[ARCHIVED THREAD] - RIT student... (Page 1 of 3)
Posted: 4/18/2007 3:24:28 AM EDT
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does anyone have anymore info on the rifles that were confiscated? here the local news reported that it was a Stag 15 AR and was illegal in NY( probably a NY compliant build) I am getting frustrated with all the uneducated reporting from the anti-gun media. Read how many things are wrong in this report... Gun Scare on Rochester College Campus Video Apr 18, 2007 - A 22-year-old Rochester Institute of Technology student is behind bars, charged with possessing illegal assault rifles in his Rochester-area college dorm room. Jonathan Hackenburg of New Jersey is facing several charges related to his alleged possession of the rifles, 200 rounds of ammunition and four cartridges. Monroe County Sheriff Patrick O'Flynn said the weapons were found at the RIT Inn and Conference Center in Henrietta. There was no plot or threat of violence, but authorities left nothing to chance following the massacre at Virginia Tech this week. "He possessed assault weapons in New York State that violated the law," O'Flynn said. "He also possessed them on campus which is another section of the law that he violated. We don't tolerate that." RIT students were notified of the arrest via e-mail, which instantly sparked campus-wide fear following the deaths of 32 people at the hands of a gunman in Virginia on Monday. "It's incredibly scary," said RIT graduate student John Thode. College officials said a student heard the sound a gun makes when its user loads it and chambers a round of ammunition. The student immediately reported the incident to campus security. "Obviously, the higher education community is sensitive to what's happening, [the incident at Virginia Tech] is a national tragedy," said RIT spokesman Robert Finnerty. "Everyone is on their guard." Hackenburg told authorities that he is a federally licensed firearms dealer in his home state of New Jersey, O'Flynn said, but that license would not be legal in New York. Hackenburg was being held Tuesday night in the Monroe County jail in downtown Buffalo on $15,000 cash bail or $30,000 bond. |
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If the rifles were NJ compliant they are also NY compliant as well. Unless he added additional features to convert them into assault weapons or the mags were not manufactured prior to 09-14-1994 the Monroe County Sheriff doesn't have a clue as to what the legal definition of an AW is in NY. In any case the guy is a dumbass for keeping them on RIT property. This will be a case to follow. www.amny.com/news/local/wire/ny-bc-ny--student-guns0417apr17,0,4163493.story?coll=ny-ap-regional-wire RIT student arrested on firearms charges, suspended April 17, 2007, 11:22 PM EDT ROCHESTER, N.Y. (AP) _ A Rochester Institute of Technology student was arrested and suspended from classes after police found two illegal guns in his room in campus housing on Tuesday. Monroe County Sheriff's deputies arrested Jonathan Hackenburg, 22, of Hackettstown, N.J., after they found two assault rifles in his room at the RIT Inn and Conference Center. An employee there had called police after hearing a sound like someone racking a gun, RIT spokesman Robert Finnerty said. The student said he was a collector and had just assembled the guns, Finnerty said. There was no ammunition in the room, but deputies later found 320 rounds of ammunition in his car. The weapons were described by police as a Stag-15 rifle and a Romanian made AR-15 rifle. Hackenburg, a senior majoring in engineering, told authorities he has spent a lot of time working on guns and rebuilding them as a hobby. "He did indicate that he has federal firearms licenses in New Jersey and that he properly purchased these weapons," said Monroe County Sheriff Patrick O'Flynn. "However, crossing the state line and possessing them in New York State is a violation of the law." Hackenburg was arraigned in Henrietta Town Court. He's charged with two felony counts of criminal possession of a weapon, as well as fourth-degree criminal possession of a weapon for possessing a firearm on school property. He was sent to the Monroe County jail on $15,000 cash bail or $30,000 bond. |
Not that it is applicable in this instance but you can legally possess a "rifle, shotgun or firearm" with written permission authorizing such use from the educational institution. There are educational institutions in NYS that have pistol/rifle teams and ranges. I really doubt he was an FFL dealer (01 FFL) in NJ. More likely he has a C&R (03 FFL) license or maybe even just a NJ FID card. (3) He or she knowingly has in his or her possession a rifle, shotgun or firearm in or upon a building or grounds, used for educational purposes, of any school, college or university, except the forestry lands, wherever located, owned and maintained by the State University of New York college of environmental science and forestry, or upon a school bus as defined in section one hundred forty-two of the vehicle and traffic law, without the written authorization of such educational institution; |
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Now they're reporting it's a "hotel". www.13wham.com/news/local/story.aspx?content_id=9a5d5d10-9005-45e5-bbf6-73c08c4ce897 Rachel Barnhart (Henrietta, N.Y.) – A Rochester Institute of Technology student has been arrested for having two assault rifles in his room, and hundreds of rounds of ammunition in his car. Jonathan Hackenburg, 22, of Hackettstown, N.J., was taken into custody after police allegedly found a Stag-15 rifle and a Romanian-made AR-15 style rifle in his room at the RIT Inn and Conference Center. Two hundred rounds of ammunition and four 30-round magazines were found in his car. School officials said a hotel employee heard the sound of a gun being racked inside Hackenburg’s room late Tuesday morning and called police. Hackenburg is one of 300 students who live in the hotel. About 50 percent of rooms are reserved for student residents. “Kudos should be given to this employee for being on the ball and immediately reporting this to our public safety department,” said RIT spokesman Bill Finnerty. Hackenburg has a New Jersey firearms permit. However, the assault rifles are illegal in New York and illegal to possess on campus. Hackenburg faces two felony counts and two misdemeanor counts of criminal possession of a weapon. Monroe County Sheriff Patrick O’Flynn said Hackenburg is a gun hobbyist and spends time rebuilding the weapons. “There was no threat. There was no indication of prior use in the area or did he make any threats he was going to use them,” O’Flynn said. Hotel manager Bill Gunther said Hackenburg is a longtime resident and he does not think the student intended to cause anyone harm. “He's like one of the family out here. He's a good kid,” Gunther said. RIT sent out a campus-wide email late in the afternoon explaining what happened. After the tragedy at Virginia Tech, grad student John Thode was alarmed. “It could have just happened here. It's really scary.You're thinking this could happen anywhere,” Thode said. O’Flynn said the timing of Hackenburg’s arrest was a coincidence. “I can't tell you anything about intent or what his mindset was or anything like that all. All I know is he possessed assault weapons in New York state that violate the law and he also possessed them on a campus,” he said. Tuesday night, Hackenburg was being held at Monroe County Jail on $15,000 cash bail and $30,000 bond. |
the WGRZ (buffalo's nbc affiliate) article makes my head hurt worse than the stoner's mugshot
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The question is whether this is a facility where the possession of a rifle or other firearm would be prohibited by NYS law. Unless the guy is an idiot and actually did possess an assault weapon as defined in the NYS PL he will at least get those charges dismissed. |
I work in City Hall for the City of Rochester in the Civil Service Dept, and I know what you mean about the draconian laws for firearms in the City among the other laws that this "made for living" city has on its books... The building in question where this all took place is in the town of Henrietta, but the Sheriffs Dept for Monroe County handled this situation. IF this happened in the City limits, the RPD would be all over this and you would be hearing from Chief Moore instead of Sheriff Patrick O'Flynn. I'm not sold as to the veracity of the claims that he possessed "Assault Weapons" per se according to the definintions of the evil features, unless this kid decided to add a telescoping stock that wasn't pinned or neglected to perm attach a muzzle break on the threaded muzzle. If it is found that his AR's were ban compliant, the case agianst him is going to hinge on whether or not the mags are preban and whether or not the off campus site is going to be considered a part of the campus of RIT. It is my understanding that the site where he lived is a part dorm, part conference center, and part of the hotel and restuarant studies program affiliated with RIT. I believe RIT owns the facility, but it is not apart of the main campus, kind of a gray area, but I doubt a grand jury will throw it out; this kid needs a good lawyer pronto 
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The media-morons are saying that the rifles confiscated were illegai in NYS, but I am willing to bet ,they have no idea WTF they are talking about  The place in which he was caught used to be a Marriott in Henrietta and was bought (leased?) by the school (RIT) some time ago. Obviously the definition of the place (hotel with rooms used for students (as dormitories) or bonafide dormitories) will make a difference in what -if any- laws were broken. The employee (hero they are calling him ), who reported the sound of a weapon being racked said "that sound has no place in a dormitory or hotel room", which leaves speculative room for hoping it is a hotel used/owned by RIT, and not considered part of the school campus (it is a couple of miles from campus)No word as to WHAT is illegal about the rifles confiscated. |
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I spoke to the spokesperson for the RIT INN. He informed me that: - The RIT INN functions as part hotel and has rooms assigned to RIT students, so the latter, is considered part of the dormitories. -The property is owned by RIT I tried to get some information on the rifles seized, but the spokesman recited the statement given to him by the Monroe Sheriff's Office.............which is that he was caught with a Stag15 and a Romanian made AR15 STYLE weapon (whatever that means) I then called the Sheriff's office and left a message for the Spokesman to call me with info on the rifles taken. When he calls me back I will try to pry out of him why the student is being charged with illegal possession of 2 rifles besides the possession of a firearm in a school campus.I will also ask the spokesman if I can interview the student tomorrow Most likely he will not call until tomorrow.I will keep you informed. |
| ill garuntee you this is how is went down...... no-one heard anyone racking a slide... someone knew this kid had guns in the hotel and they ratted him the fuck out.... the empolyees (sheeple) would no way in hell be able to decifer a slide being racked and something metal hiting something in a closed door room.... I SMELL SOMETHING FISHY |
I wonder if your situation would of been different since you were staying in what they probably consider to be the "hotel" section of the building. |
Regardless he should he charged with felony dumbass. There is no question that RIT Inn is part of RIT if you are there. I'll leave the legal wrangling to those inclined to it, but he definitely should've known better, and probably did. ETA: ElCamino '04 I never lived in the "Inn" but I know of one Arfcommer that did for a while as a dormitory room. If you want to have big scary guns there, you can just live off campus like I did. If any of my neighbors had a problem with me racking my firearms, they would've been told to pound sand. |
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www.10nbc.com/news.asp?template=item&story_id=22280 Friends of arrested RIT student say he would never hurt anyone 4/18/07 See News 10NBC report By Catherine Varnum News 10NBC is tracking down new information on the RIT student arrested Tuesday for having two assault rifles in his dorm room and more than 300 rounds of ammunition in his car. Jonathan Hackenburg is from New Jersey and says he's a licensed gun dealer in that state. We talked with two of his friends Wednesday. They say they knew him by his middle name, Matt. They say he's a levelheaded kid who made a mistake and would never hurt anyone. "It's his hobby. I don't know. It's just what he does," said friend Britton Vona. Vona and James Ko are defending their friend, Jonathan Hackenburg. "He's one of the most level headed kids I know and he's always the first to resolve any confrontation with like words," said James Ko. "I know guns are illegal on campus, but he's a good kid. He's never done anything. I've never seen him, for as long as I've known him, do anything to hurt anybody," said Vona. Hackenburg is charged with having two illegal, high-powered assault rifles in his dorm room. The 22-year-old engineering senior admitted to having the guns. He told deputies he has licenses in New Jersey and that's where he bought the guns. But both rifles are illegal in NYS. Facilities Supervisor Rodney White was walking down the hall of Hackenburg's dorm when he heard a noise he recognized. "I heard this sound, of a weapon be racked and dry fired continuously," said White. White knows that noise from being in the navy for four years. He says there's no way to describe it, he was just trained to know it. "It's the only thing in the world that really makes that sound. Wrong sounds, wrong place," said White. Hackenburg was one of several RIT students who came to the Rochester Brooks Gun Club to shoot. The owner tells us the kids were well behaved and even took safety classes to make sure they could shoot properly. The owner tells us he doesn't know if Hackenburg used those assault rifles at the club but says if the guns aren't allowed in NYS, they can't be used at the club either. "He took really good care that we were always safe when we went out shooting," said Ko. Deputies say Hackenburg doesn't have a criminal record and they don't believe he intended to harm anyone. Hackenburg's friends have listened to kids around campus talk about the arrest and have this to say about their friend, "They think he's like some kind of loner kid that's going to shoot up the place, but he's really not. He was doing really well in school and had a bunch of friends," said Ko. Hackenburg did make bail late Wednesday afternoon. His friends tell us his parents were on their way to Rochester and have hired an attorney. Hackenburg has been suspended from RIT. If convicted, he could face up to seven years in prison. |
+1... I want full disclosure.which they won't give us right away,they want us all to be afraid...WELL I'M NOT! |
Excellent post Ed. Thank you sir. I was going to do something similar today, I know a sherrif's deputy that works in the County Jail and I was going to ask him if he had any information that he could share with me, like is the kid in a huge cell with bubba and friends or is he just in a temp holding area... I see that he made bail and is out with his family and they are looking for a lawyer. I also see he is a Brooks member and not a GCL member... |
| Caught the news on Channel 7 here in Buffalo after 10:00pm the other night and as I was falling asleep, was rudely awaken by the words "Illegal assualt weapon." Glad I found this forum, had a lot of unanswered questions about just what the young man at RIT did wrong. It seems that either several of the features indicative of "assualt weapon" definition must exist on the 2 he had in possesion or the magazine was a post ban 30 rounder, or he was on campus property. The "legality" of where his room resides certainly is a gray area as others in this forum have stated and a good lawyer can arque that point in court. But what I was surprised to here from channel 7 when I emailed them with many of the same questions you all have asked was that the main reason he was arrested is that he bought the rifles in New Jersey and transported them across the state line into New York. Just another instance where reporters do not bother to check their facts when abusing there right to free speech. As far as I know it is not illegal to purchase a rifle or shotgun in any of our neighboring states and transport it into our state. Although the fact that he is a New Jersey resident and not a New York resident may have been the problem. |
You can buy a rifle in ANY state,as long as you are not violating the rules of the stete to which you are bringing it.It does NOT have to be a contiguous state. Fill a 4473 form when the FFL sells you the rifle,and you can bring them from CA to NY if you want. PK90 said above that since his status is student, he qualifies for residence in both states (NY & NJ) |
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Are telestocks, flash supressors and bayo lugs legal in NJ now that the 94 AWB has sunset? I feel for the guy but you must know the laws where you are going to make sure something like this does not happen, if he had researched NYS law it would have been a simple matter to make the rifles post ban compliant until such a time as he returned them to his home state and then restored them. Then again, he may have had a pinned stock installed and the local sherrifs department "tech" people may think that "all" telestocks are banned, it sue would be nice for this young man if it were so. Otherwise, we all need to keep an eye on this case. Where I live it is so rural most people own guns and its not uncommon to hear shooting past midnight, I am friends with the local PD Chief and he doesnt have a clue about pre-ban or post ban rifles and could care less, more metropolitan areas though are a different story, people are so paranoid these days and expect the government to make them "secure" that they think anyone with a gun must somehow be unbalanced and dangerous. Jeff 
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Whatever information you can get is very welcome.One thing you cannot have too much of is information......as long as it is accurate. 
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Pinning of a collapsible stock as well as "covering" the threads of a threaded barrel with a "permanently" attached muzzle brake has never been established to be legal when installed on a postban rifle in NYS. Anyone who does so is doing so at their own risk. |
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I have left a message for the Deputy that I know that works in the County Jail. He works until around 8 or 9AM right now, and he is going to be waking up soon, hopefully he returns my call before heading into work. I will post any info that I may obtain. Only new news is that the kid has lawyered-up (no idea who) and he has been given the STFU order from his legal counsel, albeit a little too late  Side bar: Rush Henrietta HS school evacuated/classes cancelled today because a few "unspent" rounds found in a rest-room trash can by the janitor before school started (When I was in High School, a bomb threat = 30 minutes standing on the practice fields while the school was swept and then back to classes, my have times changed) AND Greece Olympia HS was in a lock down yesterday due to some online myspace threats by recent alum's threatening a Columbine-esque racially motivated killing on the Columbine "anniversary" which led to the confiscation of a shotgun owned by the father of the student posting the threatening messages...  Here is an idea, lets put the alumni kid in the loonie bin until he sobers the hell up to reality, instead we will let him walk around all demented in the head and just take away dads shotgun...somehow people think the problem is solved |
| What the hell is going on? Are they going to eventually home school everyone for fear of a school shooting? There are plenty of nonsensical doom-sayers out there but this really makes you wonder. We might not have riots and looting the streets but it sure feels like our 'culture' is coming unhinged. |
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"Pinning of a collapsible stock as well as "covering" the threads of a threaded barrel with a "permanently" attached muzzle brake has never been established to be legal when installed on a postban rifle in NYS. Anyone who does so is doing so at their own risk." Then why do so many gun dealers here in NYS sell post ban rifles like all of those Bushmasters with the perm. attached muzzle brakes ? I was just at my dealer the other day and he has at least 6 Bushmasters out for sale with muzzle brakes perm. attached ??? I've called Bushmaster with that question and they stated the rifles were legal in NY. 1981 |
Will that bring my taxes down?
Crap. Fan. Do the math. |
I believe there was a former member here who was a dealer that said that once threaded barrels constituted a threaded barrel no matter what, even if a muzzle device was permanently attached to it. He was often called on as a witness for firearms related court cases and said he'd testify to that fact. |
Your memory serves you right.He was an ex-cop who went around proudly testifying to that effect, ruining lives for technical BS. Aimless banned him for the disservice he provided to the shooting comunity 
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At the time the federal AWB was enacted into law the U.S. Congress specifically authorized the Treasurer of the U.S. to interpret federal law and promulgate rules/regulations and render "opinions" related to the sale, possession, transport, manufacture etc. of assault firearms used in interstate commerce. During the period of time that the federal AWB was in place the BATFE issued certain rules, regulations and opinion letters related to "assault weapons". No such authority/agency for the regulation of firearms and/or interpretation of the NY AWB exists in NYS. The NY Courts could accept some, none or all the rules, regulations and opinions of the BATFE. Until a NYS court is presented with a case, hears the evidence from all parties and renders a decision nothing is "black and white". Keep in mind that that is only the first stage as you can guarantee that whatever decision a trial court makes will be appealed through the Appellate Courts and likely end up being heard by the Court of Appeals. If you are are pinning collapsible stocks or covering threaded barrels with a muzzle brake that is a risk (however small) that you must be willing to assume. As I have stated several times I do not have a dog in this fight as I do not possess a postban rifle in either configuration. For me it's a simple risk/benefit issue. I see some risk with no real benefit to justify that risk. As always this is just my meaningless personal opinion for discussion purposes. YMMV. |
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www.democratandchronicle.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070419/NEWS01/704190358/1002/NEWS (April 19, 2007) — Hearing set for student The lawyer representing a suspended Rochester Institute of Technology student says his client posed no threat to anyone when he possessed what deputies claim were two assault rifles. Jonathan Hackenburg, 22, of Hackettstown, N.J., an engineering student at RIT, was arrested and suspended Tuesday for having the weapons in his dorm room. "It was just something he enjoyed doing, researching and assembling rifles," said defense attorney John Parrinello. Parrinello questions whether the guns fall under the definition of an assault weapon. Hackenburg, who posted $15,000 cash bail, is due in Henrietta court at 4 p.m. Friday. Parrinello said it is unclear if the matter will be ultimately pursued in state or federal court. www.pennlive.com/news/expresstimes/pa/index.ssf?/base/news-4/1177042189305650.xml&coll=2 Assault weapons found in dorm Area man had guns in New York college room, police say. Friday, April 20, 2007 FROM STAFF AND WIRE REPORTS ROCHESTER, N.Y. | A Hackettstown-area man attending Rochester Institute of Technology was arrested and suspended from classes after police found two illegal guns in his room in campus housing Tuesday. Monroe County sheriff's deputies arrested Jonathan Hackenburg, 22, of Washington Township, Morris County, after they found two assault rifles in his dorm room at the RIT Inn and Conference Center. An employee there had called police after hearing a sound like someone racking a gun, RIT spokesman Robert Finnerty said. The student said he was a collector and had just assembled the guns, Finnerty said. The weapons were described by police as a Stag-15 rifle and a Romanian-made AR-15 rifle. Hackenburg also was in possession of four 30-round magazines and more than 200 rounds of ammunition. Hackenburg, a senior majoring in engineering, told authorities he has spent a lot of time working on guns and rebuilding them as a hobby. "He did indicate that he has federal firearms licenses in New Jersey and that he properly purchased these weapons," said Monroe County Sheriff Patrick O'Flynn. "However, crossing the state line and possessing them in New York state is a violation of the law." Felony charges Hackenburg was arraigned in Henrietta Town Court. He's charged with two felony counts of criminal possession of a weapon, as well as fourth-degree criminal possession of a weapon for possessing a firearm on school property. He was sent to the Monroe County jail on $15,000 cash bail or $30,000 bond. Hackenburg has since posted bail, Finnerty said. Hackenburg was not set to graduate this spring, Finnerty said. It is illegal in New York state to have weapons on a college campus, Finnerty said. In addition to going through the criminal system, Hackenburg must go through the school's student conduct procedures to determine if he will be expelled. "There are many options throughout the process, expulsion is one of them," Finnerty said. 'Overzealous reaction' No one appeared to be home at Hackenburg's Washington Township home Thursday and a neighbor said his mother was away. That same neighbor said she received a call from the Washington Township Police Department in Morris County about a year ago. She said someone with the department was asking her questions about Hackenburg's application for a gun permit. The neighbor -- who would not give her name -- said she told police Hackenburg was a good person, and she had no problem with him obtaining the permit. She and other neighbors described Hackenburg as a bright young man who always helped out in the neighborhood. While not at school, neighbors said, Hackenburg lived with his mother in a Schindler Square town house in the Hastings Square development off Schooleys Mountain Road, just north of Hackettstown's Mountain Avenue retail district. Neighbors said Hackenburg enjoys riding his motorcycle and working on his car. "I've lived here for five and a half years," the neighbor who spoke to police about the gun permit said. "He's a straight-A student. He's very kind, and if I knocked on his door for something, he'd be the first to help me." The neighbor questioned why he would be arrested and said maybe he just didn't know he wasn't allowed to have guns on the Rochester campus. "He didn't threaten anyone, he didn't do anything with the guns," she said. She said Hackenburg is the victim of overzealous campus administrators who are reacting to the situation at Virginia Tech. Staff writers Tom Quigley and Sara K. Satullo contributed to the report. |
Just an e-mail? I'm surprised they didn't lock down, evacuate and quarantine the campus. |
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I was hoping that someone would get around to actually looking at the AWB for NY and not just supposing or shooting off their mouth as usually happens in cases like this. As with the media, more damage to our gun rights can be done by those that do not have either the complete story or facts. Guys, the media does this all day long and we crucify them for it, why do we allow ourselves to do it and then not say anything? The sheriff actually said that he was more concerned with the fact that he possessed them on campus. He did not elaborate as to the illegality of the firearms, but left that determination up to the ATF. Regardless, the guy that found him was a Navy vet and knew what the sound was. It was not his intention to nail the kid, but the staff had a mandate to the safety of the campus. What do you think would happen if someone had heard the rifle action being worked, not said anything, and then it progressed to a shooting like VT??? |