Posted: 1/21/2012 2:09:22 PM EDT
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I am somewhat new to the world of guns. I spent some time in the army and none of it in the sandbox. I am very comfortable with the AR-15 platform but I'm not here to ask about that. I am finally for the first time in my life moving into my own place and able to get a gun. I want to use it for Home defense and CCW. I will be looking into the CCW course once I am settled in my new place. I have next to no experience with handguns and am wondering where to start. The only think I do know for sure is I want something that will be cheap enough to feed so I can go shooting often and stay sharp with accuracy. I am looking to spend no more than 600.00. I would like something with a physical safety on it for my own peace of mind.
I have gone to the local gun store that has a range and rents guns to look around. I noticed a Taurus they had on display that was comfortable in my hand but they didn't have any to rent for firing. As for their rentals they had one Glock and a lot of Sig. But not a single 1911. I do love how a 1911 feels but I think its a bit out of my price range and from what I understand a .45 isn't the cheapest to feed. So what advice would be given for a newb? What should I look into or try to find to test? |
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I understand that you want a handgun for home defense and CCW and that it should not be expensive to feed and it should cost less than $600.
The answer depends on what your idea of concealed carry is. Many folks here conceal carry full sized pistols. Others consider a Glock 26 to be too large. Some want a CCW to be able to fit in front pants pockets. I predict that the majority of responders will recommend a Glock 19 for you. It acts like a full sized pistol. So it is good for home defense. It carries easily with the right holster and clothing. It takes the economical and effective 9mm round. It has a higher capacity than a .38 revolver. It costs less than $600 to purchase new. If you restrict yourself to one pistol, it is hard to find a better choice than the Glock 19. If you are not concerned about capacity, consider a .38 revolver. A Ruger LCR in .38 would be fine for home defense and CCW and it costs less than the Glock 19. You mention wanting to go shooting often. The Glock 19 will be more fun at the range than the .38 version of the LCR. The Glock 19 is completely comfortable to shoot all day. Some people find the LCR recoil to be a little much after an extended range session unless they are wearing shooting gloves. If you shoot .38 out of the .357 magnum version of the LCR, it will be more comfortable than the .38 version of the LCR. |
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While I certainly understand the need for a defensive gun, one of your priorities should be basic marksmanship competency best acquired through extensive affordable practice with a .22 rimfires. It may not be chic and tactical but nothing else is going to help you become a better shot that lots of affordable practice!
For your budget find a good used Ruger standard auto and a smith and wesson 39/59 series used police trade in auto and you will have two great guns well under budget you can depend on |
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Quoted:
I do love how a 1911 feels but I think its a bit out of my price range and from what I understand a .45 isn't the cheapest to feed. So what advice would be given for a newb? What should I look into or try to find to test? A decent 1911 from a reputable brand will run you around $575-600. The great thing about 1911s is their capability to allow one to make mods when they see fit & can budget them. Ammo can be had from GA Arms for around $17 per bag of 50rds in .45acp. 124gr 9mm ammo from them is $14 per bag of 50 rds. So, only $3 per box difference in FMJ ammo. not a big deal if one really wants/needs .45acp, IMO. But you're on the right track in renting as many guns as you can BEFORE you buy one. I also urge you to do your homework on what the extra mags cost, the holster variety offerings are & their cost, parts availibility, resale value, etc. etc. Once you narrow it down to 2-3 models, then do the background on them only in order to save yourself time. Gun Broker dot com is a good source for pricing comparasion. Most local dealers might be $50~ higher on the same gun but then you have to factor in shipping it, transfer fee, sales tax, etc. Again, do you homework & find which is cheaper for you. I would strongly urge you to stick with the "big boy" name brands on whatever model you choose. Beretta, H&K, S&W, Sig, FN, Springfield Armory, CZ, etc. Heck, just go up & down the handgun forum subsections to get further ideas. Once you have 2-3 quality, proven guns at home, then you might be ok to experiment with a weird, off-center gun, IMO. Good luck! My .o2 |
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Quoted:
While I certainly understand the need for a defensive gun, one of your priorities should be basic marksmanship competency best acquired through extensive affordable practice with a .22 rimfires. It may not be chic and tactical but nothing else is going to help you become a better shot that lots of affordable practice! For your budget find a good used Ruger standard auto and a smith and wesson 39/59 series used police trade in auto and you will have two great guns well under budget you can depend on At least go buy a decent co2 powered pistol and a decent trap. A full power handgun can teach you lots of bad habits. |
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1) Get a 9mm. Ammo is not unreasonably high and you can get pretty good stopping power out of modern hollowpoints. You'll be able to afford more range time. Recoil will be better as well if you get a 9mm for CCW than a .40cal or .45acp.
2) I wouldn't recommend a Taurus unless you're getting their PT92 or one of their older revolvers. There is just too much bitching about Taurus over the last few years. Where there is smoke there's fire. BTW, I read somewhere that they got a new VP that is in charge of fixing their quality issues and customer service. I don't know if it's true but I hope it's true. 3) Consider how you are going to carry the gun. This is a big deal as something that you carry in a shoulder holster may not be that great for IWB. If it's not comfortable then you won't be carrying it for long. It may be a great gun but it might not be a great CCW gun. 4) You are already thinking about what kind of safety you want. That's good. 5) You might want to consider a CCW that takes full sized mags and the shorter magazines for concealment. This would give you more enjoyable range time and more firepower for home defense (if you use the full sized mags) 6) Single stack mags vs. double stack. There may be a width and weight issue when carrying concealed if you go with a double stack. Maybe....maybe not. It depends on the indvidual. 7) You are considering a M1911 but are wondering about the .45acp and cost. There's a lot of 9mm's M1911's out there. Just something to think about. I like a Kahr CW9 and Ruger LCR for CCW but that's my choice and I don't pretend it's the best for everyone else. I will say that the Kahr is a great concealred carry gun, carries easily and it still gives me a decent grip to hold onto. Recoil is easily managable even with +p. It's a fun shooter even if it is a CCW gun. Most people say that concealed carry guns aren't that fun to shoot and get carried a lot but shot little. I enjoy the CW9. The DAO trigger is long enough and heavy enough that I don't worry about carrying it with a round in the chamber as long as I use a quality holster. The trigger is suprisingly good for a DAO and I hate DAO triggers as a rule. They are running about $440 in my area and CDNN investments has the best price on magazines. I've got a review of the gun on the Kahr page. |
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+1 for 9mm. Trigger time is affordable, effective carry ammo is available. +1 for a .22 target pistol, not now, but as soon as you can swing it. Trigger time is so cheap, it's damn near free. I got my Ruger 22/45 for $265 out the door from AAFES, and I think it may be the single best firearm buying decision I've ever made. +1 on no Taurus. Other stuff to consider- You need to find out if you'll prefer a single action only (SAO), double action only (DAO), single action or double action (SA/DA), or striker fired design. SAO, DAO, and SA/DA guns have an external hammer. Single action means the hammer must be cocked to fire. A single action trigger pull tends to be light, short, and crisp, but if your gun is SAO, it needs to be carried with the hammer already cocked and on safe. It's a perfectly responsible way of doing things, but it makes some people nervous. Double action means that pulling the trigger will cock and release the hammer in one motion. Double action trigger pulls are generally long and heavy. That can prevent negligent discharges, but it can also make shooting tricky. Double action pistols also offer "double strike" capability. This means that if you have a failure to fire, you can simply pull the trigger again and the hammer will re-strike the firing pin. The chances of "double strike" actually being useful are slim, but it's there. SA/DA means the pistol can be operated either way (like an M9). If you pull the hammer or rack the slide, the hammer will remain cocked giving you a light single action trigger pull. Or, you can carry it with the hammer down, give the trigger one heavy pull, and the slide will re-cock the hammer for each subsequent round. Striker fired pistols do not have an external hammer. They rely on a striker which is essentially a spring-loaded firing pin with a flat hook that's held by the fire control group until you pull the trigger. Striker fired pistols tend to be mechanically very simple. The trigger pull tends to be shorter and lighter than a DA pull, but heavier and crunchier than a SA pull. You said you're looking for something with a "physical safety." I think it's safe to assume that you're referring to an external thumb-operated safety like that found on a 1911. There's pros and cons to that. As mentioned above, if you're carrying a gun on safe, it probably means you're carrying it cocked and locked as most guns cannot be on safe if the hammer is not cocked (most guns with manual safeties are SAO, anyways). It's not really a big deal if you're comfortable with it. It's also worth mentioning that some feel that flipping a safety is an unnecessary action in a heat of the moment action. If you're sure a gun with a manual safety is what you want, make sure you can operate the safety quickly and easily with your firing hand. Frame mounted safeties like those found on 1911s, CZ75s, and Browning High Powers will be very easy and natural to operate. Chances are, a slide mounted safety like those found on Berettas, Walthers, or Makarovs will not be easy to operate. Another possibility is a SA/DA gun with a de-cocker (like a Sig, for example). You chamber a round and push a lever to release the hammer without firing the gun. Even though there's no safety, the trigger is heavy enough to require a very deliberate motion to fire. A lot of police departments have relied on SA/DA sidearms (autos and revolvers), and a lot of people use them as pocket guns/ purse guns. The last type of safety commonly encountered is a "trigger safety." It seems to be the mechanism of choice on many striker fired designs. It's a small lever on the trigger that is intended to prevent the trigger from being pulled accidentally, but in reality, there's probably not too many cases where someone/ something has accidentally hit a trigger without hitting the safety. Many will argue that "the real safety is between your ears; if you holster your weapon carefully and keep your finger of the trigger, it won't fire." While that is an absolutely true statement, the fact that you've expressed a desire for something with a "physical safety" probably means a design that relies on a trigger safety alone is not for you. Some guns have combinations of safety measures. A Beretta 92's safety is also a decocker. The Smith & Wesson M&P series, Ruger SR9, and FN FNS series are all available with a thumb safety in addition to a trigger safety. Before we can make any good recommendations, we need an idea of how much of what you intend to do with whatever pistol you buy. If it's going to be shot often and carried little, a metal framed pistol will probably provide a more satisfying experience than any of it's polymer competitors. But, if you live in the heat and humidity of Florida and intend to carry every day, a big, heavy steel gun with a less than resilient finish is probably the wrong answer. Take a look at your state's Hometown Forum. If you see any threads regarding a get together or a shoot, I suggest you go if you can. Chances are, the guys you meet will help you more than any gun shop. |
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