrest. And then this same pair of assclown-detectives go through our caller ID and use the exact same M.O. ("that there is mareegeewanna seeds in yore trash")to gain illegal entrance into a friend's home. When I have this happen to me personally, coupled with the attitudes exhibited by a few of the LEOs on this board, I find it hard to refrain from bashing where bashing is deserved. Was there pot smoking going on? Absolutely! Should LEOs stoop to illegal tactics to bust a couple of pot smokers? Absolutely not! Save the illegal stuff for the war on terrorism! I've already had one thread nuked for pure trolling pleasure, I'll stop here. |
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[i]"To make laws that man cannot, and will not obey, serves to bring all law into contempt."[/i] - Elizabeth Cady Stanton Unless this fundamental problem is addressed, LEOs' will continue to be "bashed" because they are the ones enforcing these increasingly contemptible laws. ...And the rift between LEOs' & average citizens widens with the passage of each new law. [V] |
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If you read it, you will notice it is a general "bashing" which is being targeted. I am sick of "JBT" comments and insults thrown by some poor slob who got a speeding ticket. If there's a specific incident which needs to be discussed, then it's acceptable. I'm not telling you to like this group or that group, I am asking for the general bullshit abuse to end. Why? Because I am sick of the "kill cops" and "them versus us" attitudes some people have. Freedom of speech is what you make of it. Go ahead and tell your story if you have one. Go ahead and discuss a news story. Make fun of specific idiots who can't do their jobs, much as you would anyone else. I simply don't want to see our military or leo's attacked as groups because someone disagrees with this country's laws. Doesn't that seem fair enough to you? |
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Quoted: If you read it, you will notice it is a general "bashing" which is being targeted. I am sick of "JBT" comments and insults thrown by some poor slob who got a speeding ticket. If there's a specific incident which needs to be discussed, then it's acceptable. I'm not telling you to like this group or that group, I am asking for the general bullshit abuse to end. Why? Because I am sick of the "kill cops" and "them versus us" attitudes some people have. Freedom of speech is what you make of it. Go ahead and tell your story if you have one. Go ahead and discuss a news story. Make fun of specific idiots who can't do their jobs, much as you would anyone else. I simply don't want to see our military or leo's attacked as groups because someone disagrees with this country's laws. Doesn't that seem fair enough to you? After reading your explanation, It makes me wonder why this was needed in the first place. It would seem that what you were trying to accomplish could have been done with the existing rules. I just don't see how you can single out ONE specific group and give them special protection. If LEO's deserve this protection, why not everyone ? Maybe it's not the rule so much as "certain mods" that will take every opportunity to abuse it to suit their own personal agenda. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: [lolabove] I support LEOs in general and dont mind them having their own forum...but your attitude SUCKS right here in this thread! Sad really. You have now seperated yourself. [red]I just think it's funny that people get worked up over such trivial things. This is the internet for Christs sake! People who take things that seriously need to be laughed at.[/red] "You have now seperated yourself"[lol] Too funny man, really, you're killing me! So why do you think this policy was instituted?? Could it be some leo's took some comments "seriously", and whined about it? I saw one cop post that he wouldn't join the team because of the bashing by a FEW members.... |
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I've not been keeping up with the site for the past few days, so I don't know what specific post brought about rule 2e, but I really don't think it's needed. I just hope that several people will realize the constant "JBT' bullshitt really enforces a very negative perception of gun owners in general and this site in particular. There is a VERY large visitor audience out there, probably the largest of any gun site on the web. There is a larger goal than just trolling. If that's your abiding passion go to FC.com |
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Quoted: Quoted: If you read it, you will notice it is a general "bashing" which is being targeted. I am sick of "JBT" comments and insults thrown by some poor slob who got a speeding ticket. If there's a specific incident which needs to be discussed, then it's acceptable. I'm not telling you to like this group or that group, I am asking for the general bullshit abuse to end. Why? Because I am sick of the "kill cops" and "them versus us" attitudes some people have. Freedom of speech is what you make of it. Go ahead and tell your story if you have one. Go ahead and discuss a news story. Make fun of specific idiots who can't do their jobs, much as you would anyone else. I simply don't want to see our military or leo's attacked as groups because someone disagrees with this country's laws. Doesn't that seem fair enough to you? After reading your explanation, It makes me wonder why this was needed in the first place. It would seem that what you were trying to accomplish could have been done with the existing rules. I just don't see how you can single out ONE specific group and give them special protection. If LEO's deserve this protection, why not everyone ? Maybe it's not the rule so much as "certain mods" that will take every opportunity to abuse it to suit their own personal agenda. True enough. I will roll a small comment into the existing "bashing" rule. Damnit, yer so smart sometime. [;)] The goal of this is the same. I dont mind specific discussions, but I dont want to see the bashing of general groups of people. (Except lawyers, people with foul breath, and carnies... they have such small hands... [=D]) |
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A fair assessment of the problem is the interpretation of which topics and posts are offensive, and since this is left up to the discretion and interpretation of each moderator, it will continue to be a point of discord and argument. Anyone that has cruised this site for long surely knows that the entire spectrum of political and social opinion is represented by the site members; there is never going to be consensus on any topic (except perhaps the need to preserve the 2nd Amendment, and use the spell checker!). While I am writing this, I can't come up with an alternative - if everyone is expected to treat each other with respect, that will surely get slammed. A plea to get along is nearly laughable. A plea for tolerance is too broad and will be contrued to advocate some behavior that is repugnant to some block of members, but perfectly acceptable to another. I don't recall the poster yesterday, but I echo his words, "I fear the Republic truly is lost." We are all diminished. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: If you read it, you will notice it is a general "bashing" which is being targeted. I am sick of "JBT" comments and insults thrown by some poor slob who got a speeding ticket. If there's a specific incident which needs to be discussed, then it's acceptable. I'm not telling you to like this group or that group, I am asking for the general bullshit abuse to end. Why? Because I am sick of the "kill cops" and "them versus us" attitudes some people have. Freedom of speech is what you make of it. Go ahead and tell your story if you have one. Go ahead and discuss a news story. Make fun of specific idiots who can't do their jobs, much as you would anyone else. I simply don't want to see our military or leo's attacked as groups because someone disagrees with this country's laws. Doesn't that seem fair enough to you? After reading your explanation, It makes me wonder why this was needed in the first place. It would seem that what you were trying to accomplish could have been done with the existing rules. I just don't see how you can single out ONE specific group and give them special protection. If LEO's deserve this protection, why not everyone ? Maybe it's not the rule so much as "certain mods" that will take every opportunity to abuse it to suit their own personal agenda. True enough. I will roll a small comment into the existing "bashing" rule. Damnit, yer so smart sometime. [;)] The goal of this is the same. I dont mind specific discussions, but I dont want to see the bashing of general groups of people. (Except lawyers, people with foul breath, and carnies... they have such small hands... [=D]) Now those groups need bashing !! [:D] Those carnies.....and clowns **shiver** |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: [lolabove] I support LEOs in general and dont mind them having their own forum...but your attitude SUCKS right here in this thread! Sad really. You have now seperated yourself. [red]I just think it's funny that people get worked up over such trivial things. This is the internet for Christs sake! People who take things that seriously need to be laughed at.[/red] "You have now seperated yourself"[lol] Too funny man, really, you're killing me! So why do you think this policy was instituted?? Could it be some leo's took some comments "seriously", and whined about it? I saw one cop post that he wouldn't join the team because of the bashing by a FEW members.... Like I said earlier. I don't know why G.B. felt the need for the change and I don't care. It's his world, we're just living in it. If you invite me into your home, I'll follow your rules or I won't come in. As for people who take offense, I mean the ones who get really indignant, all I can say is, thin skinned people have no place in the company of men. The more they complain, the worse it's going to get. |
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I actually realized there wasn't a "group bashing" rule... which most likely is the root of the problem. (Ok the root of the problem is all the bullshit laws in this country which allow people to sue anyone, force LEOs to enforce them, and make carnies roam the land without being locked up! [;)]) I modified [b]2e[/b] to be general enough to cover bashing of all groups. Unfortunately, this does include lawyers and even political consultants. [;)] Yes, much of this is at the discretion of the mods and staff, but the rule is solid enough that someone can point out a specific "bashing" in a thread and have it locked up. |
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The temptation to bash ALL LEO's leads to bad arguments and even less understanding. Sure, we may mutter to ourselves some of these inanities that include ALL cops or ALL lawyers or ALL politicians, but we know it is just the emotion of the moment. To actually sit down and keyboard it out is just showing frustration and lack of clear thinking. Specific incidents SHOULD be brought up and hopefully LEOs will give their viewpoint and 2cents. All in all they are just people with families and responsibilities that we have more in common with than not. |
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Quoted: The temptation to bash ALL LEO's leads to bad arguments and even less understanding. Sure, we may mutter to ourselves some of these inanities that include ALL cops or ALL lawyers or ALL politicians, but we know it is just the emotion of the moment. To actually sit down and keyboard it out is just showing frustration and lack of clear thinking. Specific incidents SHOULD be brought up and hopefully LEOs will give their viewpoint and 2cents. All in all they are just people with families and responsibilities that we have more in common with than not. What he said...most law enforcement do their job well and do it honorably.....those instances where the line is crossed should be addressed - but trashing everyone in law enforcement is counterproductive. As for "jack booted thugs" comments - there have been cases of police brutality - often federal government screw ups. Often the fault lies with existing laws - sometimes with specific individuals or specific LEO agencies. No one is above the law - not even the law - but its important to find a balance where good cops are exonerated and those who are a disgrace to their profession - are treated accordingy. Again, I have nothing but the highest respect for the average LEO who upholds the law AND stays within the constraints of the US Constitution - those enforcing clearly un-Constitutional laws -I cannot respect. The excuse that someone is "just doing their job" does not apply when something is clearly wrong, illegal, or against the spirit of this great nation. Both military and law enforcement sacrifice a lot - criticism however should be given when warranted. |
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Quoted: 2e) No posts bashing groups. Discussions pertaining to SPECIFIC incidents are allowed, but bashing any group because you dislike them wont be tolerated. That's a lot better. I'm not so sure . Why is it better . If anything it is worse . THOUGHT POLICE , THOUGHT POLICE , help help . What a bunch of crap . What happened to freedom of speech ?? Don't listen if you don't like the topic or better yet partipate in the argument and give me a new view . BUT WHY CENSORSHIP ?? This is not the answer . Let someone show themselves to be the Jackass they are . |
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Quoted: Quoted: 2e) No posts bashing groups. Discussions pertaining to SPECIFIC incidents are allowed, but bashing any group because you dislike them wont be tolerated. That's a lot better. I'm not so sure . Why is it better . If anything it is worse . THOUGHT POLICE , THOUGHT POLICE , help help . What a bunch of crap . What happened to freedom of speech ?? Don't listen if you don't like the topic or better yet partipate in the argument and give me a new view . BUT WHY CENSORSHIP ?? This is not the answer . Let someone show themselves to be the Jackass they are . It's simple, it's goatboys house, his rules. When you have your own site, you can have whatever rules you want. We may disagree and fight over some of them, and as you have seen here, sometimes things get resolved to (most) everyones satisfaction. There is no better website on the internet....PERIOD !!!!! |
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Quoted: I'm not so sure . Why is it better . If anything it is worse . THOUGHT POLICE , THOUGHT POLICE , help help . What a bunch of crap . What happened to freedom of speech ?? Don't listen if you don't like the topic or better yet partipate in the argument and give me a new view . BUT WHY CENSORSHIP ?? This is not the answer . Let someone show themselves to be the Jackass they are . If someone comes into my house and says, "I hope our military gets killed for being in the middle east", I would throw them out, or most likely kick their ass. While I try not to enforce my personal beliefs here, this is something I wont tolerate. Bitch about facts and specifics, not about a group who is not responsible for an individual. Would you want me to shut down the site because one person threatens me? I don't lump the users of the site as a group responsible for the actions of one. I deal with the specifics of n incident and move on. |
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These sorts of rules are only necessary for people who aren't schooled in critical thinking and formal debate. If you have those skills, you tend to not jeopardize your argument by presenting a logical fallacy like stereotyping or generalization. I wonder what the percentage of regular members here actually understand what I just stated. |
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Quoted: The goal of this is the same. I dont mind specific discussions, but I dont want to see the bashing of general groups of people. (Except lawyers, people with foul breath, and [b]carnies... they have such small hands...[/b] [=D]) Now those groups need bashing !! [:D] Those [b]carnies[/b].....and clowns **shiver** So is it OK to bash carnies as a group? Although the incident happened more years ago then you have lived it still pisses me off as much today as it did years ago. |