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AR15.COM
9/30/2007 3:53:17 PM EDT


....which do you like better and WHY?  

Kimber Compact Stainless II

or

Springfield Loaded Champion Stainless?



10/1/2007 6:31:58 PM EDT
[#1]
Kimber, I don't like the squared off thumb safety on the Springfield or the speedbump grip safety.  Removing the ILS is easy, but will cost a few bucks in small parts.

Both are solid and reliable.  Buy the one with the features you like.

10/1/2007 7:37:05 PM EDT
[#2]
Springfield, hands down,

1.Kimber has the PITA Swartz safety that cannot be completely removed easily. SA uses the ILS safety that can be removed with a simple parts replacement.

2. Kimber is built tightly. It makes the gun feel solid and adds a negligable (extremely small) amount of accuracy, since the real key to accuracy is NOT with the slide to frame fit. This tightness comes at a dear cost. Wilson Combats can be built tightly because someone is there hand fitting the parts and inspecting these closely before releasing. Kimbers (like Springers) are slapped together with a minimal amount of attention, largely due to the mass volume produced. Pistols/parts built slightly out of spec will probably work fine on a loose pistol. The margin of error is narrowed considerably on a tight pistol. So,

                                    tight build
                                 - rigorous QC
                                 - 1" off the slide
                                 = recipe for disaster


There are thousands, if not tens of thousands of Kimbers. There are hundreds if not thousands of Kimber Compacts that work great, and I am sure at least two people will be here to tell you how great their Kimber has been to them. I played the "production pistol compact CCW game" and I was burned hard. I was also in a gunfight. That changed everything for me and I went semi custom, because I needed to be as close as humanly possible to 100% confident in the man-made machine my life depends upon, and the odds of that are damn difficult with a production compact pistol, based on this hit or miss QC BS. I don't mean to bag on production pistols in general and Kimbers in specific, but inevitably I am.

You can cut some corners to make a cost-competitive 1911 that is basically consistent with X good eggs and Y bad apples, but when you start chopping length off the slide and barrel, the margin of error narrows considerably. Kimber makes a pistol that's too tight for what they are willing to invest in QC (IMO) and that already narrow margin of a tight pistol being narrowed even further by a short slide is too much for my comfort zone. It's your life, it's your call. Even if the consensus is that this argument is making a mountain out of a molehill (which I would go to the mat over) My suggestion still stands due to the Swartz safety sucking ass. If you need any other reasons, Springfield seems to offer somewhat better service than Kimber (at least that's what I seem to read around here) and the Kimber rollmarks are ugly, which is the most important decision about buying a gun, period. Ok... kidding there.

Go with the Springer.
10/2/2007 5:51:52 PM EDT
[#3]
The Swartz system can be disabled by either.

1) installing a series 70 firing pin.

2) removing the rear sight and dropping out the plunger components.

Shoot (or at least handle) both. Buy the one you like best.
10/3/2007 6:15:49 AM EDT
[#4]
The one compact that I have heard the least issues... Colt Defender
10/4/2007 7:22:22 PM EDT
[#5]
I know it wasn't one of your options listed above but.... you might also want to look at the Dan Wesson Commander Bobtail.
10/6/2007 5:24:46 PM EDT
[#6]

Quoted:
I know it wasn't one of your options listed above but.... you might also want to look at the Dan Wesson Commander Bobtail.


I was just going to say that.