Full Details

Re the 405/167 corridor proposed plans in a nutshell:

• Max toll raised from $15 to $18
• Stretch of 405 between Bellevue and Renton added (currently free diamond lane becomes tolled lane)
• Raise HOV requirement to 3+ passengers
• Eliminate free use on weekends

Of course, they invite 'comments', but that will go nowhere.

They create more traffic and make you pay for what was free.. and they made a huge profit to squander away for their agenda.

who pays for the roads, WE DO!!! I should not have to pay extra to drive on a road I paid taxes for and maintain, yet people gladly pay to drive in HOV lanes. Insanity!!!

I don't drive any of these roads or even live near any BUT it still pisses me off.
The mismanaging of most all the taxes we pay in this state is criminal.
Look at the ferry system, the game dept, Dept of corrections on and on all mismanaged. Just look at all the trash along all the roads in this state. They can't even keep the road sides picked up.
The people just keep supporting this corrupt government and think some how it's going to change for the better.
Just amazing.
Nothing will ever change as long as we have mail in voting.
Hope I am wrong but I know I am not.

Where does all the money go from our gas tax? I know we're close to the top when compared to the other states.  Then add the tags that were supposed to be reduced. We must be supporting several sanctuary cities.

I'll sit in traffic.  Not paying more, for what I've paid for already.

I agree with this.  As long as we have mail-in voting we'll never be able to stop the steal.
Check out this blog:
https://cliffmass.blogspot.com/2024/08/vote-yes-for-washington-state.html

As if I needed another reason to avoid that shithole area.

Cliff is a lone voice of reason in the Climate Change Hysteria.

Well, the Fossil Fuel Ponzi scheme "profits" are used to buy votes from the low-income instead of returning to the General Fund.

I've noticed that pretty much everyone ignores the HOV lane requirements now. I'd say 50% of the cars I see in it are single occupant, or using it as a passing lane.

Due in part to the left lane camping that’s worse in WA than anywhere else

iirc, the tolling money is split between the state and the company that set the whole thing up. It's a subscription service, basically, with no end date. And I think the % split is outrageous. It's not like the state gets 90% of the toll money and the tolling company gets 10%.

WA uses ETAN, out of Texas, which already has some problems, like in San Diego.

An engineering company oversees ETAN in CA, not positive what's in place in WA (but probably), so there's another middleman who gets paid with tax dollars.

Gas tax is split into 3 buckets, iirc - Maintenance, debt service, new projects. Guess which one takes the lion's share? New projects has been 2nd, and whatever's left goes to maintenance. I think. It's been 10+ years since I sat on these meetings.

- They’re just plain nuts!

Came here to post this.  The "nickel" and "9 cent" gas taxes that were passed by the legislature several years back, with a bunch of projects listed, were actually financed by bonds, so they could move forward before the gas taxes were collected.  Those bonds are still being paid off, so a big chunk is dedicated to debt payoff.  Someone told me it's about 50% of the gas taxes.

New projects are always "sexy" for the legislature, so they can point at them and tell their constituents, "See what I got passed for you!".  Maintenance has always lagged, and the maintenance budget has not greatly increased in the last couple of decades, at least not enough to keep up with inflation.  In addition to the normal maintenance activities you would expect, other items are included in maintenance.  Snow removal is a big one.  The mountain passes are pretty standard budgeting items, but if we get a big lowland snow/ice event, that can severally dip into the budget.  Encampment cleanups and graffiti removal are big parts of the budget as well.  If you drive I-5 through Seattle, you'll see that they can't even keep up with that.  Every 10-15 years, the asphalt roadways need to be repaved.  That's also part of the maintenance budget, as well as any operations functions - freeway cameras, reversible lanes, traffic signals, etc.

And then there's the whole Fish Passage lawsuit that the agency has to address.  The legislature has allocated some funding for it, but with inflation, it's not enough to address all of the court ordered fixes within the deadline.

And surprise - all those projects that are constructed by private contractors are subject to sales tax in this state.  So WSDOT has to pay out and additional percentage to the contractor, who then pays it to the Dept of Revenue, who then pays it into the general fund - not the transportation fund.  There have been some efforts to either make the projects sales tax exempt, or to allocate any funds collected back to the transportation fund, but they've died in the legislature.

Yeah, pulling from memory, about 50% debt, ~40% new projects, and between 7-9% for maintenance.

There have been so many stupid proposals WSDOT tried to force down contractor's necks. One was a 3% trim right off the top for WSDOT work. You bid a $300m project for WSDOT, it's now $291m. WSDOT gets to approve your wage package (prevailing wage) and your multiplier (I forget what this is actually called). So say you can bid a project and it'll take 60 man-hours at $200/hr. You also need to get paid for overhead, like every business. So your overhead rate (THAT's what it's called) is 2.61. WSDOT could go in to your financial biz and say "hey, you're paying your executive assistants too much money, we're deducting that from your overhead rate." So your new overhead rate, after they crawl out of your financial rectum, comes out to 2.2. That's $31,320 vs. $26,400 for those of you keeping track at home. Now add a couple zeros on the end and it becomes real money.

In the meantime, WSDOT is legislatively limited to the number of engineers they can have on staff, which they ignore. When I was in that world, WSDOT was overstaffed by roughly 25%, about 300 jobs. At total compensation (wage + benes), that's over $40m of the WSDOT budget that's in violation of law.

But we all know the saying. It's WA's soap. They can wash as hard and fast as they want to.

There is no "left lane camping" on 405, 5, 520, 167, 512, 522, 90 or others.  They're full.  So tired of the camping trope.

I gotta disagree.  Maybe you're a camper and not realizing it. On Wednesday had to drive down to then back from Seattle on 5.  I'd say that no fewer than a dozen drivers in the 50 mile trip down and then several on the return were "parked" in the left.  It wasn't rush hour, 1000 going down and 1300 on the return.  Most times I'd come up on the driver driving the speed limit with no cars in front of them for at least a half mile. I know it's a dick move but I go around them on the right and get right back in front of them without my signal. In the past I've even pointed to the sign that says slower traffic move right but I doubt it helped. Not this last trip but have seen it a few times previously where someone enters the highway and immediately goes to the left lane and maybe at the speed limit and parks it.  I used to think that maybe Washington state teaches everyone in driver's ed to drive in the left lane. I've driven in every one of the lower 48 and Washington does seem to be the worst. When the traffic is bad I'm not as critical of this but still think if the drivers followed the "rule" of moving over that traffic wouldn't be as bad, at least for those wanting to get a move on.

Sorry, but that's

Sure makes the unions happy. It's no wonder they vote for the Democrats lol

Interestingly, over the course of my life, every time I've moved, it's always been farther northward. At this stage, I can't go much further without becoming a foreigner, which isn't my bag. I'm tired of this crap encroaching on me & mine, & having to move away from it. There's not much further north I can go.

It's too bad most drivers are too stupid to realize it's a message. I usually cut off campers.

Coming home once on NB I-5 just north of Nisqually (where the train derailed), there was a woman in the left lane camping. Not even going 60mph. Semis in the right lane, so passing was a bitch, literally. The left lane backup was almost up the hill to Cabela's. I got around her, finally, and tried to send a message. I slowed down. I slowed down to 50mph and she didn't get in the other lane.

The problem some drivers have is the belief that the left lane is the "fast lane." Nope, it's the "passing lane." That's why the HOV is on the other side. When you need to pass a slower HOV car, you pop in the passing lane.

If you're not passing, get over.

And in typical Washington fashion, I was pulled over around JBLM once for tailgaiting. WSP asked why I'm following so close. I said this is the passing lane, and they're not passing and need to move over. He said, "Is there a problem with the other three lanes?" We have rules! We live in a society!!! <costanza rant>

WSP? Who's that? Oh yeah, I remember those guys. Never see them any more.

There all over here harassing truck drivers with legitimately legal trucks while the gypo non legal trucks drive by while your getting a inspection.

They popped me recently too for expired tabs (by a few days), was driving through seattle in our Toyota made kid hauling suv with a carseat clearly visible.

That’s who they tend to harass, they leave elites and criminal class alone but clamp down hard on normal citizens, same story with my other half hauling our son to school one day, 6mph over and hit with a ticket

Watched one today come up fast in the left lane, the guy didn't move over fast enough, go figure, and the trooper went around in the HOV.  My mind started screaming in it's best Gomer Pyle voice "Citizen's arrest! Citizen's arrest!"

Yeah, cuz they’re camped out at the top of toll lane exits to hand out toll violation tickets.😂🤮

I read they also want to replace that I-5 bridge over the Columbia River that connects WA to OR.

Same excuses as the 520 bridge and the Alaskan viaduct: "earthquakes"

I'll not be surprised if they come up with some toll to "fund" it.

Akin to ‘Seattle is Dying’ someone needs to create a documentary called ‘For Whom Olympia Tolls’😡

You're not wrong. I travel I-5 daily, & there's often someone L lane camping. Many times when I come up on a group moving <= 60 mph, there's 2 others in the middle & R lanes, all 3 driving in a "wall" formation, holding the rest of the pack hostage.

The Columbia River Crossing (CRC) has been on the wish list for well over a decade. The project is pretty much is stalled out because Oregon doesn't want to pay for their fair share because most of the CRC is on their side. WA should say fine, and just build up the 205 crossing. Bypass DT Portland. Let the city die.

Is hat the shit show where the vehicle bridge does not add any lanes to address traffic, but it does add light rail? Isn’t it also to low for the coast guard to sign off on?

Well, I guess the commuters will have to set up another mannequin.  

Is that the same mannequin from The King of Queens?

Just so you know, law enforcement while driving a marked emergency vehicle is exempt and can use the car pool lane anytime they want and no they don’t have to be responding to priority call either. WAC 468-510-010

I didn't know that though my comment was tongue in cheek. I don't have too much of a beef with cops, I know it must be a difficult job.  I do wish they'd pull over those traveling slowly in the left as often as they pull over those going too fast.  The first time I lived here back in '99 I was travelling south on I5 and got pulled over for switching too many lanes.  I went from the extreme left to the extreme right to get around the wall on the left.  I asked the trooper if they ever pull over those travelling under the speed limit in the left, he said they did and thankfully ended up giving me a warning. Policing would help the left lane thing but Washington state needs to stop teaching its drivers to do it in driver's ed.