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Posted: 6/28/2014 2:29:42 PM EDT
[#1]
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I thought that riding a floor buffer was a grunt right of passage, like fucking a fat chick at closing time.  Quote HistoryQuoted:
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It would make it too easy on privates when it comes to policing up a range after shooting all day, they could just use a magnet on wheels and not have to scrounge around on their hands and knees Sure, next thing you know, you're going to want to get rid of the floor buffers. Floor buffers MUST stay!!!!! I've gotten and seen many a bruise from riding floor buffers  I thought that riding a floor buffer was a grunt right of passage, like fucking a fat chick at closing time. How does one keep the fat chick on the buffer when you are fucking her, I never could figger it out?????
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Posted: 6/28/2014 2:38:26 PM EDT
[#2]
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Because we are not a bunch of Godless Commies, that's why! Actually thought this would be one of the first replies
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Posted: 6/28/2014 2:52:16 PM EDT
[#3]
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I believe it gets melted down...think recycled aluminum cans. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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You do know we recycle our brass don't you? Never seen re-man or reloaded ammo in inventory. Do tell us more..... I believe it gets melted down...think recycled aluminum cans. Because you can't recycle steel? The scrapyards are gonna be shocked when they hear this ...... |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 2:53:27 PM EDT
[#4]
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Because you can't recycle steel? The scrapyards are gonna be shocked when they hear this ...... I imagine it isn't as cost effective. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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You do know we recycle our brass don't you? Never seen re-man or reloaded ammo in inventory. Do tell us more..... I believe it gets melted down...think recycled aluminum cans. Because you can't recycle steel? The scrapyards are gonna be shocked when they hear this ...... I imagine it isn't as cost effective. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 3:20:31 PM EDT
[#5]
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It is sold of as scrap surplus or sometimes sold for reloading...but in 1,000+ lb lots. GovtLiquidation carries a bunch of it. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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You do know we recycle our brass don't you? Never seen re-man or reloaded ammo in inventory. Do tell us more..... I believe it gets melted down...think recycled aluminum cans. Yup, through the DRMO... |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 4:13:17 PM EDT
[#6]
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You're high. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Steel? Well, there's only four foundries operating in the US. You're high. No, just an American doomer. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 4:33:51 PM EDT
[#7]
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When I was in from 93-97 25mm was steel cased. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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We still use steel in some of the larger calibers. When I was in from 93-97 25mm was steel cased. I believe 30 mm is as well. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 4:36:24 PM EDT
[#8]
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Because you can't recycle steel? The scrapyards are gonna be shocked when they hear this ...... Quote HistoryQuoted:
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You do know we recycle our brass don't you? Never seen re-man or reloaded ammo in inventory. Do tell us more..... I believe it gets melted down...think recycled aluminum cans. Because you can't recycle steel? The scrapyards are gonna be shocked when they hear this ...... That wasn't my point at all. He was asking how it was recycled that is the way I took it. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 4:38:08 PM EDT
[#9]
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As in sell it. Not reload it. I fucking second! Quote HistoryQuoted:
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You do know we recycle our brass don't you? Never seen re-man or reloaded ammo in inventory. Do tell us more..... As in sell it. Not reload it. I fucking second! He was in the Army what do you expect?
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Posted: 6/28/2014 4:39:30 PM EDT
[#10]
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Aluminum cases are the way to go. They are: 1: Lighter than both steel and brass. 2: More brass-like in case behavior under pressure than steel, and thus a better replacement for brass than steel. 3: Cheaper finished product than brass or steel. 4: Not prone to rust like steel. 5: Easier to work than steel. So why doesn't anyone do it? |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 4:40:59 PM EDT
[#11]
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I've always wondered why it wasn't as popular for ammo. I have shot CCI Blazer aluminum cased ammo before with zero problems out of a few pistols. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Aluminum cases are the way to go. They are: 1: Lighter than both steel and brass. 2: More brass-like in case behavior under pressure than steel, and thus a better replacement for brass than steel. 3: Cheaper finished product than brass or steel. 4: Not prone to rust like steel. 5: Easier to work than steel. I've shot that blazer, with far better results than WWB. 
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Posted: 6/28/2014 4:41:52 PM EDT
[#12]
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You do know we recycle our brass don't you? Yep, Gov Liquidation: http://www.govliquidation.com/auction/search?cmd=results&fromsearch=true&words=brass Hint, don't try going to DRMO asking for a bucket full either, they won't give it to you.... |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 4:44:36 PM EDT
[#13]
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Take away their magnets? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Steel can be recycled as well, and you can pick it up with a magnet, no need to bend over 
ETA I see I was beaten why several seconds  Take away their magnets? Cav, He sort of got you there buddy.
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Posted: 6/28/2014 4:45:49 PM EDT
[#14]
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You're high. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Steel? Well, there's only four foundries operating in the US. You're high. No shit, There are places where you can hit 4 with a rock from the same spot if you can throw like a girl. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:02:58 PM EDT
[#15]
When we are out in 5th fleet throwing 4-5 tons of metal off aircraft elevator 4 straight in the ocean I just think to myself "they really don't give a shit about saving money" and then I go take a nap.
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:06:27 PM EDT
[#16]
Um... because brass is a much more ideal material to use for cartridges than steel.
Why is this even a question? |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:08:33 PM EDT
[#17]
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As in sell it. Not reload it. I fucking second! Quote HistoryQuoted:
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You do know we recycle our brass don't you? Never seen re-man or reloaded ammo in inventory. Do tell us more..... As in sell it. Not reload it. I fucking second! So lets say there is a training ground near where I go hiking/biking a lot. There is a shit ton of blanks, should I recycle them? There's also a shit ton of mre wrappers and a decent amount of SAW plastic box mag things throughout the forest. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:08:54 PM EDT
[#18]
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It's not the tray. Aluminum casings do this. (probably galvanic) Unless they anodized them or something (which probably wouldn't work very well since the loading process would probably compromise the anodize) it is a bad idea IMHO. I have fired brass cased ammo loaded in the 1890s that looked great, and have decade old aluminum cased pistol cartridges that are in very bad shape. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Aluminum cases are the way to go. They are: 1: Lighter than both steel and brass. 2: More brass-like in case behavior under pressure than steel, and thus a better replacement for brass than steel. 3: Cheaper finished product than brass or steel. 4: Not prone to rust like steel. 5: Easier to work than steel. Lighter from a logistical standpoint, but not from a tactical standpoint. Who in the world is even gonna notice a difference in ounces on their gear? Logistical though, I can see the military saving money not just from the cost of materials, but from the costs of having to transport that stuff. Then again, Polymer cased ammo might be the better solution if the R&D companies can get the mixture of the plastic right. 
Assuming a combat load of 300 rounds (heavy for most, light for some, just roll with me here), aluminum cases would save almost 2lbs of weight. Not huge, but not tiny. You could carry two more mags for the same weight. And yes, for the engineers, this factors in thicker case walls for aluminum cases. Not just density conversion. Alumunium has odd long term storage behavior. I have 15 yr old blazer 9mm. There is a white powder creeping up the brass bullets, from the Al casings. They fire fine, but I'm guessing it's Aluminum oxide. Wonder what that's doing to barrel erosion... I wonder if brass has better long term storage? Then again, maybe it's just rubbings of the white plastic tray they are in - not sure
I imagine with steel the concern is reliability in hot chambers & extraction. Steel tends to get "sticky", and expands when hot. Get a failure to extract with a steel case and you better find a cleaning rod. With brass, it has a little spring back after the firing pressure expansion, so a lot easier to extract. It's not the tray. Aluminum casings do this. (probably galvanic) Unless they anodized them or something (which probably wouldn't work very well since the loading process would probably compromise the anodize) it is a bad idea IMHO. I have fired brass cased ammo loaded in the 1890s that looked great, and have decade old aluminum cased pistol cartridges that are in very bad shape. Frankford Arsenal was using some sort of plating process to solve the problem, with supposedly good results. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:09:57 PM EDT
[#19]
Steel is harder on chambers than brass.
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:12:09 PM EDT
[#20]
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Um... because brass is a much more ideal material to use for cartridges than steel. Why is this even a question? Because we already did 9mm v .45 and beans v no beans during the week? |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:12:55 PM EDT
[#21]
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So why doesn't anyone do it? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Aluminum cases are the way to go. They are: 1: Lighter than both steel and brass. 2: More brass-like in case behavior under pressure than steel, and thus a better replacement for brass than steel. 3: Cheaper finished product than brass or steel. 4: Not prone to rust like steel. 5: Easier to work than steel. So why doesn't anyone do it? Developing new case technologies is high risk, low reward. Frankford Arsenal was shut down while they were developing the technology. No relevant patents with the basic concept. If you spend the money developing military grade aluminum rifle cases, there is a high chance someone else will just copy the final product with none of the development invested. Lastly, not sexy enough. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:13:37 PM EDT
[#22]
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So lets say there is a training ground near where I go hiking/biking a lot. There is a shit ton of blanks, should I recycle them? There's also a shit ton of mre wrappers and a decent amount of SAW plastic box mag things throughout the forest. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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You do know we recycle our brass don't you? Never seen re-man or reloaded ammo in inventory. Do tell us more..... As in sell it. Not reload it. I fucking second! So lets say there is a training ground near where I go hiking/biking a lot. There is a shit ton of blanks, should I recycle them? There's also a shit ton of mre wrappers and a decent amount of SAW plastic box mag things throughout the forest. You actually could cut the crimp off and reload a fired blank 5.56 Lots of people convert them into 300 BLK. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:13:38 PM EDT
[#23]
Quote HistoryQuoted: sshhhh, GD ain't got time for numbers and fizaks. Building bird houses in shop class is considered the top choice for higher free electives in high school. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Boxer primed steel cases would be easily reloadable. Though they probably wouldn't last nearly as long as brass... Or maybe they would, considering primer pocket life as a limiting factor. I was under the impression that steel, being harder than brass, is much more likely to crack, even after a single firing. I don't think I could bring myself to trust steel reloads. sshhhh, GD ain't got time for numbers and fizaks. Building bird houses in shop class is considered the top choice for higher free electives in high school.  Lots of people reload steel |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:15:15 PM EDT
[#24]
Quote HistoryQuoted: Can't really stop them; you'd spend all your time chasing them around...like bop the weasel. I'm surprised more of them don't get killed/injured in their endeavors. Note that Soldier65 was talking about them stealing from the firing points...I'm talking about them going for expended ordnance down range...like sabot petals, cases dropped from aircraft, rocket bodies, you name it. They would get to the stuff before we could drive from Range Control out to inspect/score/repair targets. In fact, I think they would use the Range Control truck as their cue that it was "safe" to start scavenging. Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: On Fort Hood in the 80's we were on a life fire range shootin 20MM Vulcans. After a couple tracks had maneuvered downrange firing from several points, they turned around and came back to the starting point. A Humvee came up out of the impact area, in full view of all of us, and a couple guys jumped out and shoveled the brass into the back. After collecting several thousand rounds of spent 20MM they went back into the impact area. No one would follow them into there. We were shut down and could not fire on them, we asked to though. Later we were told that there were several HUMVEE S that were missing and presumed stolen. The belief was that the scavenger families that lived on the edges of post had the Hummvee s stashed in the Permanant no entry impact areas and that is who we watched take all that brass. Without the US Army, those folks would have starved. They're still there. "Brass pickers" as the range ops/support contractors called 'em: "Don't fuck with the brass pickers, they kill you for a shell casing or a sabot petal." I never saw the HMMWVs but they do hide in the impact area waiting for lulls in the firing so they can run out and grab whatever they can. WTF is this? They just let them go and accept it? Can't really stop them; you'd spend all your time chasing them around...like bop the weasel. I'm surprised more of them don't get killed/injured in their endeavors. Note that Soldier65 was talking about them stealing from the firing points...I'm talking about them going for expended ordnance down range...like sabot petals, cases dropped from aircraft, rocket bodies, you name it. They would get to the stuff before we could drive from Range Control out to inspect/score/repair targets. In fact, I think they would use the Range Control truck as their cue that it was "safe" to start scavenging. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:16:51 PM EDT
[#25]
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I'm surprised the military isn't worried about some stupid lawsuit when one of them gets blown up. I would think they'd shut the range down and have them arrested Quote HistoryQuoted:
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On Fort Hood in the 80's we were on a life fire range shootin 20MM Vulcans. After a couple tracks had maneuvered downrange firing from several points, they turned around and came back to the starting point. A Humvee came up out of the impact area, in full view of all of us, and a couple guys jumped out and shoveled the brass into the back. After collecting several thousand rounds of spent 20MM they went back into the impact area. No one would follow them into there. We were shut down and could not fire on them, we asked to though. Later we were told that there were several HUMVEE S that were missing and presumed stolen. The belief was that the scavenger families that lived on the edges of post had the Hummvee s stashed in the Permanant no entry impact areas and that is who we watched take all that brass. Without the US Army, those folks would have starved. They're still there. "Brass pickers" as the range ops/support contractors called 'em: "Don't fuck with the brass pickers, they kill you for a shell casing or a sabot petal." I never saw the HMMWVs but they do hide in the impact area waiting for lulls in the firing so they can run out and grab whatever they can. WTF is this?
They just let them go and accept it? Can't really stop them; you'd spend all your time chasing them around...like bop the weasel. I'm surprised more of them don't get killed/injured in their endeavors. Note that Soldier65 was talking about them stealing from the firing points...I'm talking about them going for expended ordnance down range...like sabot petals, cases dropped from aircraft, rocket bodies, you name it. They would get to the stuff before we could drive from Range Control out to inspect/score/repair targets. In fact, I think they would use the Range Control truck as their cue that it was "safe" to start scavenging. I've got about 700k fired military cases in my garage. I may have invested too heavily in one thing. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:17:04 PM EDT
[#26]
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Steel is harder on chambers than brass. Is it really, or is that just some happy gunstore horseshit? I never was sure. I do love me some steel commie ammo though. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:20:23 PM EDT
[#27]
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Is it really, or is that just some happy gunstore horseshit? I never was sure. I do love me some steel commie ammo though. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Steel is harder on chambers than brass. Is it really, or is that just some happy gunstore horseshit? I never was sure. I do love me some steel commie ammo though. Someone did a pretty good study, but the conclusion was that alot of the increased wear might have been due to the primer material in stuff like wolf. I suppose steel is harder on the chamber tho, just from it having greater friction with the chamber wall due to less spring back. Whether it's enough extra wear to worry about, who knows? I would think you'd shoot the actual bore out long before the chamber wore appreciably. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:24:31 PM EDT
[#28]
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Brass and copper we have. Steel? Well, there's only four foundries operating in the US. We couldn't build a WW II era battleship today if we wanted to. I haven't seen this much fail in a good minute... Wtf did you smoke? |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:24:49 PM EDT
[#29]
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You actually could cut the crimp off and reload a fired blank 5.56 Lots of people convert them into 300 BLK. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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You do know we recycle our brass don't you? Never seen re-man or reloaded ammo in inventory. Do tell us more..... As in sell it. Not reload it. I fucking second! So lets say there is a training ground near where I go hiking/biking a lot. There is a shit ton of blanks, should I recycle them? There's also a shit ton of mre wrappers and a decent amount of SAW plastic box mag things throughout the forest. You actually could cut the crimp off and reload a fired blank 5.56 Lots of people convert them into 300 BLK. It's got the indents running towards the bottom of the case, like so: 
Kinda iffy no? |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:28:37 PM EDT
[#30]
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It's got the indents running towards the bottom of the case, like so: http://cdn2.armslist.com/sites/armslist/uploads/posts/2013/01/11/832474_01_100_plus_rounds_m200_blanks_5__640.jpg Kinda iffy no? What's iffy about it? Cut the crimped mouth off right about 1.375 or so (just below the shoulder), resize and finish trim to 1.358 |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:32:30 PM EDT
[#31]
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I've got about 700k fired military cases in my garage. I may have invested too heavily in one thing. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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They're still there. "Brass pickers" as the range ops/support contractors called 'em: "Don't fuck with the brass pickers, they kill you for a shell casing or a sabot petal." I never saw the HMMWVs but they do hide in the impact area waiting for lulls in the firing so they can run out and grab whatever they can. WTF is this?
They just let them go and accept it? Can't really stop them; you'd spend all your time chasing them around...like bop the weasel. I'm surprised more of them don't get killed/injured in their endeavors. Note that Soldier65 was talking about them stealing from the firing points...I'm talking about them going for expended ordnance down range...like sabot petals, cases dropped from aircraft, rocket bodies, you name it. They would get to the stuff before we could drive from Range Control out to inspect/score/repair targets. In fact, I think they would use the Range Control truck as their cue that it was "safe" to start scavenging. I've got about 700k fired military cases in my garage. I may have invested too heavily in one thing. Not if it's military 5.56/7.62/12.7 brass and you still have a house.
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:33:32 PM EDT
[#32]
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Um... because brass is a much more ideal material to use for cartridges than steel. Why is this even a question? Steel seems to work fine for other countries, and it costs alot less. Thats why I asked the question. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:33:42 PM EDT
[#33]
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Not if it's military 5.56/7.62/12.7 brass and you still have a house. It sure is. And I picked most of it up directly from military bases. 
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:34:13 PM EDT
[#34]
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Lighter from a logistical standpoint, but not from a tactical standpoint. Who in the world is even gonna notice a difference in ounces on their gear? Logistical though, I can see the military saving money not just from the cost of materials, but from the costs of having to transport that stuff. Then again, Polymer cased ammo might be the better solution if the R&D companies can get the mixture of the plastic right.
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Aluminum cases are the way to go. They are: 1: Lighter than both steel and brass. 2: More brass-like in case behavior under pressure than steel, and thus a better replacement for brass than steel. 3: Cheaper finished product than brass or steel. 4: Not prone to rust like steel. 5: Easier to work than steel. Lighter from a logistical standpoint, but not from a tactical standpoint. Who in the world is even gonna notice a difference in ounces on their gear? Logistical though, I can see the military saving money not just from the cost of materials, but from the costs of having to transport that stuff. Then again, Polymer cased ammo might be the better solution if the R&D companies can get the mixture of the plastic right.
It all adds up. Ounces make pounds. I have a sneaking feeling you were never light infantry. Edited to fix the quote. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:35:07 PM EDT
[#35]
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Brass and copper we have. Steel? Well, there's only four foundries operating in the US. We couldn't build a WW II era battleship today if we wanted to. 
Nucor operates something like 23 production facilities in the US, and they're not even the big game in town. The US produced 89 million metric tons of steel in 2012. 1.3 million tons of copper. Want to revise your statement? |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:37:52 PM EDT
[#36]
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Nucor operates something like 23 production facilities in the US, and they're not even the big game in town. The US produced 89 million metric tons of steel in 2012. 1.3 million tons of copper. Want to revise your statement? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Brass and copper we have. Steel? Well, there's only four foundries operating in the US. We couldn't build a WW II era battleship today if we wanted to.
Nucor operates something like 23 production facilities in the US, and they're not even the big game in town. The US produced 89 million metric tons of steel in 2012. 1.3 million tons of copper. Want to revise your statement? I went with another arfcommer to pick up a milsurp cucv up in wisconson and I want to say we passed a HUGE steel foundry on 35. Mountains of old bales of rusted steel shreds waiting for the arc furnace. I want to say it was even a Nucor place. Name sounds familiar. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 5:49:59 PM EDT
[#37]
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Nucor operates something like 23 production facilities in the US, and they're not even the big game in town. The US produced 89 million metric tons of steel in 2012. 1.3 million tons of copper. Want to revise your statement? Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Brass and copper we have. Steel? Well, there's only four foundries operating in the US. We couldn't build a WW II era battleship today if we wanted to.
Nucor operates something like 23 production facilities in the US, and they're not even the big game in town. The US produced 89 million metric tons of steel in 2012. 1.3 million tons of copper. Want to revise your statement? One place that NOBODY outside the industry thinks of for steel is Arkansas. Yet Arkansas has a plant that makes steel that goes into every single vehicle produced in the US. They're everywhere. And we have some on the Mississippi river. 4 in the nation? We have 4 in the state I think, and we're not a steel state like Indiana. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 6:07:35 PM EDT
[#38]
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One place that NOBODY outside the industry thinks of for steel is Arkansas. Yet Arkansas has a plant that makes steel that goes into every single vehicle produced in the US. They're everywhere. And we have some on the Mississippi river. 4 in the nation? We have 4 in the state I think, and we're not a steel state like Indiana. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Brass and copper we have. Steel? Well, there's only four foundries operating in the US. We couldn't build a WW II era battleship today if we wanted to.
Nucor operates something like 23 production facilities in the US, and they're not even the big game in town. The US produced 89 million metric tons of steel in 2012. 1.3 million tons of copper. Want to revise your statement? One place that NOBODY outside the industry thinks of for steel is Arkansas. Yet Arkansas has a plant that makes steel that goes into every single vehicle produced in the US. They're everywhere. And we have some on the Mississippi river. 4 in the nation? We have 4 in the state I think, and we're not a steel state like Indiana. |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 6:18:34 PM EDT
[#39]
Quote HistoryQuoted: What would I do with my Privates who need extra duty? Quote HistoryQuoted: Quoted: Steel can be recycled as well, and you can pick it up with a magnet, no need to bend over ETA I see I was beaten why several seconds Backpage? |
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Posted: 6/28/2014 6:22:19 PM EDT
[#40]
Brass is prettier. 
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Posted: 6/28/2014 7:08:10 PM EDT
[#41]
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Hell, there's at least one and possibly two within an hour of me. Quote HistoryQuoted:
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Brass and copper we have. Steel? Well, there's only four foundries operating in the US. We couldn't build a WW II era battleship today if we wanted to.
Nucor operates something like 23 production facilities in the US, and they're not even the big game in town. The US produced 89 million metric tons of steel in 2012. 1.3 million tons of copper. Want to revise your statement? One place that NOBODY outside the industry thinks of for steel is Arkansas. Yet Arkansas has a plant that makes steel that goes into every single vehicle produced in the US. They're everywhere. And we have some on the Mississippi river. 4 in the nation? We have 4 in the state I think, and we're not a steel state like Indiana. Steel production locations in North America: 
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Posted: 6/28/2014 11:09:30 PM EDT
[#42]
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Aluminum cases are the way to go. They are: 1: Lighter than both steel and brass. 2: More brass-like in case behavior under pressure than steel, and thus a better replacement for brass than steel. 3: Cheaper finished product than brass or steel. 4: Not prone to rust like steel. 5: Easier to work than steel. The 30mm in the AH-64 Apache uses Aluminum cases. |
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