Posted: 8/9/2007 11:26:36 AM EDT
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Fact - The agent has the last can and approved form 4 in question Fact - It is a Tube, no internals or caps Fact - Calls were made to Mike for MONTHS after the can was approved. WITH ZERO return calls. I even spoke directly to his wife and left a message. This thread started as a result of that. So I find it VERY hard to believe that any attempt was made to deliver the can as he could not even return a phone call. Fact - Mike OFFERED to hold cans as long as people needed. He did not put a time frame on it. Some people purchased them because of the great price and to help with the GB numbers. Do you know how many cans are on form 3s sitting in a dealers safe that belong to sombody else? That is what a dealer does. If some dont like it so be it. Fact - you are not telling us the whole story. You went from "Yea I know him thru my wife" to writing checks on his behalf. WTF? |
uh...straight to the point and civil.......... |
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Cape -- for what its worth, I know that Mike only assembled the complete can just prior to delivery. I don't know why he did this, possibly he preferred to keep tube and internals separately to avoid problems with theft, although I don't think the BATFE would see any difference in losing a registered tube or internals vs a complete suppressor. I am only guessing, but I suspect that the BATFE have tube and enough internals to assemble a complete suppressor, and could do so if they were so inclined. Otherwise, if they took possession of the inventory of an FFL/Gunsmith and found your disassembled AR he was working on, they would say that they only have a lower, and thats all you get back. Its nonsense. All that said, it IS a mess. And there is really no excuse for it being so. ETA: Although the results may not be terribly satisfactory, I think Rob DOES deserve some credit for putting himself in the firing line and trying his best to mediate and sort this out. In a previous job I often found myself the first real, live representative of the company (Netscape) that some customers got to see face to face. For that reason I had to endure some pent up anger directed at the support organization via myself. Never particularly pleasant. Rob has dropped himself in a similar role here, and I really understand the frustrating position that he is in, as well as people's tendency to vent in his direction because he is the closest thing to a real target. But, its really not fair to him. he didn't cause the mess, he is only trying to help. |
As far as credit goes, Rob does deserve some and while we are naming names, so does Pat. As far as dealing with angry customers, that's all part of business and that is my biggest beef with this mess. My can was transfered over to Roger more than 2 months ago. Good customer service skills tells me, that had it been me and my ass was in the ringer and not able to deliver product, I'd better inform the customers, PERIOD. Other wise, how many filed form 4's on cans they wouldn't be able to get? Leaves a bad taste in too many mouths. Puts a dark shadow on classIII purchases for those who don't know any better On the plus side, makes Honest folks like Pat look that much better. Rob does deserve much credit for his involvment and I have thanked him. Where the line was crossed, was throwing that info out there about cape's situation that is not entirely accurate from what I have seen and been told. Again, I'll warn everyone who has posted in this (much like the original), or is thinking of posting in this. Keep it civil or it will result in a number of things.... 1. it being moved to the pit (and if so, watch out) 2. Warnings and eventual time outs. I'm as serious as a bleeding hemerroid on this (read, pain in your ass) Thank you. |
My venting towrds him as you put it is a DIRECT and ONLY a result of his repeated snotty comments towrads those that held paper for as long as they did. This was after he acknowledged that Mike made the offer in the first place. Not cool IMHO. It has nothing to do with the mess that he is trying ot clear up. For that I am thankful. As for the can and internals its far from nonsense. I assure you if the ATF has the tubes and internals that were "never assembled" they WILL NOT assemble the can prior to delivery. They are not a MFG and would never put themselves in a position of liability. If the ATF took possesion of a AR in peices that is exactly how it would be returned. However in the case of the tubes, the parts are bulk parts and not specific to the can. Since they consider the tube the silencer I doubt they will even include the parts needed. It would like saying the atf took a stripped reciever from inventory and returned a complete rifle with the parts from inventory.....aint gonna happen. |
Yep. Recognized and understood. |