Posted: 3/22/2010 5:25:13 AM EDT
| 2 of my friends for some reason were arguing about the 5-7 being similar to that of a .22 mag is there any truth to this? to me it sounds ludicrous. |
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It's a crappy caliber for self-defense, end of story. The only application where this has a place is in a full-auto P90 where you can put a lot of ammo on target quickly. [ETA] Also refer to: http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=19913 |
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Cute lil gun. Right up there with the Ruger Single-Six and AMT Automag from the OP's link: The 5.7×28 cartridge is not appropriate for use on anything except small game, such as squirrels and rabbits. Indeed, the ballistic performance of the 5.7×28 cartridge is remarkably similar to the .22 Magnum round.
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eh, the factory round is so neutered that it's pure meh. I handload my 40 grainers to just over 2000 fps from the pistol. I don't feel underguned when I carry it. From the 16" PS90 though they are just too fast and fragment too much to get good penetration so for that I load up 50 grainers at about 2060 fps. That gives me my penetration back.
BTW, my preferred carry piece is my XDM9 with 147 grain Gold Dots loaded to 1200 fps. |
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Quoted: eh, the factory round is so neutered that it's pure meh. I handload my 40 grainers to just over 2000 fps from the pistol. I don't feel underguned when I carry it. From the 16" PS90 though they are just too fast and fragment too much to get good penetration so for that I load up 50 grainers at about 2060 fps. That gives me my penetration back. BTW, my preferred carry piece is my XDM9 with 147 grain Gold Dots loaded to 1200 fps. What you feel is irrelevant. Do you have any data to back up your choice? |
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from the read of the article i posted its what the guy used at fort hood. Emotions and PC'ness aside, it did a pretty shitty job, terminally, based on what I read. I am glad he was not using something more effective. That last mass-shooting I remember involved a 9mm and a lot more people getting killed. |
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DocGKR posted this over on M4Carbine: I am not sure how shooting unsuspecting, unarmed individuals, who were confined in a relatively small indoor space has anything to do with defensive shooting effects––even a .22LR could prove deadly in such circumstances. As in all shooting incidents with handguns, folks who were shot in critical structures will have bad outcomes, while those hit in non-vital areas will do better. In this shooting incident, there are reports of several individuals not even being initially aware that they were hit, not to mention the heroic efforts of police officer Sgt Kimberely Munley who stopped the suspect despite being shot multiple times herself. Fortunately the traitorous perpetrator did not choose a more effective weapons system than the 5.7mm. |
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Quoted:
DocGKR posted this over on M4Carbine: I am not sure how shooting unsuspecting, unarmed individuals, who were confined in a relatively small indoor space has anything to do with defensive shooting effects––even a .22LR could prove deadly in such circumstances. As in all shooting incidents with handguns, folks who were shot in critical structures will have bad outcomes, while those hit in non-vital areas will do better. In this shooting incident, there are reports of several individuals not even being initially aware that they were hit, not to mention the heroic efforts of police officer Sgt Kimberely Munley who stopped the suspect despite being shot multiple times herself. Fortunately the traitorous perpetrator did not choose a more effective weapons system than the 5.7mm.
agreed. It was not nearly as bad as the west virginia shooting where a 9mm and 22lr where used. Then again there where far fewer people gathered in the areas at fort hood than classroom settings. |
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Quoted:
Quoted:
eh, the factory round is so neutered that it's pure meh. I handload my 40 grainers to just over 2000 fps from the pistol. I don't feel underguned when I carry it. From the 16" PS90 though they are just too fast and fragment too much to get good penetration so for that I load up 50 grainers at about 2060 fps. That gives me my penetration back. BTW, my preferred carry piece is my XDM9 with 147 grain Gold Dots loaded to 1200 fps. What you feel is irrelevant. Do you have any data to back up your choice? Nope, I dont, thats why I left it at how I feel. Also, I see you conveniently ignored the second portion I highlighted myself regarding my primary carry piece. This is the 9mm argument from the 80's and 90's all over again though, really. |
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Quoted: Quoted: Quoted: eh, the factory round is so neutered that it's pure meh. I handload my 40 grainers to just over 2000 fps from the pistol. I don't feel underguned when I carry it. From the 16" PS90 though they are just too fast and fragment too much to get good penetration so for that I load up 50 grainers at about 2060 fps. That gives me my penetration back. BTW, my preferred carry piece is my XDM9 with 147 grain Gold Dots loaded to 1200 fps. What you feel is irrelevant. Do you have any data to back up your choice? Nope, I dont, thats why I left it at how I feel. Also, I see you conveniently ignored the second portion I highlighted myself regarding my primary carry piece. This is the 9mm argument from the 80's and 90's all over again though, really. Good choice on the 9mm. The GDHP is one ofo the best on the market. I disagree with this debate being similar to the 9mm argument from the 80s and 90s. The 5.7 is a solution in search of an answer, and people trust their life to this caliber based on hyped information. If someone is fully aware of the drawbacks of 5.7 and still wants to use it - more power to them... |
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I should have explained myself on why I feel this is like the 9mm 80's and 90's arguments. Here it is. At that time, the only bullets available for the 9mm were of the same design as those used for the .357/.38's and the .45's. Until the tech cought up with the 9mm, they really were crap. Now, the 5.7x28 only has varment bullets being forced into the role of defensive rounds. It would be cool if the manufacturers put time and energy into the 5.7, but honestly, I think the market for them is too small. Much smaller than the 9mm to be sure. Yes, I do fully understand the shortcomings of the 5.7, seriously. When wearing summer clothes though, it is much easier to carry the FsN than my XDM9. Any gun is better than no gun, eh? ;)
ETA: I originally bought the FsN as a neet toy to go with my PS90 (another neet toy). It turns out that with handloads, it has more utility than with factory ammo. Hence the reason I dont feel undergunned with it when its not practical to carry the XDM. |
| 5.7x28 is a viable choice out of a full auto in my opinion, If you cant get one in full auto than I would stick to 9mm and above for sd. Dont think many on here will have any options for full auto unless you own a registered lower and a 5.7 upper. That would be pretty sweet. |
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Quoted: I should have explained myself on why I feel this is like the 9mm 80's and 90's arguments. Here it is. At that time, the only bullets available for the 9mm were of the same design as those used for the .357/.38's and the .45's. Until the tech cought up with the 9mm, they really were crap. Now, the 5.7x28 only has varment bullets being forced into the role of defensive rounds. It would be cool if the manufacturers put time and energy into the 5.7, but honestly, I think the market for them is too small. Much smaller than the 9mm to be sure. Yes, I do fully understand the shortcomings of the 5.7, seriously. When wearing summer clothes though, it is much easier to carry the FsN than my XDM9. Any gun is better than no gun, eh? ;) I understand what you're saying, but the small case capacity is the Achilles heel of 5.7. You're stuck with lightweight bullets that can be pushed fast and fragment, severely underpenetrating. On the other side of the coin are heavy bullets that are too slow; they penetrate deeply enough, but have a very small permanent cavity. The 5.7 may forever be a "if only..." caliber. Maybe someday there will be a significant breakthrough in powder design that lets the 5.7 exploit heavy bullets and high velocity, but I don't see that on the horizon anytime soon. |
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Quoted: 5.7x28 is a viable choice out of a full auto in my opinion, If you cant get one in full auto than I would stick to 9mm and above for sd. Dont think many on here will have any options for full auto unless you own a registered lower and a 5.7 upper. That would be pretty sweet. Agreed. Full auto out of a P90 can work in some applications. |