Posted: 7/16/2024 8:22:23 PM EDT
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As you know, there are multiple PCCs and PDWs that take Glock mags from Ruger, PSA, Kel-Tec, CMMG and more. There are also some out there that will do the P320. With the P365 we now have 21-round factory mags and ProMag has multiple P365 high-round mags including 32 and drum mags. I have multiple 20-round pro-mags for the P365 and they have worked flawlessly.  The FUSE is practically a duty gun and well aware of the (PDW) Flux365… When are we going to see a manufacturer make a PCC for the P365 mag? The gun is so popular I can’t see it not being a financial winner. And if there is something out there now that does take 365 mags, please share. |
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Ruger PCC w/ the Fraurem adapter. @zaitcev ETA: https://www.ar15.com/forums/t_5_4/202843_Return-of-the-comprehensive-magazine-compatibility-thread.html |
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Quoted: Ruger PCC w/ the Fraurem adapter. @zaitcev ETA: https://www.ar15.com/forums/t_5_4/202843_Return-of-the-comprehensive-magazine-compatibility-thread.html Nice! Thank you! |
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Quoted: Ruger PCC w/ the Fraurem adapter. The P365 adapter sells about third of B92 volume or half of P320. I can see why makers of PCCs prefer to wait it out. At least P320 has the advantage of being compatible with the U.S. military. We also looked at an adapter for Henry Homesteader and S&W Resolve. However, both of them present technical challenges. Nothing impossible to solve, just blows the price past the reasonable. You don't want to buy a $200 adapter for a $500 gun, right? |
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Quoted: The P365 adapter sells about third of B92 volume or half of P320. I can see why makers of PCCs prefer to wait it out. At least P320 has the advantage of being compatible with the U.S. military. We also looked at an adapter for Henry Homesteader and S&W Resolve. However, both of them present technical challenges. Nothing impossible to solve, just blows the price past the reasonable. You don't want to buy a $200 adapter for a $500 gun, right? Quoted: Quoted: Ruger PCC w/ the Fraurem adapter. The P365 adapter sells about third of B92 volume or half of P320. I can see why makers of PCCs prefer to wait it out. At least P320 has the advantage of being compatible with the U.S. military. We also looked at an adapter for Henry Homesteader and S&W Resolve. However, both of them present technical challenges. Nothing impossible to solve, just blows the price past the reasonable. You don't want to buy a $200 adapter for a $500 gun, right? Wish you'd do mag catches for 10x25mm Norma 1911 mags in the HiPoint 1095, and multiple mag catches for the S&W FPC - Beretta 92, S&W 59, SIG P320, SIG P226, Canick... Also need an AR45 magwell insert for 1911 mags, and would love it if someone brought back the AR9 adapter for unmodified Uzi mags. |
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Quoted: multiple mag catches for the S&W FPC - Beretta 92, S&W 59, SIG P320, SIG P226, Canick... Quoted: multiple mag catches for the S&W FPC - Beretta 92, S&W 59, SIG P320, SIG P226, Canick... I doubt it's possible. However, the P320 may actually fit as-is. I'm surprised if nobody tried yet. I don't guarantee reliablity, because the lips on P320 magazine are significantly shorter. But it should fit and work as long as you do not monopod it. Quoted: Also need an AR45 magwell insert for 1911 mags, ... The best I can suggest is Blind Squirrel screw-on adapters. No LRBHO, but it's similar in spirit to our own AR9MQ. https://blindsquirrel.enterprises/products/magazine-adapter-colt-1911-to-ar-15 |
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Quoted: I doubt it's possible. However, the P320 may actually fit as-is. I'm surprised if nobody tried yet. I don't guarantee reliablity, because the lips on P320 magazine are significantly shorter. But it should fit and work as long as you do not monopod it. The best I can suggest is Blind Squirrel screw-on adapters. No LRBHO, but it's similar in spirit to our own AR9MQ. https://blindsquirrel.enterprises/products/magazine-adapter-colt-1911-to-ar-15 Quoted: Quoted: multiple mag catches for the S&W FPC - Beretta 92, S&W 59, SIG P320, SIG P226, Canick... I doubt it's possible. However, the P320 may actually fit as-is. I'm surprised if nobody tried yet. I don't guarantee reliablity, because the lips on P320 magazine are significantly shorter. But it should fit and work as long as you do not monopod it. Quoted: Also need an AR45 magwell insert for 1911 mags, ... The best I can suggest is Blind Squirrel screw-on adapters. No LRBHO, but it's similar in spirit to our own AR9MQ. https://blindsquirrel.enterprises/products/magazine-adapter-colt-1911-to-ar-15 Thanks! I ask for those 9x19mm metal mags in the FPC specifically, b/c that's the same combination of mags that fit in KelTec's SUB2000 MultiMag version, and swaps out w/ a mag catch. All of those mags are pretty close to one another. Folks have been known to run Beretta 92 mags in SIG P226s w/ just an additional mag catch cut IIRC. |
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Quoted: .. the same combination of mags that fit in KelTec's SUB2000 MultiMag version, and swaps out w/ a mag catch. I knew it. However, remember that Multimag option had to be a separate SKU. It simply is a large hole, which covers the gamut of all mag notches. Then, a suitable latch is made that conforms to that large hole on the outside, but has an appropriate notch on the inside. I suppose one could "convert" FPC with a dremel, by cutting up that large hole. Then, new latches can be printed for M&P (to restore the original function), Beretta 92, P320, P365, etc. One remaining problem is LRBHO. It is not a feature of SUB2000, making Multimag easy, but I think FPC does lock on open. |
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Quoted: Ruger PCC w/ the Fraurem adapter. @zaitcev ETA: https://www.ar15.com/forums/t_5_4/202843_Return-of-the-comprehensive-magazine-compatibility-thread.html Aww, just ordered a Ruger PCC and bought some Glock mags to run in it. Ordering a Fraurem P365 adapter now. |
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Quoted: Aww, just ordered a Ruger PCC and bought some Glock mags to run in it. Ordering a Fraurem P365 adapter now. Please let us know how well it works. The P365 magazine offers certain features that make it a better fit than most alternatives for Ruger adapters. 1. The shoulder made by the transition to the single feed is uniform, which permits an overtravel stop molded into the body. Most other magazines overtravel on the ejector. That is even a problem of Ruger factory adapters. 2. The magazine notch is so high that there's essentially no tilting moment in the sliding latch, which improves longevity of the adapter. Remember to lock the bolt open. It needs to be done every time when you re-assemble after cleaning. P.S. In case you're on a desktop computer and the QR code does not work, here's the POV video: https://x.com/frauremllc/status/1728236908806087009 |
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Quoted: Sig sucks for selling their p365 and p320 magazines for $50 each. I'm happy your ProMags worked for you, but it's just as likely they would've not worked. No PCC should be built on a platform that has magazines that cost $50 each. ProMags work far more often than the ARFCOM GD mob would have you believe. ProMag is an OEM to CMMG. |
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Quoted: Someone needs to make a PCC that takes P365 FCUs Not a chassis like the flux but a real PCC. Shot the Flux Raider 365 or whatever it's called again today. Here's my take aways: CONS: Unpleasant to shoot. The 3" barrel is really not far from your face and the recoil is surprisingly spicy for 9mm. PROS: It was insanely accurate and I was hitting within a half inch at 15 yards with garbage ammo, and very quickly. It has ruined my dream of buying an MP5 as there's literally no reason to when I can get the same ballistics as that but with something that weighs less than my 1911s. CONS: Now I need to build a "real" version so currently saving up for the FUSE. Will come with the longer mags plus a couple extra inches of barrel length will make it nice and further from my face. I will also go down a rabbit hole and end up with both a threaded long-ass barrel and a micro 9mm can. this will literally likely replace all my other "long" guns not of rifle caliber. Additional sidenote. ACWs shoot frickin lights out, and the MCX in 300BO with subs and a can is also tits. That is all. honestly it's a surprisingly handy little package and anything bigger seems like a waste. |
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Quoted: PROS: It was insanely accurate and I was hitting within a half inch at 15 yards with garbage ammo, and very quickly. I'm a little surprised, considering how the tolerances stack in a Flux. In a normal pistol, the sights are on the slide. Therefore, the rail wobble matters not, as long as slide-to-barrel lock-up is good. But in a Flux, any rail wobble works against the accuracy. But the proof is in the pudding - if it works, it works! |
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Quoted: I'm a little surprised, considering how the tolerances stack in a Flux. In a normal pistol, the sights are on the slide. Therefore, the rail wobble matters not, as long as slide-to-barrel lock-up is good. But in a Flux, any rail wobble works against the accuracy. But the proof is in the pudding - if it works, it works! I had a dot on the slide of the donor pistol. So it’s as dialed in as can be. With the brace it was even more stable and fast. |
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Quoted: Shot the Flux Raider 365 or whatever it's called again today. Here's my take aways: CONS: Unpleasant to shoot. The 3" barrel is really not far from your face and the recoil is surprisingly spicy for 9mm. PROS: It was insanely accurate and I was hitting within a half inch at 15 yards with garbage ammo, and very quickly. It has ruined my dream of buying an MP5 as there's literally no reason to when I can get the same ballistics as that but with something that weighs less than my 1911s. CONS: Now I need to build a "real" version so currently saving up for the FUSE. Will come with the longer mags plus a couple extra inches of barrel length will make it nice and further from my face. I will also go down a rabbit hole and end up with both a threaded long-ass barrel and a micro 9mm can. this will literally likely replace all my other "long" guns not of rifle caliber. Additional sidenote. ACWs shoot frickin lights out, and the MCX in 300BO with subs and a can is also tits. That is all. honestly it's a surprisingly handy little package and anything bigger seems like a waste. Quoted: Quoted: Someone needs to make a PCC that takes P365 FCUs Not a chassis like the flux but a real PCC. Shot the Flux Raider 365 or whatever it's called again today. Here's my take aways: CONS: Unpleasant to shoot. The 3" barrel is really not far from your face and the recoil is surprisingly spicy for 9mm. PROS: It was insanely accurate and I was hitting within a half inch at 15 yards with garbage ammo, and very quickly. It has ruined my dream of buying an MP5 as there's literally no reason to when I can get the same ballistics as that but with something that weighs less than my 1911s. CONS: Now I need to build a "real" version so currently saving up for the FUSE. Will come with the longer mags plus a couple extra inches of barrel length will make it nice and further from my face. I will also go down a rabbit hole and end up with both a threaded long-ass barrel and a micro 9mm can. this will literally likely replace all my other "long" guns not of rifle caliber. Additional sidenote. ACWs shoot frickin lights out, and the MCX in 300BO with subs and a can is also tits. That is all. honestly it's a surprisingly handy little package and anything bigger seems like a waste. A full size PCC will be more comfortable to shoot. |
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Quoted: ProMags work far more often than the ARFCOM GD mob would have you believe. ProMag is an OEM to CMMG. Quoted: Quoted: Sig sucks for selling their p365 and p320 magazines for $50 each. I'm happy your ProMags worked for you, but it's just as likely they would've not worked. No PCC should be built on a platform that has magazines that cost $50 each. ProMags work far more often than the ARFCOM GD mob would have you believe. ProMag is an OEM to CMMG. Maybe they've improved, I've heard decent things about a couple of their products but I've personally owned a couple of various ProMag magazines that came with used guns or were in a box of stuff and none of them were reliable enough that I would have carried them. That said, IIRC, they are currently the only option for P225/P6 mags so I may end up trying them again. Just my experience with them. I take that back, I forgot I've got two of their Marlin Model 795 mags that also fit the 70 series guns and they've worked the couple of times I've used them. |
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Quoted: ProMags work far more often than the ARFCOM GD mob would have you believe. ProMag is an OEM to CMMG. |
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Quoted: While it may be a situation like Chinese manufacturing, where you can get quality if you're willing to pay for it, I've just lost a degree of respect for CMMG. Quoted: Quoted: ProMags work far more often than the ARFCOM GD mob would have you believe. ProMag is an OEM to CMMG. While it may be a situation like Chinese manufacturing, where you can get quality if you're willing to pay for it, I've just lost a degree of respect for CMMG. That's the most ignorant statement I've seen this morning - to be fair, I just got up. You should look up which magazine CMMG uses from ProMag, and then think through the reasons why they made that choice. There's no reason to disrespect CMMG on this count whatsoever. I'll give you a clue - ProMag is likely also an OEM to Diamondback. |
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Quoted: @backbencher fair, but comfortably shooting in a prolonged session is not why I got and use PCCs/PDWs. Lots of firepower in a small package that I can actually carry around with me is the motivator. Quoted: Quoted: A full size PCC will be more comfortable to shoot. @backbencher fair, but comfortably shooting in a prolonged session is not why I got and use PCCs/PDWs. Lots of firepower in a small package that I can actually carry around with me is the motivator. Understandable - why I replaced my SUB 2000 w/ a Fold AR. |
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Quoted: That's the most ignorant statement I've seen this morning - to be fair, I just got up. You should look up which magazine CMMG uses from ProMag, and then think through the reasons why they made that choice. There's no reason to disrespect CMMG on this count whatsoever. I'll give you a clue - ProMag is likely also an OEM to Diamondback. Association with a company not known for top quality will naturally allow some of their reputation to transfer to yours. I've been in this for a while - and the only highcap Promag I've ever had good feedback on were their hybrid AR magwell, AK mag body 7.62x39. Maybe they've improved in the last decade. It could happen. I'm open to having my opinion changed. I'm not going to go out of my way to search it out, but I'm open to any new evidence that comes my way. As for Diamondback, I've heard some nicely positive things about their barrels. The rest I have no opinion on. |
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Quoted: I'll give you a clue - ProMag is likely also an OEM to Diamondback. I don't know the association with Diamondback ought to imply. In my view, Diamondback is a company that is trying to turn its reputation around, but I don't know if they're succeeding. Therefore, I cannot tell if it's a good thing that they ship Promag magazines. Also, I'm pretty sure Promag can pull a lever and adjust quality of their product at will, so to speak. They have enough experience and the manufacturing base to make that happen. Because they were willing ship lots with wildly varying quality in the past, I cannot harbor any expectations. |
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Quoted: I don't know the association with Diamondback ought to imply. In my view, Diamondback is a company that is trying to turn its reputation around, but I don't know if they're succeeding. Therefore, I cannot tell if it's a good thing that they ship Promag magazines. Also, I'm pretty sure Promag can pull a lever and adjust quality of their product at will, so to speak. They have enough experience and the manufacturing base to make that happen. Because they were willing ship lots with wildly varying quality in the past, I cannot harbor any expectations. Quoted: Quoted: I'll give you a clue - ProMag is likely also an OEM to Diamondback. I don't know the association with Diamondback ought to imply. In my view, Diamondback is a company that is trying to turn its reputation around, but I don't know if they're succeeding. Therefore, I cannot tell if it's a good thing that they ship Promag magazines. Also, I'm pretty sure Promag can pull a lever and adjust quality of their product at will, so to speak. They have enough experience and the manufacturing base to make that happen. Because they were willing ship lots with wildly varying quality in the past, I cannot harbor any expectations. 5.7x28mm FN pistol type mags. ProMag is the only manufacturer of such mags other than FN, so CMMG & Diamondback use ProMag 5.7 mags for their ARish 5.7mm pistols & rifles that use the FN 57 pistol magwell. So to diminish CMMG's reputation b/c of their use of ProMag as an OEM is pure ignorance. |
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Quoted: Someone needs to make a PCC that takes P365 FCUs Not a chassis like the flux but a real PCC. I remember reading about(and even seeing a website for) a chassis system that used the P320 FCU way back before the P365 was even a thing. Was supposed to drop into different chassis like sub gun style and rifle with different options. That's been quite awhile ago and I cannot for the life of me remember any names or companies. I was looking forward to it |
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Quoted: Understandable - why I replaced my SUB 2000 w/ a Fold AR. Fair. I see PDWs as GTF off me guns for a bad situation, so comfort shooting is super low down on the list for me. A Sig Raider I actually carry with me is worth way more than a Ruger pcc that stays at home. I get it for practice and training and new shooters/women/kids but again it’s a niche role gun but one I enjoy and use frequently. Quoted: I’m sure you’ll be seeing P365 mag extensions soon +10’s The fuse mags are 21 and Flux has said they are doing mag extensions soon. |
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Quoted: My Fraurem P365 ran great today in my PCC. Five mags worth of 147gr Lawman from P365 X-Macro mags. Just got my Fraurem adapter installed (but haven't shot it, waiting on a PA 9mm microprism to arrive) and I noticed it has a very blocky edge on the new magwell. Would it seriously impact the strength of the RB9P if I took a dremel and cut a small bevel or chamfer to help guide the mags in? Seems like that bottom edge of the adapter wouldn't have much stress on it... @zaitcev |
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Quoted: Would it seriously impact the strength of the RB9P if I took a dremel and cut a small bevel or chamfer to help guide the mags in? Because RB9x is made with a lot of carbon, it can work. But in general I avoid dremel. It melts the material instead of cutting or grinding it cleanly, so you get a mess. If you have a low-speed rotary tool, or a small belt grinder, then perhaps use those. My tool of choice is a coarse file. If sufficiently coarse, it does not get clogged. With any of these tools, wear an N95 and vacuum the workplace. Knife chips are not as bad as dust. But if you use a blade, such as box cutter or pocket knife, only ever go in the downhill direction, no matter how tempting it may seem to do otherwise. It's the same as working with wood: the layers will suck the blade in an you'll get a massive gouge. Fortunately, as split is not very likely. |
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Quoted: Because RB9x is made with a lot of carbon, it can work. But in general I avoid dremel. It melts the material instead of cutting or grinding it cleanly, so you get a mess. If you have a low-speed rotary tool, or a small belt grinder, then perhaps use those. My tool of choice is a coarse file. If sufficiently coarse, it does not get clogged. With any of these tools, wear an N95 and vacuum the workplace. Knife chips are not as bad as dust. But if you use a blade, such as box cutter or pocket knife, only ever go in the downhill direction, no matter how tempting it may seem to do otherwise. It's the same as working with wood: the layers will suck the blade in an you'll get a massive gouge. Fortunately, as split is not very likely. Thanks for the tips! |
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Quoted:We also looked at an adapter for Henry Homesteader and S&W Resolve. However, both of them present technical challenges. Nothing impossible to solve, just blows the price past the reasonable. The adapter for P365 magazines in Henry Homesteader is now available. S&W Resolve is too much trouble. We're going to leave it to someone else, or maybe Smith themselves. |
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Quoted: The adapter for P365 magazines in Henry Homesteader is now available. S&W Resolve is too much trouble. We're going to leave it to someone else, or maybe Smith themselves. Quoted: Quoted:We also looked at an adapter for Henry Homesteader and S&W Resolve. However, both of them present technical challenges. Nothing impossible to solve, just blows the price past the reasonable. The adapter for P365 magazines in Henry Homesteader is now available. S&W Resolve is too much trouble. We're going to leave it to someone else, or maybe Smith themselves. Yay! Lol @ Smith managing to fuck up a PCC designed around interchangeable magazine wells. Updating mag compatibility thread now. |
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Quoted: B&T USW320 I suspect Mr. @TrailerTrash556 meant Flux. Their P320 version was out for a while. https://fluxdefense.com/shop/365-raider |
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By the way, here's the sales ratios of the aftermarket adapters for Ruger PC in 2024 by type: Beretta 92: 41% P320: 27% P365: 26% CZ-75: 6% The take rate is about 0.4%, so in absolute terms, almost exactly 1 in 1,000 owners of Ruger PCC chose a P365 magazine solution. Frankly that is very, very little. Everyone who wishes for OEMs to make PCCs with P365 magazines have to understand just how disfavourable the market is. On the other hand, P320 and P365 perform neck and neck. So, CMMG et al might get the same business by a P365 offering that they get from a P320 product that they sell today. Granted, that does not account for a possibility of institutional sales. |
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Thank you for sharing the data. For shits and giggles I asked ChatGPT, not 100% correct but good answer everything considered... A pistol-caliber carbine (PCC) chambered in 9mm that accepts slimline magazines from the Sig P365 series and/or Glock 48 / 43X could be an interesting concept, but it would likely have limited appeal compared to PCCs that use double-stack magazines. Here’s why: Potential Pros: Concealed Carry Companion – Many people carry slimline pistols like the P365 or Glock 48/43X. A PCC that shares magazines could appeal to those who want a home-defense or truck gun that complements their carry pistol. Compact and Lightweight – PCCs designed around single-stack or slimline magazines could be smaller, lighter, and more portable than those designed for full-size double-stack mags. Less Bulk in the Grip & Magwell – A slim PCC might be more ergonomic for some shooters, especially those with smaller hands. Potential Cons: Limited Magazine Capacity – The biggest drawback is magazine capacity. P365 magazines max out at 17 rounds (aftermarket). Glock 43X/48 (Shield Arms S15) maxes out at 15 rounds. Compare this to double-stack Glock PCCs that use 33-round Glock mags. Many PCC buyers want higher capacity, especially for range use or home defense. Limited Market Demand – The PCC market is competitive, with popular options like: Ruger PC Carbine Kel-Tec Sub2000 CZ Scorpion AR-9 platforms Most of these use widely available, high-capacity magazines. A slimline-mag PCC may not attract as many buyers. Magazine Compatibility Issues – Not all slimline pistol magazines are robust enough for use in a PCC, especially with high rates of fire. Aftermarket & Support – Accessories like drum mags and extended mags are far more available for double-stack platforms. Would It Sell Well? It could attract a niche market (CCW users who want a matching PCC), but would struggle against existing PCCs that use double-stack Glock or MP5 mags. If a company made it ultra-lightweight, ultra-compact, and very affordable, it might carve out a backpacking, truck gun, or survival niche. |