Posted: 6/28/2016 11:01:02 AM EDT
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I've sharpened drill bits before on dremels, air tools, angle grinders, grinders, stones, hand files, etc...
What's the most effective way to sharpen drill bits? I've reached critical mass with dull bits. I don't have a bench grinder anymore, but I've got just about everything else a well stocked shop should have. |
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As above, I have a Drill Doctor 500 and love it. There is a learning curve, so make sure you learn how to use it before you declare it "junk" or a gimmick. They will produce a perfectly sharpened bit if you do your part.
I got mine from CraigsList for $35 from a guy who did not read the directions, nor watch the enclosed VHS video. He said it "didn't work very well, so good luck with it" when I bought it. His stupidity was my gain! Oh, there are numerous Youtube videos which detail the techniques needed for success. 
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Adding my vote for the drill doctor.
If it could do brad point bits (like for woodworking) I would be set. There are ways to do that with a grinding wheel on a normal bench grinder, shaped with a diamond dressing point, but I haven't felt the need for that so far (if anyone is interested in that the info can be found on Peter Galbert's chairmaking blog and his book). |
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As above, I have a Drill Doctor 500 and love it. There is a learning curve, so make sure you learn how to use it before you declare it "junk" or a gimmick. They will produce a perfectly sharpened bit if you do your part. I got mine from CraigsList for $35 from a guy who did not read the directions, nor watch the enclosed VHS video. He said it "didn't work very well, so good luck with it" when I bought it. His stupidity was my gain! Oh, there are numerous Youtube videos which detail the techniques needed for success. +1 RTFM! I have a Drill Doctor and it works well once you learn to use it right. But most of the time I use the belt grinder to quickly touch up a bit. |
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I like my drill doctor. I didn't find it all that hard to use. I am always puzzle by those that think its difficult to use. Read and do what the instruction says and it works. Not that hard at all. From what I've seen, most don't do the initial orientation of the bit in the chuck. That isn't intuitive, so you won't get that step without the directions/manual.
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this |
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I feel so old because I hand grind them.  I can do that too, but you can never get the absolutely perfect angle which takes zero effort with the DD. I only hand grind broken bits in order to get it "close 'nuff" so the DD can then put the final sharpen on it. Once you are good with the DD it takes no longer either.
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I have plenty of augers and brad points.
With the correct files and stones they are easy to do. Have had a drill doctor for twist bits. At least the popularity of hollow chisel mortisers brought the price of bits down. Though all of them need touching up before use. |
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i will go counter to the drill doctor group.
Even reading the manual and watching the dvd that comes with it (yes I have a drill doctor and did both) they don't do the greatest job. A properly sharpened drill bit has certain relief angles and facets, and the drill doctor does NONE of those properly. What you will get on the drill doctor is a uniform flute-to-flute grind. Whether or not the actual geometry is close to what it should be is a toss-up. I use my drill doctor to get uniformity from flute-to-flute and I do the finish grind by hand. One major limiting factor that I found on the drill doctor is that the "bit alignment" process is a compromise. The thin bits of sheet metal that do the alignining index/contact the bit on the front and back side of each flute to make sure it is rotated to the proper position. Think about that for a second and you will realize that for ANY drill bit that doesn't have flute geometry that is exactly as the drill doctor was designed for will not be completely aligned properly. I have had problems with this many times. The result is the wrong relief angle; I've ended up with negative relief numerous times even when following the right procedures. Negative relief is VERY bad in a drill bit. Hence why I use it to ensure the flute-to-flute geometry is uniform and then finish grind by hand. ETA, if you just want bit for wood the drill doctor will do great, you can still drill wood with negative relief but drilling metal (especially straight holes) cannot be done with negative relief. Are those that use and recommend the drill doctor metal-workers or wood-workers? I'm primarily a metal-worker and don't recommend the drill doctor. To truly, properly sharpened drill bits you need a Darex drill sharpener (4-figure price-tag) or just send them out to be sharpened. |
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i will go counter to the drill doctor group. Even reading the manual and watching the dvd that comes with it (yes I have a drill doctor and did both) they don't do the greatest job. A properly sharpened drill bit has certain relief angles and facets, and the drill doctor does NONE of those properly. What you will get on the drill doctor is a uniform flute-to-flute grind. Whether or not the actual geometry is close to what it should be is a toss-up. I use my drill doctor to get uniformity from flute-to-flute and I do the finish grind by hand. One major limiting factor that I found on the drill doctor is that the "bit alignment" process is a compromise. The thin bits of sheet metal that do the alignining index/contact the bit on the front and back side of each flute to make sure it is rotated to the proper position. Think about that for a second and you will realize that for ANY drill bit that doesn't have flute geometry that is exactly as the drill doctor was designed for will not be completely aligned properly. I have had problems with this many times. The result is the wrong relief angle; I've ended up with negative relief numerous times even when following the right procedures. Negative relief is VERY bad in a drill bit. Hence why I use it to ensure the flute-to-flute geometry is uniform and then finish grind by hand. ETA, if you just want bit for wood the drill doctor will do great, you can still drill wood with negative relief but drilling metal (especially straight holes) cannot be done with negative relief. Are those that use and recommend the drill doctor metal-workers or wood-workers? I'm primarily a metal-worker and don't recommend the drill doctor. To truly, properly sharpened drill bits you need a Darex drill sharpener (4-figure price-tag) or just send them out to be sharpened. You are not doing it right if you get no relief angle. The problem is with the alignment step, if you don't do that right the angle starts in the wrong place. There are cams on the DD that can and do impart the correct geometry but you have to do your part right at set-up. Go read the instruction manual then experiment a bit. I have a DD and a Darex M5 and have found that the markings are for reference only and not to be assumed to be always correct. For example, on the M5 if I am grinding a 140 degree point I orient the drill in the collet using the 120 degree mark to get the proper relief angle. Learning your equipment is paramount to success. |
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You are not doing it right if you get no relief angle. The problem is with the alignment step, if you don't do that right the angle starts in the wrong place. There are cams on the DD that can and do impart the correct geometry but you have to do your part right at set-up. Go read the instruction manual then experiment a bit. I have a DD and a Darex M5 and have found that the markings are for reference only and not to be assumed to be always correct. For example, on the M5 if I am grinding a 140 degree point I orient the drill in the collet using the 120 degree mark to get the proper relief angle. Learning your equipment is paramount to success. Quoted:
Quoted:
i will go counter to the drill doctor group. Even reading the manual and watching the dvd that comes with it (yes I have a drill doctor and did both) they don't do the greatest job. A properly sharpened drill bit has certain relief angles and facets, and the drill doctor does NONE of those properly. What you will get on the drill doctor is a uniform flute-to-flute grind. Whether or not the actual geometry is close to what it should be is a toss-up. I use my drill doctor to get uniformity from flute-to-flute and I do the finish grind by hand. One major limiting factor that I found on the drill doctor is that the "bit alignment" process is a compromise. The thin bits of sheet metal that do the alignining index/contact the bit on the front and back side of each flute to make sure it is rotated to the proper position. Think about that for a second and you will realize that for ANY drill bit that doesn't have flute geometry that is exactly as the drill doctor was designed for will not be completely aligned properly. I have had problems with this many times. The result is the wrong relief angle; I've ended up with negative relief numerous times even when following the right procedures. Negative relief is VERY bad in a drill bit. Hence why I use it to ensure the flute-to-flute geometry is uniform and then finish grind by hand. ETA, if you just want bit for wood the drill doctor will do great, you can still drill wood with negative relief but drilling metal (especially straight holes) cannot be done with negative relief. Are those that use and recommend the drill doctor metal-workers or wood-workers? I'm primarily a metal-worker and don't recommend the drill doctor. To truly, properly sharpened drill bits you need a Darex drill sharpener (4-figure price-tag) or just send them out to be sharpened. You are not doing it right if you get no relief angle. The problem is with the alignment step, if you don't do that right the angle starts in the wrong place. There are cams on the DD that can and do impart the correct geometry but you have to do your part right at set-up. Go read the instruction manual then experiment a bit. I have a DD and a Darex M5 and have found that the markings are for reference only and not to be assumed to be always correct. For example, on the M5 if I am grinding a 140 degree point I orient the drill in the collet using the 120 degree mark to get the proper relief angle. Learning your equipment is paramount to success. Did you read my post? Do you have reading comprehension skills? Do you have common sense? Re-read my post and try again... you don't have a clue what you're talking about if you didn't comprehend my post. |
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Did you read my post? Do you have reading comprehension skills? Do you have common sense? Re-read my post and try again... you don't have a clue what you're talking about if you didn't comprehend my post. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
i will go counter to the drill doctor group. Even reading the manual and watching the dvd that comes with it (yes I have a drill doctor and did both) they don't do the greatest job. A properly sharpened drill bit has certain relief angles and facets, and the drill doctor does NONE of those properly. What you will get on the drill doctor is a uniform flute-to-flute grind. Whether or not the actual geometry is close to what it should be is a toss-up. I use my drill doctor to get uniformity from flute-to-flute and I do the finish grind by hand. One major limiting factor that I found on the drill doctor is that the "bit alignment" process is a compromise. The thin bits of sheet metal that do the alignining index/contact the bit on the front and back side of each flute to make sure it is rotated to the proper position. Think about that for a second and you will realize that for ANY drill bit that doesn't have flute geometry that is exactly as the drill doctor was designed for will not be completely aligned properly. I have had problems with this many times. The result is the wrong relief angle; I've ended up with negative relief numerous times even when following the right procedures. Negative relief is VERY bad in a drill bit. Hence why I use it to ensure the flute-to-flute geometry is uniform and then finish grind by hand. ETA, if you just want bit for wood the drill doctor will do great, you can still drill wood with negative relief but drilling metal (especially straight holes) cannot be done with negative relief. Are those that use and recommend the drill doctor metal-workers or wood-workers? I'm primarily a metal-worker and don't recommend the drill doctor. To truly, properly sharpened drill bits you need a Darex drill sharpener (4-figure price-tag) or just send them out to be sharpened. You are not doing it right if you get no relief angle. The problem is with the alignment step, if you don't do that right the angle starts in the wrong place. There are cams on the DD that can and do impart the correct geometry but you have to do your part right at set-up. Go read the instruction manual then experiment a bit. I have a DD and a Darex M5 and have found that the markings are for reference only and not to be assumed to be always correct. For example, on the M5 if I am grinding a 140 degree point I orient the drill in the collet using the 120 degree mark to get the proper relief angle. Learning your equipment is paramount to success. Did you read my post? Do you have reading comprehension skills? Do you have common sense? Re-read my post and try again... you don't have a clue what you're talking about if you didn't comprehend my post. Since you are the outlier in this discussion it is safe to assume it is your reading comprehension that is at fault. If you follow the instructions and use a little common sense you can achieve satisfactory results with the Drill Doctor as have many others who chimed in. Sorry if I triggered you. |
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Since you are the outlier in this discussion it is safe to assume it is your reading comprehension that is at fault. If you follow the instructions and use a little common sense you can achieve satisfactory results with the Drill Doctor as have many others who chimed in. Sorry if I triggered you. Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
Quoted:
i will go counter to the drill doctor group. Even reading the manual and watching the dvd that comes with it (yes I have a drill doctor and did both) they don't do the greatest job. A properly sharpened drill bit has certain relief angles and facets, and the drill doctor does NONE of those properly. What you will get on the drill doctor is a uniform flute-to-flute grind. Whether or not the actual geometry is close to what it should be is a toss-up. I use my drill doctor to get uniformity from flute-to-flute and I do the finish grind by hand. One major limiting factor that I found on the drill doctor is that the "bit alignment" process is a compromise. The thin bits of sheet metal that do the alignining index/contact the bit on the front and back side of each flute to make sure it is rotated to the proper position. Think about that for a second and you will realize that for ANY drill bit that doesn't have flute geometry that is exactly as the drill doctor was designed for will not be completely aligned properly. I have had problems with this many times. The result is the wrong relief angle; I've ended up with negative relief numerous times even when following the right procedures. Negative relief is VERY bad in a drill bit. Hence why I use it to ensure the flute-to-flute geometry is uniform and then finish grind by hand. ETA, if you just want bit for wood the drill doctor will do great, you can still drill wood with negative relief but drilling metal (especially straight holes) cannot be done with negative relief. Are those that use and recommend the drill doctor metal-workers or wood-workers? I'm primarily a metal-worker and don't recommend the drill doctor. To truly, properly sharpened drill bits you need a Darex drill sharpener (4-figure price-tag) or just send them out to be sharpened. You are not doing it right if you get no relief angle. The problem is with the alignment step, if you don't do that right the angle starts in the wrong place. There are cams on the DD that can and do impart the correct geometry but you have to do your part right at set-up. Go read the instruction manual then experiment a bit. I have a DD and a Darex M5 and have found that the markings are for reference only and not to be assumed to be always correct. For example, on the M5 if I am grinding a 140 degree point I orient the drill in the collet using the 120 degree mark to get the proper relief angle. Learning your equipment is paramount to success. Did you read my post? Do you have reading comprehension skills? Do you have common sense? Re-read my post and try again... you don't have a clue what you're talking about if you didn't comprehend my post. Since you are the outlier in this discussion it is safe to assume it is your reading comprehension that is at fault. If you follow the instructions and use a little common sense you can achieve satisfactory results with the Drill Doctor as have many others who chimed in. Sorry if I triggered you. 
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Since you are the outlier in this discussion it is safe to assume it is your reading comprehension that is at fault. If you follow the instructions and use a little common sense you can achieve satisfactory results with the Drill Doctor as have many others who chimed in. Sorry if I triggered you. I guess satisfactory is subjective then. If you have low standards for drill bits, sure the DD can provide satisfactory results all the time. If you have high standards (you're accustomed to US made, real quality drill bits) you will find that the DD rarely provides "satisfactory results). However, if your standards are "I just want a bit that cut material away and I don't care about any other aspect of it" you may be satisfied with the DD if you're willing to "experiments around a little". You very clearly don't understand what I'm saying with the indexing/setup step. Look at how the 2 little pieces of of sheet metal touch on the flutes of the bit, if the flute geometry varies ANY from the flute geometry the DD was designed for then you must "experiment" as you say to get the right relief. You can only "experiment" so much. As you said, you use 120 degree setting for your 140 degree bits. What happens when you run out of range and you're still getting negative relief, what do you do to solve the problem? As I said, it's a compromise. Maybe because of your lack of reading comprehension you missed the implied parts of my post and only focused on my stated dislikes of the DD? I never stated that you cannot get a sharp edge that cuts, but I can guarantee that if you sharpen any real variety of bits you WILL encounter bits that CANNOT be sharpened on the DD. You WILL encounter bits that have flute geometry that cannot be "indexed" no matter WHAT you try unless you free-hand index the bit in the collet. That is my problem with the DD. You cannot deny that the DD doesn't do multi-faceted drills (proper grind), it does a simple sharpening which doesn't lend to the best chip clearance and edge longevity. The whole system is a compromise. It doesn't mean it doesn't work, it just means its a compromise. I have the DD 750, which does split-pointing; that's 1 step closer to a true multi-face grind but even that isn't precise enough to get a proper split point. The tolerance on grind location for the split point is very tight. Injection molded plastic parts cannot hold those tolerances, and therefore it's a crapshoot if your specific DD will split point the bits properly. Mine does not. Even then, if your DD does split point properly it won't do so forever; as the sharpening wheel loosens it will change the location of the split pointing grind. For those that couldn't comprehend my first post, I hope that better explains WHY the DD isn't a great sharpener. It "can" sharpen bits, but don't count on it; the one thing you can count on is that it won't give you a bit like a factory sharpened one. You will have to experiment to even get one that is sharp, and you may encounter bits that can't be sharpened without "freehand" setting it, at which point you don't have a clue what relief angles are anyways. Ultimately I think this all boils down to people that actually understand what makes a proper drill bit and those that don't. People that don't know any better will think the DD produces a quality bit; anybody that does know better knows the DD is a compromise, made specifically to provide a capability to people that cannot hand-sharpen bits. How many times have you see a DD in a professional environment? You won't find them in machine shops for a reason. They don't have the time to tinker with it; the cost of a new bit is cheaper than the labor of messing around with the DD. |
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I guess satisfactory is subjective then. If you have low standards for drill bits, sure the DD can provide satisfactory results all the time. If you have high standards (you're accustomed to US made, real quality drill bits) you will find that the DD rarely provides "satisfactory results). However, if your standards are "I just want a bit that cut material away and I don't care about any other aspect of it" you may be satisfied with the DD if you're willing to "experiments around a little". You very clearly don't understand what I'm saying with the indexing/setup step. Look at how the 2 little pieces of of sheet metal touch on the flutes of the bit, if the flute geometry varies ANY from the flute geometry the DD was designed for then you must "experiment" as you say to get the right relief. You can only "experiment" so much. As you said, you use 120 degree setting for your 140 degree bits. What happens when you run out of range and you're still getting negative relief, what do you do to solve the problem? As I said, it's a compromise. Maybe because of your lack of reading comprehension you missed the implied parts of my post and only focused on my stated dislikes of the DD? I never stated that you cannot get a sharp edge that cuts, but I can guarantee that if you sharpen any real variety of bits you WILL encounter bits that CANNOT be sharpened on the DD. You WILL encounter bits that have flute geometry that cannot be "indexed" no matter WHAT you try unless you free-hand index the bit in the collet. That is my problem with the DD. You cannot deny that the DD doesn't do multi-faceted drills (proper grind), it does a simple sharpening which doesn't lend to the best chip clearance and edge longevity. The whole system is a compromise. It doesn't mean it doesn't work, it just means its a compromise. I have the DD 750, which does split-pointing; that's 1 step closer to a true multi-face grind but even that isn't precise enough to get a proper split point. The tolerance on grind location for the split point is very tight. Injection molded plastic parts cannot hold those tolerances, and therefore it's a crapshoot if your specific DD will split point the bits properly. Mine does not. Even then, if your DD does split point properly it won't do so forever; as the sharpening wheel loosens it will change the location of the split pointing grind. For those that couldn't comprehend my first post, I hope that better explains WHY the DD isn't a great sharpener. It "can" sharpen bits, but don't count on it; the one thing you can count on is that it won't give you a bit like a factory sharpened one. You will have to experiment to even get one that is sharp, and you may encounter bits that can't be sharpened without "freehand" setting it, at which point you don't have a clue what relief angles are anyways. Ultimately I think this all boils down to people that actually understand what makes a proper drill bit and those that don't. People that don't know any better will think the DD produces a quality bit; anybody that does know better knows the DD is a compromise, made specifically to provide a capability to people that cannot hand-sharpen bits. How many times have you see a DD in a professional environment? You won't find them in machine shops for a reason. They don't have the time to tinker with it; the cost of a new bit is cheaper than the labor of messing around with the DD. Quoted:
Quoted:
Since you are the outlier in this discussion it is safe to assume it is your reading comprehension that is at fault. If you follow the instructions and use a little common sense you can achieve satisfactory results with the Drill Doctor as have many others who chimed in. Sorry if I triggered you. I guess satisfactory is subjective then. If you have low standards for drill bits, sure the DD can provide satisfactory results all the time. If you have high standards (you're accustomed to US made, real quality drill bits) you will find that the DD rarely provides "satisfactory results). However, if your standards are "I just want a bit that cut material away and I don't care about any other aspect of it" you may be satisfied with the DD if you're willing to "experiments around a little". You very clearly don't understand what I'm saying with the indexing/setup step. Look at how the 2 little pieces of of sheet metal touch on the flutes of the bit, if the flute geometry varies ANY from the flute geometry the DD was designed for then you must "experiment" as you say to get the right relief. You can only "experiment" so much. As you said, you use 120 degree setting for your 140 degree bits. What happens when you run out of range and you're still getting negative relief, what do you do to solve the problem? As I said, it's a compromise. Maybe because of your lack of reading comprehension you missed the implied parts of my post and only focused on my stated dislikes of the DD? I never stated that you cannot get a sharp edge that cuts, but I can guarantee that if you sharpen any real variety of bits you WILL encounter bits that CANNOT be sharpened on the DD. You WILL encounter bits that have flute geometry that cannot be "indexed" no matter WHAT you try unless you free-hand index the bit in the collet. That is my problem with the DD. You cannot deny that the DD doesn't do multi-faceted drills (proper grind), it does a simple sharpening which doesn't lend to the best chip clearance and edge longevity. The whole system is a compromise. It doesn't mean it doesn't work, it just means its a compromise. I have the DD 750, which does split-pointing; that's 1 step closer to a true multi-face grind but even that isn't precise enough to get a proper split point. The tolerance on grind location for the split point is very tight. Injection molded plastic parts cannot hold those tolerances, and therefore it's a crapshoot if your specific DD will split point the bits properly. Mine does not. Even then, if your DD does split point properly it won't do so forever; as the sharpening wheel loosens it will change the location of the split pointing grind. For those that couldn't comprehend my first post, I hope that better explains WHY the DD isn't a great sharpener. It "can" sharpen bits, but don't count on it; the one thing you can count on is that it won't give you a bit like a factory sharpened one. You will have to experiment to even get one that is sharp, and you may encounter bits that can't be sharpened without "freehand" setting it, at which point you don't have a clue what relief angles are anyways. Ultimately I think this all boils down to people that actually understand what makes a proper drill bit and those that don't. People that don't know any better will think the DD produces a quality bit; anybody that does know better knows the DD is a compromise, made specifically to provide a capability to people that cannot hand-sharpen bits. How many times have you see a DD in a professional environment? You won't find them in machine shops for a reason. They don't have the time to tinker with it; the cost of a new bit is cheaper than the labor of messing around with the DD. Homeowners don't care nor will it matter to them. As long as the bit drills into what they need....who cares if it doesn't drill as perfectly as a high end drill bit. Homeowners don't need super precise drill bits. Neat to have but unnecessary. You don't care for the Drill Doctor?. Ok. Noted. I hand sharpen drill bits on a bench grinder. They aren't perfect...not even close. But guess what....they still drill holes and better than dull bits.. Cool eh? |
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Homeowners don't care nor will it matter to them. As long as the bit drills into what they need....who cares if it doesn't drill as perfectly as a high end drill bit. Homeowners don't need super precise drill bits. Neat to have but unnecessary. You don't care for the Drill Doctor?. Ok. Noted. I hand sharpen drill bits on a bench grinder. They aren't perfect...not even close. But guess what....they still drill holes and better than dull bits.. Cool eh? The OP asked for "the most effective" way... all ambiguity of defining "most effective" put aside, his post seems to be asking for the best way to sharpen drill bits, the DD is on the low end of effective means of drill bit sharpening. It can be utilized, but it is far from "effective" in my books. The problem with the DD is that the bit doesn't always "drill into what they need". It takes a great deal of tinkering and even then anybody that sharpens a great variety will find that no amount of tinkering with the settings will be able to get a properly cutting edge on certain bits. Those are the facts... The OP never stated the intended use of the bits, IMHO that is crucial information. If he is drilling thin sheet metal (.020" or less) or wood/plastics/etc, even a dull bit will cut. Just spin it long enough without lube and the bit will wear a hole through the sheet metal; may burn nearby paint and char wood too. His statement that dull bits are piling up leads me to believe that he is frequently drilling metal. And a person that expects a good metal drilling bit off the DD every time is going to be sorely disappointed. If the OP is willing to accept that the DD may give him good bits, or that the bits may need touched up on his non-existent (re-read the OP) bench grinder then the DD will be good for him. As a matter of fact, as I sit here and "down-talk" the DD it still has a place in my shop. I use it to rough sharpen bits that are in severely abused condition, or bits that I cut shorter. The DD does an excellent job of getting consistent flute-to-flute point angle, I just have to go back and properly grind/facet each of those flutes to get the right cutting edge geometry. |
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The OP asked for "the most effective" way... all ambiguity of defining "most effective" put aside, his post seems to be asking for the best way to sharpen drill bits, the DD is on the low end of effective means of drill bit sharpening. It can be utilized, but it is far from "effective" in my books. The problem with the DD is that the bit doesn't always "drill into what they need". It takes a great deal of tinkering and even then anybody that sharpens a great variety will find that no amount of tinkering with the settings will be able to get a properly cutting edge on certain bits. Those are the facts... The OP never stated the intended use of the bits, IMHO that is crucial information. If he is drilling thin sheet metal (.020" or less) or wood/plastics/etc, even a dull bit will cut. Just spin it long enough without lube and the bit will wear a hole through the sheet metal; may burn nearby paint and char wood too. His statement that dull bits are piling up leads me to believe that he is frequently drilling metal. And a person that expects a good metal drilling bit off the DD every time is going to be sorely disappointed. If the OP is willing to accept that the DD may give him good bits, or that the bits may need touched up on his non-existent (re-read the OP) bench grinder then the DD will be good for him. As a matter of fact, as I sit here and "down-talk" the DD it still has a place in my shop. I use it to rough sharpen bits that are in severely abused condition, or bits that I cut shorter. The DD does an excellent job of getting consistent flute-to-flute point angle, I just have to go back and properly grind/facet each of those flutes to get the right cutting edge geometry. Quoted:
Quoted:
Homeowners don't care nor will it matter to them. As long as the bit drills into what they need....who cares if it doesn't drill as perfectly as a high end drill bit. Homeowners don't need super precise drill bits. Neat to have but unnecessary. You don't care for the Drill Doctor?. Ok. Noted. I hand sharpen drill bits on a bench grinder. They aren't perfect...not even close. But guess what....they still drill holes and better than dull bits.. Cool eh? The OP asked for "the most effective" way... all ambiguity of defining "most effective" put aside, his post seems to be asking for the best way to sharpen drill bits, the DD is on the low end of effective means of drill bit sharpening. It can be utilized, but it is far from "effective" in my books. The problem with the DD is that the bit doesn't always "drill into what they need". It takes a great deal of tinkering and even then anybody that sharpens a great variety will find that no amount of tinkering with the settings will be able to get a properly cutting edge on certain bits. Those are the facts... The OP never stated the intended use of the bits, IMHO that is crucial information. If he is drilling thin sheet metal (.020" or less) or wood/plastics/etc, even a dull bit will cut. Just spin it long enough without lube and the bit will wear a hole through the sheet metal; may burn nearby paint and char wood too. His statement that dull bits are piling up leads me to believe that he is frequently drilling metal. And a person that expects a good metal drilling bit off the DD every time is going to be sorely disappointed. If the OP is willing to accept that the DD may give him good bits, or that the bits may need touched up on his non-existent (re-read the OP) bench grinder then the DD will be good for him. As a matter of fact, as I sit here and "down-talk" the DD it still has a place in my shop. I use it to rough sharpen bits that are in severely abused condition, or bits that I cut shorter. The DD does an excellent job of getting consistent flute-to-flute point angle, I just have to go back and properly grind/facet each of those flutes to get the right cutting edge geometry. You recommended a 4 figure sharpener for the OP. Really? You thought that was what the OP was asking about? |
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You recommended a 4 figure sharpener for the OP. Really? You thought that was what the OP was asking about? Quoted:
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Homeowners don't care nor will it matter to them. As long as the bit drills into what they need....who cares if it doesn't drill as perfectly as a high end drill bit. Homeowners don't need super precise drill bits. Neat to have but unnecessary. You don't care for the Drill Doctor?. Ok. Noted. I hand sharpen drill bits on a bench grinder. They aren't perfect...not even close. But guess what....they still drill holes and better than dull bits.. Cool eh? The OP asked for "the most effective" way... all ambiguity of defining "most effective" put aside, his post seems to be asking for the best way to sharpen drill bits, the DD is on the low end of effective means of drill bit sharpening. It can be utilized, but it is far from "effective" in my books. The problem with the DD is that the bit doesn't always "drill into what they need". It takes a great deal of tinkering and even then anybody that sharpens a great variety will find that no amount of tinkering with the settings will be able to get a properly cutting edge on certain bits. Those are the facts... The OP never stated the intended use of the bits, IMHO that is crucial information. If he is drilling thin sheet metal (.020" or less) or wood/plastics/etc, even a dull bit will cut. Just spin it long enough without lube and the bit will wear a hole through the sheet metal; may burn nearby paint and char wood too. His statement that dull bits are piling up leads me to believe that he is frequently drilling metal. And a person that expects a good metal drilling bit off the DD every time is going to be sorely disappointed. If the OP is willing to accept that the DD may give him good bits, or that the bits may need touched up on his non-existent (re-read the OP) bench grinder then the DD will be good for him. As a matter of fact, as I sit here and "down-talk" the DD it still has a place in my shop. I use it to rough sharpen bits that are in severely abused condition, or bits that I cut shorter. The DD does an excellent job of getting consistent flute-to-flute point angle, I just have to go back and properly grind/facet each of those flutes to get the right cutting edge geometry. You recommended a 4 figure sharpener for the OP. Really? You thought that was what the OP was asking about? Don't waste your time with this guy, it seems that he thinks once he wrote it down it is gospel. If you disagree with him then you must be ignorant, there is one of these guys in nearly every thread. I'm sorry I got him stirred up as that was not my intention at all, I was really trying to help him initially but now, not so much. |
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You recommended a 4 figure sharpener for the OP. Really? You thought that was what the OP was asking about? Quoted:
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Homeowners don't care nor will it matter to them. As long as the bit drills into what they need....who cares if it doesn't drill as perfectly as a high end drill bit. Homeowners don't need super precise drill bits. Neat to have but unnecessary. You don't care for the Drill Doctor?. Ok. Noted. I hand sharpen drill bits on a bench grinder. They aren't perfect...not even close. But guess what....they still drill holes and better than dull bits.. Cool eh? The OP asked for "the most effective" way... all ambiguity of defining "most effective" put aside, his post seems to be asking for the best way to sharpen drill bits, the DD is on the low end of effective means of drill bit sharpening. It can be utilized, but it is far from "effective" in my books. The problem with the DD is that the bit doesn't always "drill into what they need". It takes a great deal of tinkering and even then anybody that sharpens a great variety will find that no amount of tinkering with the settings will be able to get a properly cutting edge on certain bits. Those are the facts... The OP never stated the intended use of the bits, IMHO that is crucial information. If he is drilling thin sheet metal (.020" or less) or wood/plastics/etc, even a dull bit will cut. Just spin it long enough without lube and the bit will wear a hole through the sheet metal; may burn nearby paint and char wood too. His statement that dull bits are piling up leads me to believe that he is frequently drilling metal. And a person that expects a good metal drilling bit off the DD every time is going to be sorely disappointed. If the OP is willing to accept that the DD may give him good bits, or that the bits may need touched up on his non-existent (re-read the OP) bench grinder then the DD will be good for him. As a matter of fact, as I sit here and "down-talk" the DD it still has a place in my shop. I use it to rough sharpen bits that are in severely abused condition, or bits that I cut shorter. The DD does an excellent job of getting consistent flute-to-flute point angle, I just have to go back and properly grind/facet each of those flutes to get the right cutting edge geometry. You recommended a 4 figure sharpener for the OP. Really? You thought that was what the OP was asking about? I didn't really recommend that, for a guy of my usage (which is most certainly in excess of the OP's usage from what I can gather) a Darex is still out of the question. I simply gave him the option; if he wants a truly sharpened bit he needs to look higher than the drill doctor. Unfortunately there aren't really any good options that bridge between the DD and the Darex or other similar sharpener systems. If you read the entirety of my sentence in which I mentioned the Darex I stated that if he needs a true grind on his bits his options are a Darex (4-figure price tag) or he needs to send them out. Because you guys seem clueless when it comes to tool & cutter sharpening I'll say it really slowly so you don't miss it. T h e r e a r e b u s i n e s s e s t h a t e x i s t t h a t p r o v i d e a s e t o f s e r v i c e s t h a t a r e f o c u s e d t o w a r d s h a r p e n i n g c u t t i n g t o o l s , i n c l u d i n g d r i l l b i t s . T h e s e b u s i n e s s e s c a n l i k e l y s h a r p e n t h i s g u y ' s d r i l l b i t s t o a m o r e p r o f e s s i o n a l l e v e l t h a n e v e n a d a r e x s h a r p e n e r w i l l a t a c o s t l e s s t h a n b u y i n g a D D . T h a t w a s m y r e c o m m e n d a t i o n . I think we've really had a big miscommunication here. The root cause is you guys aren't aware of the intricacy's of cutters and sharpening of cutters and therefore we're talking on different levels. I've alluded to things that just go right over your head so you completely mis-read my statements as something totally different. Ever hear of the 4 levels of competence? I hate to point it out, but you guys seems to be in the "unconscious incompetence" level as for your knowledge of this. You only know what you know, and the fact that you aren't even aware that there are things you don't know has misled you to believe that you know what you're talking about, when in fact, there is a whole world out there of things you aren't even aware. You're arguing against facts that you refuse to even recognize as facts simply because you aren't aware that they are facts. ETA: can't get the pic to show, google "4 levels of competence" you'll get it. It's very commonly used in professional climates to illustrate to people that there are varying levels of knowledge and competence. The things that just baffles me is that tinspinner claims to own a darex but then doesn't even know enough about drills and cutters to recognize some of what I'm saying. Leads me to believe he likely doesn't own a darex, or he is "projecting" that somebody he knows owns one, he's never run it, but he wants us to think he knows what he is talking about so he name-drops Darex... maybe he didn't even know what Darex was before I mentioned it and he googled it??? Lol 
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Don't waste your time with this guy, it seems that he thinks once he wrote it down it is gospel. If you disagree with him then you must be ignorant, there is one of these guys in nearly every thread. I'm sorry I got him stirred up as that was not my intention at all, I was really trying to help him initially but now, not so much. What is it that you think I need help with? As an admitted owner of a drill doctor I simply pointed out the shortcomings of the DD (which nobody else seems to be willing to admit; likely because they just don't know any better), and I recommended some other options for the OP, IF his needs exceeded the quality or functionality that is offered by the DD. You took up odds against that and started a pissing match. I think you're the one that needs the help... 
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I started sharpening bits with one of these about 40 years ago.
 iu
It isn't a 4k$ sharpener but it works very well if set and used properly with a grinder ( i know, the OP doesn't have one). A couple of years ago my BIL gave me a DD that he wasn't using. I eventually gave it back. I still have my original sharpening jig although I've gone through several grinders. |
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I started sharpening bits with one of these about 40 years ago. <a href="https://flic.kr/p/JQmE8K" target="_blank">https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7359/28114206585_ba0524facb_o.jpg</a>iu It isn't a 4k$ sharpener but it works very well if set and used properly with a grinder ( i know, the OP doesn't have one). A couple of years ago my BIL gave me a DD that he wasn't using. I eventually gave it back. I still have my original sharpening jig although I've gone through several grinders. Have one. Use it for larger drills. Many smaller ones are hardly worth the trouble unless you MUST have that size for a critical job and it is dull. The smaller ones come around five to a pack. Save the spares and when you put the last on in an index order a refill. Planning saves money and time. |
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I started sharpening bits with one of these about 40 years ago. <a href="https://flic.kr/p/JQmE8K" target="_blank">https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7359/28114206585_ba0524facb_o.jpg</a>iu It isn't a 4k$ sharpener but it works very well if set and used properly with a grinder ( i know, the OP doesn't have one). A couple of years ago my BIL gave me a DD that he wasn't using. I eventually gave it back. I still have my original sharpening jig although I've gone through several grinders. You couldn't possibly be saying the DD isn't all it's cracked up to be could you? Haha The sharpening fixture you pictured is a good "bridge" between the DD and professional sharpeners but they do require a bench grinder (which the OP stated he didn't have). A quality made sharpening fixture can give professional results if set up and used properly, but it will take more time per bit and it does have a lot bigger learning curve. Different strokes for different folks... some people will be happy with the DD. That's fine...
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You couldn't possibly be saying the DD isn't all it's cracked up to be could you? Haha The sharpening fixture you pictured is a good "bridge" between the DD and professional sharpeners but they do require a bench grinder (which the OP stated he didn't have). A quality made sharpening fixture can give professional results if set up and used properly, but it will take more time per bit and it does have a lot bigger learning curve. Different strokes for different folks... some people will be happy with the DD. That's fine... Quoted:
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I started sharpening bits with one of these about 40 years ago. <a href="https://flic.kr/p/JQmE8K" target="_blank">https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7359/28114206585_ba0524facb_o.jpg</a>iu It isn't a 4k$ sharpener but it works very well if set and used properly with a grinder ( i know, the OP doesn't have one). A couple of years ago my BIL gave me a DD that he wasn't using. I eventually gave it back. I still have my original sharpening jig although I've gone through several grinders. You couldn't possibly be saying the DD isn't all it's cracked up to be could you? Haha The sharpening fixture you pictured is a good "bridge" between the DD and professional sharpeners but they do require a bench grinder (which the OP stated he didn't have). A quality made sharpening fixture can give professional results if set up and used properly, but it will take more time per bit and it does have a lot bigger learning curve. Different strokes for different folks... some people will be happy with the DD. That's fine... One of the above bit sharpening jigs can be had for around $25 +s&h, sometimes less. A used grinder can be found for $40 or less on Craigslist. Can a DD be purchased for that? |
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One of the above bit sharpening jigs can be had for around $25 +s&h, sometimes less. A used grinder can be found for $40 or less on Craigslist. Can a DD be purchased for that? Quoted:
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I started sharpening bits with one of these about 40 years ago. <a href="https://flic.kr/p/JQmE8K" target="_blank">https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7359/28114206585_ba0524facb_o.jpg</a>iu It isn't a 4k$ sharpener but it works very well if set and used properly with a grinder ( i know, the OP doesn't have one). A couple of years ago my BIL gave me a DD that he wasn't using. I eventually gave it back. I still have my original sharpening jig although I've gone through several grinders. You couldn't possibly be saying the DD isn't all it's cracked up to be could you? Haha The sharpening fixture you pictured is a good "bridge" between the DD and professional sharpeners but they do require a bench grinder (which the OP stated he didn't have). A quality made sharpening fixture can give professional results if set up and used properly, but it will take more time per bit and it does have a lot bigger learning curve. Different strokes for different folks... some people will be happy with the DD. That's fine... One of the above bit sharpening jigs can be had for around $25 +s&h, sometimes less. A used grinder can be found for $40 or less on Craigslist. Can a DD be purchased for that? If we're comparing used equipment, sure. The market is flooded with very lightly used DD's that people bought and either couldn't figure out how to use them or they found that the shortcomings of the design couldn't be overcome and decided to sell them... haha! |