Posted: 8/28/2007 4:20:27 PM EDT
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Well, Just wanted to share this with everyone that may be questioning the benefits of tithing. I havnt been tithing like I know I should over the last year and a half. It has always seemed that something else has come up that the money "had" to go to. (not partying or out drinking...or guns) I would have money set aside and either a doctors bill would come in for my son, truck need service or something, mostly poor planning on my part..  At the start of the month I got a very substantial raise at work and told God he was coming before anyone or anything else, no matter what. That I know as long as I give as he has instructed, he would provide for me. I didnt get my raise until the 3rd, and dont get paid but on the 15th and 30th. I wrote out my tithes check on the 16th and carried it in my wallet until the 20th. I gave it with the biggest smile and thanked the Lord for the blessings he was sending. Back on the 10th I was coming back from Austin. I got pulled over for doing 84 in a 70. I thought it was going to cost 279 for the citation, 175 for the fine and 104 for court cost to be able to take defensive driving and get the ticket dismissed. I got a call yesterday that the court clerk had recieved my paperwork in the mail and there was a problem, please call her back. I called her back and she said I had grossly overpaid them, That I was just required to pay the court cost, not the 175. That she wold be sending it back to me via check. "Thank God!!!" That was the first blessing!!! The second will be coming, I also got a new truck this weekend. When I went to the finance guy, He said the best interest rate I could get was 9.7% I called my credit union today"They were closed by the time I got in there saturday" and the lady I talked to said when I get my first bill, to call them that they can refinance for me at a MUCH better rate and save me about 80$ a month!!!! So for anyone that says tithing doesnt work, I challenge you to try it. The blessings may not come in the form of someone walking up and just handing you cash, but they will come. 
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Actually tithing is 10%. In Spanish, the word for tithes is "diezmos". The root of the word refers to ten. I have found in my life that paying a full 10% tithing to the church that I attend gives me so much peace of mind. Knowing that I am NOT cheating God of that 10% helps me feel that I am right with Him. Tithing is a great test of where our heart really is. It is easy to WANT to use that money on myself. The test of selfishness with tithing is one that separates someone that truly believes. We must "walk the walk", not just "talk the talk". Uncle-Al |
| Good for you cvanbrunt. Praise God. I'm kind of with you. With always given and on a regular basis. But I fall short of 10% most of the time. We are now starting to write checks every week that will be 10% of our salaries. And I feel better about it myself. I pray that God continues to bless you financially and gives you strength, guidance, wisdom and his protection on your lives. Amen!!!!! |
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Thank you all for the kind words. I find it is like a huge weight is lifted off my shoulders when my tithes are paid. JJ-Thank you for the prayers, I will continue to pray for you as well. CUJET- I have done some research, and from what I can find the "required" amount from God is 1/10th of your first fruits. The people in the Old and New Testaments didnt always get paid in money from what I can tell. Alot of them either worked their own land/livestock or worked on someone elses land and was paid in food/livestock. Therefore 1/10th of the first fruits may have been a portion of the first harvest or the likes of. I could very well be wrong on my interpretation and have been researching to try and make sure I am following His word as best as I can. I am out of town right now and wont be back until at least friday. I thought I had my Bible packed but have forgotten it and this is the one hotel room Ive ever been in that didnt have a Bible placed by the Gideons. I have tried to do some research on the internet to find some of the scriptures I have been reading but havnt had much luck. Uncle Al- Thank you for the information in your post, I didnt know the translation of tithe into spanish. I have to agree with you that it is a great feeling to know that I am giving God the little he asks for in return for all the blessings, and that it is a great test of where I am in my walk with God. Thank you all for the kind words. I find it is like a huge weight is lifted off my shoulders when my tithes are paid. JJ-Thank you for the prayers, I will continue to pray for you as well. CUJET- I have done some research, and from what I can find the "required" amount from God is 1/10th of your first fruits. The people in the Old and New Testaments didnt always get paid in money from what I can tell. Alot of them either worked their own land/livestock or worked on someone elses land and was paid in food/livestock. Therefore 1/10th of the first fruits may have been a portion of the first harvest or the likes of. I could very well be wrong on my interpretation and have been researching to try and make sure I am following His word as best as I can. I am out of town right now and wont be back until at least friday. I thought I had my Bible packed but have forgotten it and this is the one hotel room Ive ever been in that didnt have a Bible placed by the Gideons. I have tried to do some research on the internet to find some of the scriptures I have been reading but havnt had much luck. Uncle Al- Thank you for the information in your post, I didnt know the translation of tithe into spanish. I have to agree with you that it is a great feeling to know that I am giving God the little he asks for in return for all the blessings, and that it is a great test of where I am in my walk with God. |
It's all Gods'money, I just get to keep 90% of it We have been titing since we got married 16 years ago. We have done more and live a better life than what we should be able to on one income and homeschooling three kids. I owe it all to God taking care of us and me just doing what he ask with 10 % and trusting that 90% will be enough. And it has work all this time. |
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It's a learning process and can be difficult at times, it was for us. The 10% point can and will be argued back and forth. I wouldn't hold it against anyone either way, but I do believe in the 10%. We are more blessed than I could ever imagine, 10% is the least I can do. Like the Brother said, its all His anyway.
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Galations 3:1-14 (NASB) 1 You foolish Galatians, who has bewitched you, before whose eyes Jesus Christ was publicly portrayed as crucified? 2 This is the only thing I want to find out from you: did you receive the Spirit by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith? 3 Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh? 4 Did you suffer so many things in vain--if indeed it was in vain? 5 So then, does He who provides you with the Spirit and works miracles among you, do it by the works of the Law, or by hearing with faith? 6 Even so Abraham BELIEVED GOD, AND IT WAS RECKONED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS. 7 Therefore, be sure that it is those who are of faith who are sons of Abraham. 8 The Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel beforehand to Abraham, saying, "ALL THE NATIONS WILL BE BLESSED IN YOU." 9 So then those who are of faith are blessed with Abraham, the believer. 10 For as many as are of the works of the Law are under a curse; for it is written, "CURSED IS EVERYONE WHO DOES NOT ABIDE BY ALL THINGS WRITTEN IN THE BOOK OF THE LAW, TO PERFORM THEM." 11 Now that no one is justified by the Law before God is evident; for, "THE RIGHTEOUS MAN SHALL LIVE BY FAITH." 12 However, the Law is not of faith; on the contrary, "HE WHO PRACTICES THEM SHALL LIVE BY THEM." 13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law, having become a curse for us--for it is written, "CURSED IS EVERYONE WHO HANGS ON A TREE"-- 14 in order that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we would receive the promise of the Spirit through faith. |
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For years I believed what I was told about tithing. It was right there in Malachi 3:10. It even made sense the way they said, if you need money, you must give money, and ten percent off the top is where you begin, since that is already God's money and you are just stealing it if you, (without faith in God to provide), dare to pay a bill first. It was a lie. In the New Testament economy, Christians and all they control are God's. We have been bought with a price that no one but Jesus Christ could pay. There is no more law of the tithe. There is no command for Christians to tithe in the New Testament. Also, the tithe was not extracted from those having a hard time making ends meet. It was to come only from the increase... the tenth tenth, not the first tenth. If you raised sheep and your increase was nine sheep, you owed no tithe. It was never to be paid in money. I hope we can go through the scriptures that are mistakenly used to support a need for Christians to tithe. helping the truth to come out about tithing. |
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On another discussion board while discussing this topic someone posted that they had tithed faithfully off the top of their income until they were on the verge of losing their house so they went to the "church" where their tithe had been going and asked for help. They were given the address of a homeless shelter. Another poster had tithed and was not able to make ends meet so they asked why they weren't being blessed and were told they just didn't have enough faith to get blessed by tithing. I have also heard it suggested that sometimes it is necessary to give more than a tenth to "get blessed". Again, I am not against giving. It is just that this legalistic tithe teaching can do so much harm. |
Just because a church does you wrong doesn't mean you shouldn't give. It's not about what a church gives you back. It's about trusting God. Jesus was very pleased with the poor lady who gave almost all her money. And made the point that she has given more than the others, because it was nearly all she had. That may not say 10% but the lord likes us to give. So you could say the more you give the more he'd be pleased. I don't care if you don't tithe. But I believe your the one missing out and it's not a lie, as you say. |
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There is a lot about sowing and reaping that we may never know. The spirit in which you give is more important than the amount, as demonstrated by Jesus when he pointed out the older lady "giving all she had". God doesn't need the money, its that he wants us to have the money. Using a secular example of a farmer: How does he develop a crop? He has to plant first and that must come from the seed that he has in hand. The bible talks about 30, 60, 100 fold return, something no bank on earth could ever afford to do (3,000%, 6,000%, 10,000%) and that can be seen with a crop as well. Plant corn and you get back at least 30 fold Congrats on your return and the ones to come . It has certainly proven itself in my life. And to reiterate something someone once said to me "Always plant in good ground" and the Holy Spirit always points that out. Plant money, time, love, grace .... cup overflowing
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Cujet, I want to understand where you are coming from. Are you saying that we are not to obey God's laws? Are you saying that we are not to obey the ten commandments? I have been told before, by "mainstream" christians, that there isn't anything that they could do that nullify their "being saved". Is that what you are meaning to say here in these verses? Could you please fill me in on this topic. Thanks, Uncle-Al |
Think about it this way, we no longer have a huge "tribe" that concerns itself with worship, sacrifice and the like. In fact, the social order in Christian society is nothing like ancient Jewish times. I guess, to answer your question, I am not here to imply that we are not to follow God's laws. Nor do I believe that the NT implies salvation is a sure thing. I may not be the sharpest tack in the box, however, I clearly see your defense as borderline absurd. cujet |
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"I clearly see your defense as borderline absurd" . . . . . . . ? I have no idea what what you're talking about. But . . . . . . . . . A few thoughts about what you posted . . . .
Interesting. I find "worship" as essential to my "walk with God". "Sacrifice". Christ told us that He no longer required burnt offerings(sacrifice). He requires us to "sacrifice" our hearts and all we have.
I think you are wrong here. The "social order in christian society"("mainstream christianity") truly is EXACTLY like ancient Jewish times. Back then the hypocrites walked around telling everyone else how righteous they were and how others were going to hell. "Mainstream christianity" is doing that same thing today. The "white sepulchre" boys are alive and well. I do agree with you that there is not much "obedience" going on by the ones to profess to be "christians". The "mainstreamers" believe that there is no consequence to their behavior because they have been "saved". There is no "Honoring the Sabbath Day". The restaurants are full on Sundays. The lakes are crammed with boaters bobbing around drunk. Adultery is looked on as "Oh well, everybody does it". "Rip of my neighbor? If I don't get caught it's just good business." Jesus NEVER said to refrain from obeying Him. He said that the law of sacrifice was fulfilled in Him.(Meaning, no need for burnt offerings). As I read scripture, The law of tithing is still in effect. He never said anything to the contrary. But, I'll give you the 'thumping of the chest' in front of others to proclaim who is a true "christian"(favored of God). That occurs everyday JUST like back in ancient Jewish times.
Tithing is a law. Honouring our parents is a law. The Sabbath, stealing, coveting, lying, forgiving . . . . giving. There are more laws and commandments than we can strive to uphold each day.
You're just as sharp as the rest of us. But, I'm still not sure what you meant by my "defense". Uncle-Al |
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No way on that social order thing. Sure human nature is unchanged, but human nature and social order are 2 different things. We do not support an entire priestly tribe (maybe 1/12th the population) with tithng. The fact remains, Christianity is a very different faith than Judiaism. I belong to a fundementalist Baptist church where I have never heard the preacher ask for 10%. In fact, he makes a good point about giving from the heart. And, yes, I am one of those people who had no doubt what so ever about my faith and I gave the full 10% and suffered for it. Clearly I did not have enough income to do so. While the OP's story is nice to hear, it is much more likely there ore other factors at play here. Yes, many in this country are rich. Yes, there is lots of money floating around. But to ask someone who supports a family on 10 dollars an hour to give some of it up is simply insane! Nor do I believe it would be "right" in anybody's eyes. cujet |
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I admit that that the "10% rule" is unclear based on new testament release from old testament law, but it is a rule that my wife and I have decided to follow out of gratefullness for all of our blessings. I cannot even begin to count the blessings we have received as we follow this practice. (Notice that I did not say "because" we follow this practice. It's not a way to squeeze more blessings out of God. It's a way of giving thanks and showing faith.) I remember (before marriage) when somebody cleaned out my paypal account (and my associated checking and credit card accounts). I had a paycheck coming in a couple weeks, but things were still going to be tight until I had the unauthorized charges reversed by the banks. That Sunday at church, I felt compelled to make a large gift to a local children's ministry despite the temporary condition of my finances. I did so, and immediately after church, the pastor gave me an envelope with cash equal to the amount I had put in the collection plate. Someone had heard about my situation and had given him an anonymous donation intended for me. Coincidence? Perhaps. But when the coincidences just keep on coming, it's rather hard to ignore. 
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There you go! That was said better than I ever could say it. However I must say, there was no supernatural aspect to your "money story". It was simply a matter of communication among good people. cujet |
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2 Cor 9 1 ¶ For as touching the ministering to the saints, it is superfluous for me to write to you: 2 For I know the forwardness of your mind, for which I boast of you to them of Macedonia, that Achaia was ready a year ago; and your zeal hath provoked very many. 3 Yet have I sent the brethren, lest our boasting of you should be in vain in this behalf; that, as I said, ye may be ready: 4 Lest haply if they of Macedonia come with me, and find you unprepared, we (that we say not, ye) should be ashamed in this same confident boasting. 5 Therefore I thought it necessary to exhort the brethren, that they would go before unto you, and make up beforehand your bounty, whereof ye had notice before, that the same might be ready, as [a matter of] bounty, and not as [of] covetousness. 6 ¶ But this [I say], He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully. 7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, [so let him give]; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver. 8 And God [is] able to make all grace abound toward you; that ye, always having all sufficiency in all [things], may abound to every good work: 9 (As it is written, He hath dispersed abroad; he hath given to the poor: his righteousness remaineth for ever. 10 Now he that ministereth seed to the sower both minister bread for [your] food, and multiply your seed sown, and increase the fruits of your righteousness;) 11 Being enriched in every thing to all bountifulness, which causeth through us thanksgiving to God. 12 For the administration of this service not only supplieth the want of the saints, but is abundant also by many thanksgivings unto God; 13 Whiles by the experiment of this ministration they glorify God for your professed subjection unto the gospel of Christ, and for [your] liberal distribution unto them, and unto all [men]; 14 And by their prayer for you, which long after you for the exceeding grace of God in you. 15 Thanks [be] unto God for his unspeakable gift. |
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Without going into a lot of scriptures, tithing was instituted before the Mosiac law with Abraham. Abraham gave tithes to Melchizedek (Gen.14:20; Heb 7) The Levites were commanded to take tithes of the people by the Lord. Two different principles. Knowing that the people of the true church are children of Abraham by faith, we should do as Abraham! Bobby |
+1 You give to God because of who He is. Tithing acknowledges that God is God over all your life including your finances. Giving Him back a tenth of what He gives you. It also shows that you trust and believe in God and what God says. Giving to get something in return is not giving but rather it is buying. You cannot buy Gods blessings. It shows you have a heart problem with God. |
Animal sacrifice was also instituted before Sinai and practiced by Abraham. Should we follow Abraham on that also? |
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To me, this is the defining passage on giving in the New Testament: 2 Corinthians 9:6 But this I say, He which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully. 7 Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give; not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver. Since tithing is a law, the "not of necessity" part of the above passage rules tithing out. Motivation is key here. |
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In the Old Covenant people did not have the Holy Spirit living within them so they had to have the Law written in tables of stone. In the New Covenant, God writes His laws in the fleshly tables of our hearts. We are no longer under the Letter of the Law, but are to submit to the Spirit of the Law written in our hearts. Therefore, the New Testament says that each should give as they purpose in their heart and NOT OF NECESSITY as it was required in the Old Testament. If you understand the "spirit of the tithe", you will see that Israel was a theocracy where God directly ruled over the nation through the Law. There was not a distinction between the Temple and the Government. Tithing was the Old Testament tax system of Israel to make sure that a percentage of all that everyone earned would be set aside for the poor. It was similar to the Law that you could only harvest a field once and the rest would be left for the poor to glean their food (see Ruth and Boaz). Today, we have a separation of church and state. Our government already demands more than 10% to pay for food stamps and welfare so the spirit of this law is already in place. We should faithfully pay our income taxes in submission to the government that God has placed over us and give freely as we feel led to support the work of God. But, for a church or preacher to demand a tithe of your income to support their ministry and lifestyle is double taxing and not having an understand of the spirit of the tithe IMHO. |
No one said God commanded Abraham to give a tithe, that is the point. He gave willingly and set a standard for us to emulate. As for as the question of animal sacrifice, Abraham was commanded to sacrifice his promised son, so I think the issue of blood sacrifice is a little off topic. But to answer the question ... yes we should partake of a blood sacrifice, the sacrifice of the innocent blood. The Lord Jesus Christ. It surely is not about percentage, but IMHO 10 percent is a good place to start, then go up from there if you can. It is a matter of devotion from the heart. Let's not use grace to justify selfishness or our lack of support for the local church. |
Sorry that doesn't cut it. If you can use that "logic" then so can anti-gunners. "I have seen how gun owners kill innocent people. No one should be able to own a gun." Just because SOME men are into it solely for the money doesn't mean everyone is. There are good churches out there who are not in for the money, but to serve God. And every dime given to them is money well given. |