Posted: 8/6/2015 5:39:47 PM EDT
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I am not sure if this is the perfect spot but it looks as good as any. I've sent two of my pistols to a gunsmith for some custom work. The return time was 5 or 6 months to complete the work with of course the payment up front. I paid nearly two thousand bucks in the beginning of January for the work. I've been trying to reach the guy for 6 weeks and the only reply I got was he just had some surgery and he'd get back to me. That was about a month ago.
What I'm concerned about is the guns are regulated and mine but not in my possession and I don't believe I'll ever see them again or the money (less concerned about the cash at this point). However, I either just want them back or just want them no longer connected to me. He is an FFL so if he does his work properly they need to be "booked" in for gunsmithing work. I also have several emails and texts saying he's received them. I am willing to write the whole thing off to being an idiot but want to make sure these guns don't come back to haunt me in the future. Should I notify the ATF or the local law enforcement where the gunsmith is located? I'm not looking to stir up a lot of shit but I just want it to be resolved and as I said I willing to write off the entire investment of the pistols and the work I had paid for. I just want to be disassociated from these pistols at this point. Any thoughts? |
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Quoted: Why the hell would you pay ANYONE up front. I can see paying a nominal deposit, but full payment up front is a no go. I gotta agree with this....kind of a wonky business model to require all funds up front. That tells me enough to say they're not the kind of gunsmith you want to be sending a gun to. |
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Quoted:
I gotta agree with this....kind of a wonky business model to require all funds up front. That tells me enough to say they're not the kind of gunsmith you want to be sending a gun to. Quoted:
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Why the hell would you pay ANYONE up front. I can see paying a nominal deposit, but full payment up front is a no go. I gotta agree with this....kind of a wonky business model to require all funds up front. That tells me enough to say they're not the kind of gunsmith you want to be sending a gun to. Yep. Depending on the gauge of work being done, at least a 50% deposit is common. 100% up front however, eh... |
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To answer all the questions about payment I didn't really think about and it's not the important part of it. After I sent these pistols to this guy I did some business with Jim Garthwaite for a customs 1911. I paid nothing until completed and it was done early. I get the don't pay thing. I just don't want to be responsible for firearms that I really don't know where they are.
I have plenty of correspondence acknowledging the receipt of the firearms. I'll just call the ATF and let them know that I know longer am aware of the whereabouts of these guns. |
| I would say you have decent case for theft, if he doesn't get your property back to in the next week or two, I would be filing with the local police for theft of firearms. I would also see if they will charge him with theft of service since he hasn't done the work that you paid for, given the amounts that's at least two felonies right there. |
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I am not sure if this is the perfect spot but it looks as good as any. I've sent two of my pistols to a gunsmith for some custom work. The return time was 5 or 6 months to complete the work with of course the payment up front. I paid nearly two thousand bucks in the beginning of January for the work. I've been trying to reach the guy for 6 weeks and the only reply I got was he just had some surgery and he'd get back to me. That was about a month ago. What I'm concerned about is the guns are regulated and mine but not in my possession and I don't believe I'll ever see them again or the money (less concerned about the cash at this point). However, I either just want them back or just want them no longer connected to me. He is an FFL so if he does his work properly they need to be "booked" in for gunsmithing work. I also have several emails and texts saying he's received them. I am willing to write the whole thing off to being an idiot but want to make sure these guns don't come back to haunt me in the future. Should I notify the ATF or the local law enforcement where the gunsmith is located? I'm not looking to stir up a lot of shit but I just want it to be resolved and as I said I willing to write off the entire investment of the pistols and the work I had paid for. I just want to be disassociated from these pistols at this point. Any thoughts? Something smells..if you are willing to give your guns... |
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Something smells..if you are willing to give your guns... Quoted:
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I am not sure if this is the perfect spot but it looks as good as any. I've sent two of my pistols to a gunsmith for some custom work. The return time was 5 or 6 months to complete the work with of course the payment up front. I paid nearly two thousand bucks in the beginning of January for the work. I've been trying to reach the guy for 6 weeks and the only reply I got was he just had some surgery and he'd get back to me. That was about a month ago. What I'm concerned about is the guns are regulated and mine but not in my possession and I don't believe I'll ever see them again or the money (less concerned about the cash at this point). However, I either just want them back or just want them no longer connected to me. He is an FFL so if he does his work properly they need to be "booked" in for gunsmithing work. I also have several emails and texts saying he's received them. I am willing to write the whole thing off to being an idiot but want to make sure these guns don't come back to haunt me in the future. Should I notify the ATF or the local law enforcement where the gunsmith is located? I'm not looking to stir up a lot of shit but I just want it to be resolved and as I said I willing to write off the entire investment of the pistols and the work I had paid for. I just want to be disassociated from these pistols at this point. Any thoughts? Something smells..if you are willing to give your guns... What smells? The fact that I care less about money then making sure I'm not connected to guns I sent to an FFL that won't reply to me? Odd to impeach someone's character who's trying to express the care more about the law than money. |
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Sorry maybe I used the wrong term. I purchased the guns in NJ where they record each serial number to an ID and permit. Each time you purchase a pistol in NJ you need to apply for a permit which can take between 90 days and two years, even though by law it's 30 days. When you purchase you need to provide the permits to the dealer. There is a copy of the permit that you keep, the seller keeps, the state police and your local PD. it contains all your information, make, model and serial number of the firearm.
So in NJ I am a registered owner of the guns. I shipped them to get some work done to a FFL/gunsmith in AZ , and have all the documentation and correspondence, to get some work done. It's radio silence from the guy I just want to report what happened to me so that I am no longer responsible for these firearms. I've basically been robbed of my guns and 1800 bucks in cash. Nothing shady on my part as intimated by another poster but telling that they'd besmirch my character and don't know me or the details of this story. I haven't posted who the FFL was because this is my side and they wouldn't be able to defend themselves. So although I'm getting screwed I still wouldn't be unfair. In fact I wish they were on this forum to give their side because then I'd know something. |
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Why the hell would you pay ANYONE up front. I can see paying a nominal deposit, but full payment up front is a no go. I learned a long time ago: 1) Only pay 100% up-front when it's absolutely necessary. 2) It's never absolutely necessary. Rule of life: All work stops as soon as the last payment has been made. |
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Something smells..if you are willing to give your guns... Quoted:
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I am not sure if this is the perfect spot but it looks as good as any. I've sent two of my pistols to a gunsmith for some custom work. The return time was 5 or 6 months to complete the work with of course the payment up front. I paid nearly two thousand bucks in the beginning of January for the work. I've been trying to reach the guy for 6 weeks and the only reply I got was he just had some surgery and he'd get back to me. That was about a month ago. What I'm concerned about is the guns are regulated and mine but not in my possession and I don't believe I'll ever see them again or the money (less concerned about the cash at this point). However, I either just want them back or just want them no longer connected to me. He is an FFL so if he does his work properly they need to be "booked" in for gunsmithing work. I also have several emails and texts saying he's received them. I am willing to write the whole thing off to being an idiot but want to make sure these guns don't come back to haunt me in the future. Should I notify the ATF or the local law enforcement where the gunsmith is located? I'm not looking to stir up a lot of shit but I just want it to be resolved and as I said I willing to write off the entire investment of the pistols and the work I had paid for. I just want to be disassociated from these pistols at this point. Any thoughts? Something smells..if you are willing to give your guns... +1 here...I had the same thought as I've read this. An innocent person with clean hands wouldn't normally be willing to give in / give up so easily. There's something else here. |
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1. Out the Gunsmith and send him a link to this thread. This gives him opportunity to present his side, while protecting fellow Arfcommers from getting screwed. It also may yield information that the guy died or had a stroke or something.
2. Registered letter requesting return of guns and money. Include plans you have to report him to the BBB, file a lawsuit, report him to the local PD for theft, and to report him to the ATF to track the apparently stolen firearms. |
| This is a very common complaint with Gunsmiths, even reputable ones. Of course Plumbers, Electricians, Carpenters etc. the internet is great for communicating for small shops but also can be a screen. On the customer end, deposits keep the customer honest as well as many flaky operators out there on the customer end also. |
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+1 here...I had the same thought as I've read this. An innocent person with clean hands wouldn't normally be willing to give in / give up so easily. There's something else here. Quoted:
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I am not sure if this is the perfect spot but it looks as good as any. I've sent two of my pistols to a gunsmith for some custom work. The return time was 5 or 6 months to complete the work with of course the payment up front. I paid nearly two thousand bucks in the beginning of January for the work. I've been trying to reach the guy for 6 weeks and the only reply I got was he just had some surgery and he'd get back to me. That was about a month ago. What I'm concerned about is the guns are regulated and mine but not in my possession and I don't believe I'll ever see them again or the money (less concerned about the cash at this point). However, I either just want them back or just want them no longer connected to me. He is an FFL so if he does his work properly they need to be "booked" in for gunsmithing work. I also have several emails and texts saying he's received them. I am willing to write the whole thing off to being an idiot but want to make sure these guns don't come back to haunt me in the future. Should I notify the ATF or the local law enforcement where the gunsmith is located? I'm not looking to stir up a lot of shit but I just want it to be resolved and as I said I willing to write off the entire investment of the pistols and the work I had paid for. I just want to be disassociated from these pistols at this point. Any thoughts? Something smells..if you are willing to give your guns... +1 here...I had the same thought as I've read this. An innocent person with clean hands wouldn't normally be willing to give in / give up so easily. There's something else here. I can't tell you shortsighted it is to accuse someone of something when you don't know them, or there character or the details of a situation. The amount of money we are speaking of here isn't meaningful to me. What is meaningful is my character and making sure firearms are accounted for. I don't know if this guy would/could commit a crime or if he was robbed, etc. what I want to do is protect the innocent....me. In fact read the original post, I am having trouble with this guy but haven't tried to destroy his character because it's my side of a story. It's the side I believe to be true, but nonetheless it's mine. So move in with your conspiracy theories about something regarding me being out of sorts because it's false and unappreciated. It's amazing the comments from the clueless. As a follow up I made contact with the person in question. They claim to be suffering from leukemia. I don't know if that's true or not but that's the claim, and unlike some here I'll take him at his word. He said he'll make good on the order and there is no reason for concern and that my pistols were locked in the safe and properly booked in. This is the reason I didn't try to destroy the guys character in my original post like two of you here are doing to me. |
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I am not sure if this is the perfect spot but it looks as good as any. I've sent two of my pistols to a gunsmith for some custom work. The return time was 5 or 6 months to complete the work with of course the payment up front. I paid nearly two thousand bucks in the beginning of January for the work. I've been trying to reach the guy for 6 weeks and the only reply I got was he just had some surgery and he'd get back to me. That was about a month ago. What I'm concerned about is the guns are regulated and mine but not in my possession and I don't believe I'll ever see them again or the money (less concerned about the cash at this point). However, I either just want them back or just want them no longer connected to me. He is an FFL so if he does his work properly they need to be "booked" in for gunsmithing work. I also have several emails and texts saying he's received them. I am willing to write the whole thing off to being an idiot but want to make sure these guns don't come back to haunt me in the future. Should I notify the ATF or the local law enforcement where the gunsmith is located? I'm not looking to stir up a lot of shit but I just want it to be resolved and as I said I willing to write off the entire investment of the pistols and the work I had paid for. I just want to be disassociated from these pistols at this point. Any thoughts? You asked for thoughts on a public forum. My thought is that these reactions are unusual at best or irrational at most given the circumstances you've described. Nobody is questioning your character, but it raises a red flag to me. Normally, not always or necessarility in this case, folks who are willing to waive the white flag too quickly when they pose a set of fautless circumstance...are not as faultless as they appear to be. Just a general observation about people in general. Your described reaction seems unusual to me. Those are your guns and your $2,000 cash investment. Regardless of how rich you are, those things are yours and you're entitled to have them back. Regardless of how unfortunately sick this man is or isn't, and regardless of how much you may have in the bank, it should matter to you. This isn't even a matter of Christian forgiveness (give them your tunic too) situation...which I would understand. Just calling it as I see it since you put it here and asked for my thoughts. I do not know you or your character personally, so given that, I'm not going to automatically take everything you say as the gospel. So, that puts you into the neighborhood of...if it walks like a duck...talks like a duck...etc. Just reads suspiciously to me. Sorry. |
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You asked for thoughts on a public forum. My thought is that these reactions are unusual at best or irrational at most given the circumstances you've described. Nobody is questioning your character, but it raises a red flag to me. Normally, not always or necessarility in this case, folks who are willing to waive the white flag too quickly when they pose a set of fautless circumstance...are not as faultless as they appear to be. Just a general observation about people in general. Your described reaction seems unusual to me. Those are your guns and your $2,000 cash investment. Regardless of how rich you are, those things are yours and you're entitled to have them back. Regardless of how unfortunately sick this man is or isn't, and regardless of how much you may have in the bank, it should matter to you. This isn't even a matter of Christian forgiveness (give them your tunic too) situation...which I would understand. Just calling it as I see it since you put it here and asked for my thoughts. I do not know you or your character personally, so given that, I'm not going to automatically take everything you say as the gospel. So, that puts you into the neighborhood of...if it walks like a duck...talks like a duck...etc. Just reads suspiciously to me. Sorry. Quoted:
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I am not sure if this is the perfect spot but it looks as good as any. I've sent two of my pistols to a gunsmith for some custom work. The return time was 5 or 6 months to complete the work with of course the payment up front. I paid nearly two thousand bucks in the beginning of January for the work. I've been trying to reach the guy for 6 weeks and the only reply I got was he just had some surgery and he'd get back to me. That was about a month ago. What I'm concerned about is the guns are regulated and mine but not in my possession and I don't believe I'll ever see them again or the money (less concerned about the cash at this point). However, I either just want them back or just want them no longer connected to me. He is an FFL so if he does his work properly they need to be "booked" in for gunsmithing work. I also have several emails and texts saying he's received them. I am willing to write the whole thing off to being an idiot but want to make sure these guns don't come back to haunt me in the future. Should I notify the ATF or the local law enforcement where the gunsmith is located? I'm not looking to stir up a lot of shit but I just want it to be resolved and as I said I willing to write off the entire investment of the pistols and the work I had paid for. I just want to be disassociated from these pistols at this point. Any thoughts? You asked for thoughts on a public forum. My thought is that these reactions are unusual at best or irrational at most given the circumstances you've described. Nobody is questioning your character, but it raises a red flag to me. Normally, not always or necessarility in this case, folks who are willing to waive the white flag too quickly when they pose a set of fautless circumstance...are not as faultless as they appear to be. Just a general observation about people in general. Your described reaction seems unusual to me. Those are your guns and your $2,000 cash investment. Regardless of how rich you are, those things are yours and you're entitled to have them back. Regardless of how unfortunately sick this man is or isn't, and regardless of how much you may have in the bank, it should matter to you. This isn't even a matter of Christian forgiveness (give them your tunic too) situation...which I would understand. Just calling it as I see it since you put it here and asked for my thoughts. I do not know you or your character personally, so given that, I'm not going to automatically take everything you say as the gospel. So, that puts you into the neighborhood of...if it walks like a duck...talks like a duck...etc. Just reads suspiciously to me. Sorry. I asked for thoughts on what you would do if you were in this situation. I don't claim to be faultless again read the post. I'm not rich at all but don't worry about money as a primary concern. Secondarily I would have pursued for money back once I had taken all the appropriate steps to protect myself. I didn't say my word was gospel and didn't name names because it was my side of the story. However, now that I've spoken to the fellow he'd agree with my side of the story. Remember the question on the public forum is what would you do if someone was legally holding your guns and they went radio silent. However, you turned it into something completely different. A judge with no facts or evidence only your keen intuition--well it failed you. My character is not what I asked about, and since it was brought up its impeccable, on a public forum, it was the question above. I have all the correspondence via email, text and voicemail that supports what I've said. If I'm guilty because my first reaction wasn't money then maybe you got me there. |
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So wait. You send firearms and nearly $2k to a gunsmith. He confirms he received the firearms. The lead time comes and goes, then communication basically stops until recently(in the middle of the thread) You start the thread and basically you're willing to write off at minimum $3k or in property and cash? Troll thread, more to the story or you're being a pushover. No one in their right mind would right off that much in property and cash. Makes no sense at all. |
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I work with lots of gunsmiths, but have never heard of paying up-front before.
You really need to meet this guy face-to-face. Try to meet him at the location you think the pistols are at. I got into one of these a while back -- without up-front money, of course -- and I resolved it by going to a match where this guy was known to be a regular. He rummaged around in his crap for a while and came up with my pistols. He'd had them for six months and never taken them out of the case. Needless to say, his reputation was seriously tarnished by this (and other, like) incidence(s). |
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Not a troll story I have all communications saved. I would want my money back bu I wanted to make sure nothing out of sorts was happening.
I lived in NJ when I sent these guns to be worked on in Arizona. Face to face would cost me more than the guns. I tried contacting though phone calls and text messages on Juky 13th with only one automated and one personalized response to text. I waited a couple more weeks and based on what was written by a user here I said I felt I needed to contact the ATF. I responded that he could call in a day. His claim is he's being treated for Leukemia, I hope no one would make that up, and that he's recovering and will be able to complete my order. If there were more to the story, like I did something illegal, I wouldn't post it in a public forum. I have all correspondence, a federal express receipt, his acknowledgment of receipt of the guns, communications about the specifics of the things I wanted done. I also have confirmation through text messages that my firearms are appropriately stored and there's nothing to worry about. It's odd I admit but it is true and I've done nothing wrong. The pint is money was secondary to making sure nothing shady was happening. |
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You realize your registration is with the NJSP and not ATF right? If you're really concerned about them "coming back to you" you should file a theft report with the NJSP. BUT since you no longer live in NJ the NJSP will tell you to fuck off and that you're not their problem.
Plus, all serial numbers can be traced with enough effort. |