Posted: 12/5/2009 7:31:30 PM EDT
|
I've really been wanting to pick up a slim style 9mm. I've been wanting the Walther PPS but just a little too much money for me to warrant adding another when I don't really need it. Was at a gun shop today and was looking at the PPS again and the guy pulled out the 709 to show me and of course, I initially was like, ehh not interested in a Taurus... but I continued to look at it and it did feel good. It seemed to have a tighter smoother pull than the Kahr PM9. While I do like the feel of the PPS a little more and I prefer the longer mag plate for my big hands, the 709 did also feel good. Researching it seems it's not been too bad of a turd, quite a few positive reviews and given the price break, I might be willing to add that into the stables for a deep conceal.
Even though I'm definitely prejudice against Taurus, I'd love to hear some people tell me why I shouldn't..... |
|
I friend of mine just had the same experience you did. He traded his 9mm Khar for towards a SIG P220, and he was in need of a small 9mm carry gun to go a long with his Ruger 380. He looked at the Walther PSS and was very impressed but he didn't not like the price tag, and the only stores in our area that has the PSS in stock are the BIG BOX stores like Gander Mountain where the price is higher than a mom and pop gun store.
Long story short I told him about the new 709 Slim. I thought the 709 would be a could choice for him because he likes Taurus handguns (I never really cared for them) and the price point was affordable. Once he learned about the price he had the local gun shop order one, without even looking at one. I forgot to mention that my friend is 78 years old and personal protection is very important to him, but he gets tired loading mags...so I sent with him to break in the new Taurus and I have to say that I was VERY impressed with the 709 Slim. The gun was very accurate, did not have a single feeding issue with the 200 rounds fired. We tested some hollow point ammo and there were no feeding issues with the personal protection ammo. Like I said, I am more of a HK, Glock, SIG, Walther guy not a Taurus guy but the 709 feels to me like a single stack Glock and I really like the fact the 709 has an external safety. |
|
Quoted:
I friend of mine just had the same experience you did. He traded his 9mm Khar for towards a SIG P220, and he was in need of a small 9mm carry gun to go a long with his Ruger 380. He looked at the Walther PSS and was very impressed but he didn't not like the price tag, and the only stores in our area that has the PSS in stock are the BIG BOX stores like Gander Mountain where the price is higher than a mom and pop gun store. Long story short I told him about the new 709 Slim. I thought the 709 would be a could choice for him because he likes Taurus handguns (I never really cared for them) and the price point was affordable. Once he learned about the price he had the local gun shop order one, without even looking at one. I forgot to mention that my friend is 78 years old and personal protection is very important to him, but he gets tired loading mags...so I sent with him to break in the new Taurus and I have to say that I was VERY impressed with the 709 Slim. The gun was very accurate, did not have a single feeding issue with the 200 rounds fired. We tested some hollow point ammo and there were no feeding issues with the personal protection ammo. Like I said, I am more of a HK, Glock, SIG, Walther guy not a Taurus guy but the 709 feels to me like a single stack Glock and I really like the fact the 709 has an external safety. thanks for the feedback. I'm definitely not a Taurus guy but for the price range, and what it is, it seems like a good buy. There's not a lot of items in that 'class' of guns, IMO. The PPS and PM9 are there but the PM9 is not impressive at all to me and the PPS is just a lot of money for something I won't be using a whole lot. Of course, doesn't matter how cheap, if the 709 is crap then it's not worth 10 cents. I typically am not an external safety guy (I like Glocks/XDs) but in this application, I think it's a good feature. thanks again. |
|
Taurus, Kel-Tec, what's the difference? You take a good chance that either will have to be returned to the factory for work, either right away or within a 1000 rounds. And both repair facilities are in Florida. So the only real question is, which one will pay for the shipping and get the gun back to you, functioning properly, in the least amount of time? My money would be on KT, but then again I've been on both the KT and Taurus merry-go-rounds and nothing short of a free ride would get me back on either again. If you're dead set on buying KT or Taurus then I suggest the best plan is to buy from a dealer that will offer a 30 day money back guarantee, and shoot the shit out of the gun to make sure it works and doesn't fall to pieces every other magazine full. But your best bet is to save your money and buy a quality gun. |
|
Quoted:
Taurus, Kel-Tec, what's the difference? You take a good chance that either will have to be returned to the factory for work, either right away or within a 1000 rounds. And both repair facilities are in Florida. So the only real question is, which one will pay for the shipping and get the gun back to you, functioning properly, in the least amount of time? My money would be on KT, but then again I've been on both the KT and Taurus merry-go-rounds and nothing short of a free ride would get me back on either again. If you're dead set on buying KT or Taurus then I suggest the best plan is to buy from a dealer that will offer a 30 day money back guarantee, and shoot the shit out of the gun to make sure it works and doesn't fall to pieces every other magazine full. But your best bet is to save your money and buy a quality gun. IMO, the Taurus unit seems to have a much better fit/finish than the Kel Tecs... The Kel Tecs I've handled have been just steps above toys. Again I've never been a Taurus fan but this is the first one that has caught my eye and the quality seems to be above what I've seen from them in the past. I could be wrong of course; have you handled any of the Kel Tecs or this 709? |
It feels funky in my hand though and the relation of the trigger too.
|
"IMO, the Taurus unit seems to have a much better fit/finish than the Kel Tecs... The Kel Tecs I've handled have been just steps above toys. Again I've never been a Taurus fan but this is the first one that has caught my eye and the quality seems to be above what I've seen from them in the past. I could be wrong of course; have you handled any of the Kel Tecs or this 709?"
I agree. I've handled both and the Taurus makes the KT look like a toy in terms of fit and finish and that was the deciding factor for me. The KT PF9 I looked at had small shards of plastic protruding around the hammer. I was tempted to remove the slide and file down the plastic shards with my Leatherman, but I backed down. 
Much of the Taurus-bashing we still see is leftover from more than a decade ago when Taurus was basically the best of the low-end pistols (it is no longer a low-end pistol), and from the fact that it has always been a foreign name. Ruger owners could suffer another 10 recalls and further QC problems and many folks would stand loyally by the Ruger brand name. Taurus on the other hand... |
|
Quoted:
The PPS is worth the additional funds. http://i377.photobucket.com/albums/oo220/cashbailey_photos/WaltherPPS.jpg trade ya my glock 19 w/ night sights. |
|
Quoted:
It's a Taurus, that's all I need to know. Be prepared to send it on at least one extended vacation to Florida, on your dime. thanks 3rd. I think i've pretty much let that boat sail already... i can handle someone taking ownership and fixing a problem but bad customer service is my pet peeve... |
|
Quoted: Quoted: Taurus, Kel-Tec, what's the difference? You take a good chance that either will have to be returned to the factory for work, either right away or within a 1000 rounds. And both repair facilities are in Florida. So the only real question is, which one will pay for the shipping and get the gun back to you, functioning properly, in the least amount of time? My money would be on KT, but then again I've been on both the KT and Taurus merry-go-rounds and nothing short of a free ride would get me back on either again. If you're dead set on buying KT or Taurus then I suggest the best plan is to buy from a dealer that will offer a 30 day money back guarantee, and shoot the shit out of the gun to make sure it works and doesn't fall to pieces every other magazine full. But your best bet is to save your money and buy a quality gun. IMO, the Taurus unit seems to have a much better fit/finish than the Kel Tecs... The Kel Tecs I've handled have been just steps above toys. Again I've never been a Taurus fan but this is the first one that has caught my eye and the quality seems to be above what I've seen from them in the past. I could be wrong of course; have you handled any of the Kel Tecs or this 709? I've owned 4 Kel-Tec's and at least that many Taurii. I own none of either now nor will I consider owning either. Although for full disclosure, and to my own shame, I recently let Taurus bite me on the ass again. Seems I'm a slow learner. I've handled the PT-709, I like the size and the caliber and not much else. Taurus has the same problem KT does, and that is they use materials of average to poor quality and design their parts to be just barely strong enough. Add these two things together with a fairly potent cartridge and you get guns that don't last long. They both seem to produce a lot of guns that don't work right out of the box. I'm not sure if that's still true of KT, but it was at one time and it's still true of Taurus. At least KT will pay to have their lemons shipped back for repair and they'll repair it reasonably quickly. Taurus does neither. There are quality guns on the market for not a whole lot more. Guns that work out of the box and will keep working for many rounds. That $100 - $200 you save is insignificant in the long run. |
|
Quoted: Quoted: It's a Taurus, that's all I need to know. Be prepared to send it on at least one extended vacation to Florida, on your dime. thanks 3rd. I think i've pretty much let that boat sail already... i can handle someone taking ownership and fixing a problem but bad customer service is my pet peeve... Then you're wise to steer a wide course around Taurus. They'll fix it, but it will take a while and you'll foot the $50 bill to send it to them. And they seem to like to beat the crap out of guns before returning them. And its rare to find a dealer that will help. I was in a local gun shop today and was listening to the owner tell a prospective customer what a great gun a Taurus is. He knows better, he's gotten an ear full from me and several others recently who had to send new or like new Taurus guns he's sold back for repair, at our own expense. He knows they produce a large number of lemons, but he just doesn't care. If it doesn't work he's just going to tell you to call Taurus for warranty repair. I find this sad. I want to like Taurus, just as I wanted to like KT, but sooner or later a person gets tired of being burned and I'm tired of both brands mentioned. |