Posted: 1/16/2011 5:42:18 PM EDT
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Can someone here confirm that tenifer is NOT the same as melonite. My understanding is tenifer is a cyanide bath treatment and melonite is a salt bath treatment. I know a lot of people say they are the same. They may be close, but they are different. Anyone have a link or something that actually backs up this info.
If they are the same GLOCK would use the true tenifer treatment here in the US, right??? Let's get this right once and for all. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
| Here is an article about it. From what I've read here and elsewhere, Tenifer and Melonite are both salt bath ferritic nitrocarbourizing. Like everything though, two companies could be doing the same exact process on the same exact material and come up with two different results. It all depends on the details. |
| i think the only ones that really know the answer work at Glock. plenty of people say they are not the same and just as many say it is. i know one thing for sure, my Melonite S&W M&P .40 had areas of rust all over the slide and i have NEVER had a speck of rust on any of my Glocks. proof enough for me. |
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i know one thing for sure, my Melonite S&W M&P .40 had areas of rust all over the slide and i have NEVER had a speck of rust on any of my Glocks. M&P slides are stainless steel, Glock slides are carbon steel. Nitriding processes are really a poor choice for finishing Stainless steels, as it lowers the corrosion resistance, whereas nitriding carbon steels significantly increases corrosion resistance. I facepalmed at S&W's stainless + nitride combination, and figure that it's based on marketing instead of reality. http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=523317&page=1 Another current thread discussing nitriding of stainless. |
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I'm no chemical engineer, but I've read that Tenifer/Tennifer uses cyanide based acids, thus making them too much for our EPA regulations. Can be made with cyanide free salts to be enviromentally friendly. From my post above, The term nitrocarburizing means an enrichment of the surface layer of ferrous materials with nitrogen and a small amount of carbon. This thermochemical treatment improves the wear resistance and the fatigue strength. Used with a strongly oxidizing cooling bath - TENIFER®-QPQ - wear and corrosion resistant surfaces with an attractive black appearance are produced. Products used in nitrocarburizing TF1 cyanide-free top-up salt for TENIFER® baths*; used for treating ferrous materials. Used only in combination with the REG 1 regenerator. Working temperature 480 - 630°C. REG 1 environment-friendly, nontoxic regenerator for TF 1 baths AB 1 oxidative salt for cooling parts treated in TF 1 baths; greatly enhances the corrosion resistance (TENIFER®QPQ process). The well-known traditional Durferrit NS salts are still available*. Products Working temp. Durferrit TF 1 480° - 630° C Durferrit REG 1 Regenerator Durferrit AB 1 350° - 400° C Durferrit NS* *Known in English-speaking countries as TUFFTRIDE © Durferrit GmbH, Industriestrasse 3, 68169 Mannheim Tel.: +49 (0) 621 32224-0, Fax: +49 (0) 621 32224-809 E-Mail: [email protected] |
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i think the only ones that really know the answer work at Glock. plenty of people say they are not the same and just as many say it is. i know one thing for sure, my Melonite S&W M&P .40 had areas of rust all over the slide and i have NEVER had a speck of rust on any of my Glocks. proof enough for me.[/quote Read post 15 and 16 , engineer from S@W chimes in. http://www.finishing.com/324/69.shtml |
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I'm no chemical engineer, but I've read that Tenifer/Tennifer uses cyanide based acids, thus making them too much for our EPA regulations. Not this shit again. 
-The "Tenifer" process isn't banned by the EPA, it is just one companys name for the process. -They are the same thing using the same cyanide salts held in solution. -There are slight differences in salt ratios (all salts used are cyanide based) time and tempature used between companies, but that is it. -Quit beliving everything you read on internet forums and actually do some research on the subject. At least there are a few of you out there that know what you are talking about. ETA: hit reply instead of quote 
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Not this shit again.
-The "Tenifer" process isn't banned by the EPA, it is just one companys name for the process. -They are the same thing using the same cyanide salts held in solution. -There are slight differences in salt ratios (all salts used are cyanide based) time and tempature used between companies, but that is it. -Quit beliving everything you read on internet forums and actually do some research on the subject. At least there are a few of you out there that know what you are talking about. Why the fuck do you think I aske the goddamn question.If you don't like it,I really don't give a fuck pal. Oh,thanks for the info. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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Not this shit again.
-The "Tenifer" process isn't banned by the EPA, it is just one companys name for the process. -They are the same thing using the same cyanide salts held in solution. -There are slight differences in salt ratios (all salts used are cyanide based) time and tempature used between companies, but that is it. -Quit beliving everything you read on internet forums and actually do some research on the subject. At least there are a few of you out there that know what you are talking about. Why the fuck do you think I aske the goddamn question.If you don't like it,I really don't give a fuck pal. Oh,thanks for the info. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile  sorry about that, didn't mean you. i forgot to quote txgp17.
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Quoted: Oh, you mean like believing the stuff you just posted in an internet forum. Have you no knowledge of what a hypocrisy is?
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Not this shit again. I'm no chemical engineer, but I've read that Tenifer/Tennifer uses cyanide based acids, thus making them too much for our EPA regulations.
-Quit beliving everything you read on internet forums and actually do some research on the subject. At least there are a few of you out there that know what you are talking about. ETA: hit reply instead of quote You failed to post a link to any official company website substantiating your statement. Are you incapable, incompetent, or making stuff up? Not only did you miss the "quote" button, you missed the "spellcheck" button too. |
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i think the only ones that really know the answer work at Glock. plenty of people say they are not the same and just as many say it is. i know one thing for sure, my Melonite S&W M&P .40 had areas of rust all over the slide and i have NEVER had a speck of rust on any of my Glocks. proof enough for me.[/quote Read post 15 and 16 , engineer from S@W chimes in. http://www.finishing.com/324/69.shtml i read that. i wonder if he was involved in the rust prone m&p's with melonite. i'll stick with what works. i don't care what the process is. |
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i know one thing for sure, my Melonite S&W M&P .40 had areas of rust all over the slide and i have NEVER had a speck of rust on any of my Glocks. M&P slides are stainless steel, Glock slides are carbon steel. Nitriding processes are really a poor choice for finishing Stainless steels, as it lowers the corrosion resistance, whereas nitriding carbon steels significantly increases corrosion resistance. I facepalmed at S&W's stainless + nitride combination, and figure that it's based on marketing instead of reality. http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=523317&page=1 Another current thread discussing nitriding of stainless. makes sense then. my m&p was my duty weapon and just normal conditions would rust parts of the slide and sights. |
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Quoted: Oh, you mean like believing the stuff you just posted in an internet forum. Have you no knowledge of what a hypocrisy is?
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Not this shit again. I'm no chemical engineer, but I've read that Tenifer/Tennifer uses cyanide based acids, thus making them too much for our EPA regulations.
-Quit beliving everything you read on internet forums and actually do some research on the subject. At least there are a few of you out there that know what you are talking about. ETA: hit reply instead of quote You failed to post a link to any official company website substantiating your statement. Are you incapable, incompetent, or making stuff up? Not only did you miss the "quote" button, you missed the "spellcheck" button too. Forgive me for making a typo while half asleep.
Want proof? Try clicking on any of the links that have been posted in this thread. namely this one that 1MRBEAN posted. He also posted this. Which had you read it, you would have have found this post regarding cyanide use in metal treatment. Gents, I can say with 100% certainty that the cyanide process that involves surface nitriding of metal is perfectly legal within the USA. I know this because I currently regulate 2 such processes right here in Springfield, Ohio. They both use a molten cyanide bath to introduce the nitrogen into the structure of the metal part being nitrided. Please see
www.hefusa.com and www.trutecind.com. Jeff Jeff Yinger gov't - Springfield, Ohio Also, "spell check" isn't one word. 
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So the pattern continues, you rely on someone else to make a point for you.
Forgive me for making a typo while half asleep.
Want proof? Try clicking on any of the links that have been posted in this thread. namely this one that 1MRBEAN posted. He also posted this. Which had you read it, you would have have found this post regarding cyanide use in metal treatment. I admit that my statement on cyanide in the USA was wrong, but I have zero tolerance for an insolent condescending oxygen thief with PMS like you degrading others just because they're incorrect on something. Also, "spell check" isn't one word. Oh really, take a look at the "spellcheck" button used on the website.
Tell me again where the space is. |
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I am just getting into researching this but I was looking at a LW SS slide for a glock 20L Is there a treatment that can be done on a SS slide that is good and will last
It seems some treatments are not good on SS. I am still researching this so just asking for help and advice on this. |
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I am just getting into researching this but I was looking at a LW SS slide for a glock 20L Is there a treatment that can be done on a SS slide that is good and will last It seems some treatments are not good on SS. I am still researching this so just asking for help and advice on this. Look into the Ion Bond coatings. |
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Thanks for all the links.That is some good stuff.
So melonite is as good/or the same as tenifer, as long as it is not applied to stainless? Also,if both are allowed in the US why would GLOCK not use tenifer anymore when that has been on of the main benefits to owning a GLOCK. Damn guys this thread aint worth getting the ban hammer put on ya! All we need is good info to educate each other. Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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So melonite is as good/or the same as tenifer, as long as it is not applied to stainless? Also,if both are allowed in the US why would GLOCK not use tenifer anymore when that has been on of the main benefits to owning a GLOCK. Correct to the first question. For the second one, Glock doesn't use tenifer in the US because a different company does the metal treatment over here. The company that does the work over in Europe has the name tenifer trademarked so the companies here in the US have to use a different name, melonite. On another note, we should put some of the information about the processes in the tacked Glock Information thread so that some of they myths can be dispelled. |
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So melonite is as good/or the same as tenifer, as long as it is not applied to stainless? Also,if both are allowed in the US why would GLOCK not use tenifer anymore when that has been on of the main benefits to owning a GLOCK. Correct to the first question. For the second one, Glock doesn't use tenifer in the US because a different company does the metal treatment over here. The company that does the work over in Europe has the name tenifer trademarked so the companies here in the US have to use a different name, melonite. On another note, we should put some of the information about the processes in the tacked Glock Information thread so that some of they myths can be dispelled. Thanks for the info.Good stuff! Posted Via AR15.Com Mobile |
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i know one thing for sure, my Melonite S&W M&P .40 had areas of rust all over the slide and i have NEVER had a speck of rust on any of my Glocks. M&P slides are stainless steel, Glock slides are carbon steel. Nitriding processes are really a poor choice for finishing Stainless steels, as it lowers the corrosion resistance, whereas nitriding carbon steels significantly increases corrosion resistance. I facepalmed at S&W's stainless + nitride combination, and figure that it's based on marketing instead of reality. http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=118&t=523317&page=1 Another current thread discussing nitriding of stainless. No "facepalm" necessary so long as S&W had the formulation and temperature range correct. |